What is coding?

[Chaicho]

Im not sure if this is te correct subforum to ask this but what is coding? all i imagine when i hear coding is a hacker typing in commands in cmd and hacking nasa but can someone really explain to me what exaclty is coding and what is possible knowing how to code?

[SSL]

That's exactly it. Stinky people in basements typing on terminals with clacky keys and green text.

[ARikozuM]

Trying to bait cod?
I jest.

 

Coding would depend on what your looking for. Hacking I won't get into since it's against my policy and most likely against this forum's as well.

 

Is there anything specific that you wanted to know?

And if you're interested in learning to code I'd recommend just picking up batch script and moving up to any of the other languages.

[Chaicho]

Just now, Julian2000nl said:

other

 

1 minute ago, ARikozuM said:

Trying to bait cod?
I jest.

 

Coding would depend on what your looking for. Hacking I won't get into since it's against my policy and most likely against this forum's as well.

 

Is there anything specific that you wanted to know?

And if you're interested in learning to code I'd recommend just picking up batch script and moving up to any of the other languages.

If i learn for example java code, what can i do when i learn it ? 

[YedZed]

Khanacademy is great for learning concepts. Focus on coding concepts, not syntax. Lots of logic. A bunch of math. 

Start with HTML, CSS, and Javascript, or Python. Then work your way up.

[ARikozuM]

5 minutes ago, Chaicho said:

 

If i learn for example java code, what can i do when i learn it ? 

Sky's the limit...

RuneScape, while using an engine of it's own, uses Java as a compiler. 

 

I would suggest just starting with simple text-based games via batch script. It allows you to learn the most basic rule: Proper routing.

Everything you code needs to be kept track of so that issues can be quickly fixed.

 

Programming isn't something that I can teach, I learned some of it (forgot most since I went to vet school) from playing old text-based games.

 

I would take @YedZed's advice and just pick up HTML or Javascript. Post whatever you make to the programming sub-forum and go from there.

[Chaicho]

1 minute ago, ARikozuM said:

Sky's the limit...

RuneScape, while using an engine of it's own, uses Java as a compiler. 

 

I would suggest just starting with simple text-based games via batch script. It allows you to learn the most basic rule: Proper routing.

Everything you code needs to be kept track of so that issues can be quickly fixed.

 

Programming isn't something that I can teach, I learned some of it (forgot most since I went to vet school) from playing old text-based games.

 

I would take @YedZed's advice and just pick up HTML or Javascript. Post whatever you make to the programming sub-forum and go from there.

wow thank you i will try to learn as fast as possible

[ARikozuM]

6 minutes ago, Chaicho said:

wow thank you i will try to learn as fast as possible

Open up Notepad.

 

@echo off
cls
title Matrix Rain
goto MAIN
:MAIN
color 02
echo %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random%
goto SECOND
:SECOND
color 08
echo %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random%
goto MAIN

 

Save as X.bat after selecting the drop-down menu and selecting all files.

Run X.bat

 

EPILEPSY WARNING

[Chaicho]

3 minutes ago, ARikozuM said:

Open up Notepad.

 

@echo off
cls
title Matrix Rain
goto MAIN
:MAIN
color 02
echo %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random%
goto SECOND
:SECOND
color 08
echo %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random% %random%
goto MAIN

 

Save as X.bat after selecting the drop-down menu and selecting all files.

Run X.bat

will my computer explode now? 

[ARikozuM]

Red pill or blue pill? The choice is yours...

 

[vorticalbox]

6 hours ago, ARikozuM said:

Red pill or blue pill? The choice is yours...

 

anyone who doesn't pick charizard

 

7 hours ago, YedZed said:

Khanacademy is great for learning concepts. Focus on coding concepts, not syntax. Lots of logic. A bunch of math. 

Start with HTML, CSS, and Javascript, or Python. Then work your way up.

 I 100% agree with this. Get some OOP under your belt @Nuluvius has a nice set of links to post *wink*.

 

Once you get the concepts of OOP the language syntax are pretty easy to get your head around.

[Limecat86]

50 minutes ago, vorticalbox said:

anyone who doesn't pick charizard

Me! Blastoise FTW!

[vorticalbox]

11 minutes ago, Limecat86 said:

Me! Blastoise FTW!

first gym is super easy and so is the second gym. Charizard makes these very hard.

[Nuluvius]

On 09/08/2016 at 0:51 PM, vorticalbox said:

 I 100% agree with this. Get some OOP under your belt @Nuluvius has a nice set of links to post *wink*.

You summoned me 

 

Not just OOP but cross paradigm knowledge is just as important as it will broaden one's horizons and capabilities.

On 09/08/2016 at 0:51 PM, vorticalbox said:

Once you get the concepts of OOP the language syntax are pretty easy to get your head around.

In any event the theory is arguably more important than learning the specifics of any given syntax as it is indeed language agnostic. A strong understanding of the theory is what distinguishes a good Software Engineer/Developer who is capable of creating well designed, eloquent and extensible software from a chimp who bangs away at its keyboard producing line after line of piss poor garbage.

 

Here are some starting points for you to take a look at:

• Dependency Injection (DI)
• Inversion of Control (IoC)
• Design Patterns
  • Pluralsight Library of Design Patterns
  • Ports and Adaptors/Hexagonal Architecture
  • Model View Controller (MVC)
  • Model View ViewModel (MVVM)
• Single responsibility, Open-closed, Liskov substitution, Interface segregation and Dependency inversion (SOLID)
• Atomicity, Consistency, Isolation and Durability (ACID)
• Keep It Simple, Stupid (KISS)
• Agile Software Development Methodology
• Test Driven Development (TDD)
• Behaviour Driven Development (BDD)
• Programming Paradigms
• Comparison of Programming Paradigms

Which is all well and good but:

On 09/08/2016 at 5:14 AM, Chaicho said:

Im not sure if this is te correct subforum to ask this but what is coding?

Essentially your question was: "What is coding?"

On 09/08/2016 at 5:14 AM, Chaicho said:

all i imagine when i hear coding is a hacker typing in commands in cmd and hacking nasa but can someone really explain to me what exaclty is coding and what is possible knowing how to code?

The very nature of your preconception of the word is exactly why I bitterly hate it so much... Coding is a broad term.

 

In the context of building software it would be more appropriate to call it Software Engineering/Development since applying the term coding can seem a bit derogatory due to the scope of the process. At a professional level one can expect to be involved in both the design and architecture of a system or components of a system as well as their technical implementation by writing code in a given linguistic syntax in a given programming paradigm or just as likely cross paradigm often utilising a wide variety of technologies.

 

A Software Engineer/Developer must have a strong understanding of good engineering principals, design and architecture, they must also be technically well rounded as well as being capable of adhering to a variety of development methodologies. As one progresses in their career in the software industry they will inevitably find that their responsibilities will increase quite rapidly. Indeed at the more senior levels one can expect to be responsible for whole teams and even whole projects.

 

It's a broad field and the industry is vast. What do you want to do with your life?

[FakezZ]

On 8/9/2016 at 7:25 AM, Julian2000nl said:

There is no such thing as just "code"

You have multiple languages, here are some examples:

• HTML
• PHP
• Java
• Python
• Batch

You learn coding mostly from other people their code, and from doing projects.

Like i just setup my own imageboard with Futallaby.

 

Oh and about hacking, metasploit is cool to check out.

I hate to be "that" guy but HTML is not really a programming language

[Nuluvius]

1 minute ago, FakezZ said:

I hate to be "that" guy but HTML is not really a programming language

Indeed it's not, it is instead a markup language.

[Dat Guy]

Coding PDF for food!

[Chaicho]

17 hours ago, FakezZ said:

I hate to be "that" guy but HTML is not really a programming language

But can html help me learn web design? And then move to css?

[Dat Guy]

HTML is the only possible formatting language for websites, so: yes.

[Dat Guy]

You can't display non-HTML/XML formatted "websites" in your browser. Theoretically browsers could parse Brainfuck. But they don't.

[Nuluvius]

1 hour ago, Nicholatian said:

‘Tis a bit ironic that your efforts to throw the book at him link to KISS. None of these subjects are very practical at all, and are much to do with computer science and little to do with software programming.

The level of ignorance displayed with that statement is simply astounding. It's interesting to know that you don't see what are widely considered to be core Software Engineering principles and practices as 'very practical at all'. I'd be very interested to know what principles and practices you adhere to while writing production grade software.

[Dat Guy]

Yep, I usually write my websites in C, but I can't recommend to write a website in your favorite language before you understand at least the very basics of HTML. So HTML is an implicit prerequisite.

[Nuluvius]

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

First of all, the personal insult was really uncalled for. There is no need to go there at all.

There was no personal insult insinuated or otherwise, only a statement of direct fact; you'd made an ignorant statement. If you cannot handle the consequences of such an action and instead choose to take offence when called out on it then perhaps you should consider removing yourself from matters that may ultimately be beyond your level right now.

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Do you know how jobs are filled in producing software? You apparently don’t understand how programs are made in teams, because those theoretical texts only matter to a code monkey who’s in a one man band.

Now you have simply descended from making ignorant noises to making overtly obnoxious ones. You really aren't helping yourself.

 

I have been in the industry for over a decade now and have worked at a wide verity of levels and in a wide variety of companies of varying prestige and size. In all of those, the ones that were successful that is, these kind of principals were normal and expected at any level.

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

In a professional, teamed environment, one or more computer scientists plan out and play architect for the structure of the software. Below them, a lead developer works as a coordinator between regular programmers and the computer scientists to ensure the remainder of those practises are adhered to—what isn’t already handled by a computer scientist, that is. Then, the programmers do all of the work of actually developing the program, following intricately detailed technical specs created by the lead developer who made them from the scientific concepts written out by the computer scientists.

Companies that cultivate such an archaic authoritarian culture predominantly have a very high staff turnover and are generally considered to be nothing more than production mills. It's not agile and it's not really that commonplace these days. They should be avoided like the plague.

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

All of those manual topics you linked to are relevant to the first two groups of people; not the last. What do you think the OP is interested in doing? Being a lead dev? Studying CompSci? Considering his mental image and the general terms (s)he asked about, I doubt so.

Again this goes back the the second point.

 

Moreover you seem to have completely contradicted yourself. At one point you state that:

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

...those theoretical texts only matter to a code monkey who’s in a one man band.

Yet at another you are stating:

2 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

All of those manual topics you linked to are relevant to the first two groups of people; not the last.

Thereby you seem to be saying that the theory only ever applies to: Computer Scientists and Lead Developers exclusively i.e. every other class of developer is a simpleton 'code monkey'. Given this one can only be lead to speculate that you seem to lack a clear understanding of the industry, disciplines and job roles involved at a fundamental level...

 

As very general overview of the two disciplines: Computer Science lends itself to R&D and specialisation in mathematics and physics for example, it's more about devising new ways of doing things; be that tools, algorithms or technology. These raw products or materials are then consumed by Software Engineers/Developers and refined to production grade before being integrated into release software products. That said in the real world there's often no clear black and white separation between these two disciplines (or rather there shouldn't be in an effective team). But I would say this; as a Software Engineer, if I wanted help with some mathematical concept I'd be seeking the Computer Scientist out to sit down and plan/pair program with...

 

In an agile environment it is usually down to the Stakeholders to express a need for a thing. It's then up to the Product owner to drive the vision which coalesces into a product. It is the team; which consists of Software Engineers/Developers, Computer Scientists, Testers and other specialities of all levels who are then involved in the architecture, planning and then implementation of the product in iterative cycles.

 

In any event theory is very important at the earliest level possible. Knowledge of both Software Engineering and Computer Science is important. One may choose to weight either according to where exactly they want to be in the industry or what is of particular interest.

 

As I stated previously:

6 hours ago, Nuluvius said:

 I'd be very interested to know what principles and practices you adhere to while writing production grade software.

Anytime that you'd like to elaborate on that it should make for further interesting 'discussion'. Or perhaps you simply fall into the simpleton 'code monkey' category that you previously outlined where everything has already been dictated verbatim for you?

[vorticalbox]

Well that escalated quickly.

[Nuluvius]

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Do me a favour and cut out that superfluous verbiage. It doesn’t make you appear smarter.

Your failure to recognise the ad hominem nature in this response is quite ironic, lol.

I fail to see how as I addressed your obnoxious noises first and then deconstructed your argument second.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Now you have simply descended from indirect insults to making overtly direct ones.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

...despite your venomous tone of voice and schoolteacher harshness you seem to want to “educate” me about this with.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

So please, do tell me about how it really works, O enlightened one! Surely you must know so much about working in teams on software

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

who the fuck are you?

It's always disappointing when one debases themselves in such a way. I wonder what has made you so angry and hostile with everyone who disagrees with you/points out when you have been wrong. Moreover don't you find it hypocritical given your opening statement:

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Your failure to recognise the ad hominem nature in this response is quite ironic, lol.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Are you going to leave that vague, or are you going to cite specific company names? I know people who work under strict NDAs and can at least tell me that they work for Nintendo of Europe or whatever, so please do share this invaluable credibility you hold!

If we set aside the obnoxious overtures of your question it appeared as though you were asking as to the basis of my experience:

20 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Do you know how jobs are filled in producing software? You apparently don’t understand how programs are made in teams...

Which I detailed for you. I will not however be goaded into blurring the line between personal and professional life.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Here’s where you messed up.

 

You’ve shifted the goalposts away from what companies actually do to what companies should be doing, and I’m sorry, but we could argue until the cows come home about what people should be doing. Those are two entirely separate matters, and regardless, it’s probably much ado about nothing for us to debate that anyway.

Not really. I was addressing the point that you'd made where you think that software theory is/should be exclusively limited to only the upper echelons within a company and that the lower ranks simply implement a spec verbatim.

 

Setting aside the fact that one can't really effectively implement production grade work even following a spec verbatim without at least some basic theory (one would likely get pulled up rather quickly for violating things such as Single Responsibility) it's also a fact that these kind of companies are now in the minority since the advent of Agile. Indeed many of them are opting to invest in the injection of Agile and thus making the transition in order to keep up with the pace of current industry.

14 hours ago, Nuluvius said:

As very general overview of the two disciplines: Computer Science lends itself to R&D and specialisation in mathematics and physics for example, it's more about devising new ways of doing things; be that tools, algorithms or technology. These raw products or materials are then consumed by Software Engineers/Developers and refined to production grade before being integrated into release software products.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

I know that, and explained that before. I thought you knew all this! Tell me something I don’t know!

Now you are gaslighting:

20 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

In a professional, teamed environment, one or more computer scientists plan out and play architect for the structure of the software. Below them, a lead developer works as a coordinator between regular programmers and the computer scientists to ensure the remainder of those practises are adhered to—what isn’t already handled by a computer scientist, that is. Then, the programmers do all of the work of actually developing the program, following intricately detailed technical specs created by the lead developer who made them from the scientific concepts written out by the computer scientists.

 

All of those manual topics you linked to are relevant to the first two groups of people; not the last.

You are clearly confused about the responsibilities of each of the different roles and disciplines. This is further compounded by the fact that you are constantly contradicting yourself:

22 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

None of these subjects are very practical at all

20 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

...those theoretical texts only matter to a code monkey who’s in a one man band.

Never mind that you are saying that basic concepts involved in the fundamental structure and assembly of software are 'not very practical at all' i.e. design patterns for instance. It really doesn't look like you know very much of what you are trying to talk about at all 

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

Now, let’s bring this back to the original topic at hand for a moment.

Does the OP honestly want to become a professional software developer? No!

Is (s)he, in all likelihood, going to find all of the textbook reading you threw at them useful? No!

Does any of this “debate” on the ramifications of software development even matter at all to them? No!

A significant amount of assumptions given that relatively little is actually known.

7 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

So please, before you go on too much more about how I misunderstood the reality of the field of software programming, consider that.

Once again you are avoiding the glaringly obvious:

22 hours ago, Nicholatian said:

None of these subjects are very practical at all

21 hours ago, Nuluvius said:

 I'd be very interested to know what principles and practices you adhere to while writing production grade software.

Why are you being so elusive about this? I am inviting you to demonstrate.