W.H.O. Seeks to Classify ‘Gaming Disorder’ as a Mental Illness

[Jito463]

31 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Apple juice?!?! YOU ARE A FRAUD. EVERYONE KNOWS GAMERS ONLY DRINK MOUNTAIN DEW!

Sicko!  Everyone knows Coca-Cola is the 'Real Thing™' (in all seriousness, I can't stand MD, Coca-Cola for me).

[tlink]

1 hour ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Any sort of psychological addiction usually stems from the person needing an escape from something. If their something is so severe they indulge in their addiction more than reality, then something needs to be done.

 

Either way, it's not a mental disorder (like say schizophrenia), it's a problem with their environment. Usually.

schizophrenia is caused by a problem in the environment, how else would you get it? schizophrenia requires a trigger, you can have a gene base for it but even people with the most perfect gene base to become schizo can live with it ever triggering or people with the worst gene base to become schizo can get it. yea in some cases the environmental cause is not that big but if its big enough to cause the brain to break down in this way its pretty clear that someone was pushed beyond their limits. not to mention that suppressed genes can activate due to environmental factors, but that is a very recent discovery so i don't know if that also is the case with schizo gene's.

[dizmo]

Sounds like an awesome way to get on an assistance program.

[GeekJump]

*puts on tin foil hat* Whatever gives big pharma the chance to push more pills into us!

[MageTank]

11 minutes ago, Jito463 said:

Sicko!  Everyone knows Coca-Cola is the 'Real Thing™' (in all seriousness, I can't stand MD, Coca-Cola for me).

I have not drank a soda in over 14 years. Our parents used to make my brothers and I share drinks, and I don't know why, but I grew to resent that, so I switched to water. Never went back, not even a single sip, lol. Makes any kind of carbonated water beverage hurt my throat.

 

21 minutes ago, tlink said:

i think most people where just reacting to someone actually getting their information from breibart unironically.

I see no problem with where people choose to get their information. The problem is, when people dismiss information from sources that don't fit their narrative. I see people do that here with tech sites as well (WCCFTech being the go to website). If it fits their narrative, they use it, but if it doesn't, it's as if someone committed blasphemy by using it.

 

I always tell people that they should get multiple sources when comparing products they are about to buy, and I suppose that same advice applies to news. Try to get your information from multiple sources. Even if the sources disagree with you, try to understand why they are disagreeing, so that you are fully educated and prepared to offer a rebuttal. Sadly, people seemed to have forgotten that information can be used both ways, and that understanding the information presented by those that disagree with them, is the best way to bolster their own views. Even if you turn out to be wrong in the end, at the very least, you come away learning something new. 

[tlink]

53 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Aaaaand this thread is too political to be redeemed. This would have been an interesting thing to discuss, but alas, I fear it's too late. Before it gets nuked to oblivion, I'll at least post my opinion on the subject:

 

Everything is harmful without moderation. Even too much water is a bad thing. If "excessive gaming" is a disorder, then so is excessive anything. I know people that get their thrills doing far more dangerous things (street racing, fighting, etc) none of which are classified as a mental disorder. I am no doctor, but I feel that this is yet another scapegoat for people to blame video games for the problems that go on in this world. Much like video games are blamed on violence, poor grades, or basically anything that could also be attributed to bad parenting.

i thought the APA is also thinking about classifying extreme religious people as mentally ill. generally we classify things as a mental disorder if it doesn't appear to be culture bound and doesn't fit under other mental disorders. and of course it has to show reduced functionality on mental capability's. im not saying its perfect, by no mean but it is developing into a more mature science. excessive water drinking would more be classified as obsessive disorder/ocd or some other obsessive disorder (i don't know all the DSM5 diagnoses or most of the other classification systems such as ICD-10 and ICD-9 but they are often similar) because they are obsessive thoughts while a gaming addiction is classified differently because its the actual gaming that activates the reward center and not the complying to obsessive impulses. obsession generally is a mechanism to get in control. gaming addiction is more a method to forget. but they are actually trying to phase out the term addiction i believe, they are trying to change it into harmful use or dependence altogether, but don't quote me on that.

[MageTank]

Just now, tlink said:

but don't quote me on that.

Ha... I break all the rules.

 

Seriously though, I don't think they have all of the information to make the claims that the gaming itself activates the reward center. It might not be related to the gaming itself, and more so the response that is triggered from the gaming. Could be the sensation of winning (or losing, if someone prefers the masochistic side of things), the fulfillment of completing a task or difficult challenge, or simply put: the story itself. I know people that spend all day binge watching Netflix, do these people have a mental disorder for what can be seen as relatively the exact same level of escapism? Where do we draw the line here?

 

While I don't mind them looking into it, I think it's far too early to speak definitively, especially if they themselves are not actually trying the games. Now, before anyone quotes me with the "well, you don't expect them to try drugs to relate to addicts, do you?!?!", let me at least clarify my point. Most of these doctors are likely older individuals, and came about before gaming became as mainstream and prolific as it is. At the moment, gaming is "cool". It's everywhere. Not only that, but it's even profitable for people on Youtube and Twitch. For an older generation, it might be difficult to understand, and may even skew the results from an "outside looking in" perspective. Again, I am no doctor, I am simply offering alternative information for us to at least consider, before going along with whatever results the WHO present to us. 

[WMGroomAK]

@tlink, @MageTank, @the_spankles

Just something that should hopefully help on the clarification side of things, according to this Psychology Today Article (https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/here-there-and-everywhere/201407/internet-gaming-disorder-in-dsm-5)  the diagnostic criteria for Internet Gaming Disorder include:

 

Quote

1.  Repetitive use of Internet-based games, often with other players, that leads to significant issues with functioning.  Five of the following criteria must be met within one year:

• Preoccupation or obsession with Internet games.
• Withdrawal symptoms when not playing Internet games.
• A build-up of tolerance–more time needs to be spent playing the games.
• The person has tried to stop or curb playing Internet games, but has failed to do so.
• The person has had a loss of interest in other life activities, such as hobbies.
• A person has had continued overuse of Internet games even with the knowledge of how much they impact a person’s life.
• The person lied to others about his or her Internet game usage.
• The person uses Internet games to relieve anxiety or guilt–it’s a way to escape.
• The person has lost or put at risk and opportunity or relationship because of Internet games

This helps me out quite a bit as there are people who do display some of these kind of criteria and it is not healthy, however, that does not mean that all gamers are suffering from a Mental Illness.

[MageTank]

1 minute ago, WMGroomAK said:

@tlink, @MageTank, @the_spankles

Just something that should hopefully help on the clarification side of things, according to this Psychology Today Article (https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/here-there-and-everywhere/201407/internet-gaming-disorder-in-dsm-5)  the diagnostic criteria for Internet Gaming Disorder include:

 

This helps me out quite a bit as there are people who do display some of these kind of criteria and it is not healthy, however, that does not mean that all gamers are suffering from a Mental Illness.

Even then, some of these are too vague to me. 

Quote

The person has had a loss of interest in other life activities, such as hobbies.

A lot of my friends consider gaming to be a hobby. It also implies that people have (or enjoy) other life activities. Simply put: gaming is prevalent to me, due to it's convenience. Gathering my friends to play a game of football requires waiting for a day of good weather, driving to pickup friends and then driving to the local park, just to play for an hour or two, and then drop everyone off. Whereas if we all wake up, get on group chat and say "anyone down to play some Overwatch?", we are all in a group and giggling like little school girls within minutes. Different activity, but the end result is the same. Fun with friends. I am also confused by the emphasis on "Internet Gaming". I know people that to this very day, play Skyrim with thousands (plural) of hours. If anything, I would consider that far more unhealthy due to the impact on ones social skills while gaming completely isolated. 

 

Again, not a doctor, but yeah... It all goes back to what I said earlier. If you do too much of ANYTHING, it can be a problem. You can replace "Internet Gaming" with "Social Media" on this list, and end up with people having mental disorders en masse. 

[tlink]

Just now, MageTank said:

Ha... I break all the rules.

 

Seriously though, I don't think they have all of the information to make the claims that the gaming itself activates the reward center. It might not be related to the gaming itself, and more so the response that is triggered from the gaming. Could be the sensation of winning (or losing, if someone prefers the masochistic side of things), the fulfillment of completing a task or difficult challenge, or simply put: the story itself. I know people that spend all day binge watching Netflix, do these people have a mental disorder for what can be seen as relatively the exact same level of escapism? Where do we draw the line here?

 

While I don't mind them looking into it, I think it's far too early to speak definitively, especially if they themselves are not actually trying the games. Now, before anyone quotes me with the "well, you don't expect them to try drugs to relate to addicts, do you?!?!", let me at least clarify my point. Most of these doctors are likely older individuals, and came about before gaming became as mainstream and prolific as it is. At the moment, gaming is "cool". It's everywhere. Not only that, but it's even profitable for people on Youtube and Twitch. For an older generation, it might be difficult to understand, and may even skew the results from an "outside looking in" perspective. Again, I am no doctor, I am simply offering alternative information for us to at least consider, before going along with whatever results the WHO present to us. 

there has been a lot of research into video game addiction, for about as long as video games exist especially since the media raised a lot of concerns about it. classifying it as an addiction will only further research into it which is a good thing imo.

 

i don't know why you are involving doctors, psychologists are not doctors and you only require a psychology degree to be a psychology researcher. psychology isn't a long study and most psychologists are actually very young because its a booming science. and A LOT of researchers actually do try the drugs on test subjects to see its effects, and its not uncommon that they try it themselves so they can report the effects. most psychological research is actually done on other psychology students since there is a desperate need for test subjects. to solve this they require people signing up for the classes to participate in researches. this is why i think its a good thing they classified it as a mental disorder, because regardless of your stance you know it will increase research and you know these people need to find a way to change. unless you don't believe in the scientific method that is. 

 

science never is definitive, there are discussions about changing the P value requirements because they seem to be too tolerant for some subjects so we can weed out errors. psychology generally speaking is a very young science, but there are very few cases of us not classifying something as a mental disorder after we classified it before. at most they merge it with something else.

 

the reason i agree with them on classifying it as different from for example netflix is because it becomes a tool to live in another world and to participate in that world in a manner that creates compulsion loops which in turn strengthens their neurological pathways to return to it, because they can't get that kind of reward in the real world. this gets strengthened even more because games often don't have a real end. it isn't really important whether video game addiction is caused by a different underlying mental problem, that can be the case for many addictions. internet gaming addiction has been researched since the early 2000's so 17 years is quite a long time to research something. people should also note that this is INTERNET gaming addiction, not gaming addiction. that is a crucial difference because it means not every game is considered addictive. they mainly focus on MMORPG's and other online games that require socializing. in general psychology appears to be sure that internet gaming addiction is real, they just are not sure about its exact boundaries yet.

you can read quite a lot about the research done here:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3832462/

[tlink]

10 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Even then, some of these are too vague to me. 

A lot of my friends consider gaming to be a hobby. It also implies that people have (or enjoy) other life activities. Simply put: gaming is prevalent to me, due to it's convenience. Gathering my friends to play a game of football requires waiting for a day of good weather, driving to pickup friends and then driving to the local park, just to play for an hour or two, and then drop everyone off. Whereas if we all wake up, get on group chat and say "anyone down to play some Overwatch?", we are all in a group and giggling like little school girls within minutes. Different activity, but the end result is the same. Fun with friends. I am also confused by the emphasis on "Internet Gaming". I know people that to this very day, play Skyrim with thousands (plural) of hours. If anything, I would consider that far more unhealthy due to the impact on ones social skills while gaming completely isolated. 

 

Again, not a doctor, but yeah... It all goes back to what I said earlier. If you do too much of ANYTHING, it can be a problem. You can replace "Internet Gaming" with "Social Media" on this list, and end up with people having mental disorders en masse. 

open a DSM5, everything is defined like that. this is why people need to be educated to interpret these and effectively diagnose people. they don't just go on these criteria, but also on GAF scores and other scoring methods for various mental illnesses. i don't know them since im not a practitioner, but i can tell you its not as simple as saying yes or no to those things. if you're interested in something like that you should ask on the science or psychology subreddit or something. you also can't compare diagnosis criteria to other subjects, thats like trying to find a 666 in everything. if you look hard enough you will find it. i can also compare a fetus to cancer but that doesn't mean its the same.

[MageTank]

7 minutes ago, tlink said:

Gigantic wall of text

Aside from questioning my belief in the scientific method, none of this applies to what I was saying, lol. My entire point is, if you apply their rules to what classifies a mental disorder, then almost everything we do in life is a mental disorder. Anything in excess, can start to take over your life and end with similar results. Forget about the "compulsion loops" and "neurological pathways". None of that matters to me. The end result is: people do it as a form of escapism. If they are equally addictive, and are causing equal amounts of damage, then the brains reaction to each specific activity doesn't matter. The end result seems to be the same. Also, a lot of your information seems to be just as speculative as mine. You seem more educated on the subject, I grant you that, but you cannot say for certain that the people that are specifically studying this "disorder", are in fact, younger individuals that are aware of gaming's presence in our culture, and are/have been gamers themselves.

 

As bad as it is to say, I don't really intend to go to any psychology subreddits or science forums to study this, simply because I do not care enough to do so. I tend to view things through a very narrow, black and white lens. If excessive "internet" gaming is bad, excessive "internet" media consumption is too. To the exact same degree in my eyes. 

 

On a semi-unrelated note, is Dr. Phil really a doctor?

[ivan134]

1 hour ago, MageTank said:

I have not drank a soda in over 14 years. Our parents used to make my brothers and I share drinks, and I don't know why, but I grew to resent that, so I switched to water. Never went back, not even a single sip, lol. Makes any kind of carbonated water beverage hurt my throat.

 

I see no problem with where people choose to get their information. The problem is, when people dismiss information from sources that don't fit their narrative. I see people do that here with tech sites as well (WCCFTech being the go to website). If it fits their narrative, they use it, but if it doesn't, it's as if someone committed blasphemy by using it.

 

I always tell people that they should get multiple sources when comparing products they are about to buy, and I suppose that same advice applies to news. Try to get your information from multiple sources. Even if the sources disagree with you, try to understand why they are disagreeing, so that you are fully educated and prepared to offer a rebuttal. Sadly, people seemed to have forgotten that information can be used both ways, and that understanding the information presented by those that disagree with them, is the best way to bolster their own views. Even if you turn out to be wrong in the end, at the very least, you come away learning something new. 

Disagreeing? You think people shun Breitbart because they disagree? Lol

[MageTank]

Just now, ivan134 said:

Disagreeing? You think people shun Breitbart because they disagree? Lol

Yeah. I like to assume some of us are adults, and don't let our petty political views override rational thought. In case you accuse me of "putting words in your mouth" again, I'll make it easier. I am referring to you this time around. 

[Guest Kloaked]

2 hours ago, the_spankles said:

You guys are acting like 5 year olds. your fighting about something that has nothing to do with the topic.

This tends to happen when certain members continue to spew the same garbage, on and on and on.

 

Too bad though.

[2FA]

Well, there are two types of addiction, psychological and physiological where psychological is mentally addicted and physiological is your body being physically addicted. 

 

Most people seem to think that the only real type of addiction is physiological but the human brain is pretty weird and will create a faux withdrawal sometimes if someone psychologically addicted goes too long without their "fix." Of course, that isn't always the case either.

 

 

[tlink]

2 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Aside from questioning my belief in the scientific method, none of this applies to what I was saying, lol. My entire point is, if you apply their rules to what classifies a mental disorder, then almost everything we do in life is a mental disorder. Anything in excess, can start to take over your life and end with similar results. Forget about the "compulsion loops" and "neurological pathways". None of that matters to me. The end result is: people do it as a form of escapism. If they are equally addictive, and are causing equal amounts of damage, then the brains reaction to each specific activity doesn't matter. The end result seems to be the same. Also, a lot of your information seems to be just as speculative as mine. You seem more educated on the subject, I grant you that, but you cannot say for certain that the people that are specifically studying this "disorder", are in fact, younger individuals that are aware of gaming's presence in our culture, and are/have been gamers themselves.

 

As bad as it is to say, I don't really intend to go to any psychology subreddits or science forums to study this, simply because I do not care enough to do so. I tend to view things through a very narrow, black and white lens. If excessive "internet" gaming is bad, excessive "internet" media consumption is too. To the exact same degree in my eyes. 

 

On a semi-unrelated note, is Dr. Phil really a doctor?

what i can say is that mental illness generally is just human traits that are either overdeveloped or under developed. the distribution of healthy vs mentally ill generally follows the normal distribution, and isn't as absolute like psychology assumed for long.

 

of course i can't guarantee it because i haven't done a proper meta analysis on the subject . but it shouldn't matter in the first place since that would be researcher bias and would have problems with reproducibility, there are simple neurological indicators that it activates regions that also get activated during drug abuse. (added meta analyse of neuroscientific research in a spoiler at the bottom) 

 

also an interesting note is that there is research being done onto internet addiction and problematic computer use, just not as in depth as video game addiction because of media attention and such.

yea dr phil is really a doctor. he finished his masters and PhD in clinical psychology i thought. but even those people can be wank, just like any person can be in any field. i never watched him so i don't really know how romanticized and distorted he presents it.

 

ps: sorry if im long winded, its just an extremely complex and nuanced subject of which i myself don't know that much but just about enough to give an informed opinion about a lot of it. i don't want to trample you with information tough

 

speaking about trampling with information, here is that dump of neuroscientific research:

Spoiler

There is some evidence for the idea that dopamine is released.92 The longer the engagement continues, the more permanent the changes in the dopaminergic pathways become. It has been suggested that activity in the anterior cingulate, orbitofrontal cortex, and nucleus accumbens is modified in such a way that natural rewards are experienced as less pleasurable, further reducing control over the behavior.93,94 Research suggests that over time, synaptic activity is reduced, leading to long-term depression and neuroadaptation,95 as well as behavioral sensitization. The synapses in the ventral tegmental area become stronger, glutamate in the nucleus accumbens is reduced, and activity in the amygdala and hippocampus (related to memory) is increased, which can in turn result in craving91,96 and increased response to the availability and particular context of the addictive behavior.93,97 Some studies have shown that the addictive behavior becomes associated with these cues through activity in the nucleus accumbens, which reinforces the effects of the behavior.98 With time, tolerance to the addictive behavior develops and natural rewards are depreciated, resulting in a reward system deficiency and activation of the antireward system.99 The consequent lack of dopamine in mesocortical brain regions can lead to withdrawal symptoms, and in order to overcome these, renewed engagement in the addictive behavior ensues, and may ultimately impact upon the functions of the orbitofrontal cortex and cingulate gyrus.91,100,101

Over the last decade, a number of neuroimaging techniques have been applied to Internet gaming research, allowing for an analysis of addiction correlates regarding both brain function as well as brain structure. Electroencephalograms measure brain activity via changes in voltage in the cerebral cortex via electrodes,102 and were used in six studies of Internet and gaming addiction.103–108 Positron emission tomography measures neuronal metabolism through photons from positron emissions via positively charged electrons.109 Two studies110,111 made use of positron emission tomography to measure Internet and gaming addiction. Like positron emission tomography, single photon emission computed tomography measures metabolic activity in the brain at the level of individual photons,112 and was applied in one study of Internet addiction.113 Eight studies114–121 used functional magnetic resonance imaging to measure changes in blood oxygen levels in order to indicate brain activity in individuals with Internet and gaming addiction.122 Finally, structural magnetic resonance imaging uses methods such as voxel-based morphometry123 and diffusion-tensor imaging124 to image brain morphometry,125 and was used in two studies126,127 in order to assess Internet addiction.

A systematic review of all Internet and gaming addiction studies using neuroimaging methods until 201290 revealed that Internet gaming addiction appears similar to other addictions, including substance-related addictions, at the molecular, neurocircuitry, and behavioral levels. From a molecular perspective, gaming results in the release of striatal dopamine.111 On the other hand, it has been suggested that, in small samples, Internet and gaming addiction is associated with a reward deficiency whereby dopaminergic transporters in the brain are reduced.110,113 In order to reinstate a biochemical equilibrium,99 individuals whose reward system is deficient seek substances and activities which result in the release of dopamine. Under normal circumstances, pleasure drives (including eating and reproduction) are natural rewards that are craved, whereas unnatural rewards include psychoactive substances and addictive behaviors.128 Over time, the individual habituates to the hedonic feelings produced by Internet gaming and develops abstinence symptoms, tolerance, and withdrawal.129 Internet gaming addiction is initiated and maintained.90 The decreased dopaminergic transporters in Internet gaming addiction may explain its frequent co-occurrence with depression,130 bipolar disorder,131 and borderline personality disorder and dissociative symptoms.132

With regards to neural circuitry, when gaming, brain areas associated with addictions are frequently utilized and therefore the activity in regions such as the orbitofrontal cortex and cingulate gyrus is high, which over time can lead to significant alterations in neuronal connectivity114,116,118,119 and brain structure.115,126,127 Internet gaming becomes increasingly salient and individuals lose control over their gaming.90 The individual is immanently motivated to play online games as they have learned the behavior, eventuating in continuous engagement.133

(same source as before) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3832462/

[fade]

What's the mental disorder called for people who read Breitbart?

[Guest Kloaked]

2 minutes ago, fade said:

What's the mental disorder called for people who read Breitbart?

You should familiarize yourself with the CoC before insulting the OP.

[MageTank]

1 minute ago, Kloaked said:

You should familiarize yourself with the CoC before insulting the OP.

He's just jumping on the bandwagon. Starting to see that trend an awful lot nowadays. Rather than blame individual journalists, they would rather attack the entire publication since their views don't align with their own. I bet these same people attack all Wendy's restaurants when the get soggy lettuce on their burger.

 

To be fair, soggy lettuce can ruin ones day. Nothing is more off-putting than expecting a nice cold, crisp bite of lettuce, and to instead experience a slimy, chewy texture. 

 

Where was I going with this again?

[Guest Kloaked]

Just now, MageTank said:

He's just jumping on the bandwagon. Starting to see that trend an awful lot nowadays. Rather than blame individual journalists, they would rather attack the entire publication since their views don't align with their own. I bet these same people attack all Wendy's restaurants when the get soggy lettuce on their burger.

 

To be fair, soggy lettuce can ruin ones day. Nothing is more off-putting than expecting a nice cold, crisp bite of lettuce, and to instead experience a slimy, chewy texture. 

 

Where was I going with this again?

Well they shouldn't insult Wendy's on Twitter at least. Their social media personnel will make them want to delete their account

[ivan134]

26 minutes ago, MageTank said:

Yeah. I like to assume some of us are adults, and don't let our petty political views override rational thought. In case you accuse me of "putting words in your mouth" again, I'll make it easier. I am referring to you this time around. 

Breitbart peddles conspiracies and flat out makes up shit and you think people shun then because of a different political leaning? ROFL. Adult my ass. Accusing my of irrational thought while saying I disagree with Breitbart because of political leanings. Either you've never read anything on Breitbart or you actually agree with the shit they make up. Either way, you're not the rational adult here.

[Guest Kloaked]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

Breitbart peddles conspiracies and flat out makes up shit and you think people shun then because of a different political leaning? ROFL. Adult my ass. Accusing my of irrational thought while saying I disagree with Breitbart because of political leanings. Either you've never read anything on Breitbart or you actually agree with the shit they make up. Either way, you're not the rational adult here.

Can't blame them for making assumptions when you came into the thread like you did.

[Belgarathian]

3 hours ago, EnergyEclipse said:

What? A 'Gaming' disorder?

 

Maybe the W.H.O owner lost at Mario Kart & seeks revenge by giving everyone in whom is addicted to gaming a title? Meh. We'll never know I suppose

 

Wouldn't that be worse? You literally lost the match to a mentally ill person. 
 

[MageTank]

Just now, ivan134 said:

Breitbart peddles conspiracies and flat out makes up shit and you think people shun then because of a different political leaning? ROFL. Adult my ass. Accusing my of irrational thought while saying I disagree with Breitbart because of political leanings. Either you've never read anything on Breitbart or you actually agree with the shit they make up. Either way, you're not the rational adult here.

Let's run through the checklist, shall we? 

 

1. I never said you disagreed with them. 

1 hour ago, MageTank said:

I have not drank a soda in over 14 years. Our parents used to make my brothers and I share drinks, and I don't know why, but I grew to resent that, so I switched to water. Never went back, not even a single sip, lol. Makes any kind of carbonated water beverage hurt my throat.

 

I see no problem with where people choose to get their information. The problem is, when people dismiss information from sources that don't fit their narrative. I see people do that here with tech sites as well (WCCFTech being the go to website). If it fits their narrative, they use it, but if it doesn't, it's as if someone committed blasphemy by using it.

 

I always tell people that they should get multiple sources when comparing products they are about to buy, and I suppose that same advice applies to news. Try to get your information from multiple sources. Even if the sources disagree with you, try to understand why they are disagreeing, so that you are fully educated and prepared to offer a rebuttal. Sadly, people seemed to have forgotten that information can be used both ways, and that understanding the information presented by those that disagree with them, is the best way to bolster their own views. Even if you turn out to be wrong in the end, at the very least, you come away learning something new. 

Go ahead friend, try to find your name, or any reference to you within that post. 

 

2. You are making an assumption about me reading/agreeing with breitbart in the first place. Not only that, but the only two options are: "You've never read them" or "you agree". Nowhere in your assumption do you leave the option for me to have read them, and to have disagreed. Very petty of you, don't you think?

 

Question my rationality all you like, it won't hurt my feelings. Just know that I am not the one getting worked up, cursing over an "alt right" news site that just so happened to publish the exact same information posted on a "left-leaning" news site. The "rational adult" in this scenario, is probably the one that took the time to google more sources before dismissing information simply because "itz dah breitzbartz". 

 

I am curious though. You've gone through this song and dance with me before, and it didn't end well the last time. It's almost as if you think I've gotten soft. I need to somehow find an avatar that is manlier than Macho Man Randy Savage. Sadly, such a thing might not exist.