Microsoft confirms Windows 10X is coming to laptops amid big jump in Windows usage

[3vitor]

Linus called it that Windows would soon be free... 

 

The software being free brings its own concerns with it though. We all know how they will profit. Let's just hope our data is actually anonymous.

[Void Master]

I guess Windows might not stay as we knew it after a while.... 

Windows 10X doesn't even have proper  "windows"

what a shame .....

either i am sticking to windows 10 or 7 or linux ....

Heck even Mac OS would be better.

 

[hishnash]

12 minutes ago, 3vitor said:

Linus called it that Windows would soon be free... 

 

The software being free brings its own concerns with it though. We all know how they will profit. Let's just hope our data is actually anonymous.

Lol Microsoft caring about users privacy. They can always make money by pushing developers to sell throngs through the windowsStore.

[Windows9]

A lot of people will disagree but I think Win 8 is the best OS of all times

[Void Master]

1 minute ago, Windows9 said:

A lot of people will disagree but I think Win 8 is the best OS of all times

Windows 8 was still windows .... ( i didn't hate it personally)

but windows 10X isn't windows...

it's would be a horrible OS ....

Any linux distro recommendations ?

 

[vlads_]

I think the movement away from Win32 and towards UWP is a mistake. Win32 is a janky and at times awful API (and the styling conventions suck), but you're still fundamentally writing comprehensible programs. UWP is an over-engineered impenetrable "app" framework, more in line with an Android and iOS app than with anything else. It may be "the right thing" in the industry rn, but I don't like it one bit.

 

1 minute ago, Void Master said:

Any linux distro recommendations ?

Doesn't really matter. They're all more or less the same. I'd say Ubuntu for most people, Fedora if you like shiny software and Arch if you care about/can be bothered with configuration.

[GoodBytes]

2 hours ago, Void Master said:

I guess Windows might not stay as we knew it after a while.... 

Windows 10X doesn't even have proper  "windows"

what a shame .....

either i am sticking to windows 10 or 7 or linux ....

Heck even Mac OS would be better.

 

Excellent, because Windows 10 is not affected, still supported, still has lots of plans for features.

Dropping Windows 10 will be massive loss to the company. We are talking about several billions of dollars that will be dropped out of the window from everything that only can work on Windows 10, not 10X, from everything they are currently working on. This includes and not limited to: Visual Studio, Visual Studio Code, WSL, Windows 10 itself, Microsoft SQL Server, Exchange Server, Windows Server itself (as this will have no use), all investments in accessibility features and drivers and Direct (the company has 300 products... some can work, many can't. Listed is just some from the top of my head)

[GoodBytes]

8 minutes ago, vlads_ said:

I think the movement away from Win32 and towards UWP is a mistake.

What move? Win32 is fully supported, with new features coming for it in active development.

 

8 minutes ago, vlads_ said:

Win32 is a janky and at times awful API (and the styling conventions suck), but you're still fundamentally writing comprehensible programs. UWP is an over-engineered impenetrable "app" framework, more in line with an Android and iOS app than with anything else. It may be "the right thing" in the industry rn, but I don't like it one bit.

As a developer, your role is to evaluate what is the best tools for your application. You need to balance convenience and power. It is for a reason that we dropped Assembly coding, C/C++ in favor of many other more simplistic languages. Heck JS has this massive boom now thanks to NodeJS. Yet, C/C++ is used for all applications that requires every gram of performance.. such as games!

 

[vlads_]

1 minute ago, GoodBytes said:

What move? Win32 is fully supported, with new features coming for it in active development

On Windows 10X Win32 programs are sandboxed, which makes them feel like second class citizens, at least on paper. Don't know how it is in practice, as I've never used a 10X machine; and hopefully I never will.

 

3 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

As a developer, your role is to evaluate what is the best tools for your application. You need to balance convenience and power. It is for a reason that we dropped Assembly coding, C/C++ in favor of many other more simplistic languages. Heck JS has this massive boom now thanks to NodeJS. Yet, C/C++ is used for all applications that requires every gram of performance.. such as games!

I don't understand which is supposed to be js and which is supposed to be c/c++ in this analogy.

[Kilrah]

We all know that for 2 decades MS OSes have alternated between good and terrible for each release, and 10 is good... It will be once again a thing to skip and wait for the next one.

[LAwLz]

3 hours ago, AK89 said:

Well! Well! Well! I’ve always been a believer of Microsoft Technologies, and all my life till now, I’ve been using their OS. The Windows 10X that too coming to a single-screen device like laptop is definitely a treat for all the guys like me who are using a Windows laptop literally for everything. I work, get entertained, watch movies and do everything on my laptop and I’m sure that this move from Windows will certainly benefit people like me the most. I know the possibility are endless. The fact that they are planning on launching 10X OS on single screen first is special because I’m using one and I don’t find a dual screen useful in some ways.

Why is Windows 10X a treat to you and your use case?

Can you not work, get entertained, watch movies or do everything on your laptop right now?

 

 

  

14 minutes ago, vlads_ said:

On Windows 10X Win32 programs are sandboxed, which makes them feel like second class citizens, at least on paper. Don't know how it is in practice, as I've never used a 10X machine; and hopefully I never will.

Yeah, Win32 is most certainly a second class citizen in Windows 10X. I am not entirely sure, but I think Microsoft's own words are that WIn32 is "legacy applications", and UWP and web apps are "native apps".

[GoodBytes]

1 hour ago, vlads_ said:

On Windows 10X Win32 programs are sandboxed, which makes them feel like second class citizens, at least on paper. Don't know how it is in practice, as I've never used a 10X machine; and hopefully I never will.

Being closed minded doesn't help anyone. Not even yourself.

 

Quote

I don't understand which is supposed to be js and which is supposed to be c/c++ in this analogy.

Does Windows 10X targets gamers? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X targets developers? No. So then dont' get it.

Does Windows 10X targets video producers? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X targets servers use? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X target people who seek reliability, and 'it just works'. Yes! 

 

Does Windows 10 target network/communication analysis? No. Don't get it

Does Windows 10 target server application? No. Don't get it

Does Windows 10 has anything remotely close to the power and flexibility that Linux based OS provides? No. So then don't use the OS for such application.

 

Use the right tool for the right job. Your attitude is no more constructive than those of Linux fans complaining on Windows. People use Windows over Linux based OS for a reason. Ignoring it and going "hopefully I will never use Windows", is exactly why you have these people who will never understand the market and wonder why not even most devs wants to install Linux based OS on their main system, and prefer using it through VM or use a Mac. Same for Windows users complaining on OSX, same for Android users complaining about iOS. Many people don't care about the things you care about. What you value the most, might not be cared by others.

 

Does my mother, say, cares about WSL? No. She doesn't even care about having more than 1 window on her screen. All she wants is easy access to e-mail, Facebook and Skype. That is all. Heck, Windows RT is overkill for her. Sure IE sucks, but she would never know, not even notice the performance differences.

 

Your "average user", typically do what? Use Office suit, surf the web, see pictures, email, watch videos (maybe Netflix), chat and listen to music. In that list, what Windows 10X doesn't allow? For someone with such needs, why would you recommend Windows 10 over 10X? How is saying "Oh yea, get 10, not 10X, and spend extra on that anti-virus, or use a free one that has pop-up ads or sales your private information, and don't click on links!!! Be careful about ransomewares! And do backups? No idea how? That's ok... let me show you, and then you'll forget the next day and never do it. " How is that a good recommendation?

 

Many schools are having huge trouble maintaining their own IT infrastructure with Windows already. Google saw this opportunity, they saw that their ChromeOS isn't going anywhere, so they sold it to schools. And now it is selling like hot cakes, and that was before Android app support. iPads also is "selling" (I put that in quotes, because Apple tend to give them away to schools if they signup for an Apple exclusivity deal, which also includes free iMacs) to schools. Schools is another excellent application for Windows 10X.

 

And when dual screen device will come out, where battery life is everything, and like your phone, you would seek maximum reliability, over playing games you can't play in any case, and so Windows 10X will be ready for when Microsoft feels the time to be right.

[straight_stewie]

We need less cloud automatic cloud integration, not more.

Do any of these companies actually understand what our underlying concerns are?

[GoodBytes]

3 minutes ago, straight_stewie said:

We need less cloud automatic cloud integration, not more.

Do any of these companies actually understand what our underlying concerns are?

Yes. And Windows 10X doesn't cater to you, nor me. It target another demographics that are intrested in such OS.

[straight_stewie]

Just now, GoodBytes said:

Yes. And Windows 10X doesn't cater to you, nor me.

Isn't it like, a businesses job to develop products/provide services that their customers actually want, instead of forcing them to use something that they'd rather not?

[Kilrah]

22 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

Does Windows 10X targets gamers? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X targets developers? No. So then dont' get it.

Does Windows 10X targets video producers? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X targets servers use? No. So then don't get it.

Does Windows 10X target people who seek reliability, and 'it just works'. Yes! 

 

Does Windows 10 target network/communication analysis? No. Don't get it

Does Windows 10 target server application? No. Don't get it

Does Windows 10 has anything remotely close to the power and flexibility that Linux based OS provides? No. So then don't use the OS for such application.

 

Use the right tool for the right job.

It's normal for there to be a fear that the sheer number of average home users being happy with it at some point causes MS to drop the conventional thing and leave only that option, or turn conventional Windows into something stupid like a "pro version" with a $200/year subscription à la Adobe for the privilege of being able to do what you want because that's what everybody does with anything that's not made for the masses nowadays.

[vlads_]

@GoodBytes

I don't use Windows much outside of gaming, so I'm not looking at it from a use case perspective, just from a quality of tech perspective. I do not like the over-engineered object-oriented approach I'm seeing with other "app"-based OSes, so it'd be a shame if that were the paradigm going forward.

 

There's nothing wrong with a usable OS, it's the implementation I have a problem with.

[suicidalfranco]

[mr moose]

3 hours ago, 3vitor said:

Linus called it that Windows would soon be free... 

 

The software being free brings its own concerns with it though. We all know how they will profit. Let's just hope our data is actually anonymous.

Yep, they will profit the same way they have been, from business and productivity with a cherry on top being the average domestic consumer using cloud services and buying through their app store.

1 hour ago, straight_stewie said:

Isn't it like, a businesses job to develop products/provide services that their customers actually want, instead of forcing them to use something that they'd rather not?

That's exactly how it works 99% of the time.  In MS case what they are trying to do is develop a product that works better for the consumer.  Just because tech enthusiasts don't like it or because it fails to do as intended (think RT) doesn't mean they are trying to force products down users throats. 

 

It seems to me to be really weird that when any company fails to succeed with a product there are a myriad of reasons people will accept as why, but whenever MS fail with a product everyone is convinced it is due solely to forcing shit on consumers. 

 

It's good to know the reason AMD had been doing so bad is due to being buffoons trying to force consumers into using shit GPU's and CPU's for so long. 

[Commodus]

4 hours ago, jagdtigger said:

Ummm no? It makes only the company happy by generating more $$$ for them to the detriment of their user base. Like imagine if your gpu dies and you have to throw out the whole machine because TPM will block the startup because the new gpu id dont match with the previous one and ms would charge an arm and a leg for "repairing it".....

First, that's an extreme argument.  Even if you have a situation where TPM insists on an 'authentic' GPU (that's not even true on the Mac as far as I can tell), you're not going to be asked to replace the whole thing.  It may be an expensive replacement, but you won't be paying for the whole computer.

 

But more importantly, you're sidestepping the whole point of integration: it leads to tightly coordinated experiences that eliminate some hassles.  Apple and others know exactly what hardware they're designing for and can roll out features more aggressively and with fewer hiccups.  For example, support for high-DPI displays in Windows 10 is still something of a mess between poor scaling and the kludges that are sometimes necessary for greater-than-4K displays.  Apple?  It had well-scaled high-DPI displays on Macs in 2012, and a 5K iMac in 2014 (at a time when 5K on a Windows PC involved a 'hack' with two virtual screens).  

 

This isn't to say integration has no drawbacks, but you need to expand your definition of happiness beyond "appeals to build-it-yourself enthusiasts."  Happiness can also mean getting a feature years ahead of anyone else, or a device that you spend less time troubleshooting and more time actually using.

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

3 hours ago, 3vitor said:

Linus called it that Windows would soon be free... 

 

The software being free brings its own concerns with it though. We all know how they will profit. Let's just hope our data is actually anonymous.

Even if Windows does keep your data actually anonymous, it's not like the hundreds of services people sign up for will follow suit.  

 

If Microsoft absolutely cared, they would've at least made BitLocker standard across all editions of Windows by now. Despite most consumer PCs already having the necessary components for BitLocker (that is a TPM 2.0 chip built in), Microsoft still requires people to have a Pro license just to have the luxury of file encryption. But... I'm just rambling at this point.