Safety as DLC? Motorcycle Airbag vest will not deploy if you miss a payment

[suicidalfranco]

7 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

I don't get this, so just before you crash you pull the cord? Im pretty sure 90% of crashes are not planned, how would you know? Thats so dumb. 

what? no

when you crash, and you're pretty much flying off of your bike, from every possible side you can fly away from your bike, the cords, which is attached to your bike on one end and the jacket at the other end, gets yanked.

[Bombastinator]

8 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

what? no

when you crash, and you're pretty much flying off of your bike, from every possible side you can fly away from your bike, the cords, which is attached to your bike on one end and the jacket at the other end, gets yanked.

Military parachutists call that a static line. 

[kasugatei]

Any piece of hardware which you buy that requires some subscription to operate should be boycotted, period. In this case it can cost your life so just fu*k that s*it.

 

Another, but this time non life threatening example is I was looking for one interesting coffee roaster. It is a home grade device which costs around ~1000$. To use it you basically have to subscribe to their green coffee delivery service. Ok, at least you get something for your subscription. However, if you want to access custom roasting profiles you need to pay ~1500$ extra to unlock that feature. It is unlocked by custom license. So just fu*k you, there is no way I am willing to pay for hardware which I can't use in it's full potential, but I have to pay extra to use it's full potential. It is the same as if I bought 16 core CPU, but unless I pay additional 150% license only 8 cores will be operational.

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

what? no

when you crash, and you're pretty much flying off of your bike, from every possible side you can fly away from your bike, the cords, which is attached to your bike on one end and the jacket at the other end, gets yanked.

Oh i see they are attached to your bike like that. Why not just have airbags?

 

[Bombastinator]

55 minutes ago, RorzNZ said:

Oh i see they are attached to your bike like that. Why not just have airbags?

 

It is an airbag.  Just a stupidly expensive one that won’t go off if there’s a problem with your payment continuing for whatever reason.    “Oops” doesn’t really cut it when they’re trying to scrape half your face off the sidewalk.

[HenrySalayne]

I mean yes, this sounds like a scumbag business model, but: What's the leverage so people would actually pay for it? This vest has only one trick up its sleeve and that's what you have to switch off.

And maybe this is more of a scare tactic than an actual restriction of the product.

[suicidalfranco]

12 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Oh i see they are attached to your bike like that. Why not just have airbags?

 

it technically is, when the one in the OP detects the accident, the jacket expands like an airbag, in the case of the traditional one when the line gets yanked, it pops open a co2 that expands the jacket like an airbag. it's major purpose is to build enough pressure in combination with the helmet and make it so that the drivers head doesn't move... much... during the accident.

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, suicidalfranco said:

it technically is, when the one in the OP detects the accident, the jacket expands like an airbag, in the case of the traditional one when the line gets yanked, it pops open a co2 that expands the jacket like an airbag. it's major purpose is to build enough pressure in combination with the helmet and make it so that the drivers head doesn't move... much... during the accident.

What I meant to say is like with traditional airbag sensors that discharge in impact, rather than a cord or the internet. 
 

sorry if this is a stupid question 

[suicidalfranco]

1 minute ago, RorzNZ said:

What I meant to say is like with traditional airbag sensors that discharge in impact, rather than a cord or the internet. 
 

sorry if this is a stupid question 

cause in car you're enclosed in a box, while on a bike you either become a flying projectile or you slide out of the bike. different cases that require different solutions 

[Tech Enthusiast]

On 5/6/2021 at 9:19 PM, rcmaehl said:

 

 

My thoughts

Dear god. Please do not make safety features freaking DLC.

 

Sorry to break it to you, but that is already happening on cars of every major company.

If you don't pay for the features, they are still there.... but don't work.

 

Break assistant? Installed, but disabled.

Obstacle avoidance? Installed, but disabled.

 

It sucks, but it is already happening and here to stay, unfortunately. 

[PCGuy_5960]

10 minutes ago, Tech Enthusiast said:

 

Sorry to break it to you, but that is already happening on cars of every major company.

If you don't pay for the features, they are still there.... but don't work.

 

Break assistant? Installed, but disabled.

Obstacle avoidance? Installed, but disabled.

 

It sucks, but it is already happening and here to stay, unfortunately. 

Still, that's a one time payment. Having a subscription for a safety feature is a whole other level of scummy.

[Tech Enthusiast]

1 minute ago, PCGuy_5960 said:

Still, that's a one time payment. Having a subscription for a safety feature is a whole other level of scummy.

Not for every company, no.

And certainly not for every feature.

 

Also, this Vest we are talking about here, can also be bought with a one time payment. People can pick if they want that, or a monthly / yearly plan... still sucks, but you get the options.

[pythonmegapixel]

4 minutes ago, Tech Enthusiast said:

Also, this Vest we are talking about here, can also be bought with a one time payment. People can pick if they want that, or a monthly / yearly plan... still sucks, but you get the options.

It's also quite unusual that a safety feature add on in a car will literally double the cost of it.

[Quackers101]

1 minute ago, Tech Enthusiast said:

Not for every company, no.

And certainly not for every feature.

 

Also, this Vest we are talking about here, can also be bought with a one time payment. People can pick if they want that, or a monthly / yearly plan... still sucks, but you get the options.

no, as some stated, you still need the subscription.

The only thing I could agree with an subscription or DLC, is for more features, not for critical support or updates. So if you still get support for a single payment but more fancy stuff for a bigger cost or stuff that needs more updates and is not critical for operation of a safety device, then sure?

[Nayr438]

9 minutes ago, Quackers101 said:

no, as some stated, you still need the subscription.

Actually the site specifically states that if you buy the IN&BOX Module, you do not need to pay a subscription fee. The Subscription is to Lease the Module. The transcript posted in the original post is different than what is stated on the website, possibly just misinformation on the support side or a misunderstanding.

 

12 hours ago, Bombastinator said:

It is an airbag.  Just a stupidly expensive one that won’t go off if there’s a problem with your payment continuing for whatever reason.    “Oops” doesn’t really cut it when they’re trying to scrape half your face off the sidewalk.

Only if your Leasing the IN&BOX Module and have gone past your 30day grace period and ignored the indicators saying it wasn't active. They also state that they send notifications starting 30 days prior to your payment method expiring and while you are on your 30 day Grace Period after a payment is missed. If you purchase the Module, then it just always works.

With that said, the vest isn't really going to save your face from the sidewalk anyways.

 

 

[tikker]

So instead of death and taxes we now get death by taxes?

 

Didn't read all 5 pages, just adding my 2 cents. So I guess the biggest problem lies with the (understandable) confusion regarding payment. First you buy a $400 vest and then you find out you also need another $400 purchase/subscription  to make it work. If your product is useless without it, why can't this be simplified into an $800 purchase or $24/$240 a month/year subscription?

[Bombastinator]

How long does the vest remain viable and how long do the payments go on for though? I’m just wondering.  Safety gear generally has a finite lifespan.  This thing just keeps on getting more expensive the more we find out about it.  If the thing is good for say, randomly, 3 years.  Amortized cost per month is the cost of the device/36 plus monthly fee. So far. I also don’t know what this kind of thing costs to buy.  Apparently there are already devices in this space that work on a static line.  All that would be needed is a $25 arduino board and a motor controller to trip the “inflate” switch under specific circumstances. You could have something stringless and just replace the bits that have time limits basically forever.

[Bombastinator]

5 hours ago, Nayr438 said:

Actually the site specifically states that if you buy the IN&BOX Module, you do not need to pay a subscription fee. The Subscription is to Lease the Module. The transcript posted in the original post is different than what is stated on the website, possibly just misinformation on the support side or a misunderstanding.

 

Only if your Leasing the IN&BOX Module and have gone past your 30day grace period and ignored the indicators saying it wasn't active. They also state that they send notifications starting 30 days prior to your payment method expiring and while you are on your 30 day Grace Period after a payment is missed. If you purchase the Module, then it just always works.

With that said, the vest isn't really going to save your face from the sidewalk anyways.

 

 

Heh.  Trying various things they hope might save them from liability in the foreordained wrongful death court case.  

[Arika]

after seeing this on the WAN show, it gave me a new thought.

 

Say you buy it for $400. then spend $400 to unlock the full functionally and you fall off your bike, the vest is ruined because roads are not soft. does the full unlock carry over to a new vest if you buy it, or is the unlock tied to the 1 vest you unlocked it on.

[Bombastinator]

39 minutes ago, Arika S said:

after seeing this on the WAN show, it gave me a new thought.

 

Say you buy it for $400. then spend $400 to unlock the full functionally and you fall off your bike, the vest is ruined because roads are not soft. does the full unlock carry over to a new vest if you buy it, or is the unlock tied to the 1 vest you unlocked it on.

An interesting question al lot of safety equipment is like that.  Rock climbing ropes were generally rated for one(1) fall at which point they needed to be replaced. 

[mon1ka]

On 5/7/2021 at 5:31 AM, FakeATF said:

There should be no way that this should be allowed. Like, seriously, I should be able to use the product if I already paid for it. This honestly makes me sick

im pretty sure its in a weird grey area. id give it a week or two before the lawsuits roll in. 

 

 

[pythonmegapixel]

3 hours ago, Arika S said:

after seeing this on the WAN show, it gave me a new thought.

 

Say you buy it for $400. then spend $400 to unlock the full functionally and you fall off your bike, the vest is ruined because roads are not soft. does the full unlock carry over to a new vest if you buy it, or is the unlock tied to the 1 vest you unlocked it on.

Well, the logic is apparently that you're paying $400 for the actual vest, and then $400 for the sensor module which is inside it (and that module is what triggers the airbag if it detects a crash). So presumably if the module is undamaged because the vest protected it as well as you, then you should be able to transfer the module to a new vest.

 

I think it's unlikely that will stand up in practice, though.