The Apple Exit Strategy

[Joshua5684]

Introduction I'm getting fed up with Apple. Among them removing features for no good reason (headphone jack on iPhone, USB-A on MacBook, microphone passthrough on the headphone jack with anything other than EarPods, and many more), their stance and actions against repair, and now them changing their mind about customer privacy in light of their new on-device image hashing, I'm forced to wonder if there's any reason for me to stay in the ecosystem. Here, I'll explain how I use Apple products. I'd like you to help me figure out if I should stay or go, and if I go, what products would effectively replace my current devices.

 

My Hardware I currently own a late 2013 MacBook Pro, an iPhone 6S, and a gaming PC. My MacBook is getting pretty slow, so I'm interested in getting something new. My iPhone is doing alright. I foresee using it for at least another year. My PC could also use an upgrade or a replacement.

 

How I Use My Hardware I use my MacBook to make music in GarageBand, call and text with the forwarding feature, and bring it to school to use MS Office (it struggles in Excel). I don't use my iPhone for anything special... makes me wonder why I spent so much on it . I use my PC for gaming, of course.

 

My Initial Plan Apple Silicon has been very exciting. I've been especially excited for the rumoured 2021 MacBook Pro with retuning ports and MagSafe. Unfortunately, I'm not as excited as I was initially was because it won't have USB-A. All of my peripherals, including my instruments are A. I don't have a single C device. If I got it, I'd have to also get a dongle, which is not appealing. Also, I might be able to kill birds with one stone in the gaming department. My PC has an i5-2400 and GTX 1050 ti. The 2021 MBP will certainly out-perform it. The only BIG potential issue is x86 compatibility. I wouldn't buy it right away anyway, so I'd wait for reviews to discuss this before I purchase, but it might not be a big deal considering Valve's recent effort developing Proton (maybe there'll be a MacOS equivalent). If I really don't want to use a dongle, I could get a Mac Mini which would be my gaming/music computer, but what do I use for school? If gaming is not as good as my PC, I'd get an M1 Air, and keep my PC.

If-Then Matrix

1. If Mac gaming is good and I don't mind a dongle, get a 2021 MBP, and ditch my PC

2. If Mac gaming is good but I don't want a dongle, get a 2021 Mac Mini (assuming they're releasing it alongside the MBP with the same SOC), find another laptop, and ditch my PC

3. If Mac gaming is poor and I don't mind a dongle, get a M1 MBA

4. If Mac gaming is poor but I don't want a dongle, get a 2015 15" MBP (a yikes of an option considering they're still pretty expensive)

 

My Exit Plan: thoughts so far Samsung Galaxy and Windows have a feature similar to Apple's call/text forwarding, so maybe I'd get a Galaxy phone when I'm done with my iPhone, but to be honest, I could live without that feature. My options for music are: learn to use Ableton or FL Studio or build a Hackintosh. I'm personally interested in the idea of a Hackintosh, but I know compatibility can be a crapshoot. Though, if iCloud sets up correctly, a Hackintosh could be the best thing: have the MacOS software that I like, and dual boot Windows, so it can game. That would be pretty expensive at the moment considering the Graphics card market. That leaves a laptop. All it needs to do is run MS Office, so that shouldn't be hard to find.

 

What should I do?

[SorryBella]

38 minutes ago, Joshua5684 said:

Samsung Galaxy and Windows have a feature similar to Apple's call/text forwarding, so maybe I'd get a Galaxy phone when I'm done with my iPhone, but to be honest, I could live without that feature. My options for music are: learn to use Ableton or FL Studio or build a Hackintosh. I'm personally interested in the idea of a Hackintosh, but I know compatibility can be a crapshoot. Though, if iCloud sets up correctly, a Hackintosh could be the best thing: have the MacOS software that I like, and dual boot Windows, so it can game. That would be pretty expensive at the moment considering the Graphics card market. That leaves a laptop. All it needs to do is run MS Office, so that shouldn't be hard to find.

Ableton and FL is an industry wide standard so knowing how to use them is pretty good idea if you focus on electronic music. Im more of an FL girl myself, but Ableton is still a good stuff. For hackintosh, it is indeed pretty meh, to downright rubbish depending on how you configure it (the only way really is Intel-Radeon) and i wouldnt daily drive em myself. For icloud, you can transition to using Google Drive's new desktop app for windows to connect your desktop, laptop, and phone to a small shared storage. For laptop similar to macbooks, there's not many that i would daily drive in PC side besized the Zenbook and Vivobook lineup of Asus. Those are pretty much a laptop masterclass with how they built it.

 

Do be noted that, moving away to Apple is not silver bullet of privacy. By moving to Android-Windows solution, youre subjecting yourself to 2 major company instead of 1, Microsoft and Google. Google in particular of course have their AdSense which pretty much means if youre not doing the steps necessary to limit their data on you, those datas are pretty much gonna be pried by advertisers. For me, i would wait until CSAM public rollout to see if it is actually pretty good at evading false detection, or if its utterly unusable. But hey, its the game of "lesser of the evil" nowadays.

 

ps: consider Type-C hubs in general for both laptops and phones. Type-A is just super outdated compared to Type-C and youll see less and less of them on the market so getting a way to adapt them in a fancy daily driveable way is a good idea. And also Headphone DAC&Amp.

[dizmo]

If you depend on your PC for your living (Mac, WHY) then I certainly wouldn't use a Hackintosh as a replacement. You should be aiming for something reliable.

I also don't think you'll really get around most of the things they're cutting out; most phones are ditching the headphone jack, USB-A is starting to reach the point where it's not necessary on most devices, at least mobile ones. Moving away from an iPhone would give you more options, but it's only a matter of time before they all ditch old standards. I'd honestly just look into a desktop dock like CalDigit TS3Plus for connecting your USB A stuff. Macs aren't made for gaming. They've made it clear they have no desire to invest or support it in any large degree.

[Chris Pratt]

9 minutes ago, SorryClaire said:

Ableton and FL is an industry wide standard so knowing how to use them is pretty good idea if you focus on electronic music. Im more of an FL girl myself, but Ableton is still a good stuff. For hackintosh, it is indeed pretty meh, to downright rubbish depending on how you configure it (the only way really is Intel-Radeon) and i wouldnt daily drive em myself. For icloud, you can transition to using Google Drive's new desktop app for windows to connect your desktop, laptop, and phone to a small shared storage. For laptop similar to macbooks, there's not many that i would daily drive in PC side besized the Zenbook and Vivobook lineup of Asus. Those are pretty much a laptop masterclass with how they built it.

 

Do be noted that, moving away to Apple is not silver bullet of privacy. By moving to Android-Windows solution, youre subjecting yourself to 2 major company instead of 1, Microsoft and Google. Google in particular of course have their AdSense which pretty much means if youre not doing the steps necessary to limit their data on you, those datas are pretty much gonna be pried by advertisers. For me, i would wait until CSAM public rollout to see if it is actually pretty good at evading false detection, or if its utterly unusable. But hey, its the game of "lesser of the evil" nowadays.

Well, don't kid yourself about privacy either way. Apple didn't suddenly go from privacy focused to not. Any company is going to use any info they can get on you internally. All "privacy" really means is that they're not necessarily sharing it with other third parties. In that respect, Microsoft and Google are no worse. The tracking Google does, for example, is all anonymized. In fact, in GA4, they're going so far as to kill your account if they find you're collecting PII. Things like retargeting can feel disturbing, but the companies serving you ads don't actually know anything about you. You're just falling in a demographic that they're targeting.

 

Long and short, the paranoia around privacy has frankly gotten out of hand, anyways, but the Apple of before was no saint. If you thought they were, or were somehow even better than a Google or a Microsoft, I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.

[Joshua5684]

12 minutes ago, SorryClaire said:

Ableton and FL is an industry wide standard so knowing how to use them is pretty good idea if you focus on electronic music.

I'm not a professional. I use the free GarageBand for a reason. That being said if you have to buy a Mac to use it, is it really free? Considering the price of Ableton and FL studio, it might be more cost-effective to keep using GB on Mac.

12 minutes ago, SorryClaire said:

For icloud, you can transition to using Google Drive's new desktop app for windows to connect your desktop, laptop, and phone to a small shared storage.

I was referring to the call and text forwarding feature of iCloud. I could ditch iCloud drive in a heartbeat.

 

17 minutes ago, SorryClaire said:

Do be noted that, moving away to Apple is not silver bullet of privacy.

Privacy, itself is not such a big deal. It's more of the fact that Apple has proven to me to be either completely incompetent, or pure evil. I know Google is no better for privacy, but at least they don't tout themselves as being pro-privacy.

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

43 minutes ago, Joshua5684 said:

Introduction I'm getting fed up with Apple. Among them removing features for no good reason (headphone jack on iPhone, USB-A MacBook, microphone passthrough on the headphone jack with anything other than EarPods, and many more...

It's been years since those things have been a thing... at this point, I wouldn't consider those valid arguments. If you didn't like them, you would've quit Apple years ago, not now, many years later. Also I don't get the microphone passthrough thing. My "AKG tuned" earbuds that came with a Galaxy S8 from work function perfectly with my 6s... until the cable died on those buds. 

[captain_to_fire]

50 minutes ago, Joshua5684 said:

I'm personally interested in the idea of a Hackintosh, but I know compatibility can be a crapshoot. Though, if iCloud sets up correctly, a Hackintosh could be the best thing: have the MacOS software that I like, and dual boot Windows, so it can game.

If you're gonna Hackintosh now is probably the right time as Apple is axing support for Intel chips and x86 in a few years. Tbh I give Intel support for at least 5-7 years. Right now, no x86 chip can match the power efficiency of Apple Silicon.

 

50 minutes ago, Joshua5684 said:

All it needs to do is run MS Office, so that shouldn't be hard to find.

If you ask me, iWork + iCloud is a cost effective solution for a productivity suite compared to Office 365. As long as you use an iOS device or a Mac, iWork remains free and fully functional. If you don't want to use iCloud syncing, you can always store your files locally. Office 365 doesn't have any free tier. One must pay for the M365 Personal or Family plan.

50 minutes ago, Joshua5684 said:

their stance and actions against repair, and now them changing their mind about customer privacy in light of their new on-device image hashing, I'm forced to wonder if there's any reason for me to stay in the ecosystem.

Tbh I was in the same when the CSAM detection in Apple devices was announced. But since it's not yet rolled out, I personally would wait for it to be mature before I give judgement and move back to Android. While it is not their first privacy fiasco, I'd say that iOS and macOS are still the lesser of the three evils compared to Google and Microsoft when it comes to privacy.

• Every Android phone with Play Services will always ping and connect to Google servers especially when an app is downloaded. Not to mention, Google is an advertising company with AdSense.
• You still can't turn off telemetry collection for both Windows 10 Home and Pro. You can on macOS and iOS.
• CSAM detection was done by both Google and Microsoft, almost a decade ago before Apple.
• Facebook has a more invasive CSAM and revenge porn detection.
• Apple's main source of revenue is by selling devices and services. Google on the other hand makes most of their money from advertising.

 

 

[Joshua5684]

1 minute ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

If you didn't like them, you would've quit Apple years ago, not now, many years later.

Well, I haven't bought an Apple product since my iPhone, so one might say I quit then.

 

2 minutes ago, BlueChinchillaEatingDorito said:

Also I don't get the microphone passthrough thing. My "AKG tuned" earbuds that came with a Galaxy S8 from work function perfectly with my 6s... until the cable died on those buds. 

Maybe it's only a Mac thing, but that brings up another question: why do physically identical components (headphone jack on Mac and iPhone) function differently? It's more Apple nonsense.

[Joshua5684]

4 minutes ago, captain_to_fire said:

If you ask me, iWork + iCloud is a cost effective solution for a productivity suite compared to Office 365. As long as you use an iOS device or a Mac, iWork remains free and fully functional. If you don't want to use iCloud syncing, you can always store your files locally. Office 365 doesn't have any free tier. One must pay for the M365 Personal or Family plan.

My school provides us with a 365 subscription, and we are required to hand in assignments in the associated formats. iWork would not suffice.

[Video Beagle]

If you're wanting to leave Apple for moral reasons, then leave Apple. Saying you're leaving Apple to set up a Hackintosh just makes you a thief and a hypocrite.

[RejZoR]

5 hours ago, Chris Pratt said:

Well, don't kid yourself about privacy either way. Apple didn't suddenly go from privacy focused to not. Any company is going to use any info they can get on you internally. All "privacy" really means is that they're not necessarily sharing it with other third parties. In that respect, Microsoft and Google are no worse. The tracking Google does, for example, is all anonymized. In fact, in GA4, they're going so far as to kill your account if they find you're collecting PII. Things like retargeting can feel disturbing, but the companies serving you ads don't actually know anything about you. You're just falling in a demographic that they're targeting.

 

Long and short, the paranoia around privacy has frankly gotten out of hand, anyways, but the Apple of before was no saint. If you thought they were, or were somehow even better than a Google or a Microsoft, I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you.

It's so anonymized Google's employee stalked a woman from data they are collecting. So much for "we're private because we do it internally only". It's also funny everyone always defends and forgives Google with "they anonymize it" or whatever excuse, but when avast! was sharing data and they too anonymized it, everyone was outraged beyond any levels of rage Google ever received and all it was was a lot of "maybes" and none of solid evidence they actually properly cocked it up. It's annoying when people can't seem to be f**king consistent.

 

It's also good to see Apple is getting the heat recently for image scanning/hashing thing, which means people don't just gobble up Apple privacy schtick blindly. I mean it's great that they go in that direction, but sometimes you still have to slap them and remind them what they are doing or not doing.

[Video Beagle]

5 hours ago, Joshua5684 said:

Well, I haven't bought an Apple product since my iPhone, so one might say I quit then.

 

Maybe it's only a Mac thing, but that brings up another question: why do physically identical components (headphone jack on Mac and iPhone) function differently? It's more Apple nonsense.

 

Following the links, your actual question is "why isn't a little known or used feature  from 10 years ago on current devices?"

 

1) Just because there's the same physical connector...in this case a 3.5mm audio port, doesn't mean the interior circuitry is the same.

2) Just because a feature existed 10 years ago...in this case the ability on some macbooks to flip the port from output to input...doesn't mean it's necessary or viable today.

[Joshua5684]

2 hours ago, Video Beagle said:

If you're wanting to leave Apple for moral reasons, then leave Apple. Saying you're leaving Apple to set up a Hackintosh just makes you a thief and a hypocrite.

I believe I can have separate opinions on Apple, the company, Apple, the hardware, and Apple, the software. The company is what I have most problem with. The hardware is mediocre, and the software is great. If I want to separate myself from Apple, the company, all I need to do is stop giving them money. I don't see anything wrong with continuing to use their products.

Apple list versions of MacOS to download on their website. What's wrong with me using it... well the answer is that I'm violating their TOS. Here's why I don't care. One of the pillars of Right to Repair is requiring manufactures to sell parts to consumers, so they don't have a monopoly on repair. I think Apple should sell MacOS licenses à la carte, because they currently have a monopoly on MacOS distribution. You know, it's actually more similar to the Epic-Apple lawsuit. Instead of the app store being the monopoly, it's the whole OS. Also, I don't think a manufacturer or developer has the right to tell me how to use their product, but they do have the right to refuse to help me if I use it improperly. That's a risk I'm willing to take.

Perhaps I am a thief, but this thief is willing to pay; they just aren't willing to sell.

[Joshua5684]

3 hours ago, Video Beagle said:

 

Following the links, your actual question is "why isn't a little known or used feature  from 10 years ago on current devices?"

 

1) Just because there's the same physical connector...in this case a 3.5mm audio port, doesn't mean the interior circuitry is the same.

2) Just because a feature existed 10 years ago...in this case the ability on some macbooks to flip the port from output to input...doesn't mean it's necessary or viable today.

The feature became disabled in a software update. I don't remember downloading a hardware update so the circuitry is the same. Regardless of how niche the feature is, they spent time and money to harm the consumer. Now, maybe there's a legitimate reason why they couldn't make it work in new versions of MacOS, but that's another thing I don't like about Apple, the company. They'd never fully explain why they'd do such a thing. They removed the headphone jack because of "bravery." The real explanation is greed; they just won't admit it. Do you think the coincidence of the headphone jack removal and the release of AirPods wasn't planned? Of course it was. That kind of behaviour (removing a cheap feature to sell a more expensive one) is an indication of a monopoly.

Are you arguing in support of planned obsolescence?

[Ravendarat]

Hackintosh is almost never the answer. For most people the frustration of trying to get it to run and behave properly is never worth it. If you want to run the apple OS stay with apple.

[Ravendarat]

1 minute ago, Joshua5684 said:

The feature became disabled in a software update. I don't remember downloading a hardware update so the circuitry is the same. Regardless of how niche the feature is, they spent time and money to harm the consumer. Now, maybe there's a legitimate reason why they couldn't make it work in new versions of MacOS, but that's another thing I don't like about Apple, the company. They'd never fully explain why they'd do such a thing. They removed the headphone jack because of "bravery." The real explanation is greed; they just won't admit it. Do you think the coincidence of the headphone jack removal and the release of AirPods wasn't planned? Of course it was. That kind of behaviour (removing a cheap feature to sell a more expensive one) is an indication of a monopoly.

Are you arguing in support of planned obsolescence?

The reason they removed the jack was also for increased water proofing was it not? I thought I remembered that was a "selling point" they used, one less point of entry. And yea while its annoying to not have the headphone jack they really were just ahead of the curve on that one. More and more manufactures are removing the jack and customers have just adapted to it, and MANY outside of the hardcore  people you see on message boards like this just dont care.

[aisle9]

A Hackintosh isn't a great option for a daily driver. You've got zero guarantees that everything will play nice, and zero support if it doesn't. If you're doing it on a well-known and well-documented laptop, like the typical ThinkPad X250 setup, you're probably fine and have decent troubleshooting guides out there if not. If you do it on custom desktop hardware, it will either set up like a dream and run forever, or set up like a turd and make you question your decisions in life. Strictly imo, but if this is going to be your main PC, I would probably just bite the bullet and either convert to PC or get a Mac desktop.

[BlueChinchillaEatingDorito]

1 hour ago, Ravendarat said:

The reason they removed the jack was also for increased water proofing was it not? I thought I remembered that was a "selling point" they used, one less point of entry. And yea while its annoying to not have the headphone jack they really were just ahead of the curve on that one. More and more manufactures are removing the jack and customers have just adapted to it, and MANY outside of the hardcore  people you see on message boards like this just dont care.

Granted you could possibly make the argument it was more of a way to bolster sales of AirPods that were on the horizon. I don't think many bought into their explanation considering devices like the Xperia M4 Aqua were already boasting impressive IP ratings while maintaining the headphone jack. 

 

It makes more sense now that Bluetooth headphones are cheaper and much better in terms of sound quality and reliability than they were 4 years ago when Apple made that controversial move. 

[Dutch_Master]

Ima gonna throwa spanna in da works 'ere

 

Use Linux. Early development on making it run on Apple silicon, but the proof of concept is already out there. Still in violation of the TOS Apple imposes on you. But who cares anyway

 

Having said that, your i5 system is perfectly capable of running a decent/recent Linux distro, like Debian, Mint or Pop!_OS, especially if you upgrade cheaply with extra RAM and/or storage. True, it'll struggle with modern AAA titles, but for Proton (and similar) it'll be fine until you have the budget to upgrade the hardware to the upcoming Zen4 with DDR5 platform. Alternatively, get an AMD 5800X CPU, an B550 mainboard, 2x8 or better 16 GB RAM sticks and have MacOS running in a VM-ed Hackintosh   Your 1050 may struggle though, so an upgrade there would be advisable. The midrange AMD 6000 series cards are a decent enough value, if you can get one at MSRP or less.

[WhitetailAni]

10 hours ago, SorryClaire said:

to downright rubbish depending on how you configure it (the only way really is Intel-Radeon)

Actually, no. You can use AMD CPUs with Hackintoshing too - it's about the same difficulty as using an Intel CPU. GPUs aren't much trouble as long as they're supported (there's some weirdness with R9 2xx/3xx but other than that it's plug'n'play as long as you use the correct version of macOS), and they're quite stable once they're set up.

I set up the first half using this guide:
https://manjaro.site/step-by-step-to-install-macos-big-sur-hackintosh-on-amd-ryzen-system-using-opencore-0-6-3/
And then did some Googling and figuring things out myself for the other half.

 

If you need to use macOS for work though don't Hackintosh. It took me a solid week of tinkering to get it working correctly, but after that it was smooth sailing.

[Joshua5684]

49 minutes ago, Dutch_Master said:

Use Linux.

I have thought of that, but what problem does that solve? I have no problem with Windows. The only reason I want to get rid of my PC is to clean up my desk.

I think the biggest issue I have is that I want to use Apple software without giving money to Apple. I might be able to get a used M1 MBA if If-Then 3 is what happens.

[Joshua5684]

47 minutes ago, FakeKGB said:

If you need to use macOS for work though don't Hackintosh. It took me a solid week of tinkering to get it working correctly, but after that it was smooth sailing.

Like I said, I'm not a professional. I wouldn't mind spending that much time getting it to work if I'm making major efficiencies in my computing department.

[WhitetailAni]

Just now, Joshua5684 said:

Like I said, I'm not a professional. I wouldn't mind spending that much time getting it to work if I'm making major efficiencies in my computing department.

You can run it, but the 1050 Ti you have limits you to 10.13.6 High Sierra maximum.

[Joshua5684]

Just now, FakeKGB said:

You can run it, but the 1050 Ti you have limits you to 10.13.6 High Sierra maximum.

Great idea! I should investigate free options before I make big decisions, especially purchases. I presumed I'd have to build a whole new system, or at least get a new graphics card. I thought it only works with AMD GCs.

[WhitetailAni]

Just now, Joshua5684 said:

I thought it only works with AMD GCs.

That's the general rule, but Apple supports NVidia GPUs based on Maxwell and Pascal up to 10.13.6 and Kepler GPUs up to macOS 12. They used some mobile Kepler GPUs in their iMacs and never took out the support for reasons I don't fully understand.
I'm not complaining though because it means I can use NVidia cards for Windows and run macOS on the same system.