What makes Linux great for you and what do you think about the future?

[CosmicEmotion]

For me, Linux is the pinnacle of human-centric technology. It supports old hardware, has unbeatable workflow catered to any need and takes care of the users privacy and security like no other OS. The fact that it's open source is an amazing bonus as well.

 

A simple way to look at Linux vs Windows differences is looking at OBS vs Streamlabs with one exception I will get to a little later on. OBS is extremely customizable yet simple enough for the common person to use it after minimal set up. Streamlabs sets up literally all the basics and essentials you need without any effort required from the user but has far less features. Furthermore, Streamlabs is extremely heavy on the machine it's running while OBS uses the least resources possible.

People may start streaming by using Streamlabs but more often than not they will end up in OBS. Why? Just because it's human-centric and not all humans are the same, which is a good thing.

 

The only difference between Linux and OBS is the chicken and egg order. OBS came first and as such everything is based off of it. Linux though, came last and as such it has to break decades of habitual Windows usage, industry bias and word of mouth misconceptions. It's getting there though and anyone who tells me that a humanity exists, which does not use Linux in the future, is living in their own bubble. Because the future of humanity cannot be anything else but human-centric. The battle is already won since its inception.

[WereCat]

 

People should just use whatever works best for them. The true future is virtualisation with HW which fully support resource sharing so that you can use multiple OS seamlessly. 

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

30 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

For me, Linux is the pinnacle of human-centric technology.

[CosmicEmotion]

Can anyone not having to say anything about the subject please not comment?

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

5 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

Can anyone not having to say anything about the subject please not comment?

This is a forum, you don't get to pick and choose what people can say just because you want to plug your ears. This ain't an echo chamber. 

[CosmicEmotion]

15 minutes ago, WereCat said:

 

People should just use whatever works best for them. The true future is virtualisation with HW which fully support resource sharing so that you can use multiple OS seamlessly. 

 

What if all apps worked on a single OS that could satisfy anyone's needs, both tech age-wise and workflow-wise? Woudn't that be optimal compared to using multiple OSes?

[CosmicEmotion]

2 minutes ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

This is a forum, you don't get to pick and choose what people can say just because you want to plug your ears. This ain't an echo chamber. 

There's a little concept called "off-topic" last time I checked. This is not your free-troll zone.

[WereCat]

5 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

 

What if all apps worked on a single OS that could satisfy anyone's needs, both tech age-wise and workflow-wise? Woudn't that be optimal compared to using multiple OSes?

That's just wishful thinking. There are features and disadvantages to each OS and there's no way to satisfy everyone. 

 

Linux is a prime example of that. Just look at how many distros are there. 

[CosmicEmotion]

1 minute ago, WereCat said:

That's just wishful thinking. There are features and disadvantages to each OS and there's no way to satisfy everyone. 

 

Linux is a prime example of that. Just look at how many distros are there. 

Yeah but having multiple OSes is like having different standards for sockets for example. Like a USB thing. Having a specific platform to develop on that is versatile enough to cater to any need I think is much more beneficial than having to care about 3 different OSes that are fundamentally different from one another.

[Needfuldoer]

On the server, Linux is rock solid.

 

On the desktop, Linux is a Jenga tower.

 

All the good Linux applications (that aren't system utilities) have Windows ports.

[WereCat]

6 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

Yeah but having multiple OSes is like having different standards for sockets for example. Like a USB thing. Having a specific platform to develop on that is versatile enough to cater to any need I think is much more beneficial than having to care about 3 different OSes that are fundamentally different from one another.

Yeah but each OS is a tool. One does something better than the other and vice versa. You'd have to make an OS that has ALL the features. 

Even then that may seem like a huge bloat to someone and very difficult with so many choices to pick that they may just not want to use it. 

[CosmicEmotion]

3 minutes ago, WereCat said:

Yeah but each OS is a tool. One does something better than the other and vice versa. You'd have to make an OS that has ALL the features. 

Even then that may seem like a huge bloat to someone and very difficult with so many choices to pick that they may just not want to use it. 

 

Linux can do that, I can't think of a feature that is on Windows OS-wise and not no Linux or at least in development for Linux. Could you give some examples?

[joshfrog]

For me, It's not windows and that's good.

I hope it get's better at running games and other software i like/use.

[WereCat]

20 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

 

Linux can do that, I can't think of a feature that is on Windows OS-wise and not no Linux or at least in development for Linux. Could you give some examples?

Biggest issue for me is absolutely terrible window compositor on Wayland but otherwise I prefer Linux desktop experience over Windows. 

What annoys me most are little things that still need some work to iron out quirks which was annoying enough to go back to Windows on my main PC. 

 

And VR and Overclocking is far better on Windows too. 

[CosmicEmotion]

1 hour ago, joshfrog said:

For me, It's not windows and that's good.

I hope it get's better at running games and other software i like/use.

 

I think gaming is extremely decent on Linux. Other software might vary but the most used ones shoud work just fine.

 

45 minutes ago, WereCat said:

Biggest issue for me is absolutely terrible window compositor on Wayland but otherwise I prefer Linux desktop experience over Windows. 

What annoys me most are little things that still need some work to iron out quirks which was annoying enough to go back to Windows on my main PC. 

 

And VR and Overclocking is far better on Windows too. 

 

Wayland is great, what don't you like about it? Do you have an Nvidia GPU maybe? Cause I'm testing NVK these days and it really is going extremely fast and extremely smooth. I was playing Sekiro on it a few hours ago.

[WereCat]

42 minutes ago, CosmicEmotion said:

 

Wayland is great, what don't you like about it? Do you have an Nvidia GPU maybe? Cause I'm testing NVK these days and it really is going extremely fast and extremely smooth. I was playing Sekiro on it a few hours ago.

I use AMD. 

 

VRR does not work on GNOME with Wayland at all. 

It works on KDE fine as long as you stick to single monitor but has issues in multi-monitor setup. 

 

Window capture is hit and miss as well

[joshfrog]

4 hours ago, CosmicEmotion said:

I think gaming is extremely decent on Linux. Other software might vary but the most used ones shoud work just fine.

Gaming performance isn't so much of an issue, its more i play several games that just wont work on linux because of different forms of DRM or anit-cheat. Yes i no some DRM and anit-cheat work on linux but doesnt mean that game works with it.

I have a steamdeck and love it, running steamos not windows of course, im also running popos on my 2 laptops and is perfect for the use case for em.

I would love to install and run steamos or linux on my desktop but as i said above not all my games i play work with it and sometimes just dealing with the software is the last thing i want to do after an update breaks the game on linux. (yes i get linux people software updates n stuff are things you need to make sure work before updating but games dont work that way or the software for games)

 

I also at times need adobe software for work so unless adobe makes using there software work on linux i wont be able to switch as much as i want to.

[CosmicEmotion]

7 hours ago, WereCat said:

I use AMD. 

 

VRR does not work on GNOME with Wayland at all. 

It works on KDE fine as long as you stick to single monitor but has issues in multi-monitor setup. 

 

Window capture is hit and miss as well

 

I see, I am on AMD+Nvidia (on NVK) as well, on a laptop with two screens and VRR seems to work fine in KDE as well as in Sway. The only feature I can't wait until February 28th to come is HDR so we can finally have complete parity with Windows' features. Beyond that OBS seems to work completely fine as well (although no NVENC with NVK but FFMPEG VAAPI is really good these days) but I'm missing the Docks in Wayland, hopefully that will be fixed soon.

 

These are not Wayland issues though, it's just features that weren't really looked into and apps that haven't caught up still. I generally think Wayland is extremely good at what it's supposed to do and will only get better.

 

3 hours ago, joshfrog said:

Gaming performance isn't so much of an issue, its more i play several games that just wont work on linux because of different forms of DRM or anit-cheat. Yes i no some DRM and anit-cheat work on linux but doesnt mean that game works with it.

I have a steamdeck and love it, running steamos not windows of course, im also running popos on my 2 laptops and is perfect for the use case for em.

I would love to install and run steamos or linux on my desktop but as i said above not all my games i play work with it and sometimes just dealing with the software is the last thing i want to do after an update breaks the game on linux. (yes i get linux people software updates n stuff are things you need to make sure work before updating but games dont work that way or the software for games)

 

I also at times need adobe software for work so unless adobe makes using there software work on linux i wont be able to switch as much as i want to.

 

I see. That's more than fair. If Windows works well for you then no need to change. The anticheat issue will probably not be solved until much later, I mostly play RPGs so my Linux system works more than fine for my needs and I also get all the benefits of Linux which is quite nice.

[CyberNerd2024]

I've been daily driving Ubuntu for a couple years now. Compared to Windows, I like that Linux gives more control to the user. I get more privacy and I can choose to remove any software that I want.

I do hope Linux does improve on it's gaming capability in the future though.

[Ralphred]

Quote

What makes Linux great for you

It does what I tell it to, nothing more, nothing less.

[dragonfly43]

Life is not just Games.

Zillion of tiny devices and Super Computers only run Linux.

[tikker]

For me it's great simply because it suits my programming workflow vastly better than Windows, and I don't own a mac. For non-programming stuff like gaming or graphic design kind of things I still use Windows, since there isn't a satisfying alternative with linux support for the latter for me, for example.

 

  

21 hours ago, CosmicEmotion said:

For me, Linux is the pinnacle of human-centric technology.

I would say that crown goes to Apple's ecosystem, because I consider a human-centric technology one that focuses on ease of use and not configurability of freedom to do whatever you want within the OS. The vast majority of users will never need that. The way things interact in Apple's ecosystem is pretty darn smooth as far as I've seen.

18 hours ago, CosmicEmotion said:

Wayland is great, what don't you like about it? Do you have an Nvidia GPU maybe? Cause I'm testing NVK these days and it really is going extremely fast and extremely smooth. I was playing Sekiro on it a few hours ago.

It has gotten a lot better since its start, but running into support issues with Wayland is still not rare. Teams couldn't screenshare because of it, Barrier/Synergy didn't work with it, Nvidia is hit or miss. Now a common thread in my experience is that there is no support (either because they simply haven't done it, or because the way things operate go against Wayland's operating model), which relates to the next:

10 hours ago, CosmicEmotion said:

These are not Wayland issues though, it's just features that weren't really looked into and apps that haven't caught up still. I generally think Wayland is extremely good at what it's supposed to do and will only get better.

If something is not supported or implemented, then for the end user that still makes it a Wayland issue.

[E-waste]

On 1/26/2024 at 8:29 PM, CosmicEmotion said:

For me, Linux is the pinnacle of human-centric technology. It supports old hardware

Technically, Windows can and does too, just not as light, and Windows 11 is actively encourages trashing hardware from 2018, with cpu such as ryzen 3700x as "unsupported".  That is entirely inaccurate, and because of such, the message should be removed from the system.  All the extra hidden steps to bypass tpm chip checks and creating a local account is just a money grab.

 

Microsoft desparately wants more money from new hardware sales, because they aren't quite rich enough and need the money to continue improving Windows.  Microsoft has a cloud platform called Azure, where over 60% of the software used is open-source.

 

Microsoft is just barely hanging on with Windows, and the only reasons they have left for people to use their system is:

 

Familiar for decades

 

Bribed software support

 

Bribed hardware (driver) support

 

Proprietary DirectX support for games, where Microsoft uses their money to help game studios use DirectX tools.  If DirectX was cross-platform I wouldn't care as much.

 

Microsoft is only in the lead because of corporate greed and vendor-lockin.  They have locked all Windows users into a superior system, because they bribe manufacturers to only support Windows.  Wifi usb chips have non-existant features on Linux that Windows has in literally two clicks.

 

It's not that Linux cannot do these tasks, it's that corporate greed prevents software to do it from being developed in Linux.

 

Some new keyboards don't work on Linux, but do on Windows.  What the hell is going on with a keyboard in the last 50 years that you can't implement BASIC key function?  That's total bullshit, and intentional by manufacturers or vendors.  It's not that Linux can't read a keyboard input, but rather the device driver is somehow arbitrarily, needlessly different than a keyboard a year ago?

 

Adobe, and other large software companies, see the Linux space as too small to be worth the expense of supporting.  They could release a containerized flatpak or snap to work on all Linux, but they won't.

 

That forces users to use an operating system.  But who cares?  The software functions require a high-performance computer, so Windows will run just fine, so it's not like consumers are being harmed by this.  It's just not as much freedom.

 

Freedom... Let's think about that.  In some countries, citizens have freedoms.  A business is free to exist, and do all sorts of awesome things.  But, should a business that lives in an area that supports citizen freedom, be creating a product that literally dictates what programs can and can't be used, or on what system?  Should they be free to bribe hardware manufacturers to not support basic functions like sleep mode, or strange keyboard software that is unusable in other operating systems?

 

The other side of the argument is you are free to not use the software, and not agree to the license, but now that is literally IMPOSSIBLE.  Nearly any business will use Windows, and active directory.  It's just what people know, and Windows network employees are not as expensive to hire as Linux network employees.

 

I guess we're all just stuck in this operating system space for the forseeable future.  Corporate greed dictates and controls our lives, from seeds in the ground, to the software on our computers and televisions.

 

I think it will be several decades before operating systems begin to become compatible with one another, just as it may be centuries, before corporate greed will allow cpu from separate companies to work on different motherboards, or perhaps never.  There was a time, but will it be again?

 

Linux developers are amazing, and allow keeping electronic components above ground.  Older amd gpu can now support Vulkan, with a driver upgrade.  If they get thrown into to ground, a few years extra doesn't matter.  Don't get me started on mineral mining.  That's atrocious, it's the podcast episode in my signature.  Computer hardware is more than fast enough for games, and other tasks, that there is absolutely zero need for a new cpu or gpu.

 

A pc build around 2014 should run all games available today.  If it doesn't, compromise a bit and turn off anti-aliasing and similar performance hogs.  This is to reduce demand or need for new hardware components.  Consumers could also stop buying games that need 8 GB of memory or more to run.  My favorite example is GTA V working on a device from 2009 or before, the Xbox 360.  I think it had 512MB of system memory and 512MB video memory.  Maybe it could technically be 1 GB, I don't fully comprehend it.  The CPU has three cores at around 1.7 Ghz.  A system that antiquated could run a new game, almost a decade after the hardware was released.  So why won't other game studios optimize their games to do the same?

 

1 GB of memory is enough for a game in 2014, so why does another game need 8GB of memory?  Is it just less work to optimize, or cost less development time?  I don't see the experience of the game improving at all with higher memory use.  The GPU is different.  The user gets to decide how many graphical features are in use, why not allow a similar option for the game itself in terms of system memory use?  The way things are going, games requiring 16 GB of memory will be seen as normal and accepted.  Game storage is also increasing, but I somewhat understand that.  I think about 20 GB per game should be plenty.  The Windows operating system, with over 17 million lines of code, to run all hardware on your system, is not even 15 GB, so... games are more complicated than operating systems, or is it just the models and graphical files that take up so much space?

 

This went from what makes Linux great to hardware requirements.  It relates back to the electronic waste and human suffering in cobalt mining.  So the idea is to reduce our reliance on these hardware upgrades to reduce the demand for new hardware production.  I guess not enough people know or care to make a massive change at this point, maybe 25 years ago, but not now.

 

With being locked into Windows, we are subject to Microsoft's dictation of our lack of software rights, and the reason to give up and agree to those loss of software rights, is to have a computer system that runs software we want.  If we disagree to not give up our software rights, we give up our access to a huge amount of software.  Since most people don't WANT to have those software rights, and are content with not knowing how the system works, those users are not giving up anything at all, and getting access to most of the world's software.

 

It will probably take a lifetime for this operating system stuff to work itself out, and Microsoft will lock-in their users, or developers will lock-in their users to Windows for as long as it seems reasonable.  There is no visible solution.

 

Linux is used in space, and on another planet.  Windows is too locked down and rigid to allow such achievments.  An operating system that can support a device on another planet, can't have wifi devices that work as they do on Windows.  An operating system that literally runs the entire Internet, can't have driver support that is on par with Windows.  An operating system that runs EVERY wireless access point, router and switch, can't have accesspoint and client mode work simultaneous as it does on Windows?  Corporate greed.

[CosmicEmotion]

Quote

I would say that crown goes to Apple's ecosystem, because I consider a human-centric technology one that focuses on ease of use and not configurability of freedom to do whatever you want within the OS. The vast majority of users will never need that. The way things interact in Apple's ecosystem is pretty darn smooth as far as I've seen.

There's a Linux distro for any kind of usage. If you use something like ElementaryOS you essentially have a free Mac. Many people think that having many distros is Linux's curse but I think it's its greatest blessing.

 

Quote

If something is not supported or implemented, then for the end user that still makes it a Wayland issue.

That's naive at best. It's not a Wayland issue no matter what the end user thinks and the Linux devs can't do anything about it. App devs need to support Linux better. End of story.

 

 

 

Quote

With being locked into Windows, we are subject to Microsoft's dictation of our lack of software rights, and the reason to give up and agree to those loss of software rights, is to have a computer system that runs software we want.  If we disagree to not give up our software rights, we give up our access to a huge amount of software.  Since most people don't WANT to have those software rights, and are content with not knowing how the system works, those users are not giving up anything at all, and getting access to most of the world's software.

 

 

I mostly agree with your post and this point here is exactly how the world works in general which is the major issue. But I strongly believe that as Linux gets easier to be accessed even the casual users will recognize its immense and numerous advantages and will start using it sooner than one might think. It's already started with the Steam Deck and it's only gonna get better.

 

 

[GCandy77]

On 1/27/2024 at 2:25 AM, Needfuldoer said:

All the good Linux applications (that aren't system utilities) have Windows ports.

 

Do you know of a pulseeffects or easyeffects for windows?