Intel's responses to AMD Ryzen with i7 7740K and i5 7640K

[NumLock21]

8 minutes ago, Carclis said:

Being durable and performing well are completely different things. If someone purchases a "k" series chip they're obviously pretty likely to have some interest in overclocking and there's an even better chance that they will be limited by thermals as a result of the lower performance paste. How about Intel gives consumers the option to replace the paste between the IHS and die without voiding their warranty for trying to get the performance they should have received?

In the old days, cpus don't come with a IHS. Then they all get damaged from those who forgets to apply thermal paste or improper mounting, which results in crack/chipped dies.

[Colonel_Gerdauf]

3 hours ago, sirtoby said:

What's going to happen to the Celerons then? Core iShit ?

...

That name sounds really wrong when taken out of context; I hope you realize that.

[Carclis]

12 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

In the old days, cpus don't come with a IHS. Then they all get damaged from those who forgets to apply thermal paste or improper mounting, which results in crack/chipped dies.

If they forgot to apply thermal paste then they would pretty screwed with any current k series Intel CPU which do not come with thermal paste applied so that's not really a valid concern. I'm not saying that CPU's should not come with an IHS because it obviously serves an important purpose, but it should be serviceable by those who know what they're doing at the least, even if that means selling a specific model that allows it. If someone runs it without an IHS and then cracks the silicon die as a result then I think that would be pretty obvious to Intel and in that case the warranty should be void.

[themaniac]

6 minutes ago, huilun02 said:

Wait what Intel already knows the details/perf of Ryzen chips? 

yeah, the consumers are always the last to know, I wouldn't be surprised if Intel knew about the details/performance a few months ago

[leadeater]

14 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

Supposedly the TIM isn't the cause, but rather air pockets/bad application methods. 

 

@Lays@MageTank

When you compare all the thermal conductive properties of thermal compound the difference is actually extremely small, when you compare to actual metals. The difference is so extraordinarily massive using a IHS is the actual problem not the thermal compound, your having to conduct heat through two layers of low conductivity compared to one.

 

If there is any application issues, like air pockets or too thick compound between the die and IHS that will also significantly impact thermal transfer.

[79wjd]

3 minutes ago, Carclis said:

by those who know what they're doing at the least

Prove that you're not an incompetent moron. 

[leadeater]

1 minute ago, djdwosk97 said:

Prove that you're not an incompetent moron. 

That is next to impossible for warranty purposes, I'd never accept a blind statement of "I know what I'm doing please replace my broken $1000 CPU, it wasn't me but rather a product fault".

[Carclis]

10 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

Prove that you're not an incompetent moron. 

By not cracking the silicon die? GPU manufacturers don't demand any proof and still ship their products giving full access to the bare die.

[DarkBlade2117]

4 hours ago, sirtoby said:

I really hope that that is isn't going to turn out to be true. Intel is throwing their very easy naming scheme out of the window at the moment. 

Pentiums suddenly have hyper threading and render the i3's basically useless. If they now add an i5 with hyper threading then they have fucked their naming scheme completely. 

This is almost AMD level confusing

Idgaf if they are going to slowly upgrade their tiers.

Future=

Pentium 2c/4t

i3 4c/4t

i5 4c/8t

i7 6c/12t and

low tier Extreme lineup could be 8c/8t or maybe 16t. I personally don't care about making schemes, take the extra 20 seconds to look at the specs

[79wjd]

11 minutes ago, leadeater said:

That is next to impossible for warranty purposes, I'd never accept a blind statement of "I know what I'm doing please replace my broken $1000 CPU, it wasn't me but rather a product fault".

It was more of a rhetorical question.

11 minutes ago, Carclis said:

By not cracking the silicon die? GPU manufacturers don't demand any proof and still ship their products giving full access to the bare die.

That's not good enough. I promise you, if Intel warrantied delidded CPUs, they'd have a significant increase in warrantied chips. Not all GPU manufacturers do, some do, some don't. But it's also much easier to damage a CPU die in the delidding process. 

 

4 minutes ago, DarkBlade2117 said:

Idgaf if they are going to slowly upgrade their tiers.

Future=

Pentium 2c/4t

i3 4c/4t

i5 4c/8t

i7 6c/12t and

low tier Extreme lineup could be 8c/8t or maybe 16t. I personally don't care about making schemes, take the extra 20 seconds to look at the specs

Agreed. Also, let's not forget that the first gen i5 had dual core variants and the Skylake mobile i5s have some quad cores variants (not to mention the recent update to the Kaby Lake Pentiums). It's not unprecedented for Intel to change the definition of a CPU, but so many people in this thread are pretending that it is. 

[BuckGup]

4 hours ago, TheRandomness said:

i5... hyperthreading? How interesting. 

Intel is scared

[leadeater]

11 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

It was more of a rhetorical question.

Yep, but I couldn't resist chucking that it . 

[Carclis]

4 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

But it's also much easier to damage a CPU die in the delidding process.

That's my exact point.

10 minutes ago, djdwosk97 said:

Not all GPU manufacturers do

The ones worth buying from do because they are the ones who have good warranty processes in place that aren't a nightmare to go through (MSI, XFX, EVGA).

[AnonymousGuy]

15 minutes ago, SamStrecker said:

Intel is scared

Intel doesn't even view AMD as a competitor anymore.  Why would you when you're literally 10x as big in every metric from revenue to employees.

[79wjd]

3 minutes ago, AnonymousGuy said:

Intel doesn't even view AMD as a competitor anymore.  Why would you when you're literally 10x as big in every metric from revenue to employees.

Because while it's highly unlikely that AMD will ever take a dominant marketshare (unless Intel screws up really badly for years), they can certainly affect Intel's profits and force Intel to cut prices and/or spend more on RnD. Intel would be incredibly foolish to discount AMD just because Intel is "bigger".

[JohnnyCorporalTech]

36 minutes ago, DarkBlade2117 said:

Idgaf if they are going to slowly upgrade their tiers.

Future=

Pentium 2c/4t

i3 4c/4t

i5 4c/8t

i7 6c/12t and

low tier Extreme lineup could be 8c/8t or maybe 16t. I personally don't care about making schemes, take the extra 20 seconds to look at the specs

I guess Linus will have to make an updated version of the Tech Quickie episode describing the differences between Intel's CPU tiers.

[NumLock21]

10 minutes ago, Carclis said:

If they forgot to apply thermal paste then they would pretty screwed with any current k series Intel CPU which do not come with thermal paste applied so that's not really a valid concern. I'm not saying that CPU's should not come with an IHS because it obviously serves an important purpose, but it should be serviceable by those who know what they're doing at the least, even if that means selling a specific model that allows it. If someone runs it without an IHS and then cracks the silicon die as a result then I think that would be pretty obvious to Intel and in that case the warranty should be void.

CPU so of today will still be okay if a user forgets to apply thermal paste since it has some pre applied directly on the die, cpus from the olds says, if a user  forgets to apply thermal paste, then those cpus almost fries immediately.

[JohnnyCorporalTech]

41 minutes ago, DarkBlade2117 said:

Idgaf if they are going to slowly upgrade their tiers.

Future=

Pentium 2c/4t

i3 4c/4t

i5 4c/8t

i7 6c/12t and

low tier Extreme lineup could be 8c/8t or maybe 16t. I personally don't care about making schemes, take the extra 20 seconds to look at the specs

Bring back the Celeron, 

 

Future: Celeron Extreme edition with 10 cores, 20 threads.

 

 

 

 

Or not, Intel could just quietly kill the tier. 

[NumLock21]

2 minutes ago, JohnnyCorporalTech said:

Bring back the Celeron, 

 

Future: Celeron Extreme edition with 10 cores, 20 threads.

 

Or not, Intel could just quietly kill the tier. 

Celeron won't go away any time soon.

[Carclis]

6 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

CPU so of today will still be okay if a user forgets to apply thermal paste since it has some pre applied directly on the die, cpus from the olds says, if a user  forgets to apply thermal paste, then those cpus almost fries immediately.

Unless the Kaby Lake line is different from Skylake in terms of boxed content, that isn't true. A retail boxed 6700k literally has only the CPU in the box with no pre-applied paste and even no stock cooler.

[NumLock21]

1 minute ago, Carclis said:

Unless the Kaby Lake line is different from Skylake in terms of boxed content, that isn't true. A retail boxed 6700k literally has only the CPU in the box with no pre-applied paste and even no stock cooler.

There is TIM between the cpu die and IHS

[Carclis]

4 minutes ago, NumLock21 said:

There is TIM between the cpu die and IHS

One would very much hope so since trying to apply some on the die would void your warranty.

[NumLock21]

2 minutes ago, Carclis said:

One would very much hope so since trying to apply some on the die would void your warranty.

There is TIM on the CPU die.

[leadeater]

9 minutes ago, Carclis said:

One would very much hope so since trying to apply some on the die would void your warranty.

I think his point was more around this won't happen now days.

 

 

Edit: Video removed, Google AMD Duron Explode to see it.

[Clyne]

Hopefully more cache/cores on 7740K...my Z270 board is waiting for a i7 chip.