Static questions

[NimbusWorld]

I’m going to build a pc soon and was wondering if the old touch something metal before you move works on carpet flooring?

 

[Levent]

Yes, but you really should avoid building your computer on top materials like carpet.

[LogicalDrm]

Do it in kitchen instead. Anything is better than carpet floors.

[RejZoR]

I've built bunch of systems and fiddled with mine for basically 2 decades and never took any precautions about static and never had issues. Yet everyone keep warning about it. Seems like a myth to me... From my experience, things just aren't that sensitive to static electricity as people make them appear...

[NineEyeRon]

It depends a lot on your room’s RH, in the UK we rarely have static issues unless your really trying for it.

 

I find just going barefoot on carpet helps a lot plus touching something metal at the start and every so often. Just choose the right location and be sensible.

 

Not had a single issue in over 10 years of tinkering and cleaning.

 

Best to be slightly cautious but not something to worry about enough to stop you going ahead with a build.

[Bombastinator]

I’ve always suspected this is one of those “almost never a problem unless it is” problems. Rarely ever happens, but if it ever does, wow!  It probably happened at least once or it wouldn’t be a thing.  It might be even less of a thing now than it was, but it’s so very little trouble.  If it’s become a myth it’s a pretty harmless one.  Static does have the power to melt cpu traces much larger than those currently used.  Static can also jump.  There might be other bits that aren’t mentioned like you have to also be touching a pin or something.  I don’t know.  Touching your PSU occasionally just doesn’t seem like that big a bother.

[mariushm]

Touch something that's GROUNDED to discharge static electricity from your body, before touching components. Just touching something metal isn't enough, if that metal something doesn't have a path to ground to discharge the static electricity.

The easiest is to plug the power supply in a grounded outlet using its cable, even if it's outside the case or without any modular cables plugged in. As soon as you connect it to a mains outlet, the exterior of the power supply case becomes grounded through the mains cable and touching any metal part of the psu case will discharge you. (try to touch metal, some paints can be insulators and not discharge you).

 

In my country, we use these outlets with exposed earthing pins, so I have a power strip on my desk and it's enough to just touch these ground contacts on the sides of each outlet to discharge myself - in other countries this may not be possible so next easiest thing is to just connect a psu and then touch the metal case:

 

 

You can charge with static electricity even if you're not working on carpet, it all depends on the clothes you're wearing and sometimes on the chair you're using - I've seen people charge up with static electricity from rubbing their feed or back on fake leather or synthetic strands in the seat cover.

Touch something grounded if you moved away from the desk, or before you touch any circuit board and you'll be fine.

 

Anyway, static electricity risks are somewhat exaggerated, modern components tend to have a lot of built in protections against ESD, but you should still be careful.

 

Whenever possible, hold motherboards or circuit boards by their edges or by plastic or metal bits (for example pci-e slots or cpu cooler once it's installed, or the metal bracket of the video card and pci-e power connectors. If you keep your fingers away from pins and edge connectors and chips on the boards (ex don't put your fingers on the circuit board), you minimize the risk of damage due to ESD.

 

[TetraSky]

Watch the latest POV build guide from Linus, he shows how to ground yourself with the PSU.

 

Honestly, if you really want to build a PC on carpet, I'd suggest wearing shoes or boots, preferably the kind that has a rubber sole, to prevent static from building up on your feet while moving on the carpet.

Do that while touching the PSU from times to time, especially before touching parts. You can wear an anti static bracelet around your ankle as well.

Ideally you'd want to build it in your kitchen (hopefully your kitchen doesn't have carpet floor... that'd be disgusting AF).

[mariushm]

13 minutes ago, TetraSky said:

Watch the latest POV build guide from Linus, he shows how to ground yourself with the PSU.

 

Honestly, he kinda did it badly.

The grill in front of the fan is not always metal, some power supplies use plastic grill.

Also, the grill is often painted, and I'm not sure the clamp bites hard enough to go through the paint. There's two problems: either the clamp bites hard enough and goes through the paint and you end up with ugly marks on the grill OR the paint is not conductive and the bracelet becomes pointless, not effective.

 

I would have tied the clamp/clip anywhere else except the grill, like let's say one of the honeycomb cutouts on the back, or I'd partially screw one screw that's normally used to lock the psu to a case, and use the clip to that screw.

 

 

[Tristerin]

I believe that components way back when were much more sensitive to this for such a "old wives tale" to still exist.  I can agree with others that perhaps its just not a problem till it is but...

 

I have moonwalked in wool socks on carpet while building PC's...I tinker with PC's every other day on average...on carpet.  My 2 copper coins.

[Yogi_DaBear221]

Just don't forget one of these 

 

But for serious nah as long as you touch something metal to be safe it really isn't an issue. You don't really need to worry about the Anti-Static bracelets, just touch something metal, ie the case itself, like @mariushm said the grill may not be the best bet but if you're worried about that touch like the inside of the case like the bottom or what have you and you'll be fine.

[TetraSky]

1 hour ago, mariushm said:

The grill in front of the fan is not always metal, some power supplies use plastic grill.

Wait, what kind of craptastic PSU have you seen that didn't have a metal grill? Genuinely curious here since I've literally never seen one that used plastic for the fan grill.
But I do agree that the paint on it might prevent conductivity, though it should still be good enough to dissipate strong static build up that would've damaged anything.

[RejZoR]

13 minutes ago, Erik Sieghart said:

Static electricity isn't a myth. It can and will damage your components. Just because it hasn't happened to you yet doesn't mean it won't, and to any one else.

Has anyone ever actually killed anything with static electricity?

[Bombastinator]

18 minutes ago, RejZoR said:

Has anyone ever actually killed anything with static electricity?

This I am interested in.  The problem is it could possibly be a lot like “has anyone ever been struck by lightning”.  Just because it’s really rare doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen.  What I wonder is if it’s something that used to happen a more but there was mitigation done and it became harder and required a longer string of stupid to make possible.  Even if all of the (hundereds? Thousands?, tens of thousands?) of people who visited this site said no, it wouldn’t mean it was impossible.

 

My attitude is it might not be an actual thing, at least anymore, but the steps that need to be taken are so small that it almost doesn’t matter.  Another is I remember static being much easier to produce when I was a kid.  Wear wool socks, shuffle on a wool carpet, zap someone.   Used to be a standard thing to do for a kid to try at least once.  I don’t see it so much anymore.  Maybe it’s just that there’s less wool carpet and It’s not that it can’t happen it just doesn’t happen nearly as often because there’s less wool socks and carpet around.

Our CPUs are being saved by scotch guard or something.

[mariushm]

Problem is that it's difficult to estimate how many things die due to ESD.

 

Imagine someone takes a motherboard out and zaps it by accident with static electricity ... he installs it in the computer and it doesn't start or some onboard chip doesn't work (sound or network for example).

 

The person will return the board as DOA (dead on arrival) or customer may take advantage of laws (at least in EU) which say anything ordered online can be returned within the first 10 working days or so without having to specify any reason.

It's difficult to determine that a component died due to ESD or for other reasons, when visually there's nothing you can see on the boards.

[Bombastinator]

2 hours ago, mariushm said:

Problem is that it's difficult to estimate how many things die due to ESD.

 

Imagine someone takes a motherboard out and zaps it by accident with static electricity ... he installs it in the computer and it doesn't start or some onboard chip doesn't work (sound or network for example).

 

The person will return the board as DOA (dead on arrival) or customer may take advantage of laws (at least in EU) which say anything ordered online can be returned within the first 10 working days or so without having to specify any reason.

It's difficult to determine that a component died due to ESD or for other reasons, when visually there's nothing you can see on the boards.

Makes me wonder if there’s a higher percentages of returns in Germany.  I remember seeing a real penchant for wool there.  Statistical analysis on this one might be interesting.  Where are dead board coming back from?

[tech.guru]

17 hours ago, RejZoR said:

Has anyone ever actually killed anything with static electricity?

RAM is very sensitive to static electricity.  Many years ago a when I first started in IT I did I think ruin a memory module with static discharge 

 

I always ground myself now before I handle any components.

[Bombastinator]

Just now, tech.guru said:

RAM was very sensitive to static electricity.  Many years ago a when I first stated in IT I did I think ruin a memory module with static discharge 

 

I always ground myself now before I handle any components.

Well there’s one.  It at least was a thing.  Still not a hard confirmation, but it’s the strongest thing seen so far.  
I’m wondering if and how much having a heat spreader on a piece of ram protects this.  I notice that they started appearing on ram that didn’t really need them some time ago.

[tech.guru]

I used to do a lot of hardware replacements. Not so anymore don't know if it has improved at all.

 

Its important to note most of the onsite technicans for hp, Dell, Toshiba will ground themselves with a wrist strap they take no chances when doing onsite repairs.

[1963SS]

Although I can't drive a train I am/was an engineer. Retired now.  When ESD usage first started (Xerox, IBM and Texas Instruments I think) Their returned parts went down by about 40 percent and their reliability increased.  All insulation has a breaking point whether it be mica, thermoplastic or an air gap. If I were to put 2400 volts into my house wiring, every wire would short through the insulation and probably explode. When you develop a static charge, even on a wooden floor, carpet or whatever you can and probably have sparked to a door knob. That's probably around the 2400 volts I referenced above. Moving your arm through dry air will create more voltage than our computers are comfortable with. Now take a circuit board or electronic component that is expecting to see 3-5 volts and zap it with 2400 doorknob volts it's not going to be happy. Our insulation is only a few nanometers on our CPU's, Ram, Motherboards and such..It will be degraded. Maybe not enough to fail but it will be hurt.

 

It seems to be a very cheap insurance policy to get, at the least, a properly grounded wristband.  Why gamble a 500 dollar processor on a 5 dollar wristband. Insulation does fail when too much voltage is passed through it. Our circuit boards are no exception. As always, IMHO.