Apple Aims to Sell Macs With Its Own Chips Starting in 2021

[hishnash]

6 hours ago, Arika S said:

 I think you've missed the point I was making. A vertical monopoly, which Apple is desperately trying to become, means they are not held accountable to anyone but themselves, giving them full control over everything they do. If Apple tried to do something Intel/AMD/any other supplier didn't like, they could cut supply per what ever contract terms were agreed to. A vertical monopoly is control over every stage if production, pricing can be what ever they like because there is no threat to their supply chain. 

 

A monopoly in any form means consumers lose. 

but apple useing ARM chips means they depend on ARM and TSMC. That is more people to hold them in check than intel.

[RejZoR]

1 hour ago, hishnash said:

but apple useing ARM chips means they depend on ARM and TSMC. That is more people to hold them in check than intel.

But also broadens your supply chain. With Intel they need to rely on Intel. And even if we look x86 globally, it's Intel and AMD. I don't even count VIA...

 

As for ARM, a lot of them are making ARM chips. Hell, even Apple themselves. We're talking design. Foundries "forging" these chips are still just few, but aren't limited to absurd licensing terms like x86 and Intel has. You just buy license from ARM and that's that. They don't really care for as long as it sells.

[GoodBytes]

8 hours ago, mr moose said:

I was thinking about those who use mac for coding and the like,  they use mac for that, then boot to windows for testing and implementation. 

Typically, dev uses MacOS, because they need Linux... well they get Unix under Mac, but close enough. They need it to do the server back-end development, but want to avoid being in a Linux environment.

 

Another factor, is that the company looks "trendy" by having it using Apple computers than a generic plastic box from a non-name manufcature that makes Linux powered system. Yes, image counts. Now yes, Dell, HP, and Lenovo makes (or made) Ubuntu/RedHat powered Linux laptops and desktops business systems, but the other problem is IT support. It is difficult to get Linux expertise on hand in IT to offer support for the OS. Those who know Linux, tend to prefer a job in operations (as in maintaining and supporting company servers) or better yet, be in DevOps team, then doing IT support of employee computers.

 

That is why Microsoft is putting a lot of effort in WSL (And also implemented OpenSSH Client and Server under Windows 10. Proper OpenSSH, same one as Linux, with the same commands and behaviors), they really want to stop this, and have companies continue to pick Windows powered systems (which they usually prefer over Macs, including most devs). The problem is that:

• WSL is still new and many people don't know about it, or they want to wait and see its reliability and limitations.
• WSL really started to be quite good with WSL2 that is not yet released. It will come with the delayed April Update due to the current situation (probably be called May Update and probably be actually released to all in June/July, if it were my guess. We will see.)
• Windows Terminal, the project that Microsoft is working on to make a new command line terminal interface of this area, is doing great progress, but is far from complete. It has yet to reach version 1.0. Devs wants a good terminal. They have that on Mac, not under Windows. I mean you can use it now, its solid, but still in early development to be considered as a reliable option.

Some good news:

• WSL has started to get interests from Linux based distros, and actually put effort in delivering updates and properly supporting it.
• Visual Studio Code is a huge hit with developers. It is now part of the top most used IDEs availible.

 

[kpluck]

14 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

A broken analogue clock is only right twice a day.

 

Every year, the same rumor... well, since Apple was making its own CPUs. I guess one day it will be correct.

Every time I have seen this rumor it has been for a date in the future that has not occurred yet so it would be more correct to say that one day these rumors may be proven wrong.

 

-kp

[SpaceGhostC2C]

7 hours ago, hishnash said:

 

Vertical would be if apple purchased ARM outright and purchased TSMC.

Well, that would be even further vertical integration (design+manufacturing of CPUs instead of just design). Doesn't change that every time you move one link of the chain in-house it's vertical integration. They don't own ARM nor x86 so there's no difference there. And how many does our can do products with the same architecture has nothing to do work vertical integration, don't know why you keep bringing that up. 

 

 

7 hours ago, hishnash said:

 

 

[Zodiark1593]

8 hours ago, hishnash said:

 

Apple don't Make there CPU they buy the license from ARM (who designed most of the chip) then yes apple customise it, they then pay TSMC to make them. Compared to paying intel, (who desenge 100% and make in house) moving to ARM is increasing the number of third parties that apple depends upon.
 

Not entirely true. Apple licenses the ISA to build an ARM compatible cpu. The cores are fully custom from the ground up. 
 

ARM can and does license cores they design themselves, and even offers limited customization on their stock cores. They also offer a license to use the ISA for a licensee to build an ARM compatible core from the ground up. Apple opts for the latter. Effectively, the cores are fully Apple designed that happen to be compatible with the ARM ISA.  
 

Qualcomm’s Scorpion, Krait, og Kryo (SD820 and 821)and Samsung’s M series of cores were also fully custom. Though these two companies would later chose to switch to ARMs stock cores. 

[Guest]

23 hours ago, mrchow19910319 said:

Hopefully hackintoshing won’t go the way of jailbreaking, which is terrible and most of it’s behind a paywall now. 

[hishnash]

9 hours ago, GoodBytes said:

Yes, image counts. Now yes, Dell, HP, and Lenovo makes (or made) Ubuntu/RedHat powered Linux laptops and desktops business systems, but the other problem is IT support. It is difficult to get Linux expertise on hand in IT to offer support for the OS. 

Yer there was a good period of few years back when Dell (and some other) put effort into getting good linux support but that has worn out it seems. Linux on laptops is the biggest issue, things like GPU switching, good wifi drivers seem to be quite flaky, especially if you go with a recently released device, some of this is that it takes some time for changes made to mainline kernel to filter into distros stable releases so even if intel provide support at release time for a new iGPU and or/wifi chip the chances are *unless you want to use an custom kernel version* you need to wait 6 to 12 months at least for that to hit your linux distro so buying a new laptop can be very painful. 

The other issue with using linux at work  is the corporate software, like microsoft not providing their office suit for linux, so when you need to collaborate with others you find all sorts of pain points. Sure there are ways to get around this but it does all build up and become a big pain. 

[Someone1828]

s

[mrchow19910319]

7 hours ago, RorzNZ said:

Hopefully hackintoshing won’t go the way of jailbreaking, which is terrible and most of it’s behind a paywall now. 

yeah Jailbreak kind of sucks, for a long time now. 

 

Also those devs have to charge people cos otherwise how they gonna keep doing what they do.. 

[hishnash]

1 hour ago, mrchow19910319 said:

Also those devs have to charge people cos otherwise how they gonna keep doing what they do.. 

Yes, you need to pay people for there work, stop expecting to get everything for free, if you want stuff for free then expect them to find `other` ways to make money.

In the case of jailbreaking they could make lots of money introducing malware into the jailbreak so be happy they have found another way to put bread on the table.