U.S. Supreme court overturns anti gay marriage laws.

[cafe]

Christians always have to make things difficult...

[calarahil]

It really does. DOMA is a government regulation on people who choose to spend their lives with others of the same sex the same way heterosexuals spend their lives. The more regulation you have, the more money you must spend to uphold it. Think how much time and money we have spent as a country restricting the rights of particular groups of people. People who we would call our fellow citizens, but do not treat them so.

 

Absolutely in agreement. Respect is becoming a increasing more important thing in American society. As well as people standing up for freedom. I've always lived by you give people an inch and they'll take you for a mile. You can either let people dictate your future or do something about it.

[calarahil]

Christians always have to make things difficult...

 

not necessarily. like i said earlier they are doing the same exact thing that the gay community is doing standing up for what they believe and that is what our society is predicated upon. however, being a christian myself I believe everyone should be respected and I also believe that its not for me to make people believe in what I do because that isn't what I feel is right.

[cafe]

not necessarily. like i said earlier they are doing the same exact thing that the gay community is doing standing up for what they believe and that is what our society is predicated upon. however, being a christian myself I believe everyone should be respected and I also believe that its not for me to make people believe in what I do because that isn't what I feel is right.

Religion is a screwed mess of lies to control people

if you believe in gay marriage you cannot consider yourself a true christian becuase you cant change things like that... lol

you either are Christian or are a person who calls themself christian because they grew up on it or are trying to hopefully guarantee themselfs a spot.

[calarahil]

Religion is a screwed mess of lies to control people

if you believe in gay marriage you cannot consider yourself a true christian becuase you cant change things like that... lol

you either are Christian or are a person who calls themself christian because they grew up on it or are trying to hopefully guarantee themselfs a spot.

 

I believe in free agency endowed by my creator. I feel its better for me to respect others then impose my views. Its better for me to aim to be more christ like then to impose my views. I don't feel your statement is fair or real. I don't agree with gay marriage however I do agree with respecting people and letting people make there own choices in life whether for good or bad but that isn't for me to decide for them whether its a good or bad choice. Respect is what I'm about and respect I hope people within the gay community get PERIOD.

[Bleedman0xx]

Now I feel old.

Somebody's gotta answer the questions the 15/16 year old's come up with. =P

[cafe]

I believe in free agency endowed by my creator. I feel its better for me to respect others then impose my views. Its better for me to aim to be more christ like then to impose my views. I don't feel your statement is fair or real.

[calarahil]

People are open to believe what they want to believe. I don't feel anyone other than myself can find out what I believe spiritually. I don't need you pushing this on me. I've come civilly and I've said hey I think this is in the right step towards a more respectful of others society and its a good thing. We can agree to disagree till the cows come home. I'm just saying don't generalize and don't push your belief on me when I'm not on you. I respect you for having an opinion as I respect others who have there own opinion. It's not for me to tell you what you should do or say or believe. Also to note there are many religions out there and its unfair to generalize everyone on this earth with a predisposed opinion I call that ignorance.

[FireFox]

Now I feel old.

 

lol I know what it feels like

[FireFox]

I believe in free agency endowed by my creator

 

Your parents? unless this is some weird dream and I don't understand, they are your creators.

[calarahil]

Your parents? unless this is some weird dream and I don't understand, they are your creators

 

In the religious sense a god or a divine being. Sure the dance with no pants takes place but beyond that and I think that should be the end of as far as I go with that because that is religious talk.

[FireFox]

 

In the religious sense a god or a divine being.

 

 

Ohh OK, fair enough

[Vitalius]

People are open to believe what they want to believe. I don't feel anyone other than myself can find out what I believe spiritually. I don't need you pushing this on me. I've come civilly and I've said hey I think this is in the right step towards a more respectful of others society and its a good thing. We can agree to disagree till the cows come home. I'm just saying don't generalize and don't push your belief on me when I'm not on you. I respect you for having an opinion as I respect others who have there own opinion. It's not for me to tell you what you should do or say or believe. Also to note there are many religions out there and its unfair to generalize everyone on this earth with a predisposed opinion I call that ignorance.

As a Christian as well, I believe it is right to tell someone what they are doing is wrong. You can do that while respecting their opinion of course by way of not persecuting them for their choice.

Persecution comes in with denying them things they should technically have according to our laws simply because of their choice. That's essentially what DOMA is and does.

Ask me if homosexuality is right and I'll tell you it's wrong/evil/a sin. However, I will not persecute a people because of their sin, as that is not what Love is as defined by the Bible. And that definition is simply to do what is best for someone. And Jesus did it best (obviously), proclaiming the truth, even under persecution, and only lashing out at people when they defiled the temple by putting markets in it to abuse the poor. Otherwise He just walked around healing and preaching. 

I'm sure that's not a popular opinion among Christians, but that doesn't make it wrong. 

 

[Vitalius]

Their no reason to be against something that does't effect you to begin with tbh especialy with this kindy stuff.

While I respect your opinion that it doesn't affect me, I disagree with it.

Private effects Public. Nothing that anyone can say (because I've looked) can change my mind about that. It's an indirect thing, but it still happens. 

Whether it's a good or bad effect, I have nothing to show either way. I only know it does and believe that it is bad. Judge me for that if you wish, but that's how I see it. 

Edit:

Christ teaches to love our brothers (that's everyone else). To love is to do what is best for them. If we believe that what they do is wrong and can/will hurt them, we should do our best to teach and show them their fault. Not to hurt them, but to help them.

I can't really do that if I ignore anything that doesn't directly effect me.

[whatthe_fuzz]

THIS POST MEANS NO INSULT TOWARDS ANY GROUP OF PEOPLE BUT RATHER A THEORY

 

 

I would like to take a minute to address homosexuality from a Darwinist-scientific approach. 

 

The basis of natural selection is survival of the fittest. If you cannot survive, whether it be finding food or reproducing, then you are at fault naturally "not fit".  If something as minuscule as a snail cannot reproduce nor can the rest of its snail kin nor its species as a whole cannot reproduce it will eventually die out. this is science this is logic. 

 

so if as humans we promote this idea of couples unable to reproduce then are we also sanctioning the steady decline of the human species? its no secret homosexuality is becoming more and more prevalent so does that mean it is beginning to trend? is this the next step for human adaptation?

 

if survival of the fittest is the basis of evolution does that mean homosexuality is destined to become extinct? 

[Art Vandelay]

so if as humans we promote this idea of couples unable to reproduce then are we also sanctioning the steady decline of the human species? its no secret homosexuality is becoming more and more prevalent so does that mean it is beginning to trend? is this the next step for human adaptation?

lolwut? Homosexuality isn't becoming more prevalent, it's just becoming accepted, so people can actually admit that they are gay.

 

This sounds just like the theory that autism is becoming more prevalent, even though the reason for the increase in the number of people diagnosed with autism was because they made the definition of autism more broad. It's always funny to see the conspiracy theories that that has caused.

[Vitalius]

Well, that's assuming that homosexuality is biological. I think it's not that, and it's just an effect of our society (something within it that has existed since the greeks, for example).

Even if homosexuality become extremely prevalent in the human race, I don't think it will become extinct unless it is indeed biological. Which I doubt.

[Vitalius]

How does gay marriage effect you ?

 

 

While I respect your opinion that it doesn't affect me, I disagree with it.

Private effects Public. Nothing that anyone can say (because I've looked) can change my mind about that. It's an indirect thing, but it still happens. 

Whether it's a good or bad effect, I have nothing to show either way. I only know it does and believe that it is bad. Judge me for that if you wish, but that's how I see it. 

[Lawkodi]

This stuff pisses me off, Not trying to make people Mad but you Straight people who hate gays DONT know what its like to live as gay. Therefor you CANT say its a choice. That is like saying that its a choice to be straight... Does this sound correct? Did you choose to be straight? NO you were born a straight man/Woman The same as gay people were born a Gay man/woman. This is EXACTLY the same as Racism against blacks "Equal rights FOR ALL" That is the human way. Try being gay for ONE day you wouldnt last... You would have to feel the pain of being bullied EXTREMELY hard... Im 15 I am Bi and i KNOW its not a choice because i did not choose it... i WISH i was straight so i wouldnt have to deal with people who say stuff to me... Like seriously i want to be able to love a woman and live normaly but I CANT.

[Lawkodi]

Also there is no need for every person on earth to have a baby, Gay people can take one or two of the MAANNNYYY kids in Foster care. These foster parents tend to not care about the kids and just want money, So yes INDEED gay people could raise a child better.

[NeoZeon]

Vitalius, 

 

Your stance is a religious one. You dont know anything, you believe it to be true. As you said it yourself, there is no evidence either way (although almost every time civil liberties are granted to a population it tends to boon in almost every facet of life, such is history's story).

[calarahil]

This stuff pisses me off, Not trying to make people Mad but you Straight people who hate gays DONT know what its like to live as gay. Therefor you CANT say its a choice. That is like saying that its a choice to be straight... Does this sound correct? Did you choose to be straight? NO you were born a straight man/Woman The same as gay people were born a Gay man/woman. This is EXACTLY the same as Racism against blacks "Equal rights FOR ALL" That is the human way. Try being gay for ONE day you wouldnt last... You would have to feel the pain of being bullied EXTREMELY hard... Im 15 I am Bi and i KNOW its not a choice because i did not choose it... i WISH i was straight so i wouldnt have to deal with people who say stuff to me... Like seriously i want to be able to love a woman and live normaly but I CANT.

 

I feel as I go I'm not making it out to be something that I'm discriminating against. See there is a saying if you have nothing nice to say don't say it at all. And for me sure I gay marriage, inter gender relationships aren't my thing however who am I do tell someone else how to live there life. To me the idea that I can tell someone who to love, were they walk, what they can say isn't me and isn't what my beliefs are. And that is why I brought up the christ like comment earlier because I feel a lot of Christians aim more to follow the teachings of the bible however aren't really living by his example. That is my small criticism and I don't mean to get religious with that I just wanted to make a point that being accepting of others is the right thing to do no one person is ever going to be like us and we really need to stop big brothering people.  

[Vitalius]

Vitalius, 

 

Your stance is a religious one. You dont know anything, you believe it to be true. As you said it yourself, there is no evidence either way (although almost every time civil liberties are granted to a population it tends to boon in almost every facet of life, such is history's story).

Did you even read the first 4 pages of the thread? :| 

There is no evidence of whether it's bad or good. It's beyond painfully obvious that it does indeed effect me. If you say it does not,

*looks at gay pride parades, the entire political side of things, etc*

... Alrighty then. That's an interesting opinion that I don't see why it exists, but go for it. You're free to have it, as wrong as I believe it to be.

@calarahil,

While I appreciate your care in how you talk about this, I feel like you are ignoring, intentionally or not, a major part of what Christ did while on Earth. 

He actively went around preaching to people about the evil they did and how they should change. He did so in parables, and He never directly mentioned Homosexuality, but what made me think about that is this quote: "who am I do tell someone else how to live there life." 

Explain how that works with being like Christ when that's essentially what Christ did. Note that He did it with Love, healing and not abusing people for their sin (with exception to the Temple), but caring for them as He taught them. 

[whatthe_fuzz]

lolwut? Homosexuality isn't becoming more prevalent, it's just becoming accepted, so people can actually admit that they are gay.

 

This sounds just like the theory that autism is becoming more prevalent, even though the reason for the increase in the number of people diagnosed with autism was because they made the definition of autism more broad. It's always funny to see the conspiracy theories that that has caused.

 

 

but it is not a theory? theories take ideas. this is a fact. homosexuals cannot reproduce. end of story. therefore the genetically "fit" will survive. this is once again, based off of Darwinian science, the founding principle of modern day genetics and nature. 

[mr moose]

THIS POST MEANS NO INSULT TOWARDS ANY GROUP OF PEOPLE BUT RATHER A THEORY

 

 

I would like to take a minute to address homosexuality from a Darwinist-scientific approach. 

 

The basis of natural selection is survival of the fittest. If you cannot survive, whether it be finding food or reproducing, then you are at fault naturally "not fit".  If something as minuscule as a snail cannot reproduce nor can the rest of its snail kin nor its species as a whole cannot reproduce it will eventually die out. this is science this is logic. 

 

so if as humans we promote this idea of couples unable to reproduce then are we also sanctioning the steady decline of the human species? its no secret homosexuality is becoming more and more prevalent so does that mean it is beginning to trend? is this the next step for human adaptation?

 

if survival of the fittest is the basis of evolution does that mean homosexuality is destined to become extinct? 

Natural selection and survival of the fittest does not apply to homosapiens anymore, And I am afraid that homosexuality has been around since the dawn of time and even the earliest documentation of humanity shows homosexual behaviour so it clearly has survived evolution and for good reason.  The prevalence of singular homosexuality would have to be quite high before we could see it having an effect on either the gay population or the population as a whole. 

 

Anyway the debate here is not about causality, that will debate be flawed regardless of which side you sit on as there is no answer to that, but it is about acceptability and the implications of that. Are there financial ramifications to allowing same sex marriages? is it all just the use of a word? will allowing it effect the social moral functions of society?

 

My take is that the population of hard core Christians is about the same as the gay population, therefore every government should remove the word marriage from their law, Then the government only recognises partnerships or unions and the smart people will either live in a de facto or stay single.  One set of laws for everybody then. If you ask for more than that it is simply because you are greedy or have a bee in your bonnet about something.  We should not take from religious culture and religious culture should not dictate what everyone can or can't have.