Google trying to force me to buy Pixel again...

[Nena Trinity]

[Nena Trinity]

40 minutes ago, Benji said:

And where exactly does this say that you should buy a Pixel device? Nowhere. You can buy any device that actually has Google Play Services and is certified, which is pretty much any Android device that isn't a Huawei or ZTE phone. Doesn't have to be a Pixel.

What phone are you running anyway?

Well Huawei P40 Lite, everything ran nicely until yesterday. The only things still working are games and find my phone the two most important things I needed it for anyway? So yeah most Google stuff I can do from browser so right now my only issue is what if I most update the thing that makes the games work?

[jaslion]

11 minutes ago, Nena Trinity said:

Well Huawei P40 Lite, everything ran nicely until yesterday. The only things still working are games and find my phone the two most important things I needed it for anyway? So yeah most Google stuff I can do from browser so right now my only issue is what if I most update the thing that makes the games work?

This phone isn't allowed to use google play services. So it's working as intended.

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, Benji said:

Yeah. Does that happen to be a phone that had these initially unlockable, but factory-disabled Google Play Services? Because this phone officially doesn't come with them, so it doesn't surprise me that it doesn't work anymore. But that isn't Google's fault, it's Huawei's fault.

But Google blocked it, Huawei just did not include it. So they technically did not break any law, end user should be allowed to install any software they please right?

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

This phone isn't allowed to use google play services. So it's working as intended.

Yeah but Huawei was not allowed to ship it with the software, legally end user can do anything? That is the way it normally works.

[jaslion]

Just now, Nena Trinity said:

But Google blocked it, Huawei just did not include it. So they technically did not break any law, end user should be allowed to install any software they please right?

Depends. But your phone is HARDWARE blocked by google so even if you can install it on there it won't work because it will always be identified as a Huawei phone and thus seize function.

 

So basically want google services? Get a phone that has em.

[jaslion]

Just now, Nena Trinity said:

Yeah but Huawei was not allowed to ship it with the software, legally end user can do anything? That is the way it normally works.

Legally it's a very gray thing because well android is free to use but google services aren't.

[Nena Trinity]

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

Depends. But your phone is HARDWARE blocked by google so even if you can install it on there it won't work because it will always be identified as a Huawei phone and thus seize function.

 

So basically want google services? Get a phone that has em.

 

Just now, jaslion said:

Legally it's a very gray thing because well android is free to use but google services aren't.

True enough I suppose but what about the million of devices sold in Asia by smaller brands? All of their Google probably has the same messages popping up, how many of those will now become E-waste and what is even worse is in those countries where consumer rights is non-existent? Think about ALL THAT E-WASTE!

[jaslion]

2 minutes ago, Nena Trinity said:

 

True enough I suppose but what about the million of devices sold in Asia by smaller brands? All of their Google probably has the same messages popping up, how many of those will now become E-waste and what is even worse is in those countries where consumer rights is non-existent? Think about ALL THAT E-WASTE!

I guess they should have thought about that then?

 

It sucks but google will be evil overlord google. That and they were warned that it is only for legitimate devices. Which is why gapps works on lineageos phones that came with google originally but has issues on devices that didn't.

[Nena Trinity]

3 minutes ago, Benji said:

No, they shouldn't, because Google Play Services are actually a proprietary, not open-source service. Google certifies devices and they have the right to say no and also prohibit use of their services on non-certified devices, which is exactly what they did. Huawei actually did integrate the services but disabled them in their OS even though they weren't supposed to ship the devices with them because of failed certification and the restrictions imposed on them. They've seen "Oh, wait a minute, there's a Huawei device without Google Play Service certification" and blocked it. That's all there is to it. And the fact that, even with the most current OS (I assume you update your phone's OS) they still didn't remove it even though they don't have the certification, tells me that Huawei isn't really up-front about it as well.

Google has any right to refuse the usage of their services and they did.

This. Android is free to use and you can use it all you want, and Huawei can take the open-source variants all they want, which they do (which is what EMUI is at this point), but the Google Play Services are not free and have to be approved by Google.

 

Want a device with Google Play Services? You need to get one that is certified by Google. Which is, as I've mentioned, pretty much everything non-Huawei and non-ZTE. There isn't anything you can do about that.

 

1 minute ago, jaslion said:

I guess they should have thought about that then?

 

It sucks but google will be evil overlord google. That and they were warned that it is only for legitimate devices. Which is why gapps works on lineageos phones that came with google originally but has issues on devices that didn't.

Well I guess this means the claim Google has a Android monopoly is actually a issue, if a device doesn't have GAPPS like the LineageOS, Amazon, Huawei or the old Blackberries they cannot run any game or banking apps and sooner or later that is gonna be a problem. I also feel the amount of e-waste this is gonna cause should cause a legal ramifications for all parties involved. Lineage OS is a very good example it brings new life to old devices! It along with the other non-certified ending up in a landfill is gonna be disastrous.

[Nena Trinity]

6 minutes ago, Benji said:

Could people stop constantly talking about their e-waste and the landfills? I mean, you're responsible for buying this device even though you could've found out beforehand that it has no official support as opposed to complaining afterwards. People have the choice to buy devices with Google Play Services support and use them for as long as they like. A device, especially nowadays, doesn't last 20 years as it might have been at a certain point. You can't expect all relevant APIs to still be supported in 10+ years as many people would love to have it.

 

So, to recap at this point: You have the choice of either living with the restrictions or buying a new device that supports Google Play Services.

1 most people have 0 clue how dependant the app support is of Google Play services, two I bought the device to test that in the first place and its even worse than most can imagine. Not a single game and barely any app would work until I installed it majority of apps that did work was locally made apps for my country! The thing Epic Games is saying about Google monopoly is not a lie, ironically their game does also not work on Huawei out of box LMAO.

 

Am I screwed? Not yet it works for me right now but long term maybe not. Well the fairphone 4 looks kinda neat. Plus I got the P40 lite on a sale for nearly half price so...

[jaslion]

6 minutes ago, Benji said:

Now you know why it was on sale.

They can't even get rid of huawei's over here at massive discounts. Store my friend works at has a couple new in stock of most models but a literal bin of returned ones after a couple days because apps didn't work or they couldn't download things. You can find full flagship devices of theirs for so cheap. So great pocket camera's basically.

[OhioYJ]

You know you could just fix this right? 

 

Root it, change the device fingerprint. Same thing all of us with rooted devices do to stay certified. 

 

Not being certified on the play store really isn't too big of a deal. Just some apps won't show up. Examples most people notice right away are some of the streaming apps like Netflix. 

[Kilrah]

53 minutes ago, Nena Trinity said:

True enough I suppose but what about the million of devices sold in Asia by smaller brands? All of their Google probably has the same messages popping up, how many of those will now become E-waste and what is even worse is in those countries where consumer rights is non-existent? Think about ALL THAT E-WASTE!

Everything that was sold with Google services continues to be able to use them. That message only shows on devices that were advertised and sold without them and they were sideloaded, so not a problem for any of those smaller brands. 

 

And yes it sucks, I'm in the same position, the ones to blame aren't even Google but the US gov.

[Nena Trinity]

27 minutes ago, jaslion said:

They can't even get rid of huawei's over here at massive discounts. Store my friend works at has a couple new in stock of most models but a literal bin of returned ones after a couple days because apps didn't work or they couldn't download things. You can find full flagship devices of theirs for so cheap. So great pocket camera's basically.

They can be used in many ways, but the way most buy phones for due to apps nope. It's a step better than Windows phones and Blackberry devices especially since updates are still coming but unless the app makers stops kissing Google ass or Google allows non-certified again I am sorry to say it but land fill for most of them.

15 minutes ago, OhioYJ said:

You know you could just fix this right? 

 

Root it, change the device fingerprint. Same thing all of us with rooted devices do to stay certified. 

 

Not being certified on the play store really isn't too big of a deal. Just some apps won't show up. Examples most people notice right away are some of the streaming apps like Netflix. 

Huawei phones cannot be rooted.

12 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Everything that was sold with Google services continues to be able to use them. That message only shows on devices that were advertised and sold without them and they were sideloaded, so not a problem for any of those smaller brands. 

 

And yes it sucks, I'm in the same position, the ones to blame aren't even Google but the US gov.

Someone should yell at them for that next UN climate meeting.

 

Edit: some smaller brands might be affected, since their phones gives pop-up that the device is not certified. 

[Darkseth]

To be fair, it was well known, that the P40 and P40 lite will come without Google services.

You could've bought every other Android out there, had the same user experience and no issues with google services.

 

It doesn't have to be a Pixel. It simply can't be a Huawei next time. As unfortunate as that might be. I'd like them to continue beeing an option, but sadly, not like this.

[Nena Trinity]

11 minutes ago, Darkseth said:

To be fair, it was well known, that the P40 and P40 lite will come without Google services.

You could've bought every other Android out there, had the same user experience and no issues with google services.

 

It doesn't have to be a Pixel. It simply can't be a Huawei next time. As unfortunate as that might be. I'd like them to continue beeing an option, but sadly, not like this.

Yeah and worse yet, next trip to Asia once Pandemic is over I gotta double check that what ever I buy that is a local brand is certified also... My go to that is not Huawei or TECNO called my|phone is on the list of certified so they are good but all the others?

[ethan308666]

im pretty sure you only get this if your phones os has been modified in some sort of way 

[Donut417]

On 10/15/2021 at 6:19 AM, Nena Trinity said:

But Google blocked it, Huawei just did not include it. So they technically did not break any law, end user should be allowed to install any software they please right?

Android is self is open source and anyone can use it. Google services however is from Google, by Google and Google has the legal right to restrict those services. While you can side load those services and use them if they work, you dont have legal right to those said services. 

 

If I recall right the reason why your device might have not come with Google services is because of the pissing contest between the US and China. But thats besides the point, if the device was never intended to offer Google services you dont have the right to use Google services on the device. 

 

On 10/15/2021 at 6:34 AM, Nena Trinity said:

I guess this means the claim Google has a Android monopoly is actually a issue, i

They dont. There are other app stores available. Hell most Amazon devices run Android. Do you get Google services on them? NO, you have access to the Amazon app store. Android is open source, thats means anyone and their dog can download and install it on hardware. When Google services are offered, that generally means the company offering the hardware to consumers has an agreement with Google that most likely means they paid Google some money to have access to Google services. 

 

Next time do some research on a device and see if Google services are offered. 

[Nena Trinity]

8 hours ago, Donut417 said:

Android is self is open source and anyone can use it. Google services however is from Google, by Google and Google has the legal right to restrict those services. While you can side load those services and use them if they work, you dont have legal right to those said services. 

 

If I recall right the reason why your device might have not come with Google services is because of the pissing contest between the US and China. But thats besides the point, if the device was never intended to offer Google services you dont have the right to use Google services on the device. 

 

They dont. There are other app stores available. Hell most Amazon devices run Android. Do you get Google services on them? NO, you have access to the Amazon app store. Android is open source, thats means anyone and their dog can download and install it on hardware. When Google services are offered, that generally means the company offering the hardware to consumers has an agreement with Google that most likely means they paid Google some money to have access to Google services. 

 

Next time do some research on a device and see if Google services are offered. 

@Benji@jaslion @Darkseth@ohioYJ @Kilrah

The play store now works again, I did nothing and it just magically is back.  

[Heraldique]

On 10/15/2021 at 5:18 AM, Nena Trinity said:

Wow that really sucks. 

 

I would suggest trying to get the F-Droid App Store instead 

[Heraldique]

On 10/15/2021 at 5:18 AM, Nena Trinity said:

Download the Aurora AppStore from the APK.  Aurora will get any google app you need for you and bring it over to your phone. it’s also more private