Flacs vs Mp3's

[Goose Legs]

Mostly true - however even if I commit MP3 encoding inception, I still doubt the large majority of people can hear a difference. As far as I'm concerned the differences are psychological. Storage is cheap, but for some reason (which I personally don't get), some people have amassed a playlist of thousands of tracks and in that sort of situation storage is an issue. But those guys are in the minority I think.

 

True, but we're not talking about "most people". 

 

 

Personally I keep my tracks in flac, not because I can hear a difference, but because I feel like it.

 

I mean, if it's there, why not?

 

 

I hope you're not one of those people touting expensive-ass amps and magic cables while leaving the room untreated. Oh boy, that always gets me. Even more than whatever beliefs people hold about lossy music.

 

 

How expensive is "expensive-ass"? I have a nice pair of Klipsch Reference series (full range) speakers, and some Emotiva amps powering them. The setup was certainly more than what most average people would spend, but I also have been quite happy with it for several years now, and don't see myself getting upgraditis for the foreseeable future. Heck, the amps have so much grunt, I'm not even running a sub and the two speakers by themselves shake the house.

 

Pretty much all of my cabling is either from Monoprice or MediaBridge (from Amazon). Don't worry, I do not, nor have I ever fallen for Monster's million karat gold plated HDMI cables.  

[BoredErica]

True, but we're not talking about "most people". 

 

 

 

I mean, if it's there, why not?

 

 

 

 

How expensive is "expensive-ass"? I have a nice pair of Klipsch Reference series (full range) speakers, and some Emotiva amps powering them. The setup was certainly more than what most average people would spend, but I also have been quite happy with it for several years now, and don't see myself getting upgraditis for the foreseeable future. Heck, the amps have so much grunt, I'm not even running a sub and the two speakers by themselves shake the house.

 

Pretty much all of my cabling is either from Monoprice or MediaBridge (from Amazon). Don't worry, I do not, nor have I ever fallen for Monster's million karat gold plated HDMI cables.

The truth about cable placebo is more sinister than that. Audiophiles are buying cables that cost several times the price of Monster Cables. As you might know, it's par for the course in Headfi.

 

I haven't taken a good look at the amps for speakers. But I know the amps for headphones are very cheap. Audibly transparent south of $300.

[Footy]

Cables do make a difference.

Speakers, Amp's and DAC's make a difference.

A good source and recording make a difference.

Room acoustics make a difference.

 

I personally believe FLAC is a waste when compared to other formats available on the PC however it is better than MP3

[xtroria]

Cables do make a difference.

Speakers, Amp's and DAC's make a difference.

A good source and recording make a difference.

Room acoustics make a difference.

I personally believe FLAC is a waste when compared to other formats available on the PC however it is better than MP3

They do make a difference. You either get a working amp, dac cable etc or you dont

[Footy]

Cables can be used to affect the balance of the sound.

Digital cables into a DAC make little difference, however having a low jitter digital source is important as digital audio streams don't have error correction (digital does not automatically make something perfect)

[BoredErica]

Cables do make a difference.

Speakers, Amp's and DAC's make a difference.

A good source and recording make a difference.

Room acoustics make a difference.

 

I personally believe FLAC is a waste when compared to other formats available on the PC however it is better than MP3

go bak 2 hadfie pls

[BoredErica]

Cables can be used to affect the balance of the sound.

Digital cables into a DAC make little difference, however having a low jitter digital source is important as digital audio streams don't have error correction (digital does not automatically make something perfect)

WTF does 'balance of the sound' mean?

[Footy]

WTF does 'balance of the sound' mean?

You can use cables to affect the low frequency, mid range or high frequency of the sound without adding in the distortion of the circuits required for an EQ.

[creatip123]

go bak 2 hadfie pls

 

If not taking into account the scale of differences, I actually agrees with him, and in audible spectrum of course. The (audible) differences are there, just in tiny scale. I'd say it's like wearing 100% cotton shirt vs 90% cotton + 10% polyester (or something) shirt. Is it different? Yes. Can you feel it? On and off for me, but maybe someone somewhere can. Is it worth the extra money? Not for me, dunno about others. 

[BoredErica]

[BoredErica]

 

If not taking into account the scale of differences, I actually agrees with him, and in audible spectrum of course. The (audible) differences are there, just in tiny scale. I'd say it's like wearing 100% cotton shirt vs 90% cotton + 10% polyester (or something) shirt. Is it different? Yes. Can you feel it? On and off for me, but maybe someone somewhere can. Is it worth the extra money? Not for me, dunno about others. 

Your penchant for stringing over distinctions that make no practical differences is getting annoying. Come to think of it, no two cables are exactly alike. And maybe the wind was blowing in the direction of my house from 3 miles away and that might affect the background noise of my room. Maybe quantum mechanics is affecting the locations of electrons both in the cable and my body. Who knows, I'm not affected by the energy from empty space. Maybe others. Maybe fuck science.

Who cares about differences? The problem is whether differences are audible. We're talking James Randy challenge level of craziness here. God dam I would love to refer an audiophile and claim half the prize money.

 

 

 

 

Then again, religions are even crazier. Somehow this annoys me more. And I am so glad we're not comparing displayport cables in the gaming hobby. Dear god, I would lose my mind.

[creatip123]

 

 

Your penchant for stringing over distinctions that make no practical differences is getting annoying. Come to think of it, no two cables are exactly alike. And maybe the wind was blowing in the direction of my house from 3 miles away and that might affect the background noise of my room. Maybe quantum mechanics is affecting the locations of electrons both in the cable and my body. Who knows, I'm not affected by the energy from empty space. Maybe others. Maybe fuck science.

Who cares about differences? The problem is whether differences are audible. We're talking James Randy challenge level of craziness here. God dam I would love to refer an audiophile and claim half the prize money.

 

 

 

 

Then again, religions are even crazier. Somehow this annoys me more. And I am so glad we're not comparing displayport cables in the gaming hobby. Dear god, I would lose my mind.

 

 

Well, I posted about this (sound difference of cables) in the 'beginning...' private discussion group, posted step by step process of separating the differences with audacity. I'd be happy to provide the original test files, and you do the separation process yourself, just to ensure there were no foul plays.

[BoredErica]

Well, I posted about this (sound difference of cables) in the 'beginning...' private discussion group, posted step by step process of separating the differences with audacity. I'd be happy to provide the original test files, and you do the separation process yourself, just to ensure there were no foul plays.

I'll just end up taking it to HA and end up being the messenger boy and you didn't want to go over there. The question isn't about foul play, the question is about how the test should be done.

[pas008]

alot of tests on wire here

 

http://www.head-fi.org/t/486598/testing-audiophile-claims-and-myths

[SSL]

Your penchant for stringing over distinctions that make no practical differences is getting annoying. Come to think of it, no two cables are exactly alike. And maybe the wind was blowing in the direction of my house from 3 miles away and that might affect the background noise of my room. Maybe quantum mechanics is affecting the locations of electrons both in the cable and my body. Who knows, I'm not affected by the energy from empty space. Maybe others. Maybe fuck science.

Who cares about differences? The problem is whether differences are audible. We're talking James Randy challenge level of craziness here. God dam I would love to refer an audiophile and claim half the prize money.

 

Then again, religions are even crazier. Somehow this annoys me more. And I am so glad we're not comparing displayport cables in the gaming hobby. Dear god, I would lose my mind.

 

Why stop at audible differences? The differences should be obviously better. I'm sure plenty of expensive gear sounds different than something like the O2, but do they really improve the audio in any way?

[IateMApoo]

I really tried to tell a difference between 320 MP3 and FLAC, but i couldnt, did that on external sound card not crappy mobo audio.

[creatip123]

I'll just end up taking it to HA and end up being the messenger boy and you didn't want to go over there. The question isn't about foul play, the question is about how the test should be done.

 

First off, why are you complaining? Nobody was telling you to run errands or do what you don't want to do. Make it clear first, the 'taking it to HA', is it what I want or what you want? Because I never said or implied anything even remotely close to 'taking it to HA'. Now if it's what you want, why are you complaining to me?

 

The plot is very simple, I said yes, you said no. I said I'm ready and willing to give the test subjects, testing methods, and procedures for you to recreate. You're free to make your choice. You want to challenge my test data or methods or results, sure, why not. I like to be challenged, as that's one of many ways to learn. If I'm proven wrong, then I'll say I'm wrong. You want/need to ask somebody else (in this case, people in HA), that's your privilege, not your liability. Hell even if you wanna take this all the way up to MIT, then go ahead. Just don't put it on me, because I never told you to do anything you don't want to.

 

The way the wording is, it sounds as if what you're saying is 'You're wrong. I don't know what or how, but you're still wrong. To know what or how, I need to ask more knowledgeable people, but I don't want to, so stop asking me to prove you're wrong and just accept that you're wrong'

[ShearMe]

The whole reason mp3 came into popularity was because people couldn't hear the difference vs. non-lossy, non-compressed CDs.

[Sam Z Man]

All you audio fans commenting on this post

[Footy]

The whole reason mp3 came into popularity was because people couldn't hear the difference vs. non-lossy, non-compressed CDs.

Not really, the whole reason it came into existence is mp3s are smaller, easier to copy online with slow connections, easier to store on portable devices, easier to collect huge music collections on small hdd's.

now with all the subscription cloud play options and high bandwidth there is hardly any reason to buy music except if you want the best quality.

[bomerr]

it really depends on the speakers.

 

cheap headphones = no difference

good home speakers or car audio = difference, 

[ShearMe]

Not really, the whole reason it came into existence is mp3s are smaller, easier to copy online with slow connections, easier to store on portable devices, easier to collect huge music collections on small hdd's.

now with all the subscription cloud play options and high bandwidth there is hardly any reason to buy music except if you want the best quality.

 

There were ways of compressing music before mp3, so I cannot agree that smaller size was the main reason.

[xtroria]

it really depends on the speakers.

 

cheap headphones = no difference

good home speakers or car audio = difference, 

 

Nope. 320kbps mp3 and FLAC are indistinguishable for almost everyone

[bomerr]

Nope. 320kbps mp3 and FLAC are indistinguishable for almost everyone

that's complete BS. 

 

I could definitely tell the difference between apple lossless (converted from flac) and mp3 on my car audio setup ONCE i switched to a digital connection. and by car audio setup i mean alpine headunit, rockford fosgate amps, focal speakers and JL subwoofers. 

 

with the right equipment and setup the difference is noticeable. 

[ShearMe]

that's complete BS. 

 

I could definitely tell the difference between apple lossless (converted from flac) and mp3 on my car audio setup ONCE i switched to a digital connection. and by car audio setup i mean alpine headunit, rockford fosgate amps, focal speakers and JL subwoofers. 

 

with the right equipment and setup the difference is noticeable. 

 

Was that mp3 file converted from the same source? What codec did you use? Which "digital connection" did you use? What was the difference(s) you could discern?