Artesian Builds backlash after giveaway

[Touch My Hamm]

During Mondays stream where Artesian Builds held a giveaway while building PC's on twitch one of the giveaway winners was deemed not large enough for the giveaway. The CEO who was the one doing the giveaway talked about the stats for this user explaining how they have only 2k followers and that their "ambassador" link was never clicked and explaining this was the reasoning for them to forfeit the giveaway. The winner took to twitter where the Company now having alot of backlash from the community where even creators like JaysTwoCents (many more piling on) are talking about it.

 

Quotes

Quote

"Here is the reason chatterbabies. This person has had Ambassador for 3 months and not a single click...not a single click...not even once. Purged. This is an Ambassador giveaway and you got to be collaborating with my company."

"You gotta be doing something"

"this is a two way street you scratch our backs we shine your shoes"

"We are the PC company if Linus Tech Tips would have started a PC Company"

 

My thoughts

Obvious mistakes where made in how this was handled and whats worse it was said by the CEO of their company. If they wanted to do the giveaway to only their larger creators they should have made that clear from the start and limited the names to be what they wanted. They also based the giveaway on what their current setup is. They needed to write out the rules and not have it open to interpretation "giving away stuff for people who are not creating content". They did go over a few creators that didnt fit the criteria for the giveaway but it appears KiaPiaa is the one blowing up from this.

 

My understanding of the giveaway from the short excerpt on their stream Monday.

1.They must be an "Ambassador".

2.They must be producing content.

3. Use their updated panel with a link to their website.

4. must stream.

5. communicate with their company.

 

They might have the full rules listed somewhere on their FB or website that makes this more clear.

If I missed anything its more than likely in the Reddit mega thread.

 

 

Sources

https://www.dexerto.com/entertainment/artesian-builds-called-out-by-twitch-streamers-after-refusing-to-honor-pc-giveaway-1773630/

Mega thread on reddit:

 

[OhioYJ]

Apparently they tried to back track and offer a PC, which she declined obviously.  JayzTwoCents already stepped in and building a PC.

[Wintyr]

every one is droping them even intel made a comment they still be in business as they make good PC but it may take him a bit to recover.  No word yet that I have seen from Mr Beast and there giveaway they have partnered with artesian builds on.

[Gamer Schnitzel]

Sorry but the "streamer" is very clearly at fault here. If you have only 2K followers and not a single one clicked your referral you are NOT a content creator. Not every dipshit who begs people for follows and puts a referral link under their stream is a follower.

This person essentially just wanted free shit and got mad when they didn't get it.

 

It is completely right that the company should have added more detail to who qualifies but at the same time you have to take into account that this "company" is not even a year old and they are so small that their CEO is doing the giveaway, Their computers are very expensive and this girl is expecting to get a free high end computer while making $0.00 for them, literally nothing.

Anyone with common decency would be understanding and acknowledge that you made that company absolutely no money and cannot expect them to just hand you a $5K PC because you have a few thousand followers and you put a picture under their 1 viewer stream. Streamers are just becoming extremely entitled and Jay honestly is a moron for defending this particular streamer. The only reason he did it because those larsger tech streamers like the idea of being "paragons" in the gaming community, not because he actually agrees. You seen Jay's "giveaways"? Where he expects you to follow all his 5 billion social media accounts and he milks the shit out of you just so you can maybe win a GPU against 1m people? While making videos that you shall be grateful and he will simply cancel the giveaway if 1 more comment is ungrateful? Jay is literally no different from the CEO.

[Wintyr]

36 minutes ago, Gamer Schnitzel said:

Sorry but the "streamer" is very clearly at fault here. If you have only 2K followers and not a single one clicked your referral you are NOT a content creator. Not every dipshit who begs people for follows and puts a referral link under their stream is a follower.

This person essentially just wanted free shit and got mad when they didn't get it.

 

It is completely right that the company should have added more detail to who qualifies but at the same time you have to take into account that this "company" is not even a year old and they are so small that their CEO is doing the giveaway, Their computers are very expensive and this girl is expecting to get a free high end computer while making $0.00 for them, literally nothing.

Anyone with common decency would be understanding and acknowledge that you made that company absolutely no money and cannot expect them to just hand you a $5K PC because you have a few thousand followers and you put a picture under their 1 viewer stream. Streamers are just becoming extremely entitled and Jay honestly is a moron for defending this particular streamer. The only reason he did it because those larsger tech streamers like the idea of being "paragons" in the gaming community, not because he actually agrees. You seen Jay's "giveaways"? Where he expects you to follow all his 5 billion social media accounts and he milks the shit out of you just so you can maybe win a GPU against 1m people? While making videos that you shall be grateful and he will simply cancel the giveaway if 1 more comment is ungrateful? Jay is literally no different from the CEO.

they listed the terms of the giveaway at then changed them after they drew there name. that is what is wrong.  If he intended to do the other he should have changed the rules at the begining of the last month  to indicated this was the requirements.  and before this month that was the requirement.  I do know in the previous months stream he was talking about changing it.  But chose to do it live and then mock the streamer at the same time. and then after do it that he did a shout out as intel sponsered this stream.  Nearly every ambassador they had is now gone.  its more a legal issue as well.  

[Kisai]

2 hours ago, OhioYJ said:

Apparently they tried to back track and offer a PC, which she declined obviously.  JayzTwoCents already stepped in and building a PC.

Without having the information at hand, Apparently Artesian had been doing shady things for the at least the last year (there's a massive drop in viewership mid-2021.) The Tax Fraud allegations is also new. I was never into this and only knew what they did because at least one streamer I watch had a build from them.

 

That said, there are laws regarding giveaways.  There are things you can do on a real life stream that will get you canceled so damn quick, because the people watching are holding you accountable in real time. 

 

Now, let's steer this topic towards giveaways on twitch. Many giveaways are "for fun" things, like digital assets, game downloads, artwork, stuff that is generally worth less than $100 in real world value, and costs the streamer nothing but time. Artists do this a lot.

 

I reasonably suspect Twitch might bring down the hammer on Artesian Builds.

https://odinlaw.com/are-giveaways-on-twitch-legal/

Quote

• No applicants can be shown special favor. 
  • Adjusting the “luck” or increasing odds for different types of users defeats the requirement of randomness in a sweepstakes. This is true even if the streamer uses a set formula for “adjusting” luck (eg, subscribers get 2x entries). Every entry should be given “equal dignity.”

https://odinlaw.com/chance-versus-skill-in-a-giveaway/

Quote

Sponsors of contests need to be aware of whether they’re creating a game of skill or chance because of the legal implications and the strict gambling laws in the United States. Some states follow the guide that if chance influences the outcome of a game in any way, shape or form then it is deemed to be illegal gambling.

 

Their quote, not mine. So what would be legal, and what would be against the Twitch ToS?

 

I think Artesian would be within their right to set some terms (eg following the channel, having whatever affiliate link be present on the twitch page) because how else are they going to know you're in their community? This also prevents people from just spamming contest entries from as many email addresses they can generate.

 

However setting terms like amount of followers, live viewers, basically any information you can gleam off socialblade, would be not in the spirit of having a giveaway.

 

You see that bump on the 25th/26th, that was likely the giveaway entry date. That crash on the 2nd is the fallout of this backlash.

 

They really should have taken their own advice before trying to impose it on others.

 

https://www.twitch.tv/p/en/legal/terms-of-service/

Quote

9. Prohibited Conduct

YOU AGREE NOT TO violate any law, contract, intellectual property, or other third-party right; not to commit a tort, and that you are solely responsible for your conduct while on the Twitch Services.

i. create, upload, transmit, distribute, or store any content that is inaccurate, unlawful, infringing, defamatory, obscene, pornographic, invasive of privacy or publicity rights, harassing, threatening, abusive, inflammatory, or otherwise objectionable;

v. defame, harass, abuse, threaten, or defraud users of the Twitch Services, or collect or attempt to collect, personal information about users or third parties without their consent;

xvii. use the Twitch Services for any illegal purpose, or in violation of any local, state, national, or international law or regulation, including without limitation laws governing intellectual property and other proprietary rights, data protection, and privacy.

Like I see Twitch maybe taking action, but I think the drop in followers and viewers will speak for itself.

 

[WhitetailAni]

1 hour ago, Gamer Schnitzel said:

This person essentially just wanted free shit and got mad when they didn't get it.

No. Artesian changed the terms of the giveaway after a winner was drawn, so they could draw a new winner.

That's against the law for giveaways, sweepstakes, etc., in the US.

[poochyena]

5 hours ago, Caroline said:

Wow giveaways are fake? Unbelievable, I'm shocked.

This one specific one was. No reason to generalize other giveaways.

[cretsiah]

4 hours ago, Gamer Schnitzel said:

Sorry but the "streamer" is very clearly at fault here. If you have only 2K followers and not a single one clicked your referral you are NOT a content creator. Not every dipshit who begs people for follows and puts a referral link under their stream is a follower.

This person essentially just wanted free shit and got mad when they didn't get it.

 

It is completely right that the company should have added more detail to who qualifies but at the same time you have to take into account that this "company" is not even a year old and they are so small that their CEO is doing the giveaway, Their computers are very expensive and this girl is expecting to get a free high end computer while making $0.00 for them, literally nothing.

Anyone with common decency would be understanding and acknowledge that you made that company absolutely no money and cannot expect them to just hand you a $5K PC because you have a few thousand followers and you put a picture under their 1 viewer stream. Streamers are just becoming extremely entitled and Jay honestly is a moron for defending this particular streamer. The only reason he did it because those larsger tech streamers like the idea of being "paragons" in the gaming community, not because he actually agrees. You seen Jay's "giveaways"? Where he expects you to follow all his 5 billion social media accounts and he milks the shit out of you just so you can maybe win a GPU against 1m people? While making videos that you shall be grateful and he will simply cancel the giveaway if 1 more comment is ungrateful? Jay is literally no different from the CEO.

Hoeg Law covers this pretty well........ based on information available they could be done for gambling/ lottery/ sweepstakes law

 

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, Caroline said:

Man, people in first world countries have it so easy. You shitpost a bit on reddit and get a high end PC for free from a known youtuber, just unbelievable. Literally inconceivable for someone like me.

I yet have to see a giveaway that isn't rigged in some way. And win. 

You know what the odds are? you're most likely to find extraterrestrial intelligent life than to win a giveaway.

Really does not matter, company did a giveaway and specified the rules and conditions, did the draw, didn't like the winner, changed the rules and conditions (illegal in the US) and did a re-draw (also illegal for how they did it).

 

If as you say all giveaways are rigged then they clearly failed to rig it properly and literally committed a criminal act.

 

Even someone like Cleetus McFarland has been impacted by these laws, for his Marauder giveaway. He ended up putting a $10k built engine in to it after submitting the giveaway details to the required authorities so was not able to change that if you choose to take the car you also get $10k cash. Meaning you have a choice to pick between a car valued at around $20k-$25k plus $10k cash or $25k cash without the car. He said he cannot change it as it's too late and would be illegal to do so.

[Kisai]

46 minutes ago, leadeater said:

 

If as you say all giveaways are rigged then they clearly failed to rig it properly and literally committed a criminal act.

 

Devil's advocate:

If I were to rig a contest/giveaway I would do it by pre-drawing the winner.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/07/how-mcmillions-scam-rigged-the-mcdonalds-monopoly-game.html

 

Basically, if Artesian was trying to try and gain the most benefit from it, they would narrow down who they want to win by picking winners offline until they found one that met their criteria, and then when they're live, that winner would be the only one in the hat.

 

I have never actually watched what they do, but if they were using something like StreamElements or Moobot to do the giveaway, there is a bit of an audit trail for it. Like I know in StreamLabs, there will be a list of who entered, and how many times they entered. So I'm sure this audit trail exists, and they were just not smart enough to "not get caught", and instead tried to change the rules in real time.

 

More to the point though, if they are trying to pull the "you're not big enough" card, jokes on them. Twitch Streamers that they have done builds for are basically "top 1000" streamers, and they are nowhere near them. Right now they have 650 live, and in "emote only" mode. If they believe that they can just continue on like nothing happened, well that emote-only mode is probably going to be a permanent mode.

 

But aside from the GPU shortage, who the hell would even go to them in the first place? Not a top 1000 streamer, a big streamer can afford their own gear, and would "maybe" pick them for a build because they do more than simply slap together parts on stream. They aren't going to enter any contest. The people who are going to enter the contest are going to be the ones that thought Artesian might (rightfully as proven) give them a signal boost in the process, and/or can't afford it anyway. It kind of sucks that they just flushed all that goodwill down the toilet with the CEO running his mouth off.

 

 

[Wintyr]

They used to draw people without saying who it was live on stream and then were like denied or you won to many times in the past deny and reroll. then tell the names. also if you payed towards a build you get entered into a separate giveaway probly highly illegal

[wanderingfool2]

7 hours ago, Gamer Schnitzel said:

Sorry but the "streamer" is very clearly at fault here. If you have only 2K followers and not a single one clicked your referral you are NOT a content creator. Not every dipshit who begs people for follows and puts a referral link under their stream is a follower.

This person essentially just wanted free shit and got mad when they didn't get it.

if a company decides that they qualify as an ambassador and they met the contest rules, then it's the companies own fault...not the person who realized the opportunity.  It's like when the Mint offered $1 coins for $1 price tag, and a guy bought like $10k worth of coins on a credit card (which got rewards points).

 

In this case it's, person enters a contest that they were able to enter (if they wanted to put restrictions on it, then that's on Artesian not the streamer), streamer wins, and the company decided to go the illegal route and rescind the prize...gee I wonder why they would get mad.  It's not entitlement really, she averaged what about 500 views on her broadcasts (at about 8 hours a day)...looking through it she had a decent amount of active viewers chatting.  If they wanted her to hawk something as an ambassador then they should have made that as part of the condition.  Like entering people into the draw based on viewers actually interacting with a link . Or you know, filtering out some of the entries before hand who don't "meet" the requirements (Although by the looks of it, she did). [They were also sponsored by intel, so Intel likely picked up a decent amount of the cost]

 

In general as well, how often do you buy computers?  Even if a streamer had 1000 viewers, I bet the click through rate would be very small.  You do things like having it in profiles though to start building brand awareness.  I mean, I've bought stuff that was featured on LMG that I liked but I didn't follow the links...it all boils down to brand awareness really.

 

She also got mad in that they effectively belittled her as being a small streamer live; they handled this in the worst possible way.  Imagine going to a black friday sale where it's the first 50 people get a free TV, then being told...oh you didn't buy enough stuff to qualify for the free TV (despite it not saying it anywhere)

 

 

Actually, I think this says it all about how terrible the CEO is

 

[leadeater]

1 hour ago, wanderingfool2 said:

Actually, I think this says it all about how terrible the CEO is

Geez, there is so much more about this guy than I was expecting. At least the whole thinking he knows more than GN Steve gave me a laugh.

[poochyena]

11 hours ago, Caroline said:

I yet have to see a giveaway that isn't rigged in some way. And win. 

You know what the odds are? you're most likely to find extraterrestrial intelligent life than to win a giveaway.

LOL

I used to actively enter giveaways. Here is a list of my winnings

 

-2018-

$5 amazon
$20 steam
$20 steam
$10 steam
3 month pandora subscription
$120 in intel merchandise
chocolate bar

-2017-
gamerfuel tub + bottle
Superhot ($25 steam game)
$5 steam game
low calorie sample box ($5 worth of snacks)
LG G6 smartphone ($600 value)
$10 steam game
hi-tops for BattleGrounds ($100 steam item)
$20 steam card
gaming keyboard+mouse ($40 value)
$10 paypal
artwork commission
$60 steam gift card
$10 amazon card
veryfitpro fitness tracker watch ($40)
$10 amazon card
$25 amazon card
1 month crunchyroll
500 watt PSU
$20 amazon card

[googleuser3212]

How much you wanna bet this will be covered on the WAN show?

[googleuser3212]

I think honestly, their company is done. Honestly, I wouldn’t care. 

[tkitch]

2 minutes ago, fiddleslessless said:

How much you wanna bet this will be covered on the WAN show?

most likely, it's great fodder.

 

I love watching a good disaster burst into flames.

[googleuser3212]

Just now, fiddleslessless said:

I think honestly, their company is done. Honestly, I wouldn’t care. 

As a small creator, what they did was very insulting. I know some streamers like SurisSkeptic have burned their bridges with the company already. 

[googleuser3212]

Just now, tkitch said:

most likely, it's great fodder.

 

I love watching a good disaster burst into flames.

Time to get the popcorn lol

[leadeater]

30 minutes ago, poochyena said:

chocolate bar

Easily the best prize you have won

[poochyena]

1 minute ago, leadeater said:

Easily the best prize you have won

It WAS very tasty. It was all the way from sweden I think, or maybe some other european country.

[Retorrent]

9 hours ago, wanderingfool2 said:

if a company decides that they qualify as an ambassador and they met the contest rules, then it's the companies own fault...not the person who realized the opportunity.  It's like when the Mint offered $1 coins for $1 price tag, and a guy bought like $10k worth of coins on a credit card (which got rewards points).

 

In this case it's, person enters a contest that they were able to enter (if they wanted to put restrictions on it, then that's on Artesian not the streamer), streamer wins, and the company decided to go the illegal route and rescind the prize...gee I wonder why they would get mad.  It's not entitlement really, she averaged what about 500 views on her broadcasts (at about 8 hours a day)...looking through it she had a decent amount of active viewers chatting.  If they wanted her to hawk something as an ambassador then they should have made that as part of the condition.  Like entering people into the draw based on viewers actually interacting with a link . Or you know, filtering out some of the entries before hand who don't "meet" the requirements (Although by the looks of it, she did). [They were also sponsored by intel, so Intel likely picked up a decent amount of the cost]

 

In general as well, how often do you buy computers?  Even if a streamer had 1000 viewers, I bet the click through rate would be very small.  You do things like having it in profiles though to start building brand awareness.  I mean, I've bought stuff that was featured on LMG that I liked but I didn't follow the links...it all boils down to brand awareness really.

 

She also got mad in that they effectively belittled her as being a small streamer live; they handled this in the worst possible way.  Imagine going to a black friday sale where it's the first 50 people get a free TV, then being told...oh you didn't buy enough stuff to qualify for the free TV (despite it not saying it anywhere)

 

 

Actually, I think this says it all about how terrible the CEO is

 

Wow that guy is just a major douche, I fee sorry for anyone that works for this guy

[wanderingfool2]

8 hours ago, leadeater said:

Geez, there is so much more about this guy than I was expecting. At least the whole thinking he knows more than GN Steve gave me a laugh.

I know, I started watching the video thinking it would just be about him being a bit unprofessional or a few similar types of stories..but this is like a whole different level.  I'm surprised this guy hasn't been "cancelled" before...although guessing some of the people might have been locked into contracts as well.

 

I feel sorry for his staff, I do disagree with  KristoferYee's reasoning why people don't quit.  While I do think there are some that do it because they are being manipulated...I feel that there is likely equally as many that are doing it because they need the job and are fearful about finding other consistent employment elsewhere (because maybe they can't afford the week or two stretch between jobs, or are too afraid that even searching for a job they might be fired).  Either way, the CEO is as a whole a vial individual.

 

I really wish I knew more about the tax situation thing.  Looking at the sites people keep posting, I am not sure how reliable it is (there would be multiple inc/ltd companies under his name), and even multiple of the same named companies...so I'm taking that information with a grain of salt; but I really hope that someone does a deeper dive into it just to see what is happening with that.

[starsmine]

Yikes.
While I agree to an extent if you want your give away to ambassadors, be ambassadors that actually have brought in business. you have to define that well ahead of time. 
It also doesn't make that much sense either to do that. Giveaways by themselves are advertisement, and build hype and good will around your company.

 

  

13 hours ago, Caroline said:

Man, people in first world countries have it so easy. You shitpost a bit on reddit and get a high end PC for free from a known youtuber, just unbelievable. Literally inconceivable for someone like me.

I yet have to see a giveaway that isn't rigged in some way. And win. 

You know what the odds are? you're most likely to find extraterrestrial intelligent life than to win a giveaway.

Dude... having long odds does not make something rigged. If you have 5 prizes, and 100000 people enter, thats 1/20k odds, its not high no, but where do you get the idea of it being rigged?