Should you Even CONSIDER an Intel Laptop? - HP Envy x360

[Required]

polished

[Granular]

That screen glare is abominable.

[tswaehn]

On 7/12/2020 at 6:00 PM, AlexTheGreatish said:

 

AMD Ryzen 4000 mobile processors are so good you'll skip the Intel flagship device. The HP Envy x360 is a real beast for it's size and price.

I am trying to install Linux on the Envy x360. The current installation of Manjaro is running. However I am more a Debian guy. So I tried to the current bullseye alpha 2 release. I also installed the non-free firmware. Still there seems to be an issue with the amd driver. It looks like I have to live with Manjaro or go back to windows.

 

Just wondering if there is any idea on how to go with Debian?

 

[tswaehn]

7 hours ago, Nauzhror said:

There are certainly reasons to consider Intel laptops. I'm typing on one right now, which will outperform ANY AMD laptop in pretty much every game, and will outperform the 4800H in cpu-intensive tasks as well as give the 4900H models a run for their money. My i7-10875H is very hot, but it is also very fast. 

 

 

But more importantly, this is my laptop:

 

 

No Ryzen machine is even coming close to that.

 

The top score from a Ryzen equipped laptop is this:

 

My cpu score wins, my Graphics score wins by a landslide. 

 

the Ryzen models scores 47.93 fps in graphics test 1, 42.02 in the second test, and 31.19 in the cpu test.

Meanwhile my intel laptop scores 61.51 fps, 53.76 fps, and 31.79 fps.

That 1.92% lead on the cpu test is not a reason to pick Intel over AMD, the 28.33% and 27.94% leads in the graphics results though are.

 

All the benchmark comparisons online showing the 4800H dominating the i7-10875H are also misleading, because a laptop with decent cooling and that provides enough wattage can get a lot of performance out of the i7. I see benchmarks of people getting 3500 Cinebench 20 on it frequently, mine consistently scores over 4,000. It also scores 1730 on Cinebench R15, and I've seen benchmarks showing much lower scores for it there as well (frequently around 1550).

https://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Ryzen-7-4700U-Laptop-Processor-Benchmarks-and-Specs.449976.0.html

 

[Shatrix]

16 hours ago, Nauzhror said:

There are certainly reasons to consider Intel laptops. I'm typing on one right now, which will outperform ANY AMD laptop in pretty much every game, and will outperform the 4800H in cpu-intensive tasks as well as give the 4900H models a run for their money. My i7-10875H is very hot, but it is also very fast. 

 

 

But more importantly, this is my laptop:

 

 

No Ryzen machine is even coming close to that.

 

The top score from a Ryzen equipped laptop is this:

 

My cpu score wins, my Graphics score wins by a landslide. 

 

the Ryzen models scores 47.93 fps in graphics test 1, 42.02 in the second test, and 31.19 in the cpu test.

Meanwhile my intel laptop scores 61.51 fps, 53.76 fps, and 31.79 fps.

That 1.92% lead on the cpu test is not a reason to pick Intel over AMD, the 28.33% and 27.94% leads in the graphics results though are.

 

All the benchmark comparisons online showing the 4800H dominating the i7-10875H are also misleading, because a laptop with decent cooling and that provides enough wattage can get a lot of performance out of the i7. I see benchmarks of people getting 3500 Cinebench 20 on it frequently, mine consistently scores over 4,000. It also scores 1730 on Cinebench R15, and I've seen benchmarks showing much lower scores for it there as well (frequently around 1550).

I don't know which laptop you have, but I can tell you that even the U version of AMD new 4000 series is outperforming all Intel chips in every single test!

So I won't talk about the H-series high-end chips.

 

I have the Envyx360 laptop, and here's a Geekbench comparison between it & the one you mentioned 10875H in GIGABYTE AORUS 15G

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2914536?baseline=2744936

 

Or the DELL XPS 17"

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2912218?baseline=2744936

 

Or the Razer Blade 15" Studio

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2903125?baseline=2744936

 

All those laptops cost more than 2000$ and mine is only 1000$

 

Also check this one, results are from more than 250 thousands users

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-8750H-vs-AMD-Ryzen-7-4700U/m470418vsm1105478

 

So imagine that the Envy is smaller (13"), lighter, thinner, no big cooling inside, and the most important it needs only 15W not 45W like yours, and it has only 8 threads, and the laptops cost less than 1000$ and the scores are like this!

I guess you know that all laptops with 10875H is starting at 2000$

 

(I tried to search for the highest scores from other laptops)

 

HP Envy x360 13" Ryzen 7 4700U (8 Threads, 15W)

Single: 1230

Multi: 6115

 

GIGABYTE AORUS 15" i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1212

Multi: 7474

 

Dell Inc. XPS 17 9700 i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1282

Multi: 7741

 

Razer Blade 15 Studio Edition i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1291

Multi: 7294

 

We can also talk about the new integrated graphics in this chip, as I can even play all the games, yes at low settings and not even close to the dedicated graphics experience, but with a 16mm 1.4KG 13 inches laptop, I can live with that  

 

So yeah, AMD is outperforming Intel in the overall experience if you consider every single point in your comparisons.

[Nauzhror]

17 hours ago, Shatrix said:

I don't know which laptop you have, but I can tell you that even the U version of AMD new 4000 series is outperforming all Intel chips in every single test!

So I won't talk about the H-series high-end chips.

 

I have the Envyx360 laptop, and here's a Geekbench comparison between it & the one you mentioned 10875H in GIGABYTE AORUS 15G

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2914536?baseline=2744936

 

Or the DELL XPS 17"

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2912218?baseline=2744936

 

Or the Razer Blade 15" Studio

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2903125?baseline=2744936

 

All those laptops cost more than 2000$ and mine is only 1000$

 

Also check this one, results are from more than 250 thousands users

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i7-8750H-vs-AMD-Ryzen-7-4700U/m470418vsm1105478

 

So imagine that the Envy is smaller (13"), lighter, thinner, no big cooling inside, and the most important it needs only 15W not 45W like yours, and it has only 8 threads, and the laptops cost less than 1000$ and the scores are like this!

I guess you know that all laptops with 10875H is starting at 2000$

 

(I tried to search for the highest scores from other laptops)

 

HP Envy x360 13" Ryzen 7 4700U (8 Threads, 15W)

Single: 1230

Multi: 6115

 

GIGABYTE AORUS 15" i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1212

Multi: 7474

 

Dell Inc. XPS 17 9700 i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1282

Multi: 7741

 

Razer Blade 15 Studio Edition i7-10875H (16 Threads, 45W)

Single: 1291

Multi: 7294

 

We can also talk about the new integrated graphics in this chip, as I can even play all the games, yes at low settings and not even close to the dedicated graphics experience, but with a 16mm 1.4KG 13 inches laptop, I can live with that  

 

So yeah, AMD is outperforming Intel in the overall experience if you consider every single point in your comparisons.

You claim that the U chips beat every intel chip on every test, you then post results that disprove that statement.

 

The Gigabyte you linked scored 1212/7474, as opposed to 1230/6115. The 10875H won there in multi-threaded, it only lost in single-threaded.

 

Also, I ran the test on my laptop just now to see how it performs, it scored 1290/8282. It beat your Envy in both single-core and multi-core.

 

"I guess you know that all laptops with 10875H is starting at 2000$"

 

That is also false.

I can buy a $1,500 laptop with a i7-10875H and a RTX 2070 Super. It's the 15.6" version of the laptop I own.

 

Here: https://www.gentechpc.com/product-p/sager-np8358f2-s.htm $1,473.43 and has no tax, equivalent to a $1,390 laptop that has tax here.

This is my laptop: https://www.gentechpc.com/product-p/sager-np8378f2-s.htm

 

This is my Geekbench result: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/2926798

This is a comparison link of it vs the Envy: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2926798?baseline=2744936

 

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=✓&q=4800h

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=✓&q=4900h

 

0 4800H's on the first page beat my multi-core score, or single-core score.

0 4900H's beat my single-core score either, but one beats my multi-core.

 

So, yes, by and large I would claim my laptop's i7 is faster than AMD's mobile CPU offerings.

[KaitouX]

42 minutes ago, Nauzhror said:

 

https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/amd-ryzen-9-4900hs

vs

https://browser.geekbench.com/processors/intel-core-i7-10875h

so about the same score on average.

 

Also from the TechSpot(HardwareUnboxed) review:

Spoiler

 

For the most part the AMD CPU is faster while using less power. Intel performance comes in with the higher power consumption mainly during the boost period, which is also probably the reason why AMD is so dominant in longer workloads.

[Shatrix]

13 hours ago, Nauzhror said:

You claim that the U chips beat every intel chip on every test, you then post results that disprove that statement.

 

The Gigabyte you linked scored 1212/7474, as opposed to 1230/6115. The 10875H won there in multi-threaded, it only lost in single-threaded.

 

Also, I ran the test on my laptop just now to see how it performs, it scored 1290/8282. It beat your Envy in both single-core and multi-core.

 

"I guess you know that all laptops with 10875H is starting at 2000$"

 

That is also false.

I can buy a $1,500 laptop with a i7-10875H and a RTX 2070 Super. It's the 15.6" version of the laptop I own.

 

Here: https://www.gentechpc.com/product-p/sager-np8358f2-s.htm $1,473.43 and has no tax, equivalent to a $1,390 laptop that has tax here.

This is my laptop: https://www.gentechpc.com/product-p/sager-np8378f2-s.htm

 

This is my Geekbench result: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/2926798

This is a comparison link of it vs the Envy: https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2926798?baseline=2744936

 

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=✓&q=4800h

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?utf8=✓&q=4900h

 

0 4800H's on the first page beat my multi-core score, or single-core score.

0 4900H's beat my single-core score either, but one beats my multi-core.

 

So, yes, by and large I would claim my laptop's i7 is faster than AMD's mobile CPU offerings.

I think you forgot other important parameters I mentioned in my first comment

I was talking about a 15W chip vs 45W chip, plus the laptop is only 13" and 16mm height, so it's not even close to the much power and cooling needed to operate the i7 CPU!

So I was not "comparing" literally, but just showing you that even the U variant is much much efficient and powerful in the overall tests (performance+power consumption + heating + price + ....)

 

Got it?

 

You can go and check for the Intel CPU in the same category like the Ryzen 7 4700U, it's i7-1065G7 , and I can tell you it's joke

 

I'll give you an example, the Acer Swift 3 14" laptop, they have the same laptop with same specs but in 2 versions, one with Ryzen 5 4500U and another one with Intel i7-1065G7

 

These prices from Germany

4500U , 680€

https://www.notebooksbilliger.de/acer+swift+3+sf314+42+r4a0+662434

1065G7 , 970€

https://www.notebooksbilliger.de/acer+swift+3+sf314+57+77mu+618369

 

Both with same body, same display, same RAM 16G, and remember that the laptop itself is not great it's a cheap one, but we have 200€ difference just because they used the great i7 chip from Intel 

 

Check the difference and tell me if I'm wrong (I tried to find the highest scores for both chips from same laptop)?

https://browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/compare/2904779?baseline=2867783

So why would I get the Intel one if I'm looking for an ultrabook like this?!

 

[Nauzhror]

I never once suggested you should buy a laptop with a i7-1065G7, nor have I stated that I'd buy one with a i7-10875H that didn't also have a powerful discrete GPU. I'm not really sure why you're making a strawman argument and trying to get me to defend a stance I never held.

 

AMD CPU's are great, I've never suggested otherwise, I merely said there are reasons to consider Intel CPU's, and that the maximum potential of the Intel CPU's aren't being shown fairly in most online comparisons. ie. Plenty of sites suggest the 10875H scores 3500 on Cinebench 20, and some might, but mine also scores over 4400, and no sites are showing such results.

[zer0.k]

Does anyone know what is the song used at around the 7 minute mark?

[Pixel5]

do we have any info on how RAM speeds influence GPU and CPU performance here?

would be really interested in that thing to take on the go and maybe for some light gaming but it just lacks a tad of performance for some games.

[josiahshank16]

Anybody else slightly nervous to buy this because the price of the exact model he suggests just dropped like $150???
https://www.amazon.com/HP-ENVY-Touchscreen-Processor-Nightfall/dp/B08966H6XJ