Madison reveals experiences working at LMG

[William Isted]

7 minutes ago, Clasmir said:

 

I did a bit of online research (just 5 minutes) and it seems (Take that with a grain of salt) that even in CA, if you win the case, you usually don't have to pay court or lawyer fees. But there is a big caveat there as that isn't always the case.

 

Regardless, if she has a real case, then she should pursue it. That is the best way.

 

Shying away because of money concerns should NOT be the first and only step taken.

 

I have an issue with EE for multiple consumer violations. I looked into "no win, no fee" solicitors, free legal advice and so on. They wouldn't touch it because it wasn't worth the compensation amount for them to work on it. I spent weeks calling solicitors checking on websites and using ChatGPT because it's free and can provide resources before coming to the conclusion that unless I pay money I don't have, I'm not getting anywhere with court.

 

I can't afford to throw money at something I have recordings of a company violating consumer rights. I can't imagine I'd change my mind if I didn't happen to have those recordings as evidence.

[Kravatie1]

4 minutes ago, Middcore said:

 

Seems like if you don't have a Twitter account you can't see this, would it be possible for you to screenshot which tweets he liked? 

 

1 minute ago, Sartre said:

 

oh thankyou

 

saving me a job

[JoNBoY]

5 minutes ago, jitteryzeitgeist said:

Do you often do your own research?

no I normal read something on the internet them assume its true and jump on the cancel train! choo choo

[justin one]

do they have an "HR team" or is it just his wife and co-owner

[jitteryzeitgeist]

2 minutes ago, Booch121 said:

HERES A STATEMENT FROM LTT!!!!
https://www.theverge.com/2023/8/16/23834190/linus-tech-tips-gamersnexus-madison-reeves-controversy

 

This is pretty much all they can respond with until they have something, because it can lead to legal liability if they lean too far one way or the other.

 

At least they acknowledged it existed.

[yoc]

Anyway, why are we pretending that we weren't be warned about the awful work conditions at LMG?
 

Spoiler

Is this why Linus hates the sub?

 

[Sartre]

6 minutes ago, Booch121 said:

HERES A STATEMENT FROM LTT!!!!
https://www.theverge.com/2023/8/16/23834190/linus-tech-tips-gamersnexus-madison-reeves-controversy

 

From Linus to The Verge, via email

 

Quote

I was in a state of shock reading through these allegations, plain and simple. They aren’t consistent with my recollections. They aren’t consistent with our internal processes. They aren’t consistent with our company values.

 

We pride ourselves on maintaining a safe and inclusive environment. In addition to our existing report systems (both anonymous and otherwise) we’ve proactively reached out internally today to encourage members of our team to report any workplace bullying or harassment they might be experiencing so we can take quick and decisive action.

 

Our HR team will be conducting a more thorough assessment of the allegations, and when we are ready, we will release a more complete statement. For now I would ask that we allow our team the time they need be as thorough as possible.

 

[jitteryzeitgeist]

Just now, JoNBoY said:

no I normal read something on the internet them assume its true and jump on the cancel train! choo choo

Ah yes.

 

So flat earth or vaccines cause autism?

[coopa]

4 hours ago, Zodiark1593 said:

There isn’t enough evidence or documentation to sway my opinion one way or another (GN, for his part, presented emails, and video clips to use). And given the potential for legal action the allegations can give rise to (Madison could probably sue if she can prove her case, but given the severity of the allegations, LMG has a strong Defamation case if they can prove Madison’s statements wrong), I don’t think we’ll see any such documentation or further statements (at least from LMG) on the matter until after said potential legal proceedings conclude. 
 

Definitely a “wait for things to unfold” before I can render an opinion. 

Not a lawyer in either the US or Canada, but my understanding is that Canadian defamation law is generally easier to win a case, because of a couple factors:

1. Public figures need to prove actual malice when suing over defamation in the US (to say, that the defendant knew it was a lie and lied with the intent of harming the plaintiff). This is not a requirement in Canada (except for Quebec, which has laws much more similar to the US than the rest of Canada).
2. In the US in a defamation case the burden of proof is on the plaintiff until proven guilty, whereas in Canada the defendant is prima facie liable until proven innocent.

Now whether or not LMG could hire a bunch of lawyers and win a defamation case against a former employee is one thing. The duration of that and the public optics in the interim. An former employee publicly airs that they were abused in the work place and inappropriately grabbed (groping/sexual assault) and you sue this person on the grounds of "you have no proof?" without investigating it first? Your sponsors aren't going to want to work with you, you'll taint your brand, all as the court case can drag out for months or years (courts move glacially slow. While everyone has a right to a speedy trial in many jurisdictions, both sides will usually continue the case for long durations to come up with the best legal arguments.)

 

My two cents:

1. If Madison has expressed that she is likely to, or intends to sue LMG - then standard operating practice for companies (US or Canadian) is to say "we don't publicly comment on pending litigation." - this would not suggest anything untoward on LMG's part in itself, and we would have to see what was filed in court and LMG's responses to them in the court filings.
2. If Madison does not intend to sue, or hasn't expressed an intent, I would expect (at least, hope to) that LTT gives a more limited response. They're not going to throw out everything at once, but I expect that they would say they're going to investigate it and take the matter seriously. Names are not likely to be dropped freely at this point or a great number of details shared.

Disclaimer: As I said above, I am not a lawyer knowledgeable of the specifics of employment law in British Columbia as a province or Canada as a whole. There may be additional protections or specific law that applies to claims of workplace harassment that makes the general legal practice of defamation cases in Canada altered or moot.

[InABoxMedia]

LTT Response 
https://www.theverge.com/2023/8/16/23834190/linus-tech-tips-gamersnexus-madison-reeves-controversy

We reached out to Sebastian about these latest accusations, and he responded via email, saying:

I was in a state of shock reading through these allegations, plain and simple. They aren’t consistent with my recollections. They aren’t consistent with our internal processes. They aren’t consistent with our company values.

We pride ourselves on maintaining a safe and inclusive environment. In addition to our existing report systems (both anonymous and otherwise) we’ve proactively reached out internally today to encourage members of our team to report any workplace bullying or harassment they might be experiencing so we can take quick and decisive action.

Our HR team will be conducting a more thorough assessment of the allegations, and when we are ready, we will release a more complete statement. For now I would ask that we allow our team the time they need be as thorough as possible.

Linus Media Group CEO Terren Tong also responded via email, saying he was “shocked at the allegations and the company described” in Reeve’s posts. He went on to note that “as part of this process, beyond an internal review we will also be hiring an outside investigator to look into the allegations and will commit to publish the findings and implementing any corrective actions that may arise because of this.”

[LumpyCrumpet]

Just now, jitteryzeitgeist said:

This is pretty much all they can respond with until they have something, because it can lead to legal liability if they lean too far one way or the other.

 

At least they acknowledged it existed.

I couldn't expect them to say anything else right now, but they absolutely do need to follow up with another statement as and when they have completed what should hopefully be a very swift investigation. I would be genuinely shocked if there were not witnesses to the things Madison described.

[cbale2000]

11 hours ago, Godiwa said:

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAAHHAAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHAHA

HER: The number of daily items the Social media role at the time was expected to fill was incredibly high.
ALSO HER: I was expected to post 3 tweets, 2 Instagram posts, and 2 TikToks minimum per day.

 

So... that's like 2 minutes of work per day... I can really feel the burden now...

HER AGAIN: I was also expected to plan, film, edit, and post 2 Floatplane exclusives per week.

Aaah so now there is an actually workload there... So 2½ days per short video clip? Not like she were making feature length clips or anything...

WTF should all those solo youtubers out there say that does 5+ videos a week alone? and edit it themselves to because they are not rich enough to hire an editor? should they take a few sick days so they can go shoe shopping and drink lattes or should they just do their job?

 

Not to beat the dead horse on this point, but this was the thing that initially raised my eyebrow for this whole story.
I will be the first to admit, 3 tweets, 2 Instagram posts and 2 TikToks per day could be a lot of work, but when you consider the types of content (even the older content from years ago) posted on LTTs Twitter and Instagram pages are basically just low-effort memes, teaser images from upcoming videos, or links to videos, it makes me wonder how much time is actually needed for any of that (even I know how to use a Meme Generator). The TikTok content appears to have a bit more production behind it, but we're still talking about less than 60 seconds (sometimes, much less).

I have no idea what went into the Floatplane videos, but twice a week still sounds fairly manageable, all things considered.
Now, maybe the "writing" for this kind of content takes a lot more time than one might otherwise think, but it still sounds like something someone hired for a social media role should have been able to handle.

 

IF we grant the possibility that maybe she was just bad at her job and over-exaggerating the workload in her post, do we also also have to grant that maybe some of the other claims she made were over-exaggerated too? Especially considering we're dealing with a disgruntled former employee? I'm not one to completely dismiss these sorts of allegations out of hand, but I don't think they rise to the level of "cancel LTT completely" until some actual evidence is provided.

[William Isted]

11 minutes ago, Vilacom said:

You uh...can't sue for civil accountability? That's really not a thing?  You can sue someone civilly, which can result in compensation or potentially other action if you want to settle in exchange for something like a retraction or something akin to that.

Yeah, I'm just saying the five minute research to a link for a crappy boilerplate service isn't really that helpful.

[Middcore]

1 minute ago, justin one said:

do they have an "HR team" or is it just his wife and co-owner

 

There is nobody on the LMG site with any kind of HR-related job title, except possibly for one person listed as "Talent & Culture Supervisor," whatever that means. I don't know if even that person was there during Madison's time at the company, their employee count seems to have exploded within the past year or two. 

[IronArm]

4 minutes ago, JoNBoY said:

Call me old fashioned I like to review the evidence and then come to a conclusion.

You would never be able to review the evidence, regardless. You think you are going to just able to get a bunch of court documents instantly? 

 

Even if Madison had all the evidence anyone would ever need, it would still be a extremely lengthy process in which she would constantly be bombarded by hate messages from the idiots in the LTT community (see the EVIDENCE from Linus having to tell his own community to stop and they didn't stop harassing the kid with the play button). 

 

The people that are jumping to a conclusion aren't thinking logically either, but neither are the people that are like: "sHe ShOuLd JuSt SuE iF sHe HaS eViDeNcE!!!" Because these people clearly lack the understanding or knowledge about how long the process is, what it is like trying to go against a company worth $100,000,000, or how people deal with trauma. 

 

Call me old fashion, but I like to see people actually thinking about things before making comments.

[Jerakl]

Just now, Middcore said:

 

Trying to turn things into a "Team GN" vs "Team LTT" pissing match was ridiculous after the GN vid, but trying to maintain this framing as if Madison's allegations have anything to do with the GN vids really exposes how intellectually and morally bankrupt it is. 

What the slow polarization of literally everything in people's lives does to a mf.
EVERYTHING has to be an us-vs-them with absolutely no middle ground!
 

2 minutes ago, Middcore said:

 

The LTT forums represent a tiny fraction of the LTT fanbase/viewbase.

 

Just because someone didn't use the forum doesn't mean that they weren't a long-time member of the LTT "community" in the sense of being a fan, viewer, buyer of merch, etc. 

 

Using the forum to register their disapproval and departure from that broader community is valid, especially as there is no other real place to do it. 

Yeah that's true on an overall scale.

It's pretty much just my opinion that unless you're engaging on a level beyond consuming content you're not a "community member". In my mind community requires a further step of interaction.

[jitteryzeitgeist]

Just now, LumpyCrumpet said:

I couldn't expect them to say anything else right now, but they absolutely do need to follow up with another statement as and when they have completed what should hopefully be a very swift investigation. I would be genuinely shocked if there were not witnesses to the things Madison described.

Considering one of their current employees liked every single Madison tweet, I think shits about to get interesting

[DakotaCx]

1 minute ago, LumpyCrumpet said:

The thing that gets me is this. Steve, when he put up his original video, actually seemed genuinely fearful of the backlash he was going to get from LTT fans. Read the video description, where he's basically pleading with the user base to listen to what he's saying and not attack him for it.

 

Madison has that to deal with, plus the significant overlap between tech nerds and (frankly) incels who won't even countenance believing a woman saying she was harassed or abused unless she somehow presents a signed notarised affidavit from twelve separate individuals attesting that this happened exactly as she said it did, and sees any instance of her not acting like a Victorian prude to be evidence that actually she was asking for it.

 

It's really fucking hard coming out with this stuff, either to the public or to law enforcement. It's especially hard coming out with this stuff when you're up against a rabid fan-base and the fact that you are, ultimately, putting your name on the line about this, in a fairly close-knit industry. The whole idea that it's easy to fabricate this stuff for, I don't know, attention? Completely at odds with the fact that it's incredibly difficult, involves raking over old trauma and even today, when such accusations are taken a lot more seriously than they used to be, often comes with serious social and professional repercussions.

I don't see her DMs obviously, but looking through her @s on Twitter, she seems to be doing fine. She has +11k followers over the past day, the overwhelming majority of the tweets since her reveal appear to be supportive, sympathetic, etc. I think she'll be just fine on this one. 

[Middcore]

1 minute ago, InABoxMedia said:

Linus Media Group CEO Terren Tong also responded via email, saying he was “shocked at the allegations and the company described” in Reeve’s posts. He went on to note that “as part of this process, beyond an internal review we will also be hiring an outside investigator to look into the allegations and will commit to publish the findings and implementing any corrective actions that may arise because of this.”

Good. Necessary. 

[DarithINAbby]

15 minutes ago, Booch121 said:

Wrong. LTT does not inform you of your pay until your hired. I know this because I was interested in an engineering job there, and i found no pay information. Maybe its a little bit before your actually hired, but by then your already have your visa and plans to move.
Also, she claims she didn't have enough ram to edit her footage, causing several crashes a day (funnily enough, the editing team had the same problem)

Wrong. you're informed of your pay, or the pay structure during your interview. Or perhaps during contract negotiations when your offered the job, but before you accept, like it is with almost every other job ever. sit back and think about it a moment before you respond... "yes you're hired, but I won't mention your pay until you start working, Oh and if you ask me like every other person in history asks, I won't tell you" but you'll still come for the job anyway right?..... see how that wouldn't make any logical sense in any form (I exaggerated it for effect)

[DrHax34]

4 minutes ago, jitteryzeitgeist said:

This is pretty much all they can respond with until they have something, because it can lead to legal liability if they lean too far one way or the other.

 

At least they acknowledged it existed.

This is actually much better than I anticipated. Even hiring an outside party to investigate seems very appropriate.

[Clasmir]

2 minutes ago, William Isted said:

I have an issue with EE for multiple consumer violations. I looked into "no win, no fee" solicitors, free legal advice and so on. They wouldn't touch it because it wasn't worth the compensation amount for them to work on it. I spent weeks calling solicitors checking on websites and using ChatGPT because it's free and can provide resources before coming to the conclusion that unless I pay money I don't have, I'm not getting anywhere with court.

 

I can't afford to throw money at something I have recordings of a company violating consumer rights. I can't imagine I'd change my mind if I didn't happen to have those recordings as evidence.

That is indeed to bad. 

 

I guess where I was coming from is that, if I had a strong case and I felt that I could win, then I would approach it from I will win or settle out of court. Losing wouldn't be an option. Now... I can say that, and as someone else mentioned, words are easy. 

 

Anyhow, perhaps you haven't found the right lawyer?  Try legaleagle (the YouTube channel that says they will take and examine your case for free)

[JustWinz]

Outside investigation is needed instead of dealing with this situation in house. Hopefully they are doing it in good faith and not some farce investigation though. It all depends on who they hire for outside investigation.  

[DakotaCx]

9 minutes ago, yoc said:

Anyway, why are we pretending that we weren't be warned about the awful work conditions at LMG?
 

  Reveal hidden contents

Is this why Linus hates the sub?

 

So much of this doesn't represent terrible working conditions. It represents how these kinds of jobs are. It comes across highly as a GenZ individual entering the workforce with expectations that don't line up with reality, then getting upset about it publicly. We millennials have the same conflicts with Boomers and Gen X in some ways regarding work-life balance issues. There are whole classes on this stuff in business and leadership programs.

Every hospital I've ever worked for, which is more than a few, discourages wage discussions. They can't stop it, but every company hates it. It's only recently begun swinging in the other direction: https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/09/06/millennial-salary-taboo/

Same with unions, they discourage it, they can't stop it, but they hate it. That's just how businesses are.  

As for everything else, he explains it better:

 

[Kravatie1]

at least they have done a statement now