Don't get new, buy Used or Refurbished!

[OldNewComputers]

Recently, I bought a Dell Latitude E6430 for $120 on eBay (used). The specifications are as follows:

- Intel Core i5-3360M @ 2.8GHz

- 8GB DDR3-1333 RAM

- 320GB 5400RPM hard drive (no OS when I bought it, I installed Windows 7, note that it had no COA, I used my own key)

- DVD-RW drive

- 802.11n

- Intel HD Graphics 4000

- Battery + Power Adapter (condition: "Moderate" as said in Dell BIOS, may later replace with 9-cell from Dell)

NOTE: I didn't upgrade this thing at all. This is what it came with.

 

For $200, you'd get an Intel Celeron and only 2GB of RAM, and no DVD drive! Plus, likely no driver support for Windows 7 or even 8.1 (some only support 10). When you get up to $350, you get an i3 that performs better, but still only 4GB of RAM (but better Intel graphics). When you get to $600, sure, you get better (8GB of RAM, an i5, and maybe even a dGPU), but this is much better price-to-performance. For $200, you might even buy a useless ChromeBook!!!

 

The CPU is quite powerful, and to put it in perspective, outperforms that in the (2015, Broadwell-based) top-end most-recent MacBook Air (which is a U-class i7).

[minibois]

But how is your battery life and startup times?

Sure, second hand laptops are cool, but these are two things you would give up a bit (unless you upgrade).

[dalekphalm]

If you're on an extreme budget? Sure.

 

But that advice is certainly not universal. I just recently spent ~$1600 CAD on a laptop, and don't regret it for a second.

[PCPartListsYT]

New is always good UNLESS you are on a EXTREME budget.

[OldNewComputers]

On 1/13/2018 at 5:20 PM, Minibois said:

But how is your battery life and startup times?

Sure, second hand laptops are cool, but these are two things you would give up a bit (unless you upgrade).

Startup times? Around 40 seconds. (Windows 7 Professional).

I don't know the battery life, but the battery health is "Moderate" and I mostly use my machine plugged in, but I only need around 1 hour of battery life. Besides, I could add an SSD (128GB) for $60 and a 9 cell battery from Dell for $120.

 

On 1/14/2018 at 12:22 AM, Pangea2017 said:

The Dell Latitude E6430 is a tank: thick and indestructible

going with a slower and not so well build new machine for $200 give you the advantage of  a thin and light with a full-HD vs HD+ resolution

but you will lose legacy ports, docking ports, solid keyboard with background lighting and solid design (real metal frame inside), fingerprint sensor and some more

 

if you leave the extrem budget the value is still better on used notebooks. The Dell Lattitude E7440 (way thinner and lighter then the E6430) is still superior to everything new what gets even close to price of it.

 

PS. the E6430 with only 4GB of RAM and HD+ are running for about $250 in europe. $120 is in the middle of the E6420 and E6410.

Not bad with SSD and battery is good, but your device is heavy. Going with 2 years newer model ($400) dollar will solve these issues (comes configured with SSD).

I need a thicker machine because I want the legacy I/O ports (USB 3 type-A, DVD burner, HDMI, and VGA) as well as trackpoint and I don't need an HD screen (1600x900 or even 1366x768 is fine FOR ME) and I don't care about it being thin, plus I could barely even feel the Latitude in my bag (and I'm weak, young, and don't even work out)

 

You could always buy from an American buyer to get the 8GB of RAM and an HD for $120. But an E6420 isn't bad.

 

 

On 1/13/2018 at 5:23 PM, dalekphalm said:

If you're on an extreme budget? Sure.

 

But that advice is certainly not universal. I just recently spent ~$1600 CAD on a laptop, and don't regret it for a second.

I was on an extreme budget (I had $150 to spend). Okay, spending more on a laptop can help, but I'm sure you could do CAD on my laptop if it had dedicated graphics (which I saw a bid for a ThinkPad T430 with similar specs except a lower-end i5 and Nvidia 5200M graphics) or newer integrated. Besides, let me list what I do on my laptop

 

- web browsing

- Microsoft Office productivity

- programming (Python, Visual Basic .NET 2008)

- low-level video editing (Windows Movie Maker 2.6, 6.0, Live)

- heavy virtualization (Virtual PC 2007, VMware Workstation 14 Player) of Windows 3.1, 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, XP, Vista, 7, 8, 10, and MS-DOS

[dalekphalm]

5 minutes ago, OldNewComputers said:

Startup times? Around 40 seconds. (Windows 7 Professional).

I don't know the battery life, but the battery health is "Moderate" and I mostly use my machine plugged in, but I only need around 1 hour of battery life. Besides, I could add an SSD (128GB) for $60 and a 9 cell battery from Dell for $120.

 

I need a thicker machine because I want the legacy I/O ports (USB 3 type-A, DVD burner, HDMI, and VGA) as well as trackpoint and I don't need an HD screen (1600x900 or even 1366x768 is fine FOR ME) and I don't care about it being thin, plus I could barely even feel the Latitude in my bag (and I'm weak, young, and don't even work out)

 

You could always buy from an American buyer to get the 8GB of RAM and an HD for $120. But an E6420 isn't bad.

 

 

I was on an extreme budget (I had $150 to spend). Okay, spending more on a laptop can help, but I'm sure you could do CAD on my laptop if it had dedicated graphics (which I saw a bid for a ThinkPad T430 with similar specs except a lower-end i5 and Nvidia 5200M graphics) or newer integrated. Besides, let me list what I do on my laptop

 

- web browsing

- Microsoft Office productivity

- programming (Python, Visual Basic .NET 2008)

- low-level video editing (Windows Movie Maker 2.6, 6.0, Live)

- heavy virtualization (Virtual PC 2007, VMware Workstation 14 Player) of Windows 3.1, 95, 98, Me, NT, 2000, XP, Vista, 7, 8, 10, and MS-DOS

I think there's a misunderstanding.
 

CAD is the official designation for the currency used in Canada. CAD = Canadian Dollar. I was saying I spent $1600 Canadian on the laptop, as opposed to $1600 USD (That's United States Dollar, for those who don't know).

 

I'm not talking about Computer Assisted Design (CAD) software - although my laptop would be able to do some basic 2D and 3D stuff in CAD, but it's using an iGPU so it would have definite limits in that regard.

 

Anyway, can you define "heavy virtualization"? Your CPU only has 2 cores w/ 4 threads total, so it's not like you're going to be able to run more than 1 or 2 VM's simultaneously without tanking other system performance. Certainly does depend on the VM, assigned resources, what it's doing, etc, though.

[OldNewComputers]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

I think there's a misunderstanding.
 

CAD is the official designation for the currency used in Canada. CAD = Canadian Dollar. I was saying I spent $1600 Canadian on the laptop, as opposed to $1600 USD (That's United States Dollar, for those who don't know).

 

I'm not talking about Computer Assisted Design (CAD) software - although my laptop would be able to do some basic 2D and 3D stuff in CAD, but it's using an iGPU so it would have definite limits in that regard.

 

Anyway, can you define "heavy virtualization"? Your CPU only has 2 cores w/ 4 threads total, so it's not like you're going to be able to run more than 1 or 2 VM's simultaneously without tanking other system performance. Certainly does depend on the VM, assigned resources, what it's doing, etc, though.

I apologize for the for the misunderstanding. So you spent $1300 USD (approx.) What are the specs you got?

 

Okay, what I did wasn't heavy, but it was medium. I can run 3 or 4 VMs in VPC with decent system performance but VPC runs slower VMs than VMware Player (I guess it takes less resources to give to the VMs) but I can run Windows XP and Windows 7 in VMware (but not two Win7/Vista VMs).

 

Also, is the PC you bought an ultrabook? You see, compared to $200 USD laptops (not comparing it to yours, unless yours is an ultrabook, in which it is in the same non-upgradable league), mine is upgradable. If I had $350 USD to pimp my laptop, I could. Upgrade the CPU to an Ivy Bridge Quad Core i7 (hyperthreaded), 16GB of RAM, add an mPCIe GPU (or an Express Card eGPU), an SSD, and a new 9-cell battery (my current is either 4-cell or 6-cell). But my laptop is fine as it is.

[dalekphalm]

1 hour ago, OldNewComputers said:

I apologize for the for the misunderstanding. So you spent $1300 USD (approx.) What are the specs you got?

 

Okay, what I did wasn't heavy, but it was medium. I can run 3 or 4 VMs in VPC with decent system performance but VPC runs slower VMs than VMware Player (I guess it takes less resources to give to the VMs) but I can run Windows XP and Windows 7 in VMware (but not two Win7/Vista VMs).

 

Also, is the PC you bought an ultrabook? You see, compared to $200 USD laptops (not comparing it to yours, unless yours is an ultrabook, in which it is in the same non-upgradable league), mine is upgradable. If I had $350 USD to pimp my laptop, I could. Upgrade the CPU to an Ivy Bridge Quad Core i7 (hyperthreaded), 16GB of RAM, add an mPCIe GPU (or an Express Card eGPU), an SSD, and a new 9-cell battery (my current is either 4-cell or 6-cell). But my laptop is fine as it is.

The laptop I bought is an HP Spectre x360.

It has an i7 U series Coffee Lake CPU, 8GB RAM, and a 256GB nvme SSD.

 

It’s thin and light, lasts upwards of 8+ hours on battery, and convertible into tablet form factor (the hinge swings all the way around so the keyboard and screen are back to back). 

 

Could I get the same system specs (CPU, ram, etc) for cheaper? Yes definitely. But not in the small and light form factor, with the great battery, the convertible form factor, and of course, the extremely high quality build quality and materials used in construction. 

 

I made a trade off, because specs aren’t everything - certainly not in how I use the device. 

[OldNewComputers]

Just now, anthonyjc2010 said:

Looks at i7-8650U. You do realize that not all i7s are equal, right?

Yes, I do. The 7th and 8th gen i7s are very powerful. I was also partially commenting on the fact that the MacBook Air (the latest model, mind you) is still using 5th gen CPUs. Also, why did Intel stop selling the M-class CPUs (only having the U and HQ-class CPUs, and some others; the H is the closest analogue I can find).

[OldNewComputers]

20 hours ago, anthonyjc2010 said:

They still make them. Intel m series CPUs were rebranded (exluding the m3 models, because m3 looks better than i3) to Y-series.

I don't mean Intel Core M CPUs, I mean Intel Core i5 3360M, for example. M as a suffix. I know the H is close, though.

 

20 hours ago, Pangea2017 said:

These things are even cheaper if i order in the USA, pay 30$ shipping, 19% tax in Germany and replace the keyboard with a new german. Two months early and i would have bought it oversee. 25% cheaper after all cost.

 

The m-series was a rebrand of the y and is now again y.

Same as above; Intel Core i5 3360M, not Intel Core m3

[OldNewComputers]

10 hours ago, anthonyjc2010 said:

Oh. No, they don't make those SKUs anymore.

That's the problem. They've eliminated the "mainstream" or "mid-range" laptop processor. Now, notebooks carry the U, H, HQ (or one of the other variants). But mainstream laptops have a U-class CPU, not M

[Damascus]

@CUDA_Cores

 

Muahahahahahahaha

[General Winter]

for a cheap computer like that, sure; for a more expensive laptop, its definitely not worth the risk

 

i got a "manufacturer refurbished" laptop for $1420 and ended up having to pay nearly $80 to replace the fans months after i got the thing (it has a 1070 so those fans are really important even in idle) , i thought i was getting a deal at the time and then shortly there after for $1500 i could've gotten the same laptop w/ 120hz monitor instead of my 60hz g sync that i currently have

[OldNewComputers]

23 hours ago, General Winter said:

for a cheap computer like that, sure; for a more expensive laptop, its definitely not worth the risk

 

i got a "manufacturer refurbished" laptop for $1420 and ended up having to pay nearly $80 to replace the fans months after i got the thing (it has a 1070 so those fans are really important even in idle) , i thought i was getting a deal at the time and then shortly there after for $1500 i could've gotten the same laptop w/ 120hz monitor instead of my 60hz g sync that i currently have

I have to agree with you. For cheaper computers, used is better but for more expensive ones, it's not worth the risk. I'd say anywhere in the $50 to $300 range, used is good.

[General Winter]

3 hours ago, OldNewComputers said:

I have to agree with you. For cheaper computers, used is better but for more expensive ones, it's not worth the risk. I'd say anywhere in the $50 to $300 range, used is good.

yeah, its still a good laptop though, fans are the only major issue, everything else works fine and i never had a 120hz monitor anyway so i'll move on once i finish college and i can afford to buy stuff (with my new job i'm hoping to net after college)

[Hiitchy]

I bought an Acer E5-774G-582T on sale (refurbished)  for $679. It has an i5-7200u and a 940mx with 1tb of storage that I'm planning to switch to SSD storage eventually. It does what I need it to do since I barely play games but it's nice since I don't really play triple A titles. 

[OldNewComputers]

On 1/21/2018 at 2:36 AM, Hiitchy said:

I bought an Acer E5-774G-582T on sale (refurbished)  for $679. It has an i5-7200u and a 940mx with 1tb of storage that I'm planning to switch to SSD storage eventually. It does what I need it to do since I barely play games but it's nice since I don't really play triple A titles. 

As far as new computers go, your Acer Aspire E15 is a good deal. I know if you spent $600 you could get an MX150 + i5 8250U (quad core + hyperthreaded), but you said you don't play games so you don't need it.