Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[Clasmir]

2 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

More people here (except me of course!) should use AI to craft their responses, it would elevate the level of discussion. <smiley face>

I couldn't agree more, when you really dig into what an AI can respond with, you can read between the lines. 

 

Carry on kind sir.

[MercuryRain]

1 hour ago, Loopers said:

 

I know it's hard to wrap your head around the spun narrative you've entangled yourself in, but c'mon, use your head.

First, I'm not a "fan" of anyone. I don't fanboy and hate people who do. I know that's a concept folks struggle to comprehend as you're so tightly wound up around your bias and hatred, but again... I expect it from the obtuse audience feasting over the flames.

 

The original video went up on June 23rd. It was discussed and agreed to send it back in late June. 

 

 

The email chain shown in the apology video shows Aug 10th and confirms the block was given to LMG. Twist and bend yourself however you like, it was theirs and placed in inventory as such. I know facts are inconvenient so feel free to bury your head in the sand.

 

 

 

 

The problem with folks like yourself who can't get out of their own way is they tend to overlook facts. The block was given to them with the assumption it "would be good for you to have for future builds." This was poor decision-making for a small business to make bold assumptions. It's also why I said, GN or J2C would have been the better choice. They went with a large outlet, not the reliable one for accuracy.

 

The following statement though I WOULD FEEL THE SAME AS Billet was their hope they would use it for further exposure, not to be sold or auctioned off. That wasn't up to Billet to dictate once you give your hardware away. You can hope the person it's been handed to doesn't and expect they wouldn't, but like it or not, it was LMG's to choose to play hockey with or auction it. /Full stop

I can give someone a thing and expect they use it for the reasons I gave it to them, it doesn't mean I get to demand it back because they didn't. That's life. Deal with it.

 

 

Have you? I have, twice. I also didn't need to video. I didn't have my pitchforks out for any of them (GN, LMG, or Billet) Real people work behind those screens and there is no need to attack anyone. I do however expect better from LMG for all the reasons Steve pointed out. I expect better from Steve for the same reasons he went after LMG and failed to do his job properly and chose not to reach out. The hilarious commentary of (It will give LMG a leg up or get ahead of it) is some of the dumbest takes I've ever heard.

 

I keep seeing you people repeat this. It's fascinating how childish you can be. Grow up or go back to Reddit where the dogpiling is. I value everyone's opinion, but if you cannot distribute equal blame in all directions, you're not being objective in any way and you're leading with blind hate. Mistakes were made everywhere and I hope all three learn from it.

 

 

The video was made for people like you because you needed it apparently to believe LMG is bad and they will be better. You were told what you needed to hear and anything less would have been bad. It was a typical corporate response. The video was already tone-deaf with tasteless plugs...wait, never mind, he's my hero, I can't say that. 

 

Imagine if, for a moment, most rational grownups can view all 3 objectively and call out all 3 for their bullshit. Sadly, you're the Reddit crowd who needed to be limited due to dogpiling because that's what you do when someone you hate gets kicked while down. Look no further than the calls to cancel your FP subs and unsub. It's cancel culture at its best in an attempt to hurt real people.

 

Let's make it very clear once again --

 

LMG owned that block. It was theirs to do what they pleased with it. Despite agreeing to send it back, it was on a best-effort basis. It will be on their timetable when they can and with LTX approaching and shit-tastic communication skills inside LMG exasperated the issue further and despite people who hate facts as they're presented to you, that email as per-colton was sent to procurement to send back while forgetting to CC\include Billet so they were aware 2 days prior to Steve posting his video I 99% agreed with.

 

I've repeated this too many times in this thread and I won't be responding to you as it's clear from the onset, you're not interested in fact finding. I apologize for the long winded response but this entire thread has turned into a circular argument and as J2C said, like a war between two groups. Have yourself a good day/night.

Thoroughly well crafted and articulated response, and he is still refusing to engage with any points other than the one's we've refuted four times already and then going back to us thinking that Linus is our idol.

 

I give up.  He clearly has no capacity for comprehending the written English language.

[IKWMTY]

15 minutes ago, MercuryRain said:

Thoroughly well crafted and articulated response, and he is still refusing to engage with any points other than the one's we've refuted four times already and then going back to us thinking that Linus is our idol.

You made a legitimate point somewhere in this 330 page thread?

[Arneun]

21 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

There are also people who firmly believe the earth is ~6000 years old. Maybe it will go better for you but I doubt.

 

At least you are actually emailing them instead of just shiat posting like the rest of us.

Well... the thing is: I don't want the LLT and GN to disappear. I want them to be the best versions of themself.

If I wanted GN to disappear I would speculate on reasons to the things I'm pointing out. 

If I wanted LTT to disappear I would dunk on them for Madison, mistakes and Linus being unhinged sometimes.

 

But in my opinion LTT is already on the very good path to repair.

They are conducting proper investigations (internal and external ones), they are reassessing their internal processes - there is nothing we can do as public other than wait and meme about this. Possibly provide feedback when asked for.

 

GN on the other hand - they aren't on the good path in my opinion. They didn't even considered what they are doing improperly, and to put it simply - I suspect (and I thought about using "know" here for a while) that GN is capable of publishing unverified information with showing no remorse. The main question for me is what it takes.

 

And anyone that is saying that GN did nothing wrong:
can you please tell me:
a) How did they know for sure that Billet didn't agreed on selling prototype?
b) How did they know for sure that LTT did agree to sent it back?
c) How did they know for sure that LTT doesn't compensated Billet Labs fairly for the prototype?

 

Because "Billet told them" isn't knowing that "for sure". That's publishing allegations instead of facts.

[MercuryRain]

16 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

You made a legitimate point somewhere in this 330 page thread?

You have yet to make one, that's for sure.

 

We. Do not. Idolize. Linus.

 

We. Are not. Defending. Linus.

 

You really need to figure out what those words mean.

 

I know the English language is hard, but it's really not that difficult to understand.  We've told it to you about 20 times collectively now and you still haven't seemed to grasp the meaning.

[IKWMTY]

 

T

 

6 minutes ago, Arneun said:

 

GN on the other hand - they aren't on the good path in my opinion. They didn't even considered what they are doing improperly, and to put it simply - I suspect (and I thought about using "know" here for a while) that GN is capable of publishing unverified information with showing no remorse. The main question for me is what it takes.

 

And anyone that is saying that GN did nothing wrong:
can you please tell me:
a) How did they know for sure that Billet didn't agreed on selling prototype?
b) How did they know for sure that LTT did agree to sent it back?
c) How did they know for sure that LTT doesn't compensated Billet Labs fairly for the prototype?

 

Because "Billet told them" isn't knowing that "for sure". That's publishing allegations instead of facts.

 

LMG has already verified all three (3) of your assertions. You are clearly grasping at straws to save your fallen hero. It's trivial for Billet to produce the email chain and provide it to GN, just like LMG did in their silly corporate apology video.

 

Do you really think GN is so reckless that would do all this without satisfying whatever internal controls they have? 

 

It's telling that people here think GN "accidently" found the truth.

[MercuryRain]

2 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

 

grasping at straws to save your fallen hero

Jesus Christ do you ever stop?

[MercuryRain]

2 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

Linus stans

[Arneun]

1 minute ago, IKWMTY said:

Do you really think GN is so reckless that would do all this without satisfying whatever internal controls they have? 

 

It's telling that people here think GN "accidently" found the truth.

I'm not saying that they "accidently" found the truth.

I'm saying that they let go of control whether they've published truth or not. They missed the details, whether accidentally (better for them), or intentionally (worse for them). They simply shouldn't.

And if GN did provide factually accurate story without missing any details and their internal controls were satisfied, then why LTT provided much needed context in their video?

 

It was GN's job to provide factually accurate story if they decide to publish allegations of one side. The story they published wasn't full. It would be if they did their job and contacted LTT for comment about situation with Billet Labs.

 

And they did it twice. Second time after being called out for not doing that.

[IKWMTY]

1 minute ago, MercuryRain said:

There's the smoking gun we've been looking for. GN is finished! 

[MercuryRain]

2 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

There's the smoking gun we've been looking for. GN is finished! 

I mean, we've told you multiple times what the """smoking gun""" is.

GN refuses to hold themselves to the same standard that they requested of LTT.  Open and shut case.  We can call this out while still criticizing LTT.  Pointing this out doesn't mean we're a """"""""""Linus Stan"""""""""" but your brain is apparently incapable of finding the answer to 2+2, so at this point I don't expect remotely intelligent conversation from you. 

[IKWMTY]

1 minute ago, Arneun said:

I'm not saying that they "accidently" found the truth.

I'm saying that they let go of control whether they've published truth or not. They missed the details, whether accidentally (better for them), or intentionally (worse for them). They simply shouldn't.

And if GN did provide factually accurate story without missing any details and their internal controls were satisfied, then why LTT provided much needed context in their video?

 

It was GN's job to provide factually accurate story if they decide to publish allegations of one side. The story they published wasn't full. It would be if they did their job and contacted LTT for comment about situation with Billet Labs.

 

And they did it twice. Second time after being called out for not doing that.

What did they say that wasn't "factual". Please provide actual quotes. 

 

What was the "much needed context"? Colton can't use email? Linus is a thin skinned man baby? Please don't tell me it's the "they originally said we could keep it".

[IKWMTY]

1 minute ago, MercuryRain said:

I mean, we've told you multiple times what the """smoking gun""" is.

GN refuses to hold themselves to the same standard that they requested of LTT.  Open and shut case.  We can call this out while still criticizing LTT.  Pointing this out doesn't mean we're a """"""""""Linus Stan"""""""""" but your brain is apparently incapable of finding the answer to 2+2, so at this point I don't expect remotely intelligent conversation from you. 

Since I'm such a simpleton, can please post this "smoking gun" and only this "smoking gun" without the insults?

[MercuryRain]

7 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

Since I'm such a simpleton, can please post this "smoking gun" and only this "smoking gun" without the insults?

Over the course of the Gamers Nexus video, Steve repeatedly blames Linus Tech Tips for not making corrections in their videos when inaccurate information was included, whether for various benchmarking charts, or a simple situation as the plastic coverings on the feet of the pwnage mouse.

 

And yet, over the past couple days, after we have seen the email chain where it has become very obvious that Billet Labs gave the waterblock to LTT with no expectation of ever getting back - we have the image screenshot, in writing, from their rep that LTT was supposed to keep the waterblock - he has not added that clarification to his own video, after making the clear implied accusation that Linus failed to return property which was not his.

 

Turns out, the property was his, and his team was, out of the goodness of their hearts, returning something that had been surrendered to them completely. 

 

To not include this detail in his video in any format - comment, caption, voiceover, what have you, is direct hypocrisy.  It doesn't matter if the rest of his video was correct - and it is.  That simple act is hypocritical, and that means even if he is correct in this situation, he is not right.

 

He did not make that video for altruistic reasons.  He did not make it to improve the journalistic and testing standards of tech youtube as a whole.

 

He made the video because he saw an opportunity to (once again, correctly) disparage a competitor and he knew, as long as he didn't make himself blatantly obvious that he isn't following his own rules, nobody was going to call him on it.

 

You are playing directly into that strategy and it has worked so well on you I shudder to think what happens when you see actual political debates and other things that actually matter.

[IKWMTY]

1 minute ago, MercuryRain said:

Over the course of the Gamers Nexus video, Steve repeatedly blames Linus Tech Tips for not making corrections in their videos when inaccurate information was included, whether for various benchmarking charts, or a simple situation as the plastic coverings on the feet of the pwnage mouse.

 

And yet, over the past couples day, after we have seen the email chain where it has become very obvious that Billet Labs gave the waterblock to LTT with no expectation of ever getting back - we have the image screenshot, in writing, from their rep that LTT was supposed to keep the waterblock - he has not added that clarification to his own video, after making the clear implied accusation that Linus failed to return property which was not his.

 

Turns out, the property was his, and his team was, out of the goodness of their hearts, returning something that had been surrendered to them completely. 

 

To not include this detail in his video in any format - comment, caption, voiceover, what have you, is direct hypocrisy.  It doesn't matter if the rest of his video was correct - and it is.  That simple act is hypocritical, and that means even if he is correct in this situation, he is not right.

 

He did not make that video for altruistic reasons.  He did not make it to improve the journalistic and testing standards of tech youtube as a whole.

 

He made the video because he saw an opportunity to (once again, correctly) disparage a competitor and he knew, as long as he didn't make himself blatantly obvious that he isn't following his own rules, nobody was going to call him on it.

 

You are playing directly into that strategy and it has worked so well on you I shudder to think what happens when you see actual political debates and other things that actually matter.

Exactly as expected. You are arbiter of what is "right". <eye roll>

 

Did LMG agree to return the block? Yes. Did they return the block? No, they sold it at auction? Does it matter that Billet was originally going to let LMG keep it to put in a build, etc.? No. 

 

GN's reasons for making the video (which neither of know) don't matter. Just like the idiots accusing LMG of maliciously selling the bock to screw over a small startup.

[MercuryRain]

1 minute ago, IKWMTY said:

Just like the idiots accusing LMG of maliciously selling the bock to screw over a small startup.

Ah.  So Steve is an idiot.  Glad we agree on something.

 

One Billet Labs gave the block to LTT and said that they were letting LTT keep it, what happens after that is nobody's fault.  Someone can TRY to get the block back to give it back to him once it's requested.  But there is no guarantee that that block is ever going to get back to Billet.  And it's silly to expect it would.  They gave it to someone. They gave it to someone FOR REVIEW, apparently with the unvoiced expectation that that review would be positive and life would be great for them. 

 

Anything that happened to them because of this situation is honestly their own fault.  If they can't handle the loss of a $2000 prototype that they gave away without any expectation of getting it back, they do not have a business.  Simple as that.  They have never had a business.  They have had a scam.  That's it. 

 

The context that has been added by you there is also something that Steve failed to add in his video.  He has just failed.  Spectacularly, I might add.  To follow his OWN GUIDELINES THAT HE SET FOR LTT in the VERY VIDEO HE SET THEM.

[IKWMTY]

3 minutes ago, MercuryRain said:

Ah.  So Steve is an idiot.  Glad we agree on something.

Nothing but baseless personal attacks. <yawn> Yeah, you're not Linus stan, you just hate GN Steve. <eye roll>

 

You're making your fallen hero proud. Next time make you to include a LLT store plug and some childish sexual innuendo along with the misinformation.

 

I guess it was too much for to provide a quote. Wait, that would mean you actually watched a GN video. My mistake - sorry

[Guest]

5 hours ago, IKWMTY said:

It's clear you haven't watched the Artesian Builds video, or the Newegg video, or the any videos where GN treats LMG just like another corporation. 

 

Just extract the quotes that prove you right with a time and I'll be happy to watch the clip.

 

Just drop the "he didn't contact LMG" whine. It makes you argument look worse than it already is.

 

Firstly you accuse a lot of people of a lot of things. I suspect you created your account with the sole intent of doing so. You speak of facts but ignore the entire LTT/LGM video and their situation. I have viewed every video of both Newegg and Artesian Builds in real-time as it happened. Please don't presume, you know me, my intentions and my reasoning. You don't.

 

My sentiment remains the same. GN presume they knew how LTT/LMG will respond. They said this much in the same videos that you claim I haven't watched. I recall in the Artesian Builds video, GN did reach out to Noah Katz via email. For you to claim this is not true brings me to my second point. In the Newegg situation, I recall only from memory that they did visit and meet with Newegg. Why wouldn't they want to visit with LTT/LMG and allow them to explain their side of the situation?

 

Clearly based on the videos you said I never watched, both Artesian Builds and Newegg were given the opportunity to respond.   

 

Lastly, I do not appreciate your poor choice of words and your attitude towards me. It is clear you aligned yourself with GN and it is your prerogative to do so. I am not affiliated with LTT/LMG I am not employed with them. I gain nothing but lost hours expressing my concerns and having to deal with individuals like yourself.

 

In my conclusion, GN neglected a few very important details regarding LTT/LMG. GN knew they LTT/LMG had a new CEO that never had the opportunity to speak. Everyone that ever watched any LTT content knew of the company's restructuring. LTT did make a lot of mistakes. Their company grew in a very short amount of time. Processes and company policy along with oversite are inevitable. This is seen in the corporate world all the time.  

 

GN needs to explain their own actions. They need to step up not you. In summary, it is not a you or me thing, it is a them thing. They need to sort this out not us.

[MercuryRain]

13 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

You're making your fallen hero proud.

 

 

 

"The trouble was just how long it took LTT to acknowledge this mistake.  This should have triggered deletion of the video basically immediately when they confirmed it was erroneous, a community post on youtube, a twitter post, and a timeline for the fixed video with corrections."

12:03 to 12:17 in the video this entire thread is about.

 

Later, at 33:54, he talks about how they auctioned the block off without Billet Labs' permission.

 

There should be a caveat in here stating that LTT maintained full ownership of the block per their prior terms with Billet Labs, and until Billet Labs actually receives the item back in their possession, it doesn't matter who at LTT says they're going to return it.  It is still not Billet Labs' property.  It later says they had a responsibility that was ignored.  Sure, but then any time you have ever said you would give someone $5 for a service they provided to you and it took them an extra 5 days, better cancel that person off the face of the planet.

By his own standards, once people started accusing Linus of being a thief while citing the GN video as proof, Gamers Nexus should have immediately deleted the video and issued clarifications on YouTube Community, Twitter, and released a timeline for when a corrected video would be released.

 

None of that has happened.

 

Let me repeat that; 

If Steve followed his own rules as he laid them down to LTT for ethics, the very video we are discussing would not exist right now.  It does, therefore I can only conclude that Steve is either a complete moron who forgot what he said less than 12 hours after he said it, or he knows exactly what he is doing and it was his intention to be a hypocrite all along, as long as it wasn't overly blatant.

[IKWMTY]

10 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

Firstly you accuse a lot of people of a lot of things. I suspect you created your account with the sole intent of doing so. You speak of facts but ignore the entire LTT/LGM video and their situation. I have viewed every video of both Newegg and Artesian Builds in real-time as it happened. Please don't presume, you know me, my intentions and my reasoning. You don't.

Your recollection is wrong. Go get the proof or your shinebox. Linus had an opportunity to respond on this forum and we know how that went. Then the apology video where he cried about Reddit idiots hurting his feelings. Quite the role model you have.

10 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

 

My sentiment remains the same. GN presume they knew how LTT/LMG will respond. They said this much in the same videos that you claim I haven't watched. I recall in the Artesian Builds video, GN did reach out to Noah Katz via email. For you to claim this is not true brings me to my second point. In the Newegg situation, I recall only from memory that they did visit and meet with Newegg. Why wouldn't they want to visit with LTT/LMG and allow them to explain their side of the situation?

Yes, they did eventually go out an confront Newegg while in CA for other business, Otherwise, you are wrong yet again. Why is it so hard for people to do the minimum amount of effort before embarrassing themselves on the internet. Linus, it that you?

10 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

 

Clearly based on the videos you said I never watched, both Artesian Builds and Newegg were given the opportunity to respond.   

You couldn't be more wrong. Go watch them again.

10 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

 

Lastly, I do not appreciate your poor choice of words and your attitude towards me. It is clear you aligned yourself with GN and it is your prerogative to do so. I am not affiliated with LTT/LMG I am not employed with them. I gain nothing but lost hours expressing my concerns and having to deal with individuals like yourself.

I don't care and no one is forcing you to post gibberish on this forum.

10 minutes ago, 3m3m said:

 

In my conclusion, GN neglected a few very important details regarding LTT/LMG. GN knew they LTT/LMG had a new CEO that never had the opportunity to speak. Everyone that ever watched any LTT content knew of the company's restructuring. LTT did make a lot of mistakes. Their company grew in a very short amount of time. Processes and company policy along with oversite are inevitable. This is seen in the corporate world all the time.  

 

GN needs to explain their own actions. They need to step up not you. In summary, it is not a you or me thing, it is a them thing. They need to sort this out not us.

GN neglected nothing important and need to explain nothing more than they already said.

[MercuryRain]

2 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

 

GN neglected nothing important and need to explain nothing more than they already said.

Then there was literally zero point to the video because journalistic accuracy and ethics is worthless and unnecessary. 

[IKWMTY]

2 minutes ago, MercuryRain said:

Then there was literally zero point to the video because journalistic accuracy and ethics is worthless and unnecessary. 

I'm guessing your day job isn't as the executive editor of the NYT.

 

GN's story was ethical and accurate.

[Loopers]

19 minutes ago, MercuryRain said:

Later, at 33:54, he talks about how they auctioned the block off without Billet Labs' permission.

This is where I have to assume people choose to ignore the fact they didn't need their permission and demonstrates the importance of reaching out to LMG for comment for context on a damning expose they're about to publish. Had people known it wasn't Billet's property anymore, it became a courtesy effort to send it back.

The commentary GN allowed that followed due to poor\lazy reporting was wrong.

 

The guy is on an iMax level projecting as he comes off as a fanboy for Steve. Only joined to dogpile and had no interest in an impartial discussion. People like that are bottomfeeders only interested in rubbernecking with little interest in course correction. No matter how hard anyone tries to discuss it, they repeat themselves and call you a stan for a reaction. Just ad hominem responses.

[Loopers]

7 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

*in my opinion* GN's story was ethical and accurate.

Fixed that for you. 

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, IKWMTY said:

Your recollection is wrong. Go get the proof or your shinebox. Linus had an opportunity to respond on this forum and we know how that went. Then the apology video where he cried about Reddit idiots hurting his feelings. Quite the role model you have.

Yes, they did eventually go out an confront Newegg while in CA for other business, Otherwise, you are wrong yet again. Why is it so hard for people to do the minimum amount of effort before embarrassing themselves on the internet. Linus, it that you?

You couldn't be more wrong. Go watch them again.

I don't care and no one is forcing you to post gibberish on this forum.

GN neglected nothing important and need to explain nothing more than they already said.

For me it is almost 6:00 AM, Let me be clear about something. I don't have role models. It is a limiting mindset. I understand journalism, I use to be one. I don't care about Reddit, I consider it to be a toxic website. I will reiterate this, GN is personally involved in this situation. GN is not an external force. Steve knows Linus off camera and they had a very long friendship. How long is not publicly known. I know Linus holds Steve in high regard.    

 

It is poor practice as a journalist to use private knowledge in a journalistic piece. It is poor practice to assume anything. It is a bad practice not to allow someone to respond before it gets released. These choices are by design to ambush LTT to get an emotional response. It worked the proof is on this forum. Then GN preemptively said they will not respond to the video. Anyone can see Linus got played here. If you wish to ignore this then that is your prerogative. I have not done journalism in 20 years I don't know how the practice has changed.

 

For me personally, it is about the truth, to report the story accurately. It is not a journalist's job to create the story. The fact remains LTT/LMG was ambushed and manipulated into giving an emotional response. As you rightfully pointed out, that did not help the matter. But ask yourself how it came to be in the first place.

 

Forget Linus, forget Steve look at the situation critically.

 

I hold no animosity towards anyone. Facts are facts.