Obama plans to BAN 5.56 through executive order

[ComradeHX]

oh was he the one that said he had a "sniper"

Yep. Pew Pew.

360noscope

[spartaman64]

I really hope you're kidding...

 

You told us you had a "sniper" (rifle)

Nope, just a BB gun.

Which you bought in a gun store? (BULL)

yep have fun having a bb gun fight with an air gun doing 2500 fps first of all it doesnt shoot bb so its by definition not a bb gun

[Lewellyn]

i have the freedom to state my opinions even if people dont agree with them. also what did i say was stupid

 

Yes, you do. It was probably something something about BB guns, although I only skim over these sorts of threads anyways.

[spartaman64]

Yes, you do. It was probably something something about BB guns, although I only skim over these sorts of threads anyways.

it doesnt shoot bbs so its by definition not a bb gun 

[Prastupok]

yep have fun having a bb gun fight with an air gun doing 2500 fps

Stop quoting 2,500 feet per second. that is a measure of speed. Light hits you at 186,000 miles per second... but that doesn't hurt either does it?

[spartaman64]

Stop quoting 2,500 feet per second. that is a measure of speed. Light hits you at 186,000 miles per second... but that doesn't hurt either does it?

light has no mass either and bullets do

[Prastupok]

light has no mass either and bullets do

 

But you don't fire bullets! So you're wrong either way. Stop quoting speed. It doesn't make any difference here.

[spartaman64]

But you don't fire bullets! So you're wrong either way. Stop quoting speed. It doesn't make any difference here.

fine metal projectile happy

[Lewellyn]

Stop quoting 2,500 feet per second. that is a measure of speed. Light hits you at 299 792 458 meters per second... but that doesn't hurt either does it?

[Prastupok]

 

Stop quoting 2,500 feet per second. that is a measure of speed. Light hits you at 299 792 458 meters per second... but that doesn't hurt either does it?

 

 

299,792.458 km/s = 186,000 miles per second

[Lewellyn]

Metric system > All

[Toddskins]

I'm surprised how ignorant a lot of the US Americans are that they are not adamantly opposed to anything against the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution.  As for the rest of you from other countries, allow me to explain something to you.

 

First and foremost,  the 2nd Amendment is not about the rights of the people to go hunting.  It's about having the right to keep and bear arms, against the Federal Government. And when they drafted that law, the citizen had the right and access to the exact same type of weaponry that the Federal Army had.  Citizens could own cannons.  The Federal Government had its powers LIMITED on purpose, to protect the people from the abuse of too much power.  But the Fed keeps stealing, illegally, more and more power from the people, so that the people are now in fear of the Federal gov't.

 

History lesson, i.e. COMMON SENSE:  When the NAZI party rose to power with the young Adolf Hitler leading it, they took away all the gun rights and confiscated the guns of the German people, so they could not defend themselves and were hostage to the party.

 

Same thing is being done in the USA, state by state.  California, New York, Illinois, are among the most tyrannous states in the country (the people's right have been subverted), and with the toughest STATE laws against the citizens of those states, they have the HIGHEST crimes in the country.  So the people are not able to protect themselves against criminals at all, those states have the worst criminal record anywhere.  But where gun rights are in full force, such as Idaho, Kansas, Texas, crime rate is very low.

George Washington, 1st president of the USA, said "Guns anywhere and everywhere.  There is nothing as comforting as knowing that the people are armed and able to defend themselves."

Next, most murders are not committed with guns.  Knives are at the top of the list.  And while death of people getting killed by drivers of vehicles is many times higher than those with a gun, why are the gun-grabbing politicians (communists to the core) not trying to outlaw cars and trucks?  And in the very rare case where a person goes crazy and opens fire on innocent people, why  do they not make it loud and clear (as was the case in the last 3 shootings) that those assailants had been on Rx drugs?  So we should be going after the pharmaceutical companies due to the bad side effects of their drugs.  But noooooooooooo, nothing on that in the news.

The socialist (Democrats) agenda is nothing but evil tyranny.  To enslave every human being, strip them of their rights to act independently, and continue to steal their money via taxation and regulation.

America is being set up for death by these elitists, and it amazes me how naive the people are (Democrats, mostly).

What is so obvious, and flabbergasting, is how the regime says nothing bad about the terrorist activities against 21 Christians  in Libya who were just beheaded, and 70 burned alive in a cage the next day, by Islamic Extremists (ISIS?) and in fact Obama defends their position by making the statement on TV that a few hundred years ago in Europe, the Christians during the Crusades did the same thing to people!  Deflecting the heinous crime taking place today, and deflecting to something, arguable, from a few hundred years ago!  And while he/they supply arms to groups that are now "terrorists", they want to take guns away from the law abiding US Citizens.

And if these terrorist decide to come into the USA, because Obama wants as many of them in here as he can get and refuses to hold any illegal alien in here as a criminal, will not deport them, and gives them free welfare and medical treatment on the US Tax payer's hard earned work, what will the people do to defend themselves against these terrorist cells?  So he arms terrorists, protects their rights to have guns, but takes away the rights of the US citizenry. #$*(($ #@

 

He appointed Eric Holder to be Attorney General who gave guns to Mexicans, which were then found to have been the guns that killed Americans and other citizens in Mexico.  Operation Fast & Furious.  Then Hilary Clinton and Obama are all for the rights of the Egyptians to overthrow or help to chasten their government, and all for the rights of those people to protest against their government, but the moment people in New York, or Washington DC start to protest, they are roped off, sometimes thrown in jail, harassed to no end, and not allowed to speak in areas where we once could.

You just cannot fix stupid.  

 

[Jaybird]

@Jaybird You should have done a bit more reading before starting this thread. 

 

The ban is NOT on all 5.56x45 or .223 rem ammunition, it is on the M855 62GR steel core projectile, which is very common in cheap commercially available military surplus ammunition. 

 

They want to do this because they suddenly realized that the sales of AR pistols are extremely high right now because no one wants to sit around and wait for a tax stamp to build a proper SBR, now this only matters because there is already a law on the books banning "armor piercing" pistol ammunition. The ATF now wants to include the M855/SS109 round because of the prevalence of AR type pistols now in public circulation. These rounds are marked by the military with a green tip. 

 

Here is a picture of two of my mags loaded with LC M855:

 

 

 

Now dont take this as my being in favor of the ban. This is just the government coming to the ground breaking conclusion that rifle rounds can penetrate pistol plates. No shit.

as far as iam aware the M855 is the run of the mill round. i just picked up a case of 900 m855. they were not painted with a green tip but as far as branding and labeling goes i dont see a difference. if you explain more ill be happy to read. 

[Toddskins]

If you never take the time to watch something excellent, take 8 minutes and watch this.  The guy was fired from MSNBC (I believe it was) not long after this airing.

 

[Trik'Stari]

I'm surprised how ignorant a lot of the US Americans are that they are not adamantly opposed to anything against the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution.  As for the rest of you from other countries, allow me to explain something to you.

 

First and foremost,  the 2nd Amendment is not about the rights of the people to go hunting.  It's about having the right to keep and bear arms, against the Federal Government. And when they drafted that law, the citizen had the right and access to the exact same type of weaponry that the Federal Army had.  Citizens could own cannons.  The Federal Government had its powers LIMITED on purpose, to protect the people from the abuse of too much power.  But the Fed keeps stealing, illegally, more and more power from the people, so that the people are now in fear of the Federal gov't.

 

History lesson, i.e. COMMON SENSE:  When the NAZI party rose to power with the young Adolf Hitler leading it, they took away all the gun rights and confiscated the guns of the German people, so they could not defend themselves and were hostage to the party.

 

Same thing is being done in the USA, state by state.  California, New York, Illinois, are among the most tyrannous states in the country (the people's right have been subverted), and with the toughest STATE laws against the citizens of those states, they have the HIGHEST crimes in the country.  So the people are not able to protect themselves against criminals at all, those states have the worst criminal record anywhere.  But where gun rights are in full force, such as Idaho, Kansas, Texas, crime rate is very low.

George Washington, 1st president of the USA, said "Guns anywhere and everywhere.  There is nothing as comforting as knowing that the people are armed and able to defend themselves."

Next, most murders are not committed with guns.  Knives are at the top of the list.  And while death of people getting killed by drivers of vehicles is many times higher than those with a gun, why are the gun-grabbing politicians (communists to the core) not trying to outlaw cars and trucks?  And in the very rare case where a person goes crazy and opens fire on innocent people, why  do they not make it loud and clear (as was the case in the last 3 shootings) that those assailants had been on Rx drugs?  So we should be going after the pharmaceutical companies due to the bad side effects of their drugs.  But noooooooooooo, nothing on that in the news.

The socialist (Democrats) agenda is nothing but evil tyranny.  To enslave every human being, strip them of their rights to act independently, and continue to steal their money via taxation and regulation.

America is being set up for death by these elitists, and it amazes me how naive the people are (Democrats, mostly).

What is so obvious, and flabbergasting, is how the regime says nothing bad about the terrorist activities against 21 Christians  in Libya who were just beheaded, and 70 burned alive in a cage the next day, by Islamic Extremists (ISIS?) and in fact defends their position by making the statement on TV that a few hundred years ago in Europe, the Crusades did the same thing to people!  And while he/they supply arms to groups that are now "terrorists", they want to take guns away from the law abiding US Citizens.

And if these terrorist decide to come into the USA, because Obama wants as many of them in here as he can get and refuses to hold any illegal alien in here as a criminal, will not deport them, and gives them free welfare and medical treatment on the US Tax payer's hard earned work, what will the people do to defend themselves against these terrorist cells?

You just cannot fix stupid.  

 

Probably the best summary yet. The main problem is that a majority of the anti-gun people aren't students of history, know nothing about guns, and in countries where there rights have been taken, they don't even realize how truly defenseless they are.

 

Let me quote The Great Dictator for a moment:

"Then- in the name of democracy - let us use that power - let us all unite. Let us fight for a new world - a decent world that will give men a chance to work - that will give youth a future, and old age a security. By the promise of these things, brutes have risen to power. But they lie! they do not fulfill that promise. They never will!

 

Dictators free themselves but they enslave the people! Now let us fight to fulfill that promise! Let us fight to free the world - to do away with national barriers - to do away with greed, with hate and intolerance. Lets us fight for a world of reason, a world where science and progress will lead to all men's happiness. Soldiers! in the name of democracy, let us unit!"

 

The governments of "the west" have been promising things will get better for a long time now, yet the never do, they increase their own power and their own wealth at the expense of everyone else, only during times of great scandal do you catch them doing something that truly must be done, and even the it's only to increase their own standing. The point of the speech is that all citizens must be willing to fight. In the legal sense, when the second amendment says "a well regulated militia", something often pointed out by the anti gun movement, refers not to an organized militia. If you look up the laws in this country, the governors of each state can call to arms, and person of voting age and willing to fight, this is what is meant by militia. We the citizens ARE the government, and are SUPPOSED TO BE the police in a sense, why do you think we have the right to citizens arrest? Which you DO have, even to this day.

 

The responsibility for safety and security rests upon your own shoulders, not someone elses. This world is not a playground where you have the guarantee of someone taking care of you, survival is your own responsibility, and any attempt to lessen the ability of others to ensure that that responsibility is fulfilled, is truly an evil thing. It is your duty to take care of yourself and those around you, to protect yourself and those you love. Not to cower in the dark hoping the police show up in time to put you in a plastic bag.We can argue about laws an ideologies till the end of time, but at the end of the day natural law cannot be denied, those who are not there, cannot protect you when it matters most. Only YOU can do that.

[The Crazed Child]

meanwhile in Australia even a BB gun is illegal

[watts300]

[Toddskins]

Best words on the subject of this thread:

 

[Real_PhillBert]

as far as iam aware the M855 is the run of the mill round. i just picked up a case of 900 m855. they were not painted with a green tip but as far as branding and labeling goes i dont see a difference. if you explain more ill be happy to read. 

M855 is by all standards a run of the mill 5.56 round, its very common and popular. But it does have two features that the feds are getting all up in arms about.

 

1: it can be fired out of AR pistols. This may seem obvious that a standard run of the mill 5.56 round can be fired out of a pistol length AR platform but this is the government, nothing is obvious to them.

 

2: The projectile in the M855/SS109 round is a 62 grain projectile with a steel core. This was actually adapted in response to the soviet 7N6 5.45x39 round for the AK-74 platform, which also has a steel core. 

 

Here's where the government is getting its panties in a bundle. The ATF has had a ban on "Armor Piercing" pistol ammunition for many years now, but now that the AR platform has become very popular and people dont really want to wait around for 6 months to get the NFA approval to SBR their AR, they are simply building AR pistols. These are allowed to have less than a 16" barrel length but by definition are designed to be operated by one hand and do not have stocks on them. Here's the deal, the M855/SS109 round will pass through IIIA level pistol plates (duh, its a rifle round) but now the ATF is throwing a hissy fit because people are firing this rifle round out of what the ATF is classifying as a "Pistol."  

 

Its really all about the wording of the previous laws, there is actually no new laws, they are simply deciding to enforce the laws that are on the books differently than they have before. 

 

This is really dumb because any and every full power 5.56/.223 round will punch through IIIA plates, because they are simply not designed to absorb that much energy. 

 

I hope this helps to shed a bit of light on the issue for you I dont blame you for being confused, I have seen some articles (primarily from some pretty liberal sources) claiming that they are trying to ban all 5.56/.223, this is not the case. This time at least.

[Lewellyn]

I'm surprised how ignorant a lot of the US Americans are that they are not adamantly opposed to anything against the 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution.  As for the rest of you from other countries, allow me to explain something to you.

 

First and foremost,  the 2nd Amendment is not about the rights of the people to go hunting (correct).  It's about having the right to keep and bear arms, against the Federal Government (wrong).

 

You just cannot fix stupid. (correct)

 

What a long winded diatribe of historical distortion. Attribution to Nazis? Nice..

[Toddskins]

Actor / rapper ICE T on gun control

[Toddskins]

Female testimony to government - sees her parents killed while in a cafeteria, and was unable to help.  Why?

 

[Suika]

yes lets risk people's lives so we can hunt

If my goal was to kill, I can think of hundreds of other ways to kill that does not involve a firearm, you'd be shocked how hella creative people can get on the topic of murder. Firearms are just a common tool, they are not the only means. Plus firearms are not discreet, they aren't as effective when you plan to get away with murder.

 

[sarcasm]Oh, let's not forget illegally owned and unregistered weapons, those are used in murder an awful lot. Is Obama going to ban illegal weapons? Gee wiz, I sure hope he does![/sarcasm]

[Lewellyn]

If my goal was to kill, I can think of hundreds of other ways to kill that does not involve a firearm, you'd be shocked how hella creative people can get on the topic of murder. Firearms are just a common tool, they are not the only means. Plus firearms are not discreet, they aren't as effective when you plan to get away with murder.

 

Oh, let's not forget illegally owned and unregistered weapons, those are used in murder an awful lot. Is Obama going to ban illegal weapons? Gee wiz, I sure hope he does!

 

I don't know why I hear this one so often. Want to hear a pedantic response that is deserved? "People still commit murder (substitute drugs or literally anything else), so why is it illegal."

 

Most illegal firearms were at one point legal. They are created/bought legally then sold on the black market (straw purchase) or stolen (stealing is the least common). A widespread ban creates a black market that raises the price to a premium level due to a decrease in supply (huh, micro economics).

 

There are good arguments for gun ownership and there are bad ones. That's a bad one.

[Suika]

I don't know why I hear this one so often. Want to hear a pedantic response that is deserved? "People still commit murder (substitute drugs or literally anything else), so why is it illegal."

 

Most illegal firearms were at one point legal. They are created/bought legally then sold on the black market (straw purchase) or stolen (stealing is the least common). A widespread ban creates a black market that raises the price to a premium level due to a decrease in supply (huh, micro economics).

 

There are good arguments for gun ownership and there are bad ones. That's a bad one.

...I was countering an ignorant comment with another? I thought it would have been easier to have seen that, but I guess not.