Edison Motors recently unveiled a demo truck, which is now being put through its paces

[DonnieDarkmode]

 

Summary

 Edison Motors, started by Chace Barber, a logging truck driver, and Eric Little, his business partner, out of Merritt, B.C., completed their second prototype truck “Topsy” and is seeking further investment to build out production. Edison Motors builds hybrid diesel-electric heavy duty trucks for hauling heavy loads and handling difficult roads. Barber was motivated by his dissatisfaction with the order delay on a Tesla Semi, and lack of any other electric/hybrid alternative.

 

Quotes

Quote

 It wasn’t just Tesla that came up short. No other electric-vehicle manufacturer was building heavy-duty trucks – the kind that could survive dense forests, haul gravel or carry cement mixers. The major trucking companies on the market – Peterbilt and Kenworth – are electrifying only last-mile trucking, the vehicles that deliver food through city streets and on highways.

 

My thoughts

 I started following this guy on tiktok a few years ago, back when he was a logging truck driver complaining about some of the deficiencies of the Tesla Semi. He seemed to jokingly suggest that he’d start a rival company to build a truck that could actually do what he needed, and call it “Edison”, but after a few years it seems it’s turned into a real thing. Seeing as these guys are also based out of B.C. it would be really cool to see someone like Alex head up there and see what they’re all about.

 

Sources

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-hybrid-electric-logging-truck/ 

[Senzelian]

Sound good. Their truck is almost more fuel efficient than my Mustang. 

[DonnieDarkmode]

1 hour ago, Senzelian said:

Sound good. Their truck is almost more fuel efficient than my Mustang. 

Yeah I thought that was pretty impressive. These won’t be meant for long hauls on highways, but I assume there will still be savings even in off-road usage. The traction and torque from those electric motors certainly won’t hurt either. Either way, 1000km on 128L of fuel is impressive for something capable of pulling over 45,000 kg. 

[bcredeur97]

honestly hybridization shouldn't die -- it's still the best choice for long distance IMO

Especially if you can design it so the electric motor is always powering the wheels. With recharging be handled by a generator like they are doing. The electric motors are so efficient as using the power, and the engine can be so much more efficient charging the batteries instead of driving the wheels. It's a nice 1-2 combo punch. 

And that helps counter-act the fact that batteries just aren't that energy-dense, all things considered.

Make it a diesel engine on top of that, and you get like a 20% efficiency gain just because diesel. End result is a car or truck you can drive incredibly far in, pretty efficiently.

 

Me over here still waiting for diesel hybrid Trucks/SUV's that no one seems to want to make, they would be the perfect work or long haul vehicles.

[DonnieDarkmode]

On 10/18/2023 at 8:50 PM, bcredeur97 said:

honestly hybridization shouldn't die -- it's still the best choice for long distance IMO

Especially if you can design it so the electric motor is always powering the wheels. With recharging be handled by a generator like they are doing. The electric motors are so efficient as using the power, and the engine can be so much more efficient charging the batteries instead of driving the wheels. It's a nice 1-2 combo punch. 

And that helps counter-act the fact that batteries just aren't that energy-dense, all things considered.

Make it a diesel engine on top of that, and you get like a 20% efficiency gain just because diesel. End result is a car or truck you can drive incredibly far in, pretty efficiently.

 

Me over here still waiting for diesel hybrid Trucks/SUV's that no one seems to want to make, they would be the perfect work or long haul vehicles.

From what I understand that’s what they did. It’s driven by electric motors (not sure how many, but multiple), and the diesel engine is only for charging the battery; it’s pure electric drive.
 

As far as passenger vehicles, apparently Toyota is going to offer the new Land Cruiser Prado for NA as a hybrid with a diesel engine at some point in the future. Obviously a different drive setup to the truck here, but still has some of the benefits you highlighted. I’ve been wondering why it’s not more common myself.  

[OX_S]

In the latest video, "My pool leaked and killed my computer" Alex was wearing an Edison Motors hat

[Needfuldoer]

On 10/18/2023 at 2:43 PM, DonnieDarkmode said:

hybrid diesel-electric heavy duty trucks for hauling

Wait, why hasn't this been a thing until now? Use electric drive in the city and lots, get regen instead of Jake brake, and run a diesel generator for longer trips. Diesel-electric trains have been around for ages.

[Monkey Dust]

12 hours ago, Needfuldoer said:

Wait, why hasn't this been a thing until now? Use electric drive in the city and lots, get regen instead of Jake brake, and run a diesel generator for longer trips. Diesel-electric trains have been around for ages.

I guess cost & weight. If you think electric cars need a big battery... It probably wasn't financially viable until very recently.

 

I don't believe diesel-electric train use batteries? Diesel-electric trains are used in the UK, the Bristol to London train I use occasionally is one. Wherever there isn't overhead power lines for it to use, if it's moving, there is the vibration and noise of the diesel engine(s?).

[Needfuldoer]

1 hour ago, Monkey Dust said:

I guess cost & weight. If you think electric cars need a big battery... It probably wasn't financially viable until very recently.

 

I don't believe diesel-electric train use batteries? Diesel-electric trains are used in the UK, the Bristol to London train I use occasionally is one. Wherever there isn't overhead power lines for it to use, if it's moving, there is the vibration and noise of the diesel engine(s?).

That's the thing though. The battery would only have to be big enough for a few miles of EV range and soak up some regenerative braking.

 

The Chevy Volt and Malibu Hybrid used the same electric drive unit, but the Volt's battery was 12 times the size of the Malibu's. 

[dalekphalm]

One of the reasons why Diesel Hybrids haven't really picked up in popularity has something to do with the fact that they don't have a traditional throttle, and their peak efficiency range is wider than that of a gasoline engine, making the gains less impressive than with a gasoline engine.

 

On the other hand, gasoline engines tend to be most efficient in specific RPM bands, so the engine can charge the battery at the most efficient point in the RPM band, thus mitigating it's extreme inefficiencies outside of that peak efficiency range and providing a larger benefit.

 

A diesel generator charging the batteries, which runs the electric motor is a good idea in theory - I think we'll see more of this happen as regulations around larger vehicles start to tighten though. Larger commercial vehicles have much less tight targets than commuter cars, so I just think there's been less incentive to look for a solution.

 

Keep in mind this is a very simplistic understanding I have, so some nuances might well be missing.

[Rocketdog2112]

For long haul usage, there would have to be diesel powered unit to provide heat and AC for idle and off duty times. 

[TetraSky]

Quote

The batteries mean that the truck can drive 1,000 kilometres on 120 litres of fuel, working out to around 12 litres for 100 kilometres. A family-sized SUV is around 10 litres for 100 kilometres. Before the batteries, the truck was 40 litres for 100 kilometres, 70-per-cent less efficient.

Bro, my car from 2014 is 9 liters per 100 kilometers (even though manufacturer claims it should be closer to 6.5).

I'm starting to think it's not fuel efficient if a big truck like that can do 12 liters per 100 km. lol

[dalekphalm]

On 10/29/2023 at 10:21 AM, Rocketdog2112 said:

For long haul usage, there would have to be diesel powered unit to provide heat and AC for idle and off duty times. 

Depending on the capacities of the battery, it can likely power both the heater and the AC unit. Potentially for extended periods of time.

 

The Diesel engine acts like a generator, supposedly. And you can still run power off the generator if the battery is low, so I see no issues with Heat or AC. If they're smart, they put a heat pump in for the heater, with maybe resistive backup (plus you can probably just run a space heater inside the cabin anyway if you needed). In either case, having the heater function regardless of whether the diesel generator is running would seem to be a crucial feature.

[Lurking]

 

[djksm]

On 10/18/2023 at 2:43 PM, DonnieDarkmode said:

 

Summary

 Edison Motors, started by Chace Barber, a logging truck driver, and Eric Little, his business partner, out of Merritt, B.C., completed their second prototype truck “Topsy” and is seeking further investment to build out production. Edison Motors builds hybrid diesel-electric heavy duty trucks for hauling heavy loads and handling difficult roads. Barber was motivated by his dissatisfaction with the order delay on a Tesla Semi, and lack of any other electric/hybrid alternative.

 

Quotes

 

My thoughts

 I started following this guy on tiktok a few years ago, back when he was a logging truck driver complaining about some of the deficiencies of the Tesla Semi. He seemed to jokingly suggest that he’d start a rival company to build a truck that could actually do what he needed, and call it “Edison”, but after a few years it seems it’s turned into a real thing. Seeing as these guys are also based out of B.C. it would be really cool to see someone like Alex head up there and see what they’re all about.

 

Sources

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/business/article-hybrid-electric-logging-truck/ 

freightliner has an electric truck... not a last mile truck. ecascadia

[Monkey Dust]

On 10/29/2023 at 2:51 PM, TetraSky said:

Bro, my car from 2014 is 9 liters per 100 kilometers (even though manufacturer claims it should be closer to 6.5).

I'm starting to think it's not fuel efficient if a big truck like that can do 12 liters per 100 km. lol

Plug in Hybrids quote their fuel efficiency starting with a full battery, and with frequent charging. In actual use, they will vary between 0 l/km, if only run on electric power, and not much better than a pure ICE equivalent if you never charge it. They're not magic.

 

Getting 12 l/km out of that truck, I'd assume, requires quite a lot of charging. So out in the wild will rely on charging infrastructure at truck stops. I guess depending on the trailer, the trailer's roof could be covered in solar, yielding a few miles/km of range.

[dalekphalm]

On 11/1/2023 at 8:57 AM, Monkey Dust said:

Plug in Hybrids quote their fuel efficiency starting with a full battery, and with frequent charging. In actual use, they will vary between 0 l/km, if only run on electric power, and not much better than a pure ICE equivalent if you never charge it. They're not magic.

Roughly speaking, you'd be looking at non-plug-in Hybrid efficiencies.

 

My Hybrid Corolla (Non-plug-in) averages 4.5L/100km since we bought it in February. That varies quite a bit on your day to day (lots of variables, but current battery charge is the biggest).

 

They're not magic but they'll still benefit from Brake Regen. Not as useful on long straight trips with minimal stops though.

On 11/1/2023 at 8:57 AM, Monkey Dust said:

Getting 12 l/km out of that truck, I'd assume, requires quite a lot of charging. So out in the wild will rely on charging infrastructure at truck stops. I guess depending on the trailer, the trailer's roof could be covered in solar, yielding a few miles/km of range.

Ideally all the major truck stops should be having charging infrastructure installed. Even if they can only do a partial charge using a DC Fast Charger, it'll help.