Windows 11 - Insider Program - Master Thread

[Tan3l6]

Not cool - after swpping to Dev Channel on 11 insider, can't install. 

Every time after 2 reboots WHEA error:

 

Spoiler

 

[james126]

On 9/16/2021 at 3:23 PM, Tan3l6 said:

Not cool - after swpping to Dev Channel on 11 insider, can't install. 

Every time after 2 reboots WHEA error:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Did you tried Going back to previous build from Settings > Windows Update > Advanced Options > Recovery > Go back.

[Tan3l6]

2 hours ago, james126 said:

Did you tried Going back to previous build from Settings > Windows Update > Advanced Options > Recovery > Go back.

The installation luckily reverts by itself so no constant failure loop. 

So no need to go back to previous build manually.

[Jontario]

@LAwLz I agree with most of that but I consider microcode a driver. It's like a lower level driver in the firmware. Apparently IBM considers firmware and microcode to be synonymous. Something I learned when brushing up on microcode. 

[LAwLz]

1 hour ago, Jontario said:

@LAwLz I agree with most of that but I consider microcode a driver. It's like a lower level driver in the firmware. Apparently IBM considers firmware and microcode to be synonymous. Something I learned when brushing up on microcode. 

I guess it's fair enough if you want to consider it a driver. My point is that it doesn't really matter. The microcode doesn't interact with the OS and the OS doesn't have to care which microcode you use. It's the same as your OS not need to know which router you got at home. Your router doesn't care what OS your PC got, and your PC doesn't care which OS your router got. Likewise, your CPU's microcode doesn't care which OS you are running, and your OS doesn't care which microcode you're running. 

 

That's why I said a "CPU driver" isn't the reason why Windows 11 only supports some CPUs. 

[Tan3l6]

On 9/16/2021 at 12:53 PM, Tan3l6 said:

Not cool - after swpping to Dev Channel on 11 insider, can't install. 

Every time after 2 reboots WHEA error:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Seems it's not Windows 11 insider build that causes it. 
Rather it's somekind of driver issue.

After making USB installer the result after rollback is:

Spoiler

No idea how to filter out the culprit. But fortunatley the build I'm on is very stable with AMD card.

[Master Disaster]

So yesterday I took some spare time I had and used it to upgrade my second OS drive on my desktop to Win 11, mostly because I'm actually quite interested in trying out Direct Storage when MS finally release DX12 ultimate.

 

Since its been a few years since I reinstalled Windows I decided to grab an 11 ISO from MS and do a clean install and I noticed something in the OOBE that is 100% new to Windows 11.

 

After install finished the system rebooted and OOBE ran, it sat there for a VERY long time (longer than the time it took to install) before finally it started applying a full build upgrade (I assume the wait was because of my slow internet speeds).

 

Does this mean that from now on, if you try to install an older build of 11 and you have internet its going to grab and install the latest build automatically for you? Or is this just a beta thing?

 

Anyone else noticed this?

[Forbidden Wafer]

3 hours ago, Master Disaster said:

After install finished the system rebooted and OOBE ran, it sat there for a VERY long time (longer than the time it took to install) before finally it started applying a full build upgrade (I assume the wait was because of my slow internet speeds).

Tried on my ancient Mac with a Core 2 Duo, and it was pretty fast, even with the slow DDR3 and a 5400 RPM spinning rust. Did not connect it to the internet while installing W11.

[Vitalstatistix]

Hi!
My laptop is an Acer Swift 3 with a Ryzen 5 2500u. I wanted to install Windows 11 but it turns out the processor isn't supported by windows 11 (however, it does have TPM and secure boot is enabled!) My question is, if I download the ISO from UUP dump, would it be possible to switch back to the public release branch? Or should I just wait for the public release to be available and then do a fresh install?

 

[doubleflower]

On 9/10/2021 at 9:22 PM, LAwLz said:

That's because the hardware requirements are arbitrary and doesn't have anything to do with things like performance or security.

The weird thing is that Windows 10 happily runs on very old hardware (even old LGA775 hardware supports Windows 10 with little issues) 

 

It's somewhat strange to see Microsoft goes from making an OS that they are hoping that everyone can upgrade to (to the point of forcing the upgrade automatically), to making an OS that people cannot upgrade to even though they are interested in the upgrade itself  

[linkboy]

On 9/13/2021 at 8:04 AM, LAwLz said:

I really don't think there are any technical reasons for why Microsoft decided to cut support for certain CPUs. Nothing I have seen or heard so far points to there being a security, performance, stability or feature reason. My guess is that Microsoft just wanted to lose some baggage and essentially threw darts on a dartboard when decided what would be cut and what would be supported. In 2025 when Windows 10 is EoL it won't really matter if they cut support at 7th gen or 8th gen in Microsoft's mind.

 

I really do think that Microsoft is approaching this from a "what do we want to support" approach instead of a "can the OS run on this hardware" approach and the Surface line is playing a massive reason into that.

 

Looking at the Surface devices that are receiving the Windows 11 update compared to the ones that aren't

 

• Surface Go - Not receiving Windows 11, has Pentium Gold 4415Y (Surface Go 2 is, has Intel Core m3 8100Y/Intel Pentium Gold 4425Y)
• Surface Pro (2017) - Not receiving Windows 11, has 7th gen CPU (Surface Pro 6 is, has 8th gen CPU)
• Surface Laptop - Not receiving Windows 11, has m3-7Y30/7th gen CPU (Surface Laptop 2 is, has 8th gen CPU)
• Surface Book - Not receiving Windows 11, has 6th gen CPU (Surface Book 2 is, has 8th gen CPU)
• Surface Studio 2 - Receiving Windows 11, has 7th gen CPU (current device being sold, no current replacement)

 

They're supporting two generations of each Surface line that is getting Windows 11

 

• Surface Go 2 and 3 is getting Windows 11
• Surface Pro 7 and 8 is getting Windows 11
• Surface Pro X (SQ1/SQ2) is getting Windows 11
• Surface Laptop 3 and 4 is getting Windows 11
• Surface Book 2 and 3 is getting Windows 11

 

Windows isn't the primary money maker for Microsoft that it used to be, but the Surface line is and Microsoft wants to push it hard. Microsoft is a hardware manufacture and their hardware line is going to have an impact on Windows development, especially if the same person is overseeing development of both.

 

Windows 11 is the first major Windows release where the same person (Panos Panay in this case, not sure if he's still going to oversee the two teams with his latest promotion to the Executive Board) is overseeing both the Surface line and Windows development.

 

I don't think that it's a coincidence that their approach with Windows changed the second that the person mainly responsible for the Surface line starts to oversee Windows development.

 

You can't separate Windows development and the Surface line anymore. Any decision that Microsoft makes related to what CPUs Windows will support will directly be tied to the Surface line.

[GoodBytes]

Updated version of the Photo app is being released to all.

Some of you might had already have it.

 

The Photo app interface got updated to Windows 11 styling, and cleaned up a bit.

 

Check it out!

[GoodBytes]

Also, Nvidia released new Windows 11 drivers.

These ones are accessible normally, as you would other Nvidia drivers.

 

Desktop

• Studio: https://www.nvidia.com/Download/driverResults.aspx/180559/en-us
• Game Ready: https://www.nvidia.com/Download/driverResults.aspx/180557/en-us

Mobile

• Studio: https://www.nvidia.com/Download/driverResults.aspx/180560/en-us
• Game Ready: https://www.nvidia.com/Download/driverResults.aspx/180558/en-us

[Jontario]

On 9/18/2021 at 8:55 AM, LAwLz said:

I guess it's fair enough if you want to consider it a driver. My point is that it doesn't really matter. The microcode doesn't interact with the OS and the OS doesn't have to care which microcode you use. It's the same as your OS not need to know which router you got at home. Your router doesn't care what OS your PC got, and your PC doesn't care which OS your router got. Likewise, your CPU's microcode doesn't care which OS you are running, and your OS doesn't care which microcode you're running. 

 

That's why I said a "CPU driver" isn't the reason why Windows 11 only supports some CPUs. 

I think my point remains though if I remember it correctly that they don't want to update the driver, or microcode when they can just get you to buy a new hardware. Even if the OS doesn't care what you're using I'm sure there are potential stability, performance and/or compatibility issues with older microcode. Microsoft claimed less crashes on the newer platforms with some stat that was extremely misleading showing a big increase in instability on older hardware with something like 50% less crashes without giving the baseline which was low. 50% less crashing seems awesome but when almost nobody is crashing it's kind of miniscule in reality. I would assume most of these are on shitty proprietary systems though since I've had no instability.

[Jontario]

On 9/22/2021 at 3:06 AM, Master Disaster said:

So yesterday I took some spare time I had and used it to upgrade my second OS drive on my desktop to Win 11, mostly because I'm actually quite interested in trying out Direct Storage when MS finally release DX12 ultimate.

 

Since its been a few years since I reinstalled Windows I decided to grab an 11 ISO from MS and do a clean install and I noticed something in the OOBE that is 100% new to Windows 11.

 

After install finished the system rebooted and OOBE ran, it sat there for a VERY long time (longer than the time it took to install) before finally it started applying a full build upgrade (I assume the wait was because of my slow internet speeds).

 

Does this mean that from now on, if you try to install an older build of 11 and you have internet its going to grab and install the latest build automatically for you? Or is this just a beta thing?

 

Anyone else noticed this?

Even on older versions of windows some people practice to install the os without a network connection, this being one of the reasons.

[Jontario]

On 9/25/2021 at 6:46 AM, doubleflower said:

The weird thing is that Windows 10 happily runs on very old hardware (even old LGA775 hardware supports Windows 10 with little issues) 

 

It's somewhat strange to see Microsoft goes from making an OS that they are hoping that everyone can upgrade to (to the point of forcing the upgrade automatically), to making an OS that people cannot upgrade to even though they are interested in the upgrade itself  

They sell laptops now, they didn't before.

[GoodBytes]

Build 22468 has been released to the Dev Channel

 

This one has no new features. As we are nearing the GA of Windows 11, it is just fixes.

Fixes:

Quote

Taskbar

• Mitigated a rare explorer.exe initialization hang related to loading the network icon.

Search

• Improved reliability of showing the flyout when hovering over the Search icon in the Taskbar.
• If you navigate to the Search icon in the Taskbar using the keyboard, navigating away will now dismiss the recent searches flyout.
• The options when right clicking recent files displayed when searching for certain apps like Word should work now when you select them.

File Explorer

• If you right click files in OneDrive locations in File Explorer, the context menu will no longer unexpectedly dismiss when you hover over entries that open sub-menus, like “Open with.”
• Double clicking a network folder to open it will no longer unexpectedly try to pin it to Quick Access instead of opening it.

Input

• Addressed an underlying font issue that was making the right hand of the shruggie kaomoji ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ not display in the correct position, as well as apostrophes in certain cases.

Settings

• Your preferred microphone input format setting (as configured in Sound Settings) should persist upgrade now.
• Addressed an issue where certain drives were unexpectedly not displaying in Defragment and Optimize Drives.

Other

• We’ve resolved the issue preventing MDM enrolled PCs from successfully updating to the previous build. These devices are now unblocked from updating to the latest build.
• Fixed an issue that could cause unexpected flickering in certain apps such as Microsoft Edge when using multiple monitors with different refresh rates.
• Mitigated a display related issue that was causing some Insiders to experience an increase in bug checks in recent flights.
• Did some work to address an issue where the Windows Update icon in the Taskbar might display but suddenly disappear when you hovered over it.
• Addressed a rare issue with certain devices after sleep where Wi-Fi would get stuck in an off state and trying to toggle it back on wouldn’t work.
• Mitigated an issue for certain devices that could cause the system to freeze in some scenarios.

NOTE: Some fixes noted here in Insider Preview builds from the active development branch may make their way into the servicing updates for the released version of Windows 11 after general availability on October 5th.

 

 

Known issues:

Quote

[General]

• Users updating from Builds 22000.xxx, or earlier, to newer Dev Channel builds using the latest Dev Channel ISO, may receive the following warning message:

The build you are trying to install is Flight Signed. To continue installing, enable flight signing.

If you receive this message, press the Enable button, reboot the PC, and retry the update.

• Some users may experience their screen and sleep timeouts being reduced. We’re investigating the potential impact that shorter screen and sleep timeouts could have on energy consumption.

[Start]

• In some cases, you might be unable to enter text when using Search from Start or the Taskbar. If you experience the issue, press WIN + R on the keyboard to launch the Run dialog box, then close it.

[Taskbar]

• The Taskbar will sometimes flicker when switching input methods.
• We’re investigating reports that Notification Center will get in a state in recent builds where it doesn’t launch. If you are impacted by this, restarting explorer.exe may resolve the issue for you.

[Search]

• After clicking the Search icon on the Taskbar, the Search panel may not open. If this occurs, restart the “Windows Explorer” process, and open the search panel again.
• Search panel might appear as black and not display any content below the search box.

[Widgets]

• The widgets board may appear empty. To work around the issue, you can sign out and then sign back in again.
• Widgets may be displayed in the wrong size on external monitors. If you encounter this, you can launch the widgets via touch or WIN + W shortcut on your actual PC display first and then launch on your secondary monitors.

 

https://blogs.windows.com/windows-insider/2021/09/29/announcing-windows-11-insider-preview-build-22468/

[GoodBytes]

Surprise update:

Paint interface got updated with Win11 look and feel:

 

[Forbidden Wafer]

3 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

Surprise update:

Paint interface got updated with Win11 look and feel:

 

It actually looks good. I'm surprised.
However, the taskbar still unusable. I want my right-click with all the options back.

[LAwLz]

16 hours ago, Forbidden Wafer said:

It actually looks good. I'm surprised.
However, the taskbar still unusable. I want my right-click with all the options back.

Yeah I am surprised that it looks pretty good. Haven't been a fan of most of the Windows 11 redesign, but the paint one is alright.

Too bad the color picker still calls the comdlg32.dll.

They rounded the corners but that was pretty much it.

 

Hopefully they will update that as well, but my guess is that it will be this way for at least a while, and this mess will be in the release version of Windows 11.

 

[doubleflower]

6 hours ago, LAwLz said:

Yeah I am surprised that it looks pretty good. Haven't been a fan of most of the Windows 11 redesign, but the paint one is alright.

Too bad the color picker still calls the comdlg32.dll.

They rounded the corners but that was pretty much it.

 

Hopefully they will update that as well, but my guess is that it will be this way for at least a while, and this mess will be in the release version of Windows 11.

 

Probably something to do with backwards compatibility or something

[doubleflower]

22 hours ago, Forbidden Wafer said:

It actually looks good. I'm surprised.
However, the taskbar still unusable. I want my right-click with all the options back.

Start11 actually does this

 

Should be a somewhat decent replacement for the regressed taskbar and start menu functionality

[LAwLz]

48 minutes ago, doubleflower said:

Probably something to do with backwards compatibility or something

It's not.

People need to stop using this as an excuse whenever Microsoft are lazy or incompetent. 

[GoodBytes]

57 minutes ago, doubleflower said:

Probably something to do with backwards compatibility or something

I have to agree with @LAwLz. The color panel is external. The programs simply gets the selected value after calling the API call to get the color panel. It doesn't matter that the panel has changed or not. In addition, Paint is supported... Microsoft JUST updated the interface.

 

Personally I don't expect Microsoft to update this panel in phase 2 of Sun Valley project. There is just too many other panels that needs to be updated that are more user facing.

[doubleflower]

22 minutes ago, GoodBytes said:

I have to agree with @LAwLz. The color panel is external. The programs simply gets the selected value after calling the API call to get the color panel. It doesn't matter that the panel has changed or not. In addition, Paint is supported... Microsoft JUST updated the interface.

 

Personally I don't expect Microsoft to update this panel in phase 2 of Sun Valley project. There is just too many other panels that needs to be updated that are more user facing.

Fair enough I guess.  There's seems to be too many legacy stuff out there that they have to update and all they can do is to layer new things on top on the old ones for some weird reason.