Official Nvidia GTX 970 Discussion Thread

[patrickjp93]

So there is no such thing as future proofing is just tired gamer dogma?

Eh, if you have a 5960X now and push it up to 4, 4.5GHz, you'll have a beastly chip for a decade unless we jump to graphene and get the huge clock boosts that will inevitably bring. There is such a thing as future-proofing when it comes to CPUs, at least on the Intel side. My dad worked off a Q6600 for almost 8 years for instance. It was only when he decided he wanted to do educational videos for a professional firm that he found out there are much better chips for rendering these days. Now he has a 4790k, and I expect that'll last him another 8 years or more.

[Thony]

Nvidia just started digging, wow. What a start to 2015.

[SteveGrabowski]

it is when you dont check how the product performs. its like when i bought a 770 in january last year and would now complain that its not a good card for 1440p... but i checked benchmarks and knew what i was buying. youre trying to futureproof with a card not meant for that

 

Advertising 4GB of VRAM seems to be targeting future proofing since nothing uses 4GB now unless you're talking 4k, which as you have said, isn't something this card was ever designed for.

[Menta]

we all know its still a great card and will be in the times to come honestly at 1080p maybe a few years. but still there are other concerns as why NV did not correct the specs or came out with a statement, will they do it again?

 

why it look so long to figure it out and passed all the review sites.

 

this is not about performance 

 

 

 http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/shopping/shopping-abroad/guarantees/index_en.htm in the midle of the page they gave a example and it fits perfect in ou case

"Sample story
Non-conformity of goods is not always immediately apparent

Mirek ordered a laptop, which appeared to work well. However, more than a year after buying it, he discovered that it had less memory than it was supposed to have.

Although this problem had not been obvious to him immediately, and the laptop was still functional, it nonetheless did not conform to what was advertised or agreed when he bought it. Mirek was therefore able to obtain a partial refund from the shop. "

This is in the link that I put, so at least here in EU If someone push a litle harder I think that the stores I going to be force to acept at leat a a partial refund .

[LukaP]

Fair enough, is see where you're both coming from.

 

I don't agree with what Nvidia has done. I know it does not affect performance (for the most part). Waiting 3-4 months to correct misinformation is wrong and the claimed bandwidth of the memory is wrong for the .5GB which is false advertising. What is stupid is people thinking it's magically going to make their card worse or worse than what was shown in benchmarks. It will perform the same now as it did back then.

 

I would like to see a small disclaimer for the .5GB on the specs just like there should be about dual GPU cards and their VRAM.

i agree completly. its not right that it took them this long, but it changes nothing. thats it

[LukaP]

Advertising 4GB of VRAM seems to be targeting future proofing since nothing uses 4GB now unless you're talking 4k, which as you have said, isn't something this card was ever designed for.

no, advertising 4GB of ram targets the fact that there is 32Gb worth of GDDR5 on the card. the fact that there is so much there, is because AMD last gen had to one up NVs 3GB, and they couldnt just "stay behind" for one more generation.

[79wjd]

Fair enough, is see where you're both coming from.

 

I don't agree with what Nvidia has done. I know it does not affect performance (for the most part). Waiting 3-4 months to correct misinformation is wrong and the claimed bandwidth of the memory is wrong for the .5GB which is false advertising. What is stupid is people thinking it's magically going to make their card worse or worse than what was shown in benchmarks. It will perform the same now as it did back then.

 

I would like to see a small disclaimer for the .5GB on the specs just like there should be about dual GPU cards and their VRAM.

I agree with you that it's not right, and that there should be a disclaimer. However, do keep in mind, engineers likely wouldn't have seen the misinformation spread and PR team wouldn't even know the specs are wrong. So I can genuinely believe it took some time for it was found out -- and then, like everything in big business, it took some time for them to make an announcement. 

 

 

Advertising 4GB of VRAM seems to be targeting future proofing since nothing uses 4GB now unless you're talking 4k, which as you have said, isn't something this card was ever designed for.

It's like the 4gb 270. Is that advertised as a 4k card because it has 4gb of VRAM? 

[bogus]

i agree completly. its not right that it took them this long, but it changes nothing. thats it

Luka you need to pass beyond the stage of "its not right", to its illegal. There are laws that forbid this kind of actions - this is literally playing with peoples money.

[Sidiox]

The performance indeed stays the same, there is no denying that. But how would you like it if you set out to buy a car, you see all the reviews that say it has a v8, and with that it does x mph and has y horsepower. So you like that and buy the car. Then after 4 months you find out that the car doesn't have a V8 but instead a V6 +2 empty cylinders that aren't connected (I don't know cars) , but the performance and all that is still true. Wouldn't you still feel cheated? Ofc this isn't a perfect analogy but it shows how I feel at least. 

[LukaP]

Luka you need to pass beyond the stage of "its not right", to its illegal. There are laws that forbid this kind of actions - this is literally playing with peoples money.

its not illegal if their PR department plays it right, which they are.

 

and its not playing with anyones money, the performance is still there, you just dont realise youre blowing this out of proportions.

 

 

and dont ever, ever call me Luka, im not your friend. 

[SteveGrabowski]

Boy Luka's pissed this morning

[TheRetiredSlave]

TO the people who are saying that the GTX 970's performance at 4K is absolutely crippled, I made this little chart:

Just to clarify, the "performance scaling difference" numbers show how much better the performance of the 980 scales than the 970. A negative number means that the 970 scaled better than the 980.

So, by my math, on average the GTX 970 performance at 4K scales ~2% worse than the GTX 980 at 4K (compared to their performance at 1080p).

If you think that the 980 is a magically good performer at 4K and that the 970 is a total piece of garbage at 4K, you're simply wrong. The performance now is still the same performance as it always has been. We can guess that the performance two years from now will also show a similar story; that the 980 scales a couple percent better than the 970, but the 970 still performs close and is/was substantially cheaper.

If you want top-end performance, buy the top-end card. I'm not saying that Nvidia is in the right; I'm just saying that getting pissed of and saying that they're the worst company ever is overreacting to something that isn't very big..

[Razzaa]

Nvidia will not be held responsible because they didn't sell the card to the consumer. This is the response from Gigabyte:

 

Dear ,

This is the hardware design and since there is nothing wrong with the hardware, there is no return offer on it. Below is the official statement from NVIDIA for your reference. 

The GeForce GTX 970 is equipped with 4GB of dedicated graphics memory. However the 970 has a different configuration of SMs than the 980, and fewer crossbar resources to the memory system. To optimally manage memory traffic in this configuration, we segment graphics memory into a 3.5GB section and a 0.5GB section. The GPU has higher priority access to the 3.5GB section. When a game needs less than 3.5GB of video memory per draw command then it will only access the first partition, and 3rd party applications that measure memory usage will report 3.5GB of memory in use on GTX 970, but may report more for GTX 980 if there is more memory used by other commands. When a game requires more than 3.5GB of memory then we use both segments.

Regards,
GIGABYTE

[LukaP]

Boy Luka's pissed this morning

Yes, pissed off that retards blow shit out of proportions, when in reality, its not even close to being a problem

[SteveGrabowski]

Yes, pissed off that retards blow shit out of proportions, when in reality, its not even close to being a problem

 

Does this mean we're not friends, Luka? 

[LukaP]

Does this mean we're not friends, Luka? 

we never were. but i dont hold grudges, so if you realise youre the idiot in this thread, i will treat you like everyone else again.

 

hell if @patrickjp93 managed to get me to treat him like everyone else again, im sure you can (no offense patrick)

[zappian]

The amount of nvidia fanboys that defend nvidia after they lied ,faked specs and spit in their face.

 

[SteveGrabowski]

we never were. but i dont hold grudges, so if you realise youre the idiot in this thread, i will treat you like everyone else again.

 

hell if @patrickjp93 managed to get me to treat him like everyone else again, im sure you can (no offense patrick)

 

I hate to lose a friend over half a GB of VRAM. It's not right.

[bogus]

Sarcasm, irony and just the odd joke. Please learn it people.

I'm currently studying International Business Administration on university (bachelor) and I know that of course, this is not how it works at all (well maybe a little of the humour aspect). why does everything has to be taken seriously when this was clearly a joke. When I was an intern at the compass group I was surprised how relaxed the ambiance was and that people in the management actually made decisions on the fly-that is within reason of course-. Of course I am not linking this to the nvidia issue but you have to understand that even the big companies, actually especially the big ventures more often than not have an unique business model that does not match the theoretical "optimal" company structure. Of course they have a lot in common but some differ substantially.

Second, this isn't some made up story just out of the blue. Pcper had a conference call with nvidia where they stated marketing and engineering had a "miscommunication". I liked how pcper put it in other words marketing didnt ""understand"" what it meant.

Without going too off topic (well on topic but not on your question) It's just a joke.

Well I'm a product manager, who've worked previously in media agency's and I know what comes in and what goes out in the briefings. What is known, not known, and who knows it. This kind of shit doesn't go unnoticed, not even in PRE-RELEASE. This is defined during the product development, so marketers can work upon it - then it's presented INTERNALLY, before even being presented to creative agency's or media agency's.

I said it because that's what you said, and ironically is what NVIDIA is trying to feed to the media (what i've hilighted in bold), to feed them and the 970 owners - witch is bullshit.

The problem is that people are buying into it, like this is some sort of "ups! how clumsy of us!" when besides being known among them, I bet my right testicle as this was part of their marketing strategy - to sell this as a full 4GB 256bit card, as a trimmed down 980, to justify it's price and the price of the 980. And it is in fact a trimmed down 980, but it had some costs... costs they decided to hide and not highlight - typical of NVIDIA.

 

The problem is that this "ups" moment it's illegal.

[LukaP]

The amount of nvidia fanboys that defend nvidia after they lied ,faked specs and spit in their face.

 

 

lied about a number of ROPs and the vRAM bandwith. the benchmarks are what they are, thats what we are defending

 

I hate to lose a friend over half a GB of VRAM. It's not right.

you definitely wont lose a friend

 

The problem is that people are buying into it, like this is some sort of "ups! how clumsy of us!" when besides being known among them, I bet my right testicle as this was part of their marketing strategy - to sell this as a full 4GB 256bit card, as a trimmed down 980, to justify it's price and the price of the 980. And it is in fact a trimmed down 980, but it had some costs... costs they decided to hide and not highlight - typical of NVIDIA.

 

It is still a 4GB 256b card nevertheless, and it still performs like it was shown to, only now we know how they made it perform worse than a 980

[zappian]

its not illegal if their PR department plays it right, which they are.

 

and its not playing with anyones money, the performance is still there, you just dont realise youre blowing this out of proportions.

 

 

and dont ever, ever call me Luka, im not your friend. 

 

They faked specs sweetie.

 

The performance is close , but the issue here is the moral implications of what happened

 

its like selling you a 1 TB SSD that has 100 MB of 5400 rpm HDD and 900 GB of true SSD.

 

Its the same thing that happened here.

 

 

Exibit A:

 

The video i linked 

 

Exbith B:

Fake specs at launch:

 

REVISED SPECS after this debacle

 

Original specs:

 

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/asus-geforce-gtx-970-strix-review,5.html

 

If you choose to ignore this FACT you are simply a fan boy.

[bogus]

its not illegal if their PR department plays it right, which they are.

 

and its not playing with anyones money, the performance is still there, you just dont realise youre blowing this out of proportions.

 

 

and dont ever, ever call me Luka, im not your friend. 

I call you what ever I want to call you. And I don't want to be your friend. Deal with it.

Back on topic: You think this is something that can be solved by PR? How clueless are you?!

They sold THE WRONG PRODUCTS to people. There are no sweet talks when it comes to the law - in the UE they are pretty much fucked up if people want refunds - http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/shopping/shopping-abroad/guarantees/index_en.htm

At least inform yourself.

[Razzaa]

 

 

It is still a 4GB 256b card nevertheless, and it still performs like it was shown to, only now we know how they made it perform worse than a 980

This^^^

[LukaP]

They faked specs sweetie.

 

The performance is close , but the issue here is the moral implications of what happened

 

its like selling you a 1 TB SSD that has 100 MB of 5400 rpm HDD.

 

Its the same thing that happened here.

 

Dont. Call. Me. Sweetie.

 

The performance of the 970 is what it is. its a 300$ card that can do 1080/1440p@60FPS, nothing more. we knew that from the day it was released. the fact that it has less ROPs and a different memory structure than what we thought before has nothing to do with it, and frankly, as a consumer, you need not care of that, if you get sufficient framerates from it

[SteveGrabowski]

I call you what ever I want to call you. And I don't want to be your friend. Deal with it.

Back on topic: You think this is something that can be solved by PR? How clueless are you?!

They sold THE WRONG PRODUCTS to people. There are no sweet talks when it comes to the law - in the UE they are pretty much fucked up if people want refunds - http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/shopping/shopping-abroad/guarantees/index_en.htm

At least inform yourself.

 

I still want to be Luka's friend.