Quantum Break will not be coming to Steam - Windows Store Exclusive

[Derangel]

1 minute ago, samcool55 said:

No i'm not.

I'll give you an example.

Dx12 has many features, one of them is Raster Order Views. At this moment it's supported by a handful of intel gpu's and maxwell 2nd gen.

And let's say that feature is required for running the game.

But you are for example on i don't know, an AMD card, the 390X, which doesn't support it. Then what?

Will it be like "bad luck, upgrade" or will it fall back on software emulation, and probably killing performance and making the game perform bad, or even unplayable?

 

And the 390X does have Dx12 support.

That's what the system requirements are for!

[Guest Kloaked]

1 hour ago, Speedbird said:

.....and?

 

What's wrong with the Windows Store? Both EA and Ubisoft now distribute their titles thorugh their own platform, but when Microsoft does it, everybody loses their minds. It's a Windows 10 exclusive anyway. I get it, you like Steam because of its features, but I'm sure MS will sooner or later make something similar to the exisiting platforms, with a social network, in-game overlay and achievements.

That's the point. It's one more platform we have to worry about if we were to purchase that game. I hate Steam with a passion but I wish it was the only platform I had to worry about. 

 

Plus, everyone lost their minds when those other platforms came out. Don't make a meme out of it when what you said isn't true. 

[Sakkura]

Just now, samcool55 said:

No i'm not.

I'll give you an example.

Dx12 has many features, one of them is Raster Order Views. At this moment it's supported by a handful of intel gpu's and maxwell 2nd gen.

And let's say that feature is required for running the game.

But you are for example on i don't know, an AMD card, the 390X, which doesn't support it. Then what?

Will it be like "bad luck, upgrade" or will it fall back on software emulation, and probably killing performance and making the game perform bad, or even unplayable?

 

And the 390X does have Dx12 support.

Well it's very simple, if the game requires support for Rasterizer Ordered Views, the minimum requirements for the game will only mention cards that support Rasterizer Ordered Views.

However, chances are it does not require support for that feature level 12_1 feature.

[ivhyn]

Just now, GoodBytes said:

Question guys.. How does that affect you that is not on Steam? What are the downside?

No Fullscreen (forced borderless window mode)

Forced Vsync (adaptive sync apparently doesn't work because of the above reason)

No Reshade

No SLI/Crossfire

No Overlay (RTSS, Fraps)

Cannot be added to the Steam game list

[samcool55]

Just now, Derangel said:

That's what the system requirements are for!

But how is a normal person going to figure that out?

 

That's why i said they have to going to make it very very clear, or it will be a disaster.

With games you can look at your specs, and the specs the game requires. Now you have to get almost a seperate list with all Dx12 features that are in the game, and the one you support. And they will also make it clear which ones you really need, or the ones that are optional and can be turned off.

[Sakkura]

Just now, ivhyn said:

No Fullscreen (forced borderless window mode)

Forced Vsync (adaptive sync apparently doesn't work because of the above reason)

No Reshade

No SLI/Crossfire

No Overlay (RTSS, Fraps)

Cannot be added to the Steam game list

What? Running fullscreen doesn't require Steam.

Vsync has nothing to do with Steam either.

SLI/Crossfire has nothing to do with Steam either. Nor does Fraps etc.

It can be added to the Steam games list as a non-Steam game.

[Misanthrope]

35 minutes ago, Derangel said:

And they need full DX12 support for this game because?

 

What are you talking about? There is no Games For Windows Live 2.0. Online features for first party games will be handled through XBL and the features BUILT INTO the OS itself. The Windows Store is just another store front.

Ill conceived store front with added features (which yes, I do count them since windows 10 is a requirement) that people might not like and can become intrusive, lousy and self defeating?

 

I think the similarities are self evident.

[GoodBytes]

8 minutes ago, Samfisher said:

Refund policy, consolidation of games, established friends list and community, wide knowledge base of users for any issues, regular sales.

- You mean the pain the neck, "I will do anything for you to not your refund easily" Steam service? Might as well not exists (in my opinion).

- You can add games to Steam

- Real friends knows who you are, and they can join you. If they have Windows 10, with a MS account, they are on XBox service.

- You do have sales on the Windows Store if you bother looking.

- The internet is where you look for troubleshooting in any case.

 

 

 

[Humbug]

2 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Question guys.. How does that affect you that is not on Steam? What are the downside?

 

I don't really understand it either. Some people don't like the idea of an open market with multiple stores competing. They want all their games from one place.

 

the irony is that without this open competition steam themselves would never have taken off and saved pc gaming.

 

having multiple stores IMO is an inevitable part of the pc experience. We are not like consoles where everything is set in stone. Devs have choice... The stores compete with each other. Today steam is leading. In a few years things could change...

[Sakkura]

2 minutes ago, samcool55 said:

But how is a normal person going to figure that out?

 

That's why i said they have to going to make it very very clear, or it will be a disaster.

With games you can look at your specs, and the specs the game requires. Now you have to get almost a seperate list with all Dx12 features that are in the game, and the one you support. And they will also make it clear which ones you really need, or the ones that are optional and can be turned off.

People can look at the minimum requirements for GPU:

Quote

GPU: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 760 or AMD Radeon R7 260x

If they have that or above, they're good. Super simple stuff.

[samcool55]

1 minute ago, Sakkura said:

Well it's very simple, if the game requires support for Rasterizer Ordered Views, the minimum requirements for the game will only mention cards that support Rasterizer Ordered Views.

However, chances are it does not require support for that feature level 12_1 feature.

It probably won't and it's just an example.

But that does raise another worry. How big will the market be?

I mean first of all they are limiting it to W10, and people with Dx12 cards.

Which gets rid of more than 50% of the pc gamers. Limiting the market by a lot.

If you just look at who the market is, it's probably not going to go well...

And then there are always the people hating the Store. Again limiting the market.

[ivhyn]

1 minute ago, Sakkura said:

What? Running fullscreen doesn't require Steam.

Vsync has nothing to do with Steam either.

SLI/Crossfire has nothing to do with Steam either. Nor does Fraps etc.

It can be added to the Steam games list as a non-Steam game.

No, but being forced to the Windows Store causes the issues I listed... And Windows Store apps cannot be added as non-Steam games

[JcGross]

Don't worry they'll change their tune after a while, I'm dead certain.

[Ex14]

2 minutes ago, ivhyn said:

No, but being forced to the Windows Store causes the issues I listed... And Windows Store apps cannot be added as non-Steam games

Are you basing your thoughts/statement on hands on experience just wondering? or isit just hearsay?

[GoodBytes]

2 minutes ago, ivhyn said:

No, but being forced to the Windows Store causes the issues I listed... And Windows Store apps cannot be added as non-Steam games

The game is not a Universal App

[samcool55]

1 minute ago, Sakkura said:

People can look at the minimum requirements for GPU:

If they have that or above, they're good. Super simple stuff.

But what if people have an older card but more powerful?

I have a 6970, which is similar to the 260x performance wise, but 0 Dx12 support, so even tho i meet sort of the minimum requirements, i'm screwed.

A full list is probably the only option

[Humbug]

1 minute ago, ivhyn said:

No, but being forced to the Windows Store causes the issues I listed... And Windows Store apps cannot be added as non-Steam games

question- is there an exe which launches the game?

cause if you can find that in the filesystem then I guess you can add it to steam.

[Sakkura]

1 minute ago, samcool55 said:

It probably won't and it's just an example.

But that does raise another worry. How big will the market be?

I mean first of all they are limiting it to W10, and people with Dx12 cards.

Which gets rid of more than 50% of the pc gamers. Limiting the market by a lot.

If you just look at who the market is, it's probably not going to go well...

And then there are always the people hating the Store. Again limiting the market.

Well they are specifically using the game to drive adoption of Windows 10 and the Windows Store. So those are not negatives from Microsoft's point of view.

As for limiting it to DX12 cards, most gamers have that already. The only people they're going to exclude are people with eg. a Radeon HD 6970.

1 minute ago, ivhyn said:

No, but being forced to the Windows Store causes the issues I listed... And Windows Store apps cannot be added as non-Steam games

Really? I haven't really used any Windows Store games, but I doubt that's really the case. As long as there is an .exe, Steam should be able to run it.

[Derangel]

2 minutes ago, Kloaked said:

That's the point. It's one more platform we have to worry about if we were to purchase that game. I hate Steam with a passion but I wish it was the only platform I had to worry about. 

 

Plus, everyone lost their minds when those other platforms came out. Don't make a meme out of it when what you said isn't true. 

Steam being the only platform is a fucking nightmare scenario. Monopolies are bad, especially when the company you wish had one has already proven itself to be fairly anti-consumer. Despite promising over a YEAR ago to improve their customer service they have done fuck all on that front. Not to mention the clusterfuck that is the curator system, the completely fucked Steam Greenlight, and the mess that Early Access has turned into. I mean hell, the ONLY reason they added refunds is because they were forced to because they violated EU consumer laws. Valve clearly does not care about improving the user experience unless it is forced to.

 

Just now, samcool55 said:

But how is a normal person going to figure that out?

 

That's why i said they have to going to make it very very clear, or it will be a disaster.

With games you can look at your specs, and the specs the game requires. Now you have to get almost a seperate list with all Dx12 features that are in the game, and the one you support. And they will also make it clear which ones you really need, or the ones that are optional and can be turned off.

Read the system requirements and ask questions? Those are the things normal people do if they're confused about something. It will be years before AAA games lock out current generation cards. Every current DX12 capable card will be able to run DX12 games for a long time.

[Nizkus]

Just now, Ex14 said:

Are you basing your thoughts/statement on hands on experience just wondering? or isit just hearsay?

At least not being able to add windows store games to steam should be right, since afaik you don't have direct access to game files

[Ex14]

Just now, JcGross said:

Don't worry they'll change their tune after a while, I'm dead certain.

I hope not. 

The last time they did, several nice ideas didn't materialize  for a while. 

[Samfisher]

2 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

- You mean the pain the neck, "I will do anything for you to not your refund easily" Steam service? Might as well not exists (in my opinion).

- You can add games to Steam

- Real friends knows who you are, and they can join you. If they have Windows 10, with a MS account, they are on XBox service. Also, chat conversation are saved,

- You do have sales on the Windows Store if you bother looking.

- The internet is where you look for troubleshooting in any case.

 

 

 

- I've refunded 3 games with no issues whatsoever

- Not all games can as mentioned in this thread by others

- Nobody I know bothers to sign in to their MS account on Win 10, and nobody I know owns a Xbox.  I live in Asia, chances of playing any sort of online game with people near enough to actually meet and count as real friends are slim to none.  99% of any game friend list I have consists of people at least 8 hours to 27 hours flight away.

- Maybe

- Not if it's too widespread, splitting customer base and people who experience the same issues.  If it was on Steam, chances are someone on the steam Forums has the exact same problem as you do.  Using Google to search for specific topics on issues for games leads to a stupid amount of back and forth where there aren't enough people on each forum/platform to have a consistent experience.

[Misanthrope]

10 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Question guys.. How does that affect you that is not on Steam? What are the downside?

I only see upsides. Steam DRM validation is slow, if steam is closed, it takes a long time to startup the game. It would promotes a monopoly. Steam has been going downhill due to lack of competition. Game shortcuts made by Steam can't be pinned on the task bar or start menu, because Valve has never fixed their invalid shortcuts bug since Steam started.

Preface: I don't care if its separate I care is mandatory windows 10.

 

With that out of the way, I have uplay and origin installed. Might install gog.com too. However I like games to be neatly organized on one place. 

 

Other minor incentives exists but you're right it's mostly superfluous. Not different than people who used to get Xbox to be were their friends are.

[Sakkura]

Just now, Derangel said:

Steam being the only platform is a fucking nightmare scenario. Monopolies are bad, especially when the company you wish had one has already proven itself to be fairly anti-consumer. Despite promising over a YEAR ago to improve their customer service they have done fuck all on that front. Not to mention the clusterfuck that is the curator system, the completely fucked Steam Greenlight, and the mess that Early Access has turned into. I mean hell, the ONLY reason they added refunds is because they were forced to because they violated EU consumer laws. Valve clearly does not care about improving the user experience unless it is forced to.

I agree, but on the other hand store fragmentation is also a minor nightmare scenario. Having to juggle half a dozen different stores is going to get really, really annoying. Getting all the stuff together in one location is just super-convenient. And it's why you have one app store on phones/tablets, rather than a variety of different stores from different publishers.

[Anult]

1 minute ago, Ex14 said:

Are you basing your thoughts/statement on hands on experience just wondering? or isit just hearsay?

To quote Durante over on the neogaf forums:

Quote

Any type of executable-level modification or injection, as well as changes to data files in some cases.
So, say goodbye to
- Performance analysis overlays.
- Graphics injectors.
- Integration of useful external applications like Mumble.
- Community fixes or feature extensions.
- In-depth modding.
- Support for popular peripherals like the Steam controller. (!)
- Some GPU features such as SLI.
- Actual exclusive full screen mode.

These issues still haven't been rectified since the inception of the Windows Store and until changes are made, I wouldn't advise people buying any game from the Windows Store until this stuff is fixed ASAP.