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Is it legal for a teacher to do this? [UK]

SIGSEGV
By SIGSEGV
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My section was about confiscated property. Once the phone was in the teachers posession, that's what takes over. Not the part before the search.

Regardless I've contacted the board of education and we'll see what they have to say on the matter. More out of curiosity and boredom than anything else.

 

True, but this is the UK, not the US. Passwords are not protected in the UK either. Different laws.

 

Oh I agree, but most parents don't agree with every law. Especially in the UK.

From my understanding the school system there is extremely strict.

 

Confiscation doesn't give the teacher/tutor the right to search the device. So you've nullified your original point. If it is confiscated with good reason, those being the ones we both listed, it then becomes a search and there must be 2 tutors/teachers present, one searching, one witness. It's written in good'ol black and white, which I hope you read as you keep on citing it. I have read it btw. Which is why I'm failing to understand why you're not understanding the breach of privacy?

 

Also Parents do agree with law, however they don't agree with fuck boi teachers doing what ever the fuck they want because they're on a power binge and breaking the law.

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True, but this is the UK, not the US. Passwords are not protected in the UK either. Different laws.

Just weird

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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̌̅̒̾̈́̆͌̌̾̎̽̐̅̏́̈̔͛̀̋̃͊̒̓͗͒̑͒̃͂̌̄̇̑̇͛̆̾͛̒̇̍̒̓̀̈́̄̐͂̍͊͗̎̔͌͛̂̏̉̊̎͗͊͒̂̈̽̊́̔̊̃͑̈́̑̌̋̓̅̔́́͒̄̈́̈̂͐̈̅̈̓͌̓͊́̆͌̉͐̊̉͛̓̏̓̅̈́͂̉̒̇̉̆̀̍̄̇͆͛̏̉̑̃̓͂́͋̃̆̒͋̓͊̄́̓̕̕̕̚͘͘͘̚̕̚͘̕̕͜͜͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͠ͅS̷̢̨̧̢̡̨̢̨̢̨̧̧̨̧͚̱̪͇̱̮̪̮̦̝͖̜͙̘̪̘̟̱͇͎̻̪͚̩͍̠̹̮͚̦̝̤͖̙͔͚̙̺̩̥̻͈̺̦͕͈̹̳̖͓̜͚̜̭͉͇͖̟͔͕̹̯̬͍̱̫̮͓̙͇̗̙̼͚̪͇̦̗̜̼̠͈̩̠͉͉̘̱̯̪̟͕̘͖̝͇̼͕̳̻̜͖̜͇̣̠̹̬̗̝͓̖͚̺̫͛̉̅̐̕͘͜͜͜͜ͅͅͅ.̶̨̢̢̨̢̨̢̛̻͙̜̼̮̝̙̣̘̗̪̜̬̳̫̙̮̣̹̥̲̥͇͈̮̟͉̰̮̪̲̗̳̰̫̙͍̦̘̠̗̥̮̹̤̼̼̩͕͉͕͇͙̯̫̩̦̟̦̹͈͔̱̝͈̤͓̻̟̮̱͖̟̹̝͉̰͊̓̏̇͂̅̀̌͑̿͆̿̿͗̽̌̈́̉̂̀̒̊̿͆̃̄͑͆̃̇͒̀͐̍̅̃̍̈́̃̕͘͜͜͝͠͠z̴̢̢̡̧̢̢̧̢̨̡̨̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̲͚̠̜̮̠̜̞̤̺͈̘͍̻̫͖̣̥̗̙̳͓͙̫̫͖͍͇̬̲̳̭̘̮̤̬̖̼͎̬̯̼̮͔̭̠͎͓̼̖̟͈͓̦̩̦̳̙̮̗̮̩͙͓̮̰̜͎̺̞̝̪͎̯̜͈͇̪̙͎̩͖̭̟͎̲̩͔͓͈͌́̿͐̍̓͗͑̒̈́̎͂̋͂̀͂̑͂͊͆̍͛̄̃͌͗̌́̈̊́́̅͗̉͛͌͋̂̋̇̅̔̇͊͑͆̐̇͊͋̄̈́͆̍̋̏͑̓̈́̏̀͒̂̔̄̅̇̌̀̈́̿̽̋͐̾̆͆͆̈̌̿̈́̎͌̊̓̒͐̾̇̈́̍͛̅͌̽́̏͆̉́̉̓̅́͂͛̄̆͌̈́̇͐̒̿̾͌͊͗̀͑̃̊̓̈̈́̊͒̒̏̿́͑̄̑͋̀̽̀̔̀̎̄͑̌̔́̉̐͛̓̐̅́̒̎̈͆̀̍̾̀͂̄̈́̈́̈́̑̏̈́̐̽̐́̏̂̐̔̓̉̈́͂̕̚̕͘͘̚͘̚̕̚̚̚͘̕̕̕͜͜͝͠͠͝͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͝͝ͅͅͅī̸̧̧̧̡̨̨̢̨̛̛̘͓̼̰̰̮̗̰͚̙̥̣͍̦̺͈̣̻͇̱͔̰͈͓͖͈̻̲̫̪̲͈̜̲̬̖̻̰̦̰͙̤̘̝̦̟͈̭̱̮̠͍̖̲͉̫͔͖͔͈̻̖̝͎̖͕͔̣͈̤̗̱̀̅̃̈́͌̿̏͋̊̇̂̀̀̒̉̄̈́͋͌̽́̈́̓̑̈̀̍͗͜͜͠͠ͅp̴̢̢̧̨̡̡̨̢̨̢̢̢̨̡̛̛͕̩͕̟̫̝͈̖̟̣̲̖̭̙͇̟̗͖͎̹͇̘̰̗̝̹̤̺͉͎̙̝̟͙͚̦͚͖̜̫̰͖̼̤̥̤̹̖͉͚̺̥̮̮̫͖͍̼̰̭̤̲͔̩̯̣͖̻͇̞̳̬͉̣̖̥̣͓̤͔̪̙͎̰̬͚̣̭̞̬͎̼͉͓̮͙͕̗̦̞̥̮̘̻͎̭̼͚͎͈͇̥̗͖̫̮̤̦͙̭͎̝͖̣̰̱̩͎̩͎̘͇̟̠̱̬͈̗͍̦̘̱̰̤̱̘̫̫̮̥͕͉̥̜̯͖̖͍̮̼̲͓̤̮͈̤͓̭̝̟̲̲̳̟̠͉̙̻͕͙̞͔̖͈̱̞͓͔̬̮͎̙̭͎̩̟̖͚̆͐̅͆̿͐̄̓̀̇̂̊̃̂̄̊̀͐̍̌̅͌̆͊̆̓́̄́̃̆͗͊́̓̀͑͐̐̇͐̍́̓̈́̓̑̈̈́̽͂́̑͒͐͋̊͊̇̇̆̑̃̈́̎͛̎̓͊͛̐̾́̀͌̐̈́͛̃̂̈̿̽̇̋̍͒̍͗̈͘̚̚͘̚͘͘͜͜͜͜͜͜͠͠͝͝ͅͅͅ☻♥■∞{╚mYÄÜXτ╕○\╚Θº£¥ΘBM@Q05♠{{↨↨▬§¶‼↕◄►☼1♦  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one of my teachers got away with giving me bad scores all year without a reason, i was not allowed to complain about it, the school only communicated with parents, and they ensured me i was a shitty student, even though all arguments between me and the teacher ended in the scores being updated to 10/10...

Same... That's why I am stuck taking the same math class as last year, and another right now is giving me an E. Every assignment that has been graded has been turned in.

 

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Yeah, pretty sure thats illegal

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How could this ever be legal... The only way for it to be legal, is if a police officer does it, with a warrant.
Otherwise, the teacher would need to get the permission(most likely written) of that kid to even be able to do this himself.

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Same... That's why I am stuck taking the same math class as last year, and another right now is giving me an E. Every assignment that has been graded has been turned in.

well, i asked the teacher to show me why my scores were that low, he refused, i talked to the principal, he refused.

my parents talked to the principal, and he talked to the teacher, next class a super pissed off teacher hands me a stack of (wrongly corrected) tests.

 

thats where the straight A's started, and the guy blaming me for the school forcing all teachers to let students know where they went wrong on a test.

(PS: the teacher claimed i never asked, and they blindly believed him, he also didnt get in trouble for 20 tests with a 0 that should have been a 10)

 

schools like this can only be improved by damaging that what they are good at: their reputation with parents. if the parents know what practisces happen there, they are faster to intervene, and thus the school's reputation will get damaged faster, driving them down a hole where they cant do anything but improve how students are treated.

every time the school comes up i inform the people in the conversation about what it felt like for a student, rather than how the parents are soothed about how amazing it is, while students are left to rot in a school where the education hasnt advanced since the building was a WWII military base.

 

How could this ever be legal... The only way for it to be legal, is if a police officer does it, with a warrant.

Otherwise, the teacher would need to get the permission(most likely written) of that kid to even be able to do this himself.

on topic: its not the teacher's job of going trough the phone, its the school management thats supposed to do that, and if its serious enough for such methods, the police should have been there already... not that anyone cares for the rights of students either way, its just the parents that need to be soothed, they're paying the whole party.

 

this spoiler is an edited in rant, its kinda negative and long, so be prepared i guess...

EDIT: ps; if you ever hear about a young male in belgium that went insane and burned down a school, that'll probably be me, and that school. i honestly feel they ruined my life, and if i ever come to a point where i become a psychopath, they're my target. they're the breeding ground of scum in my area, and even though they think they're doing good, they're doing anything but. they claim they support students with ADHD, autism, dyslexia, etc. actually they do anything but. students with ADHD are in detention daily because they dont pay attention, students with autism are let loose in an enviroment where its normal to kick in windows to prove a point. students with reading or writing difficulties get told to just try harder, people with language problems just get shunned.

they dont talk to students, nor do they care about them. stuff like before mentioned happens on a daily basis. teachers openly have their favourites that get straight A-s, and their "lesser favourites" that get straight F-s (i'm not an athletic person, and because of that my sports teacher found it necessary to make me run in 30°c weather out in the sun with a heat stroke. they ensured my parents i was blowing up the problem, and me being dizzy all day after 2 hours of nosebleeds was not related.) i'm just putting this here as an attention grabber for parents, maybe listen to what your child is telling you, maybe the school isnt as right as you think they are. i'm a timid person, nor do i think "i'll sue you" is the right approach, but if i ever find out that a school does to my kids what happened to me (god forbid i ever produce offspring..) i will personally make sure they have to close their doors forever. schools get away with too much, because a child's word is easily ignored, or forgotten. i spent 5 years in that hellhole without a voice, i came out as a young adult unsure how to use my voice, or how to even fit in a society. the school i spent my last two years of high school got me straight, and taught me that what that hellhole was, isnt what a school should be. my education and mental health has been ruined, dont let your kid fall in the same hole.

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well, i asked the teacher to show me why my scores were that low, he refused, i talked to the principal, he refused.

my parents talked to the principal, and he talked to the teacher, next class a super pissed off teacher hands me a stack of (wrongly corrected) tests.

 

thats where the straight A's started, and the guy blaming me for the school forcing all teachers to let students know where they went wrong on a test.

(PS: the teacher claimed i never asked, and they blindly believed him, he also didnt get in trouble for 20 tests with a 0 that should have been a 10)

 

schools like this can only be improved by damaging that what they are good at: their reputation with parents. if the parents know what practisces happen there, they are faster to intervene, and thus the school's reputation will get damaged faster, driving them down a hole where they cant do anything but improve how students are treated.

every time the school comes up i inform the people in the conversation about what it felt like for a student, rather than how the parents are soothed about how amazing it is, while students are left to rot in a school where the education hasnt advanced since the building was a WWII military base.

 

on topic: its not the teacher's job of going trough the phone, its the school management thats supposed to do that, and if its serious enough for such methods, the police should have been there already... not that anyone cares for the rights of students either way, its just the parents that need to be soothed, they're paying the whole party.

 

this spoiler is an edited in rant, its kinda negative and long, so be prepared i guess...

EDIT: ps; if you ever hear about a young male in belgium that went insane and burned down a school, that'll probably be me, and that school. i honestly feel they ruined my life, and if i ever come to a point where i become a psychopath, they're my target. they're the breeding ground of scum in my area, and even though they think they're doing good, they're doing anything but. they claim they support students with ADHD, autism, dyslexia, etc. actually they do anything but. students with ADHD are in detention daily because they dont pay attention, students with autism are let loose in an enviroment where its normal to kick in windows to prove a point. students with reading or writing difficulties get told to just try harder, people with language problems just get shunned.

they dont talk to students, nor do they care about them. stuff like before mentioned happens on a daily basis. teachers openly have their favourites that get straight A-s, and their "lesser favourites" that get straight F-s (i'm not an athletic person, and because of that my sports teacher found it necessary to make me run in 30°c weather out in the sun with a heat stroke. they ensured my parents i was blowing up the problem, and me being dizzy all day after 2 hours of nosebleeds was not related.) i'm just putting this here as an attention grabber for parents, maybe listen to what your child is telling you, maybe the school isnt as right as you think they are. i'm a timid person, nor do i think "i'll sue you" is the right approach, but if i ever find out that a school does to my kids what happened to me (god forbid i ever produce offspring..) i will personally make sure they have to close their doors forever. schools get away with too much, because a child's word is easily ignored, or forgotten. i spent 5 years in that hellhole without a voice, i came out as a young adult unsure how to use my voice, or how to even fit in a society. the school i spent my last two years of high school got me straight, and taught me that what that hellhole was, isnt what a school should be. my education and mental health has been ruined, dont let your kid fall in the same hole.

^^^^^^^^^^^^

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You mean the way it's supposed to be used? ;)

Also, it's definitely. One L, no E.

No, that is not the way they are suppose to be used.

If using multiple quotes, then you must either use spoiler tags or use @[username]

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No, that is not the way they are suppose to be used.

If using multiple quotes, then you must either use spoiler tags or use @[username]

What are you talking about? Please quote and source any rule in the CoC that prevents him from using quotes in that manner. That's exactly how Multi-quote is supposed to be used. Every person he quoted will get a notification, automatically - and furthermore, it's easy for every person to follow his post, his quotes, who he is replying to, etc.

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What are you talking about? Please quote and source any rule in the CoC that prevents him from using quotes in that manner. That's exactly how Multi-quote is supposed to be used. Every person he quoted will get a notification, automatically - and furthermore, it's easy for every person to follow his post, his quotes, who he is replying to, etc.

I was given a--

i cannot tell you what i was given but it was given by a moderator for multi-quoting many users and replying to their posts

OFF TOPIC: I suggest every poll from now on to have "**CK EA" option instead of "Other"

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Posted

I was given a--

i cannot tell you what i was given but it was given by a moderator for multi-quoting many users and replying to their posts

I assume they gave you a "warning point", which is kind of like keeping score for being bad.

 

I'm also assuming that was a one off, and that Moderator was wrong. There is not a single mention of "Multi-quote" or "Multi Quote" at all in the CoC. There is only one reference to "multiple", which is about not being allowed to create multiple accounts.

 

Weird. I'm sorry you had to deal with that. I'd love to see an explanation from the Mod team about the justification such a ridiculous rule that isn't listed anywhere.

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Posted

I assume they gave you a "warning point", which is kind of like keeping score for being bad.

 

I'm also assuming that was a one off, and that Moderator was wrong. There is not a single mention of "Multi-quote" or "Multi Quote" at all in the CoC. There is only one reference to "multiple", which is about not being allowed to create multiple accounts.

 

Weird. I'm sorry you had to deal with that. I'd love to see an explanation from the Mod team about the justification such a ridiculous rule that isn't listed anywhere.

nonono

you are not allowed to speak of warning points and such according to the moderators outside of a PM.

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nonono

you are not allowed to speak of warning points and such according to the moderators outside of a PM.

You cannot confirm or deny that. I understand. I can speculate to the end of the world though :P To muse to myself.

 

Anyway, back on topic :P

 

Even if this is legal - well - it shouldn't be. Not unless there are extremely extenuating circumstances, or unless they have a court order and a police officer present.

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Posted

If he did have a passcode, and the teacher asked him, and he gave the teacher the passcode, then he is in effect giving consent. However, the kid could then also argue that he was coerced.

 

If the teacher asks you for your passcode, just say no. If the teacher insists, straight up tell them "You do not have authority to make me divulge my passcode. The contents of that device are my personal property, and you accessing them without my consent or a court warrant violates my privacy, and the rights assured to be under UK law. Please do not ask again."

 

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Taking the phone should be legal, copying data off of the phone is illegal and can only be done by authorities, in this case obviously the police, and I'd definitely contact the principal and inform them about it so they'll take the disciplinary actions. I'd also contact either a lawyer and/or the police and ask if and what can be done.

 

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So apparently, in my school a kid was made to give his phone to a teacher, the teacher then proceeded to go through his phone and copy all his stuff off of it. He did this because there was a fight and the teacher thought he'd have a recording of it or something, the teacher called the kids parents and told them he had been in 'gang related activities' (the kid's not in a gang and the teacher's already been warned about going round calling any group of kids a 'gang' before).

I'm angry that a teacher would do this anyways, but is it even legal?

This is probably not the place to ask this, instead try talking to a lawyer or other person who knows a lot about the law to get this sorted out

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Confiscation doesn't give the teacher/tutor the right to search the device. So you've nullified your original point. If it is confiscated with good reason, those being the ones we both listed, it then becomes a search and there must be 2 tutors/teachers present, one searching, one witness. It's written in good'ol black and white, which I hope you read as you keep on citing it. I have read it btw. Which is why I'm failing to understand why you're not understanding the breach of privacy?

 

Also Parents do agree with law, however they don't agree with fuck boi teachers doing what ever the fuck they want because they're on a power binge and breaking the law.

I have bad news my friend, you are unfortunately wrong and I was correct. I received a reply from the UK Department of Education this morning on my way to work.

I'll simply quote you the email below.

 

 

Dear Darin

Thank you for your email of 16 December about policies relating to searching and confiscating property from pupils.

Teachers have the power to discipline pupils for misbehaviour and this includes the power to confiscate, retain or dispose of a pupil’s property as a disciplinary penalty, where reasonable to do so. The government has produced advice for schools on searching, screening and confiscation which you may wish to read and is available at: www.gov.uk/government/publications/searching-screening-and-confiscation<http://www.gov.uk/government/publications/searching-screening-and-confiscation>.

Where the person conducting the search finds an electronic device they may examine any data or files on the device if they think there is a good reason to do so. Following an examination, if the person has decided to return the device to the owner, or to retain or dispose of it, they may erase any data or files, if they think there is a good reason to do so.

In determining a ‘good reason’ to examine or erase the data or files the staff member must reasonably suspect that the data or file on the device in question has been, or could be, used to cause harm, to disrupt teaching or break the school rules.

If inappropriate material is found on the device it is up to the teacher to decide whether they should delete that material, retain it as evidence (of a criminal offence or a breach of school discipline) or whether the material is of such seriousness that it requires the involvement of the police.

While the government has set out the legal framework within which schools can confiscate and retain pupil’s property as a disciplinary penalty, schools are free to develop specific policies according to their own particular circumstances. The law does not set out when to return the item, or who to return the item to as these are issues for the school to decide dependent upon the individual situation. Schools are, however, required to act reasonably.

It is important to note that any complaints with regards to the screening and searching of pupils should be dealt with using the school’s complaints procedure

I hope this clarifies the situation.

Your correspondence has been allocated reference number 2015-0056547. If you need to respond to us, please visit: https://www.education.gov.uk/contactus and quote your reference number.

As part of our commitment to improving the service we provide to our customers, we are interested in hearing your views and would welcome your comments via our website at: https://www.education.gov.uk/pcusurvey.

Yours sincerely

K Walker  

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I have bad news my friend, you are unfortunately wrong and I was correct. I received a reply from the UK Department of Education this morning on my way to work.

I'll simply quote you the email below.

Nice they copy and pasted what I cited to you

A witness needs to be present to conduct a search.

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Nice they copy and pasted what I cited to you

A witness needs to be present to conduct a search.

I asked if there needed to be two present. Seeing as they mention teacher and not teacher and witness or teachers you're incorrect.

I'm sorry you can't seem to get passed the fact that you're looking at physical searches and not searches of a device already confiscated.

:rolleyes:

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And that my children is why you lock your phone.  Might want to check school rule books.  In some cases they do have your "permission" to search your stuff.  Though that might be built on legal shaky ground that requires probable cause and law enforcement to be present. (That's the US though...)

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I asked if there needed to be two present. Seeing as they mention teacher and not teacher and witness or teachers you're incorrect.

I'm sorry you can't seem to get passed the fact that you're looking at physical searches and not searches of a device already confiscated.

:rolleyes:

They didn't answer you with their own answer, they gave you the same stuff we've been passing around.

That's how they answer you without answering so they can't be used in court. You have a lot to learn about British law my friend, stick to your own.

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I asked if there needed to be two present. Seeing as they mention teacher and not teacher and witness or teachers you're incorrect.

I'm sorry you can't seem to get passed the fact that you're looking at physical searches and not searches of a device already confiscated.

:rolleyes:

I must admit, @Benji_w has a point. They didn't answer that specific question (about two teachers) you posed. They simply avoided it and used somewhat ambiguous answers.

 

I would reply to the email and specifically request clarification regarding two teachers. Get them to outright say, in writing, whether multiple teachers are required or not. If they continue to refuse to specifically address that question (eg: Keep avoiding it or answering vaguely), then call them out on it.

 

They didn't answer you with their own answer, they gave you the same stuff we've been passing around.

That's how they answer you without answering so they can't be used in court. You have a lot to learn about British law my friend, stick to your own.

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Just make a claim saying he's a paedophile that'll get him in trouble.

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