Gamers Nexus alleges LMG has insufficient ethics and integrity

[Babymillie]

1 minute ago, Dom1252 said:

Live show that doesn't even show in uploads on youtube anymore... 

also it's several hours long and no one cares, most people have it as a background noise... 

 

and even then, Linus usually doubles down instead of admitting mistakes

 

I care i watch it every saturday the moment i wake up i turn on the wan show, So.... yeah now you?

[Dom1252]

1 minute ago, Babymillie said:

 

I care i watch it every saturday the moment i wake up i turn on the wan show, So.... yeah now you?

cool, so I assume WAN show has same amount of views (with at least 75% watched, not just clicks on video) as regular LTT videos, right? 

or it doesn't even hit a 25% of that? 

[bandainamcofan]

2 minutes ago, SAUVE76 said:

advise them that cooler may work with a 4090ti, so in that LTT did nothing wrong

They trash a product because the creator said "we haven't tried it, it might work, but we're not sure," refused to do the test with the proper GPU, claimed he wouldn't spend the time/money to do it correctly, and then said it isn't a problem he didn't do it correctly because his conclusion was right anyway. Yes, Linus absolutely did something wrong in this instance.

[RWxAshley]

6 minutes ago, ericmadeyourday said:

And yes, he disabled monetization on that video and didn't bring up a sponsor commercial part... In this video. Does anyone really think that this crap isn't making his channel bigger? Does anyone think he didn't consider that? There would have been so many ways to do this without getting on a high horse. Discussing problems you have with someone you know personally in public spaces is never a good idea. Just a sign of bad taste.

This isn't a drama video. GN has so much to lose from taking on LMG given they operate in the exact same industry. The oppotunity cost alone from potentially never being able to work with Linus again is too great. This isn't some Dramalert, or a reactionary twitch streamer that has nothing to lose from reacting to the latest drama that is outside of their industry/influence.

This is GN addressing not just linus, but the rest of the industry about legit concerns.

[Texbobcat]

12 minutes ago, Dom1252 said:

I disagree that he would be terrible owner if he had no idea about this, LMG is a big company and this isn't something that needs owner approval 

I do think he is horrible owner for letting this happen anyway tho 

Even if he didn't know about the emails requesting for it to be returned he still should've known when signing off on the items to be auctioned off that he didn't have the right to sell the block.

[Babymillie]

Just now, Dom1252 said:

cool, so I assume WAN show has same amount of views (with at least 75% watched, not just clicks on video) as regular LTT videos, right? 

i don't care if the wan show has 1 view or it has million views, it has at least one view and that's mine

[treestain]

2 minutes ago, TheBeast2211 said:

In this case the journalistic best practice you are talking about does not apply. That is reserved for situations where previously undisclosed or unreported information is being brought to light. Everything GN raised in their video is already in the public domain, and was put there by LMG themselves. There is no need for comment on something that has in effect already been commented on by the party in question.

Then GN should've disclosed he responses that were made at the time if he is going to open up past drama that has been commented on and dealt with, and at the very least shared that Linus compensated Billet Labs.

 

GN has always reached out for comment when doing a story, not only was LMG an exception, but Linus's previous responses were ignored. In fact the only response that GN showed was (yes, admittedly) Linus's extremely piss poor response on the WAN show. You do not get to pick and choose who gets to defend themselves and leave a comment on your report, and you do not get to pick and choose which responses/clips to show on the subject you're reporting on if you are truly aiming for "subjective" and "non bias" reporting. This is not journalism. I seriously thought I was watching Fox News for a moment.

[Dom1252]

1 minute ago, Babymillie said:

i don't care if the wan show has 1 view or it has million views, it has at least one view and that's mine

It's a great place where to put fake apologies, if barely anyone watches the whole thing, so who's gonna care

[Shlouski]

2 minutes ago, Dom1252 said:

Live show that doesn't even show in uploads on youtube anymore... 

 

youtube.com/@LinusTechTips/streams ?

 

 

4 minutes ago, Dom1252 said:

also it's several hours long and no one cares, most people have it as a background noise

 

Several thousand people watch it, can you show me your data to support your claim?

 

6 minutes ago, Dom1252 said:

and even then, Linus usually doubles down instead of admitting mistakes

 

I think you and me are watching a different Linus, he often admits mistakes from what I've seen, but not all of them.

[bandainamcofan]

1 minute ago, treestain said:

You do not get to pick and choose who gets to defend themselves and leave a comment on your report

In what way is Linus unable to reply to this? It was a video made in reply to comments made on public youtube videos. GN did nothing wrong from a journalism ethics standpoint.

[WereCat]

13 minutes ago, treestain said:

I never said he should "let it slide."

 

LMG did not put their credibility in "jeopardy." It was one employee, who got his facts wrong, who was in a 20 second clip on a Twitter post. There wasn't an hour long video about Gamers Nexus attacking the company as a whole on the LTT Channel. I didnt even hear about it until now, same with plenty of others. Gamers Nexus could've replied to the post, they could've reached out to Linus directly as Linus is very quick to fix and resolve things, but they didnt. They pitifully lit a community on fire hoping for their competition to go with it. This isnt a fun and nifty topic, this is bad.

That employee is a part of LMG though.

 

I'd say calling it a drama is a stretch. They did raise valid concerns and awareness though. You could call anything that raises awareness as "trying to make drama". 

 

And he did actually respond on Twitter to HUB. Not sure if GN seen it or no... Probably yes though. 

 

 

 

And regarding community "being lighted on fire" I see many people with less than 10posts suddenly coming out of the darkness of the web expressing their opinion and only few of them having out of spite remarks. There will always be haters no matter how many followers you have. 

 

I do have an issue with Linus calling disappointed fans that have concerns as a "vocal minority" and putting us in the same bag as haters though. It's so easy to dismiss those comments under such a blanket statement. 

 

Most posts of what I see here are supporting and understanding towards Linus while being disappointed with his reply and want him to do better which I find to be commendable. 

 

Yes, it was only a short clip on Twitter but that doesn't really matter as long as it was seen be lots of people which it has. I'm not even on twitter and I've seen it on Lemmy about 20min after it was posted. 

[__Dreamer__]

i'm seeing GN video and the only thing i can think of is
Why going full blast on "quantity over quality" delivering 25+ videos per week while you can't keep up with the quality?

The only reason LTT do exist is because he always delivered insanely good reviews that are also entertaining

i will definitely not spend my time on a review that is not genuine, especially when we are talking about expensive stuff like CPUs.

[RWxAshley]

Just now, treestain said:

Then GN should've disclosed he responses that were made at the time if he is going to open up past drama that has been commented on and dealt with, and at the very least shared that Linus compensated Billet Labs.

 

GN has always reached out for comment when doing a story, not only was LMG an exception, but Linus's previous responses were ignored. In fact the only response that GN showed was (yes, admittedly) Linus's extremely piss poor response on the WAN show. You do not get to pick and choose who gets to defend themselves and leave a comment on your report, and you do not get to pick and choose which responses/clips to show on the subject you're reporting on if you are truly aiming for "subjective" and "non bias" reporting. This is not journalism. I seriously thought I was watching Fox News for a moment.

People have missed another key point. Linus long knew about the auction happening, and failed to address it publicly before GN made it a point of discussion. Linus has had ample time since LTX to discuss this publicly, and openly. Why did we only learn about it thanks to GN digging it up instead of Linus publicly saying it the moment the fuck up occured? What more time did Linus need to address this publicly?

[dragonuck76]

2 minutes ago, Karon said:

Let me translate:

 

Linus mislead customers with crap data, swapped the videos for corrected videos IN THE ONLY WAY THAT DOESN'T LET PEOPLE KNOW IT WAS SWAPPED and does nothing to try and inform the misinformed users. 

 

BUT GODDAMN STEVE SHOULDN'T LET THE PUBLIC KNOW ABOUT THIS! 

TO the amount of videos which discusses data, this mis-information is a small %, and if you really just watch LTT for such data info, and not watch others, then read up on the product as you should then that is your mistake and anyones who just watchs say LTT and then goes out and buys it... that is totally wrong and it also something that LTT states for everyone to do.... and if they LTT make mistakes let them know, but I would not say in the manner of attack as GN has done... infact I watched 15mins of GNs video and had to turn off again, as it is just so dis-tasteful, the points are all personal attacks, yes backed with data and info, proof if you like, but for me, it was handled in a very poor poor manner by GN.  Again not saying LTT need to make things better as they go along, but LTT have stated over and over they are,, and that mistakes will happen and they will improve.  I believe they will.  But on GN again, I have been a sub to his channel for a long while and have watched some of his videos, and they have always come across to me in a negative manner sometimes... they made some good videos, dont get me wrong, but they are very few, and they to have made mistakes just as LTT have, and never corrected them...so again use the old phrase

[WallacEngineering]

So I just got done watching the video and yes I did watch the entire thing and paid attention to the comments and remarks made towards LTT.

 

To be honest I have noticed some errors and LTT testing lately but before I make a thread on any topic I always watch Steve as well as Hardware Unboxed reviews of the same product before I come to any sort of conclusion and make any sort of comment or new thread.

 

Because I spend so much time checking my data before forming an opinion, I didn't realize how severe the errors had gotten at LTT. And I believe GNs hypothesis stating that LMG is simply rushing their videos too quickly is probably correct.

 

What other reviewer do you know of that pushes out 5 to 6 videos every single day between the main channel and short circuit and these other sub channels? I will not say that I believe LMG has become focused on nothing but money because I severely doubt Linus himself would ever allow that to happen, but I do think they are rushing way too hard and they need to back off.

[Dom1252]

1 minute ago, Shlouski said:

youtube.com/@LinusTechTips/streams ?

Several thousand people watch it, can you show me your data to support your claim?

I think you and me are watching a different Linus, he often admits mistakes from what I've seen, but not all of them.

I mean, look at the views, they are there 

then look at views of regular LTT videos 

 

I just assume people watch smaller part of stream than videos, because how long it is and how many things it covers, but I am sure Linus could prove me wrong with channel stats... but I'd bet my yearly salary that those stats would confirm that less people watch full wan show than full LTT video

 

"he often admits mistakes from what I've seen" 

way more often he pretends he was right 

[Dom1252]

1 minute ago, SAUVE76 said:

TO the amount of videos which discusses data, this mis-information is a small %

90% is small? basically every LMG video that has some graph has or had mistake in it in last two years

[Karon]

1 minute ago, SAUVE76 said:

TO the amount of videos which discusses data, this mis-information is a small %, and if you really just watch LTT for such data info, and not watch others, then read up on the product as you should then that is your mistake and anyones who just watchs say LTT and then goes out and buys it... that is totally wrong and it also something that LTT states for everyone to do.... and if they LTT make mistakes let them know, but I would not say in the manner of attack as GN has done... infact I watched 15mins of GNs video and had to turn off again, as it is just so dis-tasteful, the points are all personal attacks, yes backed with data and info, proof if you like, but for me, it was handled in a very poor poor manner by GN.  Again not saying LTT need to make things better as they go along, but LTT have stated over and over they are,, and that mistakes will happen and they will improve.  I believe they will.  But on GN again, I have been a sub to his channel for a long while and have watched some of his videos, and they have always come across to me in a negative manner sometimes... they made some good videos, dont get me wrong, but they are very few, and they to have made mistakes just as LTT have, and never corrected them...so again use the old phrase

Defending a gas lighter with more gas lighting. Classic

[Babymillie]

1 minute ago, Dom1252 said:

It's a great place where to put fake apologies, if barely anyone watches the whole thing, so who's gonna care

 

Yeah then how do I know that he talked about the mouse error in past WAN show? you may not watch the whole thing but that's a you problem no? if you do not care about 2/3h long video doesn't mean others don't watch it, fyi isent Steves video like 44mins or so to... 

[treestain]

4 minutes ago, bandainamcofan said:

In what way is Linus unable to reply to this? It was a video made in reply to comments made on public youtube videos. GN did nothing wrong from a journalism ethics standpoint.

I thought the discussion was GN reaching out for comment, of course he can leave a comment on the video whenever he wants to. It's GN strangely not reaching out for a comment in LMG and LMG only.

[TechTipper4]

I think the main thing that is standing out to me is the amount of double standards that there seems to be. 

• At the end of the day it’s not up to LMG to decide how Billet runs their business or what products they develop. It seems to be that they’re hiding behind the excuse of trying to ‘help’ them. Just last WAN shown Linus was talking about people were trying to talk him out of making the screwdriver…
• Also last WAN show Linus was talking about someone at LTX having a prototype backpack which he wasn’t pleased about. But then he auctions off Billets prototype. It may have been a mistake but if they’re aware of the sensitivity of their own prototypes then they should be extra cautious with other companies prototypes. 
• Finally, Linus has said he is disappointed that GN did not contact him before publishing their video to gain context. Yet they were more than happy to publish the video ripping apart Billet even though LMG are the ones who did not use the product as intended but was the context of this clearly explained in LMGs video?

Over the years I have learned that sometimes you’re going to get stuff wrong, at work and in life and that is OK. For me the best way to deal with it is head on, reflecting on the situation and figuring out how to avoid it in the future. This is how you grow and improve. 

[Dom1252]

Just now, Babymillie said:

 

Yeah then how do I know that he talked about the mouse error in past WAN show? you may not watch the whole thing but that's a you problem no? if you do not care about 2/3h long video doesn't mean others don't watch it, fyi isent Steves video like 44mins or so to... 

majority of people only know because of this controversy, how many people cared before GN video? 

[dragonuck76]

7 minutes ago, bandainamcofan said:

They trash a product because the creator said "we haven't tried it, it might work, but we're not sure," refused to do the test with the proper GPU, claimed he wouldn't spend the time/money to do it correctly, and then said it isn't a problem he didn't do it correctly because his conclusion was right anyway. Yes, Linus absolutely did something wrong in this instance.

 

where in the video does Linus make this claim.  Billet Labs advised LTT that the GPU should work

[WallacEngineering]

14 minutes ago, Karon said:

Let me translate:

 

Linus mislead customers with crap data, swapped the videos for corrected videos IN THE ONLY WAY THAT DOESN'T LET PEOPLE KNOW IT WAS SWAPPED and does nothing to try and inform the misinformed users. 

 

BUT GODDAMN STEVE SHOULDN'T LET THE PUBLIC KNOW ABOUT THIS! 

Unfortunately Steve and GN are 100% correct about going public with this. LMG and LTT respectively have grown so large and so powerful that almost nobody knew what was going on because almost nobody has the time to even keep up with all of their content. On top of this LTT is so powerful now that when concerns were voiced, those concerns were slapped down with harsh criticism from fans of LTT.

 

Considering just how many people are involved and how broad the mistakes have been, I don't feel there was any other way that attention could have been brought to this situation.

[YoungBlade]

17 minutes ago, TheBeast2211 said:

In this case the journalistic best practice you are talking about does not apply. That is reserved for situations where previously undisclosed or unreported information is being brought to light. Everything GN raised in their video is already in the public domain, and was put there by LMG themselves. There is no need for comment on something that has in effect already been commented on by the party in question.

LMG had not made a public comment on auctioning off the Billet Labs prototype, which is by far the most damning part of the video.

 

And again, if they had just reached out for comment, then LTT fans wouldn't be able to use this as a shield and claim unfair treatment. That's why it's a good idea in this case.