is OC really worth the investment? I did a calculation.

[plasticplanet]

Seeing so many people overclocking, and now I wonder it is even cheaper to just go with faster CPU.

Overclock:

motherboard: Asus Z170-A (amazon:$150) most popular mobo in  LTT buy's choice.

CPU: I5 6600K 91W (newegg: $240)

Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo (neweeg: $25 after rebate)

total: $415

No OC:

mobo: Asus H170 PRO-CSM (amazon: $95) similar spec ASUS, DDR4 ATX

CPU: I7-6700 65W  (newegg: $310)

cooler: stock

total: $415

 

from my calculation it seems like it is much better to just go with faster non-oc cpu. And that's even I didn't take a more powerful PSU into my calculation.

 

[A Damn Crab!]

Of course it is... 

 

i7 6700 is faster but won't beat a 6600k clocked high enough as it's single core performance will destroy the 6700, the 6700 has an advantage in games and apps that use more threads.

 

6700k is still better.

 

If you need threads i would go X99 and 5820K.

[gtx1060=value]

1 minute ago, plasticplanet said:

Seeing so many people overclocking, and now I wonder it is even cheaper to just go with faster CPU.

Overclock:

motherboard: Asus Z170-A (amazon:$150) most popular mobo in  LTT buy's choice.

CPU: I5 6600K 91W (newegg: $240)

Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo (neweeg: $25 after rebate)

total: $415

No OC:

mobo: Asus H170 PRO-CSM (amazon: $95) similar spec ASUS, DDR4 ATX

CPU: I7-6700 65W  (newegg: $310)

cooler: stock

total: $415

 

from my calculation it seems like it is much better to just go with faster non-oc cpu. And that's even I didn't take a more powerful PSU into my calculation.

 

while it is more efficient just to go unlocked, this is an enthusiast's game, we like to fiddle around with voltages, plus, overclocking does increase the performance a lot - you could get a 6600k to 4.2 or 4.3 if you get lucky 

[Evanair]

This is really dependent on your application.  Threaded programs vs unthreaded.  I have a OC switch script on my desktop that lets me OC on the fly and increase fan speed to compensate, which I use when rendering, which ends up being much more clock-speed dependant rather than mutli-thread once you get above 4 or 6 threads, depending on your application.

 

I would agree with this argument when dealing with lower end processors, but not at the top end.  Especially when you were able to (and still are on Supermicro boards) OC a non "k" series processor.  If you find a good die, you really can crank a ton of performance out of a cheaper CPU.

[done12many2]

4 hours ago, Evanair said:

I have a OC switch script on my desktop that lets me OC on the fly and increase fan speed to compensate, which I use when rendering, which ends up being much more clock-speed dependant rather than mutli-thread once you get above 4 or 6 threads, depending on your application.

 

Wouldn't Intel SpeedStep and Windows Power Options do the same thing?

[Evanair]

1 hour ago, done12many2 said:

Wouldn't Intel SpeedStep and Windows Power Options do the same thing?

I really don't think Windows Power Options can increase the voltage on my CPU, nor on other items on the motherboard.  

As for Intel Speedstep...

Quote

When you enable speedstep,then when your CPU will downclock itself in idle mode, and will work on its stock clock at load.And when you disable it,your CPU will always run its stock clock.  - Maziar on Tom's Hardware Forums (he said it better than I could)

That's an Under-clocking feature, which is the exact opposite of what I want.  I don't want to Down-clock from stock, I want to run stock speeds without Turbo speeds, and when I need the extra power, Overclock and increase voltage.  

[Jumper118]

7 hours ago, plasticplanet said:

Seeing so many people overclocking, and now I wonder it is even cheaper to just go with faster CPU.

Overclock:

motherboard: Asus Z170-A (amazon:$150) most popular mobo in  LTT buy's choice.

CPU: I5 6600K 91W (newegg: $240)

Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo (neweeg: $25 after rebate)

total: $415

No OC:

mobo: Asus H170 PRO-CSM (amazon: $95) similar spec ASUS, DDR4 ATX

CPU: I7-6700 65W  (newegg: $310)

cooler: stock

total: $415

 

from my calculation it seems like it is much better to just go with faster non-oc cpu. And that's even I didn't take a more powerful PSU into my calculation.

 

Your calculation does not factor in the excellent fun and excitement you can have overclocking the cpu. Also a locked cpu on a z170 board is the best combination because you then get both. 

[Simon771]

24 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

Your calculation does not factor in the excellent fun and excitement you can have overclocking the cpu. Also a locked cpu on a z170 board is the best combination because you then get both. 

Wait what?

locked CPU on Z170 is the best combination? You mean unlocked maaybe?

 

I do agree with "fun factor" with overclocking.

[DunePilot]

Overclocking chipset motherboards are ALWAYS the best combination unless it's a system where you know you will absolutely never upgrade the CPU or will never resell. Literally the extra $20-40 bucks on the initial purchase.... that's the price of some beer and maybe a pizza.

[Jumper118]

1 hour ago, Simon771 said:

Wait what?

locked CPU on Z170 is the best combination? You mean unlocked maaybe?

 

I do agree with "fun factor" with overclocking.

no i mean locked. because bclk overclocking is a thing and its way more fun than press +1 on the multipler 10 times. 

[Simon771]

4 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

no i mean locked. because bclk overclocking is a thing and its way more fun than press +1 on the multipler 10 times. 

But BCKL overclocking isn't as stable as multiplier increasing.

Or am I wrong? Whenever I changed BCKL on my i7 4790k for more than 103, it crashed.

[Jumper118]

Just now, Simon771 said:

But BCKL overclocking isn't as stable as multiplier increasing.

Or am I wrong? Whenever I changed BCKL on my i7 4790k for more than 103, it crashed.

why do think its less stable? i have had my 4770K at over 190mhz then it crashed.  

[Simon771]

3 minutes ago, Jumper118 said:

why do think its less stable? i have had my 4770K at over 190mhz then it crashed.  

190mhz, but how many multipliers? 20?

 

I have no idea why isn't BCKL that stable. I just figured that if I leave it alone, I won't have any problems

[Jumper118]

2 minutes ago, Simon771 said:

190mhz, but how many multipliers? 20?

 

I have no idea why isn't BCKL that stable. I just figured that if I leave it alone, I won't have any problems

the multi doesnt make any difference. obviously you cant run 40 multi cos that is 8ghz  can run 172x27 quite nicely. 

[Simon771]

1 minute ago, Jumper118 said:

the multi doesnt make any difference. obviously you cant run 40 multi cos that is 8ghz  can run 172x27 quite nicely. 

I might try to mess around with my BCKL and mutplier numbers when I get home.

[done12many2]

9 hours ago, Evanair said:

This is really dependent on your application.  Threaded programs vs unthreaded.  I have a OC switch script on my desktop that lets me OC on the fly and increase fan speed to compensate, which I use when rendering, which ends up being much more clock-speed dependant rather than mutli-thread once you get above 4 or 6 threads, depending on your application.

 

3 hours ago, Evanair said:

I really don't think Windows Power Options can increase the voltage on my CPU, nor on other items on the motherboard.  

As for Intel Speedstep...

 

That's an Under-clocking feature, which is the exact opposite of what I want.  I don't want to Down-clock from stock, I want to run stock speeds without Turbo speeds, and when I need the extra power, Overclock and increase voltage.  

 

Yeah, I completely understand what Intel Speedstep, C-States and Windows Power Options are, but what I don't understand is why you're using a script to switch between stock non-turbo speeds (base clock) and whatever type of overclock you just described.  I'm curious to the purpose and how it works.

[Guest]

Best value is h110 board + 6700k. 

 

The k SKU's are still clocked higher and will easily turbo with no issues. 

 

Resale is better too on k SKU's 

[done12many2]

19 minutes ago, Simon771 said:

190mhz, but how many multipliers? 20?

 

I have no idea why isn't BCKL that stable. I just figured that if I leave it alone, I won't have any problems

 

Dividers/straps are needed in order to keep the DMI at or near 100 MHz.  Otherwise increasing the BCLK too far causes the crashing you describe.  

[done12many2]

4 minutes ago, Alexokan said:

Best value is h110 board + 6700k. 

 

I'm about to buy a Z170 board for my son for $39.99 after rebates and promos.  I think there's a little value in that.  

[Guest]

1 minute ago, done12many2 said:

 

I'm about to buy a Z170 board for my son for $39.99 after rebates and promos.  I think there's a little value in that.  

most certainly! But that's shopping the deals and it will always prevail over saying x is better than y. 

 

[Lays]

22 minutes ago, Simon771 said:

But BCKL overclocking isn't as stable as multiplier increasing.

Or am I wrong? Whenever I changed BCKL on my i7 4790k for more than 103, it crashed.

Skylake's BCLK is much different. It's been changed from the way it was with Haswell and previous gens.

 

You can BCLK locked skylake chips up to 4.5-4.7 ghz 24/7 lol

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Lays said:

Skylake's BCLK is much different. It's been changed from the way it was with Haswell and previous gens.

 

You can BCLK locked skylake chips up to 4.5-4.7 ghz 24/7 lol

I hate when people recommend this. 

 

You have to be experienced to accomplish this and is on a level higher than just OC'ing, which many are already intimidated by. 

[Simon771]

7 minutes ago, Lays said:

Skylake's BCLK is much different. It's been changed from the way it was with Haswell and previous gens.

 

You can BCLK locked skylake chips up to 4.5-4.7 ghz 24/7 lol

4,7GHz on locked chip sounds a bit unrealistic to me, since it's not that easy to get 4,7GHz on unlocked skylake chip.

[Jumper118]

1 minute ago, Simon771 said:

4,7GHz on locked chip sounds a bit unrealistic to me, since it's not that easy to get 4,7GHz on unlocked skylake chip.

my i5 6500 was better than my i5 6600K by about 100mhz

[JCBiggs]

over clock is absolutely worth the investment... 

 

if I charge my hourly rate .... (ill just use $30 in this case, its actually more than that)  and I look at an average task that i do on a daily basis, which is cam programming. and these are real numbers

 

 

Spoiler

 

Cam path generation of complex  surface - No OC

Compute time of rebuilds for an average model -  2  minutes 40 seconds 

executed on average 20 times a day =  total time of 26.66 minutes (converted to decimal for easy calc) 

 

compute time of simulation and sim execution - 3:20 seconds

executed and aveage of times per day = 33.333 minutes.

 

Total daily compute time of 59.999.

 

so for 60 minutes a day, I'm just siting in front of my pc waiting.  30 bucks an hour,  1 hour per day, 260 days per year...

means it cost my boss  $7800 bucks to pay me to wait...

 

 

 

now with a very minor OC, that leads to a 8% increase (i actually got around 14%)

 

Spoiler

 

Cam path generation of complex  surface - 8% OC

Compute time of rebuilds for an average model -  2  minutes 27 seconds 

executed on average 20 times a day =  total time of 24.53 minutes (converted to decimal for easy calc) 

 

compute time of simulation and sim execution - 3 minutes 04 seconds

executed and aveage of times per day = 30.67 minutes.

 

Total daily compute time of 55.2 ( 92% of the non oc total) 

 

30 bucks an hour,  55.2 minutes per day, 260 days per year...

 cost my boss  $7176  bucks to pay me to wait if I have an OC...

 

 

that difference has covered the entire cost of the K series CPU.. and im not even going to bother subtracting what i would of paid for a locked CPU...and I was on the light side on both the hourly rate, and the percentage of oc..

 

 

now if i expand that further to the actual billed total to the customer (which is what really matters because thats how you stay competitive and in business)

 

then I end up with 

$19,500 non oc

$17,940 with OC

 

 

so yes... in a world that does any amount of actual billed compute time... OC is absolutely worth it.  and im in a field that doesnt do THAT much compute. as you can see, only an hour a day.. if your processing videos for hours and hours at a time.... this would add up exponentially.   now on that same token however.... i opted to use a 6850k processor because it was specifically geared toward multitasking.. so im not acutally really losing that 1 hour per day.. when my pc is crunching, i have enough cpu left to send emails and do other task that have to be done.  this wouldnt be possible with a lesser cpu (trust me... last place i work had a garbage cpu and i couldnt do anything while i waited)  by that math, a 600 cpu saved my boss 7 grand.  (oh and you have to divide the cost of the parts over the 3 year life expectancy of the PC... so 200 bucks extra per year to save 7000....)

 

 

 

point made?