OpenIV Shuts down due to Legal Issues

[AlisterM]

https://www.change.org/p/gta-v-modding-community-re-allow-gta-v-modding?source_location=petition_nav

[vanished]

1 hour ago, goodtofufriday said:

Heres the official resposne

 

http://kotaku.com/popular-gta-v-modding-tool-shuts-down-community-explod-1796112893

UPDATE 6/15 7:58PM: Here’s Rockstar Games, confirming the situation:

 

“Take-Two’s actions were not specifically targeting single player mods. Unfortunately OpenIV enables recent malicious mods that allow harassment of players and interfere with the GTA Online experience for everybody. We are working to figure out how we can continue to support the creative community without negatively impacting our players.”

Glad to see Rockstar working for the players and not against them in this case.  Say what you like but they do seem to have a history of listening.

 

Also, hopefully they will come to a resolution.  Shutting down a mod tool because it can be used for online mods is like shutting down the manufacture of rope because it could be used to hang someone.  The flaw is in your game, that's what needs to be fixed.  Design it in a way where "breaking" it for multiplayer and single player are totally different, that way any respectable software will only provide a single player option, leaving you free to shut down the actually problematic ones.  Or, you know, just make it so multiplayer can't be affected by local mods at all.

[HarryNyquist]

59 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

Or, you know, just make it so multiplayer can't be affected by local mods at all.

I remember the days when Singleplayer and Multiplayer were two separate executables.

[xDylanio]

Wait, say you had openiv downloaded on your pc. Can you still use it. 

[Jito463]

20 minutes ago, xDylanio said:

Wait, say you had openiv downloaded on your pc. Can you still use it. 

Unless they release a patch that invalidates the program, there's no reason it wouldn't still work.  The only change is that the group responsible will no longer be releasing updates.

[samcool55]

The negative GTA V reviews just keep appearing, awesome!

That "overwhelmingly negative" on their steam product page is a big slap in their face as it should be.

[TOMPPIX]

http://www.lcpdfr.com/files/file/16257-fuck-taketwo-blimp/

[Derangel]

On 6/16/2017 at 9:59 AM, Ryan_Vickers said:

Glad to see Rockstar working for the players and not against them in this case.  Say what you like but they do seem to have a history of listening.

 

Also, hopefully they will come to a resolution.  Shutting down a mod tool because it can be used for online mods is like shutting down the manufacture of rope because it could be used to hang someone.  The flaw is in your game, that's what needs to be fixed.  Design it in a way where "breaking" it for multiplayer and single player are totally different, that way any respectable software will only provide a single player option, leaving you free to shut down the actually problematic ones.  Or, you know, just make it so multiplayer can't be affected by local mods at all.

Rockstar's statement is BS. OpenIV outright disabled GTA Online when you used it. To T2 and Rockstar wanted to stop mods from messing with GTA Online there are other tools out there that actually do it, they should go after them. This just screams of them going anti-mod.

[ravenshrike]

41 minutes ago, Derangel said:

Rockstar's statement is BS. OpenIV outright disabled GTA Online when you used it. To T2 and Rockstar wanted to stop mods from messing with GTA Online there are other tools out there that actually do it, they should go after them. This just screams of them going anti-mod.

Eh, in theory someone might have figured out how to create something in Open IV, remove it with another program, and then figured out how to use the extracted mod with GTAOnline dll injection scripts, but that's an additional two completely separate and unaffiliated programs in use besides Open IV. Also, it's rather unlikely. More likely is that someone figured out how Open IV did its thing in a general sense and recreated it on their own or created a hacked version of Open IV which will be completely unaffected by any C&D on Take Two's part. That assumes that Rockstar wasn't outright told to cover for Take Two's idiocy of course.

[Derangel]

28 minutes ago, ravenshrike said:

Eh, in theory someone might have figured out how to create something in Open IV, remove it with another program, and then figured out how to use the extracted mod with GTAOnline dll injection scripts, but that's an additional two completely separate and unaffiliated programs in use besides Open IV. Also, it's rather unlikely. More likely is that someone figured out how Open IV did its thing in a general sense and recreated it on their own or created a hacked version of Open IV which will be completely unaffected by any C&D on Take Two's part. That assumes that Rockstar wasn't outright told to cover for Take Two's idiocy of course.

I'm sure Rockstar is just toeing the company line here. Especially when you consider Take-Two's CEO recently talked about how they're not charging customers enough or pushing microtransactions as much as they could.

[vanished]

8 hours ago, Jito463 said:

Unless they release a patch that invalidates the program, there's no reason it wouldn't still work.  The only change is that the group responsible will no longer be releasing updates.

They did, when I opened OpenIV is said there was an update available as usual, so I installed it and then when launching the new version it just said they've been shut down and offered to uninstall it.

[ColdSteel]

Good, they reverse engineered GTAV's code, it's why the won't open source it. They have every right to take legal action.

[ravenshrike]

39 minutes ago, ColdSteel said:

Good, they reverse engineered GTAV's code, it's why the won't open source it. They have every right to take legal action.

Except they explicitly went with clean room design which is perfectly legal to circumvent copyright with in the US. See Sony Computer Entertainment v Connectix.

[ColdSteel]

3 minutes ago, ravenshrike said:

Except they explicitly went with clean room design which is perfectly legal to circumvent copyright with in the US. See Sony Computer Entertainment v Connectix.

hmmm...

[ravenshrike]

Just now, ColdSteel said:

hmmm...

Much more likely they're using some other program that they don't have a license for in order to assist with program development.

[ColdSteel]

Just now, ravenshrike said:

Much more likely they're using some other program that they don't have a license for in order to assist with program development.

possible. I really think they are using directly reverse engineered code.

[ravenshrike]

16 minutes ago, ColdSteel said:

possible. I really think they are using directly reverse engineered code.

Except they've explicitly said that they've complied with clean room code implementation.

 

Quote

 

r almost ten years of OpenIV development, we had tried to play as nice as possible and even more:

 

• Strictly following of Civil Code of Russia (only reverse engineering for interoperability).
• Only clean-room reverse engineering.
• No distribution of original data and code.
• And absolutely no messing with Online…

http://openiv.com/?p=1324

 

Which makes it much more likely that the code broaches some other copyright or releasing it would breach contractual obligation. Or, y'know, he was attempting to brush the guy off on Twitter without something like "We don't want to".

[TopDollar]

21 hours ago, Jito463 said:

Unless they release a patch that invalidates the program, there's no reason it wouldn't still work.  The only change is that the group responsible will no longer be releasing updates.

At least when I tried to use OpenIV it forced you to "update" the program and then displayed the uninstall window shown in the original post. Super shitty since I only just bought GTA V a couple weeks ago. Was only using graphics enhancement and vehicle handling mods.

[Jito463]

 

13 hours ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

They did, when I opened OpenIV is said there was an update available as usual, so I installed it and then when launching the new version it just said they've been shut down and offered to uninstall it.

1 minute ago, TopDollar said:

At least when I tried to use OpenIV it forced you to "update" the program and then displayed the uninstall window shown in the original post. Super shitty since I only just bought GTA V a couple weeks ago. Was only using graphics enhancement and vehicle handling mods.

 

Quote

Unless they release a patch that invalidates the program

By this, I actually meant Rockstar/TakeTwo releasing a patch for the game, not OpenIV updating the mod tool.  Though obviously that is also an issue for people who use the program.

[PlayStation 2]

On 6/16/2017 at 9:53 AM, AlisterMultimedia said:

https://www.change.org/p/gta-v-modding-community-re-allow-gta-v-modding?source_location=petition_nav

wanna explain to me what a petition on change.org would do

[KuJoe]

On 6/16/2017 at 10:59 AM, Ryan_Vickers said:

Glad to see Rockstar working for the players and not against them in this case.  Say what you like but they do seem to have a history of listening.

 

Also, hopefully they will come to a resolution.  Shutting down a mod tool because it can be used for online mods is like shutting down the manufacture of rope because it could be used to hang someone.  The flaw is in your game, that's what needs to be fixed.  Design it in a way where "breaking" it for multiplayer and single player are totally different, that way any respectable software will only provide a single player option, leaving you free to shut down the actually problematic ones.  Or, you know, just make it so multiplayer can't be affected by local mods at all.

Having read the real reason they sent the letter to OpenIV, I fully support their decision now. Before reading it, this thread sounded like they sent the C&D letter to stop modding as a cash grab/pissing contest and now that the real reason was posted I can't see how people are against them. Modding a single player game is one thing, modding a multiplayer game to impact other players is completely different and shouldn't be allowed.

[Jito463]

On 6/17/2017 at 10:34 AM, Derangel said:

Rockstar's statement is BS. OpenIV outright disabled GTA Online when you used it. To T2 and Rockstar wanted to stop mods from messing with GTA Online there are other tools out there that actually do it, they should go after them. This just screams of them going anti-mod.

3 hours ago, KuJoe said:

Having read the real reason they sent the letter to OpenIV, I fully support their decision now. Before reading it, this thread sounded like they sent the C&D letter to stop modding as a cash grab/pissing contest and now that the real reason was posted I can't see how people are against them. Modding a single player game is one thing, modding a multiplayer game to impact other players is completely different and shouldn't be allowed.

Not according to the above poster.  They claim that the online multiplayer functionality is disabled when using OpenIV.  I can't speak for that personally, since I don't own GTA, much less have the mod tool (and even if I did, I'd have MP disabled anyway).

[KuJoe]

Just now, Jito463 said:

Not according to the above poster.  They claim that the online multiplayer functionality is disabled when using OpenIV.  I can't speak for that personally, since I don't own GTA, much less have the mod tool (and even if I did, I'd have MP disabled anyway).

Why would Rockstar lie about something anybody could easily fact check? Something doesn't add up here. This coupled with OpenIV's claims that the source code could never be released because of "illegal" reasons makes me think there is more to the story and so far the only party that hasn't done anything shady in my eyes is Rockstar. I hope the whole truth comes out soon.

[vanished]

8 hours ago, Dan Castellaneta said:

wanna explain to me what a petition on change.org would do

nothing, as always

8 hours ago, KuJoe said:

Having read the real reason they sent the letter to OpenIV, I fully support their decision now. Before reading it, this thread sounded like they sent the C&D letter to stop modding as a cash grab/pissing contest and now that the real reason was posted I can't see how people are against them. Modding a single player game is one thing, modding a multiplayer game to impact other players is completely different and shouldn't be allowed.

That doesn't make any sense.  Even if this is true, what they did was still wrong and deserving of all the backlash.  They could have very easily sent them a letter telling them to prevent online modifications instead of shutting them down entirely.

 

They could also put some effort into protecting multiplayer more...

[HarryNyquist]

9 minutes ago, Ryan_Vickers said:

They could also put some effort into protecting multiplayer more...

Only if you buy more Shark Cards!