Intel's getting slower and Kaby Lake processors delayed[PCPER]

[Agent181]

So as we all know with no competition companies start to do less R&D, now this has happened to intel more.

 

 

 

Last week Scott shared all that we can find out about Kaby Lake, Intel's asynchronous Tock between Skylake and Cannonlake.  Don't hold your breath for their release, nor for Cannonlake if DigiTimes sources are accurate.  If true, consumers will not see Kaby Lake for at least a year with enterprise waiting even longer which will push back the scheduled release of notebooks and PCs using the processors likely not showing up for a month or so afterwards.  Skylake should be finally appearing in time for Fall and in theory products using it should be available at that time as Skylake's delay was the initial cause of these delays.  As for Cannonlake; it is going to be a while.

"Following the delay of Skylake processors, Intel's next-generation Kaby Lake processors, which were originally scheduled for early 2016, reportedly will be pushed back until September 2016 for the consumer version and January 2017 for the enterprise one."

-Scott Michaud pcper

 

 

 

Me: Expect to see less performance gain for new cpu's that will be coming out over the next few years, it will be maybe a performance increase of 5-10% and less power consumption, now its up to AMD which we all know is in bad shape to bring something out of their ass to wake up intel or we are going to be stuck with the performance we get now for a while.

 

Source: PCPER

 

[MageTank]

I am still bummed that Broadwell has yet to hit the market yet it was claimed to be launching in Q2 of this year. Now i see two broadwell CPU's being sold on ebay with the release date of "August 6th" which is 1 day after the Skylake release. I really do believe Intel is getting slower, its been evident since the first broadwell delay.

[TheKDub]

AMD could take a hint from intel and work on power efficiency if they're not going to work on improving performance by much (For their GPUs, CPUs, and APUs )

[ApolloX75]

Not surprising. No one is nipping at their heels or putting them on the ropes now.

Hopefully Zen gives them a good slap.

[Enderman]

They are working on more efficiency improvements and lower power consumption than leaps in performance

IMO thats more important since more and more games are going to be using DX12 and other factors that take load off the CPU and more on the GPU

[Enderman]

I am still bummed that Broadwell has yet to hit the market yet it was claimed to be launching in Q2 of this year. Now i see two broadwell CPU's being sold on ebay with the release date of "August 6th" which is 1 day after the Skylake release. I really do believe Intel is getting slower, its been evident since the first broadwell delay.

Memory express already has broadwell i7s in stock...

The only reason I didnt buy one last weekend was because it was $500 compared to the 4790k's $400

[MageTank]

Memory express already has broadwell i7s in stock...

The only reason I didnt buy one last weekend was because it was $500 compared to the 4790k's $400

 

 

 

This item is not stocked in our warehouse and may take 2-4 weeks for delivery. Special order items also require a 100% nonrefunable deposit and can only be returned for RMA replacement once your order has been placed.

 

This is what is shown during checkout. Trust me, no retailer has this chip for sale yet, and the only people that do are selling it as a pre-order with a stupidly high price tag. Intel has yet to even hint at the official release date of Broadwell, even though its claimed to have already been launched. 

[Zeruel]

Forget heat and power, make bigger cores and increase IPC!

[patrickjp93]

Ah so rumors of Intel's nightmare with 10nm may be true. ASML may have oversold just what their machines can do with multipatterning, and if EUV still really isn't ready, it will mean Samsung and TSMC will be delayed deep into 2017 as well. This could get interesting.

[patrickjp93]

Not surprising. No one is nipping at their heels or putting them on the ropes now.

Hopefully Zen gives them a good slap.

I wouldn't say that. Power 8 and Oracle Sparc still dominate many-threaded scale-up workloads. I'm sure Intel wants that piece of the pie too. I think this has more to do with a revision of the tick-tock to a double-pumped cadence between CPU and GPU architectures, and there's rumor afoot that Intel's 10nm yields are in the single digit percent range. ASML may have vastly overestimate what multipatterning can do at these lithographies, and EUV is still nowhere near ready. This could spell a huge slowdown for the entire industry.

[patrickjp93]

This is what is shown during checkout. Trust me, no retailer has this chip for sale yet, and the only people that do are selling it as a pre-order with a stupidly high price tag. Intel has yet to even hint at the official release date of Broadwell, even though its claimed to have already been launched.

Um, you do know that's all we're getting, right? Broadwell is basically an OEM and niche only item. Newegg doesn't even plan to stock it at all.

[MageTank]

Um, you do know that's all we're getting, right? Broadwell is basically an OEM and niche only item. Newegg doesn't even plan to stock it at all.

No, i was unaware that it was not going to be slated for a full retail release. Where was it ever stated that it wouldn't be? I've been following broadwell since its original announcement for a long time now, and even have an entire build dependent on its release. How do you know for certain that Newegg does not intend to stock it? Have they said this somewhere?

[Bouzoo]

Wait, so the line that was introduced because another line was delayed also got delayed? Did not see that coming.

[marldorthegreat]

Not surprising. No one is nipping at their heels or putting them on the ropes now.

Hopefully Zen gives them a good slap.

Zen does not look that different to bulldozer. in terms of the way they are talking about it.

[patrickjp93]

Forget heat and power, make bigger cores and increase IPC!

IPC has little more to grow for SISD computing. Already most of the clock latencies per instruction are between 1 and 3 cycles. There's a hard theoretical limit tied to clock speed once every instruction only requires 1 cycle, and division will never be that fast anyway due to the algorithmic requirements. The GHz race is pretty much over. The ILP race is pretty much done too. It's up to programmers and compilers to deliver on it. Branch prediction was already Intel's strongest suit at 95+% accuracy. IPC is nearing the end of its growth. At this point newer, wider instructions need to be used, or tasks need to be broken down into more threads. Perhaps Intel could do 4-way or 8-way SMT like on Xeon Phi or Power 8 respectively, but you'd still need the thread count.

The age of big IPC gains is over. No one is going to blast ahead of Intel. Everyone will get very close to each other, and then it will be a contest between SIMD, MIMD, and MPMD computing models: who can fit the most cores with the most ALUs/dedicated units, the deepest pipeline, the widest pipeline, the highest clock speed, the biggest cache, and the fastest cache? It's not going to be about IPC when every instruction is at its theoretical limits. It's going to be about which programming model wins out and who will have the hardware best suited for it. So far Intel has the best SIMD. Oracle has the best MPMD, and IBM has the best MIMD CPU. AMD has the best heterogeneous integrated solution, but that's a small distraction from the big transformative battle coming in computer science.

[patrickjp93]

No, i was unaware that it was not going to be slated for a full retail release. Where was it ever stated that it wouldn't be? I've been following broadwell since its original announcement for a long time now, and even have an entire build dependent on its release. How do you know for certain that Newegg does not intend to stock it? Have they said this somewhere?

Newegg reps at E3 have basically confirmed it.

[MageTank]

Newegg reps at E3 have basically confirmed it.

Can i get a source for this? Is there any existence on the internet of this happening? I am trying to find it to no avail. 

[patrickjp93]

Wait, so the line that was introduced because another line was delayed also got delayed? Did not see that coming.

It could be Intel wants to more heavily overhaul their next generation of graphics architecture. Skylake is still gen 8/8.5. Kabylake is gen 9. If Intel's trying to put full DX 12 support, H.265, GPU thread preemption, tighter heterogeneous integration, and maybe 5K transcoding hardware in, that could be the reason Kaby is now delayed. It seems to me Intel is either double-pumping its tick-tock cadence for both CPU/GPU architecture to minimize production risks, or ASML shit the bed on multipatterning potentials of their current machines with EUV still not being nearly as viable as Intel prefers. If Samsung tries to take the risk with EUV and hits the sorts of problems Intel's been predicting, then 14nm is going to be a repeat of the aged 28nm node GPUs endured.

[patrickjp93]

Can i get a source for this? Is there any existence on the internet of this happening? I am trying to find it to no avail.

JayzTwoCents will probably have a video about it before long. I got it straight from the goat's mouth so to speak.

[Notional]

AMD could take a hint from intel and work on power efficiency if they're not going to work on improving performance by much (For their GPUs, CPUs, and APUs )

 

A lot of that is due to lower nodes, What this means is, that AMD and Intel will be on the same node again next year (14nm), and that Kaby Lake will launch at about same time as ZEN. But if Zen launches as highend processors, they might be a real threat to Intel, as the "x99" version won't launch until 2017.

 

This is very good news for us all indeed. Much more competition!

[patrickjp93]

A lot of that is due to lower nodes, What this means is, that AMD and Intel will be on the same node again next year (14nm), and that Kaby Lake will launch at about same time as ZEN. But if Zen launches as highend processors, they might be a real threat to Intel, as the "x99" version won't launch until 2017.

This is very good news for us all indeed. Much more competition!

Broadwell E and Skylake E are both coming in 2016 as well. It's not like AMD will get off Scott free.

[Paranoid Kami]

AMD could take a hint from intel and work on power efficiency

[Notional]

Broadwell E and Skylake E are both coming in 2016 as well. It's not like AMD will get off Scott free.

 

Oh I know, but broadwell isn't fantastic compared to Haswell. Maybe 5% better? I guess it will be better if they bump up the number of cores on all the -e versions, but the non -e versions are only up to 4 cores, so doubt it. I really hope ZEN sturs up some shit.

[Paralectic]

They have a monopoly position. 

[TheKDub]

 

They may say that, but I'm not going to believe it until I see it.