Xbox Is Now the First Carbon Aware Console, Update Rolling Out to Everyone Soon

[Middcore]

OP, are you under the impression that this update allows Microsoft to remotely turn off "your" Xbox (the quotes are because you said you don't own one) and determine when you're allowed to use it? 

 

Because if not, it seems like you're just mad because you don't believe climate change is real and therefore you resent any measure ostensibly taken to combat it, even when it has no impact on you. 

[Middcore]

16 minutes ago, starsmine said:

Literally the only people who care to opt out are the small select group that are turning this into a culture war for reasons unknown to me. So they all know about the feature now, they can go ahead and turn it off. Use more power during standby to "own the other side" or whatever they think it does. Have the xbox turn on to update during peak power costs so you can feel good about giving money to the power utilities in your area or whatever. That is your choice to make still. 
There is no need to create friction for users who do not know about the feature to turn powersavings on.

This really feels like actively sticking your face in a truck tail pipe while it rolls coal to stick it to all those damn prius drivers moment honestly. Go do that if that is your life choice.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I think you will find most people prefer not doing that and would rather not have the friction of having to choose to not actively do that.

 

 

[darknessblade]

2 hours ago, Middcore said:

OP, are you under the impression that this update allows Microsoft to remotely turn off "your" Xbox (the quotes are because you said you don't own one) and determine when you're allowed to use it? 

 

Because if not, it seems like you're just mad because you don't believe climate change is real and therefore you resent any measure ostensibly taken to combat it, even when it has no impact on you. 

It is not that I don't believe that it does not exist.

 

What I have a issue with is that companies shift the blame to the consumer.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220504-why-the-wrong-people-are-blamed-for-climate-change

 

If companies really want to battle climate change they should not do it at ANY expense of the consumer.

Meaning: The consumer CANNOT be affected in ANY way, shape or form.

 

Is it that difficult to understand that I want to keep my consumer rights, and not get F*CKED by another company, just because they want claim the Xbox saves a minimum of 1 picogram of CO2 per hour per consumer in said modus.

 

 

[Middcore]

Just now, darknessblade said:

It is not that I don't believe that it does not exist.

Just gonna let the triple negative pass here... 

 

Just now, darknessblade said:

What I have a issue with is that companies shift the blame to the consumer.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20220504-why-the-wrong-people-are-blamed-for-climate-change

 

If companies really want to battle climate change they should not do it at ANY expense of the consumer.

Meaning: The consumer CANNOT be affected in ANY way, shape or form.

 

Is it that difficult to understand that I want to keep my consumer rights, and not get F*CKED by another company, just because they want claim the Xbox saves a minimum of 1 picogram of CO2 per hour per consumer in said modus.

 

 

 

What is the "expense" to consumers? How is anyone "fucked" by this change?

 

For four pages of this thread you have completely failed to articulate how this harms anyone. Microsoft announced the change, and you can opt out of it if you wish, although there is no benefit to doing so. 

 

So why the anger? 

 

 

 

[leadeater]

14 minutes ago, Middcore said:

What is the "expense" to consumers? How is anyone "fucked" by this change?

 

For four pages of this thread you have completely failed to articulate how this harms anyone. Microsoft announced the change, and you can opt out of it if you wish, although there is no benefit to doing so. 

 

So why the anger? 

But they could of, they did not, but they could. So screw them for not doing something they could of done, but didn't do, because they could of done it. So damn them to hell! 

[darknessblade]

12 minutes ago, Middcore said:

 

For four pages of this thread you have completely failed to articulate how this harms anyone. Microsoft announced the change, and you can opt out of it if you wish, although there is no benefit to doing so. 

 

So why the anger? 

Because of 1 simple reason:

 

If companies think they can get away with something as simple as changing users their 'power settings" without PRIOR CONSENT.

they will start changing more things without the consumer its explicit consent.

 

 

[WhitetailAni]

1 minute ago, darknessblade said:

Because of 1 simple reason:

 

If companies think they can get away with something as simple as changing users their 'power settings" without PRIOR CONSENT.

they will start changing more things without the consumer its explicit consent.

 

 

This is called a "slippery slope" fallacy. If A happens (minor change), Z has to happen (gigantic major change).

 

I advise reading this:

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

 

If you respond with "I'm not reading that" I will have no choice but to laugh at you.

[IkeaGnome]

5 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

Because of 1 simple reason:

 

If companies think they can get away with something as simple as changing users their 'power settings" without PRIOR CONSENT.

they will start changing more things without the consumer its explicit consent.

 

 

You still have yet to show where Microsoft blamed you for climate control. 
You have yet to show where this enables them to remote shut down an Xbox. 
 

You’re forgetting that they updated sleep states THAT WERE ALREADY IN THE XBOX to be able to use less power and download game updates while sleeping. 

[Quackers101]

as for settings, I would have more concern with windows and google, in how they add or change to benefit them... screw edge

[Zodiark1593]

21 hours ago, starsmine said:

That did not explain jack shit as to what the issue is.

The issue is that firmware updates exist? Is that it?
Dead ass, what the actual fuck is woke about using less electricity? This makes zero sense, even in the context of the culture war. 
Xbox giving you the option to say, hey update during this time window means that xbox, is woke?
What is the issue here? all consoles have had consistant firmware updates since the ps3/360/wii gen, and even then, the ps2 had firmware updates it needed to run for a few games. 
 

 

Pretty simple explanation.

 

Negative emotions don't really give an F about logic (to the point of being self-destructive in some cases), and negativity is what fuels a culture war. Absolutely nothing new in human history, and the examples of merely bad, to outright disastrous outcomes, are numerous.

 

That's all. The only winning move is to not play. Focus on the things in your life that are within your control, and your personal interests that make you happy.

[darknessblade]

1 hour ago, FakeKGB said:

This is called a "slippery slope" fallacy. If A happens (minor change), Z has to happen (gigantic major change).

 

I advise reading this:

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope

 

If you respond with "I'm not reading that" I will have no choice but to laugh at you.

Gave it a quick glance, and most of their arguments are from the political spectrum.

 

Also not a personal attack, but based on your location, I can already know you have never had enjoyed any form of proper consumer protection.

 

Which is my main argument, that what Microsoft does goes against consumer protection regulations.

  

1 hour ago, IkeaGnome said:

You still have yet to show where Microsoft blamed you for climate control. 
You have yet to show where this enables them to remote shut down an Xbox. 
 

You’re forgetting that they updated sleep states THAT WERE ALREADY IN THE XBOX to be able to use less power and download game updates while sleeping. 

 

They blame you the consumer the very second they change settings of YOUR DEVICE WITHOUT YOUR PRIOR CONSENT.

 

Also if they really want people to use said settings, why haven't they opted for a GUI prompt after a system update like """"HEY: you can change power-settings to reduce electricity cost at menu XXX"""".

 

But with them changing it without prior consent, it shows that they do not care about you the consumer, and only their greenwashing agenda.

[starsmine]

5 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

They blame you the consumer the very second they change settings of YOUR DEVICE WITHOUT YOUR PRIOR CONSENT.

 

Also if they really want people to use said settings, why haven't they opted for a GUI prompt after a system update like """"HEY: you can change power-settings to reduce electricity cost at menu XXX"""".

 

But with them changing it without prior consent, it shows that they do not care about you the consumer, and only their greenwashing agenda.

Explicitly no. they are not blaming the customer by changing the default firmware behavior. 

There is no blame here at all. MS pushed a change that made A MICROSOFT product consume less. If microsoft is "blaming" anyone its themselves and they are rectifying that by lessening the life cycle emissions of a product that they designed, manufactured, and sold in the millions, meaning millions of tons of CO2 not produced via a direct result of microsoft making a change over the rest of the usable life of the product. At NO point is the home user involved.

will you stop going on about "without prior consent"? That is nonsense. Dont update your xbox then if you dont consent to software updates. Like I dont know what you think a software update is. There are plenty of people out there with xbox consoles on old firmwares. be like them. 
You did consent when you hit update/allow automatic updates.
If you no longer consent, take it off the network. 

[Middcore]

49 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

Gave it a quick glance, and most of their arguments are from the political spectrum

 

 

Slippery slope fallacies are very common in political debate. Your noting this is not a rebuttal to the charge you are commiting the fallacy.

 

Your arguments sum up to "It is a moral ill for the product I bought to be improved without my consent, even if I am given the option of declining the improvement should I want to for some inexplicable reason."

 

This is impossible to take seriously.

[Arika]

Why are there all these marbles just laying all over the floor all over this thread? Did someone lose them?

[WhitetailAni]

1 hour ago, darknessblade said:

Also not a personal attack, but based on your location, I can already know you have never had enjoyed any form of proper consumer protection.

That's nice. I'm perfectly happy with the consumer protection I get, as I almost exclusively buy used tech via eBay.

[AlwaysFSX]

10 hours ago, darknessblade said:

If they want to make a change why aren't they shutting of the lights in the offices during the night when nobody is around, or just use PIR sensors in all the hallways, making useless waste of having light on in hallways nobody uses a thing of the past?

I didn't know you worked there, please tell us more about how their offices operate.

[darknessblade]

1 hour ago, starsmine said:

Explicitly no. they are not blaming the customer by changing the default firmware behavior. 

There is no blame here at all. MS pushed a change that made A MICROSOFT product consume less. If microsoft is "blaming" anyone its themselves and they are rectifying that by lessening the life cycle emissions of a product that they designed, manufactured, and sold in the millions, meaning millions of tons of CO2 not produced via a direct result of microsoft making a change over the rest of the usable life of the product. At NO point is the home user involved.

will you stop going on about "without prior consent"? That is nonsense. Dont update your xbox then if you dont consent to software updates. Like I dont know what you think a software update is. There are plenty of people out there with xbox consoles on old firmwares. be like them. 
You did consent when you hit update/allow automatic updates.
If you no longer consent, take it off the network. 

 

Please show me the exact step to step OFFICIAL guide from Xbox/microsoft themselves, to disable automatic firmware updates.

 

Since if you cannot disable it that means they change setting without prior consent. 

Which will eventually cause issues similar to a issue with a smart oven thinking it was a steam oven

https://hackaday.com/2022/03/18/welcome-to-the-future-where-your-microwave-thinks-its-a-steam-oven/

 

Or in other words they push a update that essentially bricks your console, because the power settings have been set to automatically shut down after 1 minute of boot. meaning you only have  1 minute to disable said settings.

 

Let me give another example of the Apple TV which gave a update that forces users to have a IPHONE to activate their apple TV

https://www.techradar.com/news/apple-has-made-it-harder-to-use-apple-tv-4k-without-an-iphone-and-its-a-step-back

If you do not own a Iphone, you have to use a different less common activation method, that is not possible without having to fully reset your device.

 

Would you like it if Microsoft suddenly demands you to use a windows Phone to activate your Xbox-ID?

Or force you to have a microsoft ID on your PC linked to said device, having to install a special app from the Microsoft store to send a activation key to your Xbox?

 

Just because a company wants to change settings no matter how minor, without the users consent, does not mean they can just do it.

Consumer protection laws exist for a reason, and banning a company from changing settings without the users explicit consent is one of them.

 

49 minutes ago, Middcore said:

Slippery slope fallacies are very common in political debate. Your noting this is not a rebuttal to the charge you are commiting the fallacy.

 

Your arguments sum up to "It is a moral ill for the product I bought to be improved without my consent, even if I am given the option of declining the improvement should I want to for some inexplicable reason."

 

This is impossible to take seriously.

I am not talking about it being morally ill for the product being improved.

 

They can improve it all they want. but if they change settings without prior consent, that is one step to far, since that goes against consumer protection laws/regulations.

 

 

[leadeater]

8 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

since that goes against consumer protection laws/regulations.

No, no it doesn't.

[starsmine]

4 hours ago, darknessblade said:

 

Please show me the exact step to step OFFICIAL guide from Xbox/microsoft themselves, to disable automatic firmware updates.

You are not playing online anyways if you dont want firmware updates. 
Those firmware updates are the anticheat for online games as well as a drm check for streaming services as well as how it gets new keys for blu-rays that have yet to come out. 
(also guess what, anticheat and drm is always changing registry settings in the background that the user does not have access to in the OS)

Less shitposty
>

Quote

Do I have to install the update? 

No, but if you want to play or communicate on the Xbox network, you must have the latest console software. New games may also require the update before you can play them.

https://support.xbox.com/en-US/help/hardware-network/settings-updates/system-update-overview#:~:text=Once the console has shut,which will cancel the update.

[starsmine]

24 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

Or in other words they push a update that essentially bricks your console, because the power settings have been set to automatically shut down after 1 minute of boot. meaning you only have  1 minute to disable said settings.

 

What?

 

24 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

Let me give another example of the Apple TV which gave a update that forces users to have a IPHONE to activate their apple TV

https://www.techradar.com/news/apple-has-made-it-harder-to-use-apple-tv-4k-without-an-iphone-and-its-a-step-back

If you do not own a Iphone, you have to use a different less common activation method, that is not possible without having to fully reset your device.

Yes that is a problem, but its not an industry norm, nor do I expect apple to keep it like that. But I fail to see how that applies to the xbox
And surprise, surprise, apple didnt keep it like that

Quote

Update: Apple contacted @hugelgupf to provide a workaround. Apparently, fully signing out of iCloud and back in on the Apple TV will prompt terms and condition screen which can be accepted on the same device. Weird. Original story below.

https://9to5mac.com/2023/01/16/apple-tv-iphone-required/

Apple made an oopsie, but then apple went and rectified it, OH NO the horror on that one. 
 

24 minutes ago, darknessblade said:

Just because a company wants to change settings no matter how minor, without the users consent, does not mean they can just do it.

Consumer protection laws exist for a reason, and banning a company from changing settings without the users explicit consent is one of them.

 

I am not talking about it being morally ill for the product being improved.

 

They can improve it all they want. but if they change settings without prior consent, that is one step to far, since that goes against consumer protection laws/regulations.

lmao what? In no country is that against consumer protection law. I have literally no idea where you are getting these ideas.
Again, I dont know if you know what a software update is with the way you phrase these things.

[Lightwreather]

5 hours ago, darknessblade said:

If companies really want to battle climate change they should not do it at ANY expense of the consumer.

Meaning: The consumer CANNOT be affected in ANY way, shape or form.

Hate to break it to you, but no.

Things will have to change for everyone, consumers, prosumers, producers and all, everyone has a part and everyone will feel some or the other change, if they don't, then nothing's happening

 

[vetali]

I keep my Xbox fully powered off... it boots fast enough from a cold start for me.

[mononymous]

Didn't Microsoft annouce last year that Windows would be carbon aware with their updates?
I guess woke culture wasn't overhyped back then to be news worthy I guess.  

 

Does that mean people who are complaining about Xbox and uses Windows would now switch to Linux?

[IWolfieI]

Has anyone got some tin foil?

 

 

In all seriousness, isn't this just emulating what Sony has been doing since the PS4 with rest mode but more efficient? As it's been stated many times you do not own the software just a licence to access and use it, just like the games you would play on your fictional Xbox, you don't own the game just a licence to play it. If you worked with enterprise or business solutions you'll get said licence and sometimes it's as strict as not allowing you to do your own troubleshooting and having to contact the company to fix it. It's quite literally how every single modern device is maintained.

Microsoft's only mistake is to tell people like you they've made this change, the ‘standby’ state is likely always on by default. It's just they're updating it to be more energy efficient and save you time with your fictional xbox when your fictional game needs updating, god forbid.

 

[darknessblade]

11 hours ago, leadeater said:

No, no it doesn't.

Maybe not in New-zealand. but in europe it does go against consumer regulations.

 

  

11 hours ago, starsmine said:

You are not playing online anyways if you dont want firmware updates. 
Those firmware updates are the anticheat for online games as well as a drm check for streaming services as well as how it gets new keys for blu-rays that have yet to come out. 
(also guess what, anticheat and drm is always changing registry settings in the background that the user does not have access to in the OS)

Less shitposty
>

https://support.xbox.com/en-US/help/hardware-network/settings-updates/system-update-overview#:~:text=Once the console has shut,which will cancel the update.

Or in other words It is a FORCED OPT-IN, if you want to keep using the console.

  

11 hours ago, starsmine said:

lmao what? In no country is that against consumer protection law. I have literally no idea where you are getting these ideas.
Again, I dont know if you know what a software update is with the way you phrase these things.

It is against the DMA and DSA regulations.

https://digital-strategy.ec.europa.eu/en/policies/digital-services-act-package

Quote

The Digital Services Act and Digital Markets Act aim to create a safer digital space where the fundamental rights of users are protected and to establish a level playing field for businesses.