Official Nvidia GTX 970 Discussion Thread

[Faa]

You're now turning this on AMD? This is about Nvidia lying to their customers about the specifications of their card, AMD didn't lie about anything.

 

Also, you compared a 970 Strix to a 290 reference earlier, pick an aftermarket one next time, otherwise it's just biased. Lastly, giving out personal threats to anyone with AMD CPU's is just childish and pathetic.

AMD did lie about Mantle's performance; http://www.overclock.net/t/1528559/directx-driver-overhead-and-why-mantle-is-a-selling-point-bunch-of-benchmarks/0_100

Also I'm not comparing a 970 Strix to a 290 reference card, a vaporx isn't a reference card.

[silberdrachi]

Don't graphics cards perform bad when all the v ram is populated?

 

Yes but the issue is that the gpu doesnt have as much game accessible ram as it was marketed to have.

[Lays]

Thank you. 

 

 

I wonder if/when the Strix will get a fix.

 

Maybe for CPU's when the next chipset comes out, not chancing their GPU's, too much of a reputation for bad drivers for my liking.

 

Not going to debate this, just my opinion on the AMD GPU's.

 

 

It doesn't even fix anything though, users in the thread said it didn't fix anything

[Bloodkil933]

AMD did lie about Mantle's performance; http://www.overclock.net/t/1528559/directx-driver-overhead-and-why-mantle-is-a-selling-point-bunch-of-benchmarks/0_100

Also I'm not comparing a 970 Strix to a 290 reference card, a vaporx isn't a reference card.

 

 

And consuming twice the power and while easily being above 70 dBa in CF. Here's a noise test measured from 4" for the 290 Sapphire vaporx people praised as a quiet card; http://be.hardware.info/reviews/5540/8/sapphire-radeon-r9-290x-vapor-x-oc-4-gb-review-geluidsproductie

56 dBa at full load, 33 dBa at idle which is almost as loud as a 970 strix at full load (38dBa); http://be.hardware.info/reviews/5621/23/nvidia-geforce-gtx-980--970-review-incl-ultra-hd-test-asus-vs-msi-geforce-gtx-970

I can set my 970's fan speed fixed to 800 rpm while maintaining temps around 75°

 

Since when did a VaporX reach 56dBA?

 

You're now turning this on AMD? This is about Nvidia lying to their customers about the specifications of their card, AMD didn't lie about anything.

 

Also, you compared a 970 Strix to a 290 reference earlier, pick an aftermarket one next time, otherwise it's just biased. Lastly, giving out personal threats to anyone with AMD CPU's is just childish and pathetic.

 

You must clearly misunderstand what Mantle was intended to do, it was intended to lower CPU overheads and allow more work to be offloaded to the GPU, so people with low end CPU's would see more more performance than those with high end ones.

[Razzaa]

 Since when did a VaporX reach 56dBA?

 

You must clearly misunderstand what Mantle was intended to do, it was intended to lower CPU overheads and allow more work to be offloaded to the GPU, so people with AMD CPU's would see more more performance like those with Intel.

Fixed that for you

[jaggysnake57]

jaggysnake57 it is people like you that make the world what it is .... a **** hole!  Stop making excuses for false advertising and so on.  You as a consumer should want it to turn out well for all consumers all the time or wait do you work for Nvidia or have some sort of sponsorship from them?  If so that would explain your stance then which would be a person only worried about their own bottom line and not the world as a whole.

first off if you think that being ripped off is the worse thing that can happen in the world your ignorant and thefore your argument is moot.  i am a consumer, i own a 970 gigabyte and i am currently trying to get the thing RMAed due to a piss poor clock (not stable at +50 on the core, bined chips my ass) so please dont talk to me like you are some moral crusader for all thats right. my stance is that i brought my card for 1080p and 1440 down the line. personally i think if you brought a 970 for 4k your an idiot 4k is dual 980 territory right now. so the whole 3.5gb ram, dont care. not to mention that i brought my card, as so many others do, based on reviews and benchmarks from people like linus, logan, jayz2cents et el not bassed on its specs. btw can you tell what an ROP and how having less has made a difference to you? these benchmarks showed the 970s performance, regardless of the change in ROPs or l2 cache and included the 3.5/.5gb ram issues given most did 4k testing.

 

for me this 970 thing is a bit like selling a car that is a3 litre v12 has 300bhp does 0-60 in 6 seconds and can hit 150mph, then 6 months after it comes out saying we made an error in printing the specs it only has 2.5 litre v8 engine but still has 300bhp and still does 0-60 in 6 and tops out at 150mph.  the performance is the same just how it gets there is different

 

Fine then nvidia will be sued by false advertisement as intel was when they falsified pentium 4 benchmark numbers.

 

yeah but intel fudged benchmarks therefore the performance, nvidia fudged specs, the performance is still the same

 

Oh boo hoo, lets give the man an Oscar for his sob story. Buddy, I lived through a head on collision that left me unable to WALK without wishing I had a direct line of morphine to keep the pain at bay, so don't come up here with this "woe is my life, you don't know anything" bullshit. Maybe be happy instead of being such a miserable pissant who derails and ruins the good vibes of anything? 

Keep being mad that my threads generate good discussion and yours generate shitposting and hate because thats what you encourage. Maybe stop acting like a punk and you'll get more favourable interactions with people. 

@zappian, unless you're going to launch a class action lawsuit today (and provide proof that you did) then please stop trying to be a social justice warrior and being so outraged for everyone on this forum. Put your balls where you claim they are and do something beyond signing some bullshit petitions that mean nothing. 

Oh wait, you won't. Cause you and most people here are just kids with little grasp on how the world works and think its a nice sentiment to scream "SUE THEM SUE THEM LIARS LIARS PANTS ON FIRES". God, since when did society encourage their youth to be such self obsessed do-gooders who care only to ACT like they know whats important but instead have no fucking idea what actually is. 

@jaggysnake57 is right. Title 2, Net neutrality, tax reform, education reform; you clowns don't know a thing about things that actually affect your lives but you're all good to go to make a fucking Mt. Everest out of this. 

wait is this me and you agreeing......i feel dirty

 

seriously though you hit the nail right on the head!

[Bloodkil933]

Fixed that for you

 

No I did not, people with Intel CPU's were also getting performance boosts with Mantle.

[79wjd]

It doesn't even fix anything though, users in the thread said it didn't fix anything

I saw that, but I don't put a whole lot of faith in random people on the internet -- especially ones who complain (it's like negative reviews on a product on Newegg/Amazon/etc... -- most of those reviews come from people who had issues because they were being stupid). 

 

I'm not saying that it fixes anything, but I'd like to see some reliable/intelligent source saying yay or nay. 

[Lays]

I saw that, but I don't put a whole lot of faith in random people on the internet -- especially ones who complain (it's like negative reviews on a product on Newegg/Amazon/etc... -- most of those reviews come from people who had issues because they were being stupid). 

 

I'm not saying that it fixes anything, but I'd like to see some reliable/intelligent source saying yay or nay. 

 

 

If it did fix anything, there would of been massive propaganda and posts about Gigabyte fixing it.

[BiG StroOnZ]

 

Actually, out of curiosity, is that still true of AMD gpus in crossfire using mantle?  I thought that part of the reason that crossfire/sli setups in the past could only use what each gpu had in memory alone was because the technique they used was alternate frame rendering, where each gpu would render the scenes one after the other.  With mantle, and presumably dx12, asychronous rendering is possible where one gpu could perform rendering tasks using its memory while another gpu, even of differing power and ram amounts could work on some other arena or visual effect.

 

 

VRAM still doesn't stack. 

 

This is absolutely irrelevant to the issue at hand. Firstly, there should be no "one company and the other"; we're the consumers, and we should keep an eye for both of them - not side with one of them and pledge loyalty, while trying to dig a grave for the other one. When both companies were actually interested in competing with each other and had a somewhat equal footing (Radeon 5870 launched at 400$ for example), we had rather good prices for the amount of performance offered. Right now, the equal GPUs have bloated in prices in a way that supercedes inflation.

 

And yes, it is bullshit. And yes, nVidia does that too.Just check their boxes. GTX 590 is a 3GB card and a 690 is 4GB, but you also know it is not true just like how the 295x2 8GB is not true. You also knew that the 2GB 4970x2 wasn't true. But it's the same kind of bullshit that you have with mobile GPUs; anyone with a little bit of information or a quick google search will figure out that the Xfire / SLI / multiGPU card VRAM is for each card only, and anyone with a little bit of searching about how to buy a good laptop will figure out that 980M is not a GTX 980.

 

This thing, however, had professional reviewers fooled. You couldn't be more informed about it unless you really started digging up some stuff or were using some test programs which somehow started struggling before the full 4GB of VRAM was in use.

 

GTX 970 was supposed to have PRETTY MUCH the same performance @ higher resolutions as what 980 would. BOTH cards have rather anemic VRAM for high-end in 2015, but they're at least directly comparable in how much they suck. If you were buying a single GTX 970 for a 1080p monitor, this changes nothing. If you were buying a GTX 970 SLI setup with prior information, you could have treated it as a superior alternative to a single GTX 980, depending on the games you play.

 

The 970 and 980 still performs exactly how it does in all the benchmarks before people knew about any of this, so I don't see any of your point. 970 SLI is fine (most people knew it was a superior alternative to a single 980):

 

 

 

 

 

Performs just as good as a 295x2 in most scenarios, which the 295x2 supposedly has all of it's memory available at the same bandwidth. So if even at higher resolutions it is performing well. I'm not understanding what's the issue here. They didn't fake benchmarks. The benchmarks are still completely valid. The ROP count was a misrepresentation. However that doesn't take away the performance numbers that currently exist. The performance numbers are still valid. None of the reviewers faked those performance numbers. So what is the exact point here. This is not like NVIDIA payed off all of their reviewers to fake benchmarks to make it seem like it performed better than it actually does. The amount of ROPs it has that was released is not in line with what it actually has. Nonetheless, that doesn't change how it performs. Even in high resolution scenarios.

 

Even a single 970 is within 13% of a 980 at high resolutions:

 

 

Still a 970 is faster than a 290 on average, and a 980 is faster than a 290X on average.

 

Why not throw a napalm in Nvidia's courtyard again with the TITAN Z.

 

Manufactures like to capitalize on how much VRAM is actually available. Even if each GPU can only address half of it.

 

Let's just drop a nuke on all of Silicon Valley then. That should take care of it. 

[79wjd]

If it did fix anything, there would of been massive propaganda and posts about Gigabyte fixing it.

Maybe, maybe not. I'm still surprised it wasn't publicized at all -- I would've expected an update like that to be an active topic on LTT. So it might just be something that people haven't noticed yet. 

 

Like I said, I'm not saying it fixed anything -- and I'm assuming it hasn't changed anything until I see proof otherwise, but the potential for it to be a solution is still there. 

[Faa]

Since when did a VaporX reach 56dBA?

 

Since it's measured from 4"? That card isn't quiet.

 

You must clearly misunderstand what Mantle was intended to do, it was intended to lower CPU overheads and allow more work to be offloaded to the GPU, so people with low end CPU's would see more more performance than those with high end ones.

 

Read that thread I linked, everything was about cutting CPU overhead which we compared AMD's Mantle with Nvidia's DX there was almost no difference but there was a huge difference between Nvidia's & AMD's DX. AMD claiming Mantle performs so much better than DirectX is a complete lie. I don't know what you guys think makes Mantle amazing. Because it's a low-level API? Well so is DX since 2002.

[Shahnewaz]

I said perhaps, still gotta ask. http://www.tones.be/producten/grafische-kaarten

They don't have any true 4GB card I can replace my card with.

But they won't take your 970 return anyway cause it's not defective. I think I'm missing/not understanding something here.

 

You're now turning this on AMD? This is about Nvidia lying to their customers about the specifications of their card, AMD didn't lie about anything.

Whoa whoa hold on..... where in my post did I turn this on AMD??? :mellow: :huh:

AMD has absolutely nothing to do with this thread or issue anyway.

[Guest Kloaked]

-snip-

Even with all of that information that clearly backs up what I and other people have been saying, you're still a white knight fanboy of Nvidia!!!11!!1!one!

[Bloodkil933]

 

Since it's measured from 4"? That card isn't quiet.

 

 

Read that thread I linked, everything was about cutting CPU overhead which we compared AMD's Mantle with Nvidia's DX there was almost no difference but there was a huge difference between Nvidia's & AMD's DX. AMD claiming Mantle performs so much better than DirectX is a complete lie. I don't know what you guys think makes Mantle amazing. Because it's a low-level API? Well so is DX since 2002.

 

 

Who is ever 4" away from their GPU??

 

 

Whoever or wherever told you that must clearly be mistaken...

[Bloodkil933]

But they won't take your 970 return anyway cause it's not defective. I think I'm missing/not understanding something here.

 

Whoa whoa hold on..... where in my post did I turn this on AMD??? :mellow: :huh:

AMD has absolutely nothing to do with this thread or issue anyway.

 

I was talking about Faa, not you mate

[zanduh]

So there was misinformation and some people are taking it more personal than others. People are allowed to react however they see fit. 

[marldorthegreat]

The majority of people are really happy with the 970 purchases form what I can read form comments, despite this story.

It seams to affects most doing 4K gaming, which isn't a lot of people. And teh 970, even if it didn't have this problem, is really not a good purchase for 4K, new big games will probably struggle on the 970 at 4K and high settings.

THEY STILL LIED. Being happy about it is not the point

[79wjd]

THEY STILL LIED. Being happy about it is not the point

And they should be called out/bitched at for lying, but going after them with pitchforks complaining about how "my 970 is now crap" is nonsensical as the performance is still the same as every benchmark showed at the time od purchase. 

[sgloux3470]

It's not even about that. Let me put it this way. You give me the choice of buying two oranges, one is slightly larger than the other. I opt to buy the smaller one because it fits my needs only to realize that it's not even an orange, it's a bitter grapefruit.

Of course my GTX 970 isn't worthless, I never implied it is. Not for 1080p or 1440p at least. But for 4K it is utterly worthless now. I had bought the card in anticipation of a 4K G-Sync monitor upgrade this year along with another 970 to power it. But now Nvidia slaps me in the face and tells me my card is worthless for the purpose I had originally bought it for. I'm sorry but if this isn't infuriating enough, the mere aspect of deception is enough for me to call it quits with this rotten arrangement.

UPDATE : And despite what Faa my lead you to believe I do in fact HAVE an MSI Gaming GTX 970, not that I care what an inconsiderate flame-baiter thinks.

Plenty of games run in 4K without touching 3GB of vram. Those that do are engines that intelligently allocate leftover VRAM. I have a spreadsheet that I'm working on for 4K testing and this is one of the things I'm keeping track of. Will update this post with the link later.

[alicskysareblue]

OP is being rather sensational (there really needs to be a rule against that on these forums)

 

read the anantech article and lets be logical what does nividia gain by lying ? even if they are in full damage control, they are not known for being stupid. 

[79wjd]

OP is being rather sensational (there really needs to be a rule against that on these forums)

 

read the anantech article and lets be logical what does nividia gain by lying ? even if they are in full damage control, they are not known for being stupid. 

Well, it wouldn't be the first time a company lied....so...yea. (Kingston changing the NAND on the V300, Ubi proclaiming 30FPS to be better as it's more cinematic/Consoles are more powerful than pcs)

 

Although I do believe it was simply miscommunication. 

Edited January 27, 2015 by colonel_mortis

[zappian]

OP is being rather sensational (there really needs to be a rule against that on these forums)

 

read the anantech article and lets be logical what does nividia gain by lying ? even if they are in full damage control, they are not known for being stupid. 

 

Selling cards to early adopters , 100 millon 970 sold , rivers of money.

Not much you know.

[GoodBytes]

THEY STILL LIED. Being happy about it is not the point

Please read the rest of the thread, and my other posts.

[zappian]

first off if you think that being ripped off is the worse thing that can happen in the world your ignorant and thefore your argument is moot.  i am a consumer, i own a 970 gigabyte and i am currently trying to get the thing RMAed due to a piss poor clock (not stable at +50 on the core, bined chips my ass) so please dont talk to me like you are some moral crusader for all thats right. my stance is that i brought my card for 1080p and 1440 down the line. personally i think if you brought a 970 for 4k your an idiot 4k is dual 980 territory right now. so the whole 3.5gb ram, dont care. not to mention that i brought my card, as so many others do, based on reviews and benchmarks from people like linus, logan, jayz2cents et el not bassed on its specs. btw can you tell what an ROP and how having less has made a difference to you? these benchmarks showed the 970s performance, regardless of the change in ROPs or l2 cache and included the 3.5/.5gb ram issues given most did 4k testing.

 

for me this 970 thing is a bit like selling a car that is a3 litre v12 has 300bhp does 0-60 in 6 seconds and can hit 150mph, then 6 months after it comes out saying we made an error in printing the specs it only has 2.5 litre v8 engine but still has 300bhp and still does 0-60 in 6 and tops out at 150mph.  the performance is the same just how it gets there is different

 

 

yeah but intel fudged benchmarks therefore the performance, nvidia fudged specs, the performance is still the same

 

wait is this me and you agreeing......i feel dirty

 

seriously though you hit the nail right on the head!

Performance is NOT THE SAME at 4k.

 

http://www.reddit.com/r/buildapc/comments/2tu86z/discussion_i_benchmarked_gtx_970s_in_sli_at_1440p/