The real difference between "Free-Sync" vs G-Sync

[TheRuke]

Oh so Linus said it, so it MUST be true? *shakes head* Linus isn't the end all be all, I've had great luck being an early adopter of tech, being a beta tester of tech and games. But hey, you and he don't want to do it, thats cool. Like I said, its a PERSONAL PREFERENCE, not some golden rule that you think everyone should follow. Which is stupid when you think about it, because well... lets be honest if everyone followed his (and I am taking your word as I haven't heard him say it myself) and your rule, no one would ever touch it, and it would stay in the early phases and real people would not touch it outside the lab. Then YOU and HE would never ever use. Makes you think about things.

 

Covered that here pretty well above, so let me quote them, both posts, directly.

 

Yes, that one is $800 dollars, but of course you and I can't buy it today. I was talking about what you can buy today, this exact moment. Not some product that hasn't even hit shelves and was just unveiled. I don't know how good the panel is, so I can't say whether it is good or bad. Everyone at CES was raving about how good the panel looked. There are good TN panels that look amazing, and there are total ASS panels. Just like there are ASS IPS panels. I can say MY Personal  27" TN 144hz monitor is killer, and once I personally tweaked the colors it looks damn good. But hey, you have your preferences and they aren't mine. I can't dictate to you what is best for you, just like you shouldn't go around fussing and complaining that TNs all suck and everyone should have IPS. Its not the case, and shows an attitude that you know what is best for me, when you have no clue in the world what is what.

He said it's bad for the regular joe who won't be able to buy version 2. Do you even fucking watch Linus?

 

Bottom line. I'm not paying for something right when it comes out because it will be more expensive and have more bugs. I am especially not paying for something that I can get for free.

[Nineshadow]

G-Sink

Free-Sink.

Hell yeah!

[Jasmin]

A. Never be an early adopter

B. $700 ROG is unacceptable

C. TN panels 

Following logic of A you would kill most clever, innovative tech out there. If nobody want's to buy new, but maybe not perfect stuff then why would a company ever invest more money into the project? I get the idea behind 'not being an early adopter' but you need to accept the idea of 'voting with your wallet' if everybody votes NO by not buying early versions then you won't have later iterations. I'm not asking to go out there and buy something you like the concept of, even if it's implemented badly, when you don't have spare cash. But going around and saying 'don't be an early adopter' is going to punish you at the very end. Especially when it's 'I'd like to but don't have the money so I will talk other people out of it so I can feel better with myself'. Pure, cheap envy.

 

IPS is great for color reproduction (apart from black on most non-pro monitors unfortunately) but is rather slow. While you can buy them as cheap as 200$ in EU there's only one IPS panel that is marketed forwards gamers - EIZO's Foris 2333. Even that thing is inferior to TN panels in terms of speed and blacks. I'd be grateful if people stopped spamming how shit TN panels are until IPS are at least equal to them in everything. Right now it's speed, no-ghosting and blacks VS colour and view angle. There's no 'better' choice for every use. Yet.

 

 

He said it's bad for the regular joe who won't be able to buy version 2. Do you even fucking watch Linus?

 

Bottom line. I'm not paying for something right when it comes out because it will be more expensive and have more bugs. I am especially not paying for something that I can get for free.

 

 

Linus has his ideas. We have ours. He is no absolute being.

 

Buying something when you can get it for free? Well depends on the situation. If everyone would follow it there wouldn't be F2P games out there. That's on thing.

 

In respect to AMD's idea... Well... For one thing you would have to buy a new monitor. It's not free. The most important thing is that there's nothing to buy yet. There's no proof of concept. All I can see is an idea that great many owners of ATI graphics want to belive in so they can feel that much better about their choice even if it defies logic. 

[TheRuke]

Following logic of A you would kill most clever, innovative tech out there. If nobody want's to buy new, but maybe not perfect stuff then why would a company ever invest more money into the project? I get the idea behind 'not being an early adopter' but you need to accept the idea of 'voting with your wallet' if everybody votes NO by not buying early versions then you won't have later iterations. I'm not asking to go out there and buy something you like the concept of, even if it's implemented badly, when you don't have spare cash. But going around and saying 'don't be an early adopter' is going to punish you at the very end. Especially when it's 'I'd like to but don't have the money so I will talk other people out of it so I can feel better with myself'. Pure, cheap envy.

 

IPS is great for color reproduction (apart from black on most non-pro monitors unfortunately) but is rather slow. While you can buy them as cheap as 200$ in EU there's only one IPS panel that is marketed forwards gamers - EIZO's Foris 2333. Even that thing is inferior to TN panels in terms of speed and blacks. I'd be grateful if people stopped spamming how shit TN panels are until IPS are at least equal to them in everything. Right now it's speed, no-ghosting and blacks VS colour and view angle. There's no 'better' choice for every use. Yet.

 

Linus has his ideas. We have ours. He is no absolute being.

 

Buying something when you can get it for free? Well depends on the situation. If everyone would follow it there wouldn't be F2P games out there. That's on thing.

 

In respect to AMD's idea... Well... For one thing you would have to buy a new monitor. It's not free. The most important thing is that there's nothing to buy yet. There's no proof of concept. All I can see is an idea that great many owners of ATI graphics want to belive in so they can feel that much better about their choice even if it defies logic. 

Ok Never was a strong word. Do you know what reviews are? They're a persons personal opinion on a product. Most smart people go out a look or read a few. If you like what you hear, go ahead and buy version 1 but you'll kick yourself later when version 2 is so much better which you may or may not buy. As a 15 year old, I am very selective with what I buy with the little money that I have earned.

 

Unless you're very competitive, I would go with IPS. TN allows for higher refresh rates but you don't get the best viewing experience. Kinda like playing at 720p. Kinda.

 

I did not say he is an absolute being. Why do you keep quoting me on things I have already accepted as wrong or overstated comments? He gave his opinion, I agreed with it.

 

The difference with F2P and a game you paid for is completely different. G-Sync and Free-Sync are basically the same thing, just implemented in different ways.

 

Why would you need to buy a new monitor? I thought it was a firmware update.

[Suika]

G-Sync exists and is proven to work. People only speculate FreeSync, which may never actually exist on a desktop platform. That's the difference.

 

Until FreeSync is announced and exists in the form of a desktop monitor, G-Sync is better. Because, well, it actually exists.

[Jasmin]

Ok Never was a strong word. Do you know what reviews are? They're a persons personal opinion on a product. Most smart people go out a look or read a few. If you like what you hear, go ahead and buy version 1 but you'll kick yourself later when version 2 is so much better which you may or may not buy. As a 15 year old, I am very selective with what I buy with the little money that I have earned.

 

Unless you're very competitive, I would go with IPS. TN allows for higher refresh rates but you don't get the best viewing experience. Kinda like playing at 720p. Kinda.

 

I did not say he is an absolute being. Why do you keep quoting me on things I have already accepted as wrong or overstated comments? He gave his opinion, I agreed with it.

 

The difference with F2P and a game you paid for is completely different. G-Sync and Free-Sync are basically the same thing, just implemented in different ways.

 

Why would you need to buy a new monitor? I thought it was a firmware update.

Not being an early adopter as 15 is smart unless you have willing parents with deep pockets

 

I'm using Asus ML238 which is a TN with suprising viewing angles and quite a decent image quality. During various builds I had it side to side with a couple of IPS panels (never over 400$ though) and what I noticed was that image was usually warmer on the IPS, but blacks looked yellowish and the ghosting was unbearable to me (at leats 5 ghosted copies of whatever that was being dragged over the screen). Looking at newer mid-range panels I can notice the same thing happening (I really wanted the Asus MX239H as a 2nd monitor) - watching the vid of the monitor you can usually notice quite a lot of drag.

 

As many have pointed out there's no working concept of what AMD claims. There was also some talk of needing a DP 1.3 which is not even out yet. I don't believe them of this being as simple as a firmware update unless proven wrong by a working concept.

[TheRuke]

Not being an early adopter as 15 is smart unless you have willing parents with deep pockets

 

I'm using Asus ML238 which is a TN with suprising viewing angles and quite a decent image quality. During various builds I had it side to side with a couple of IPS panels (never over 400$ though) and what I noticed was that image was usually warmer on the IPS, but blacks looked yellowish and the ghosting was unbearable to me (at leats 5 ghosted copies of whatever that was being dragged over the screen). Looking at newer mid-range panels I can notice the same thing happening (I really wanted the Asus MX239H as a 2nd monitor) - watching the vid of the monitor you can usually notice quite a lot of drag.

 

As many have pointed out there's no working concept of what AMD claims. There was also some talk of needing a DP 1.3 which is not even out yet. I don't believe them of this being as simple as a firmware update unless proven wrong by a working concept.

unwilling parents

 

Really? I have a $100 Acer IPS monitor and I have almost never ran into the problems you had. It does get a little warm after extended use however. Are viewing angles really that important? Or is that more of a multi monitor set up thing?

 

It's a laptop but here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/7641/amd-demonstrates-freesync-free-gsync-alternative-at-ces-2014

I am really uncertain about the display port thing tho. I didn't even know my 7870 had one until my friend showed me

[Jasmin]

unwilling parents

 

Really? I have a $100 Acer IPS monitor and I have almost never ran into the problems you had. It does get a little warm after extended use however. Are viewing angles really that important? Or is that more of a multi monitor set up thing?

 

It's a laptop but here: http://www.anandtech.com/show/7641/amd-demonstrates-freesync-free-gsync-alternative-at-ces-2014

I am really uncertain about the display port thing tho. I didn't even know my 7870 had one until my friend showed me

The problem raised is that the laptop display is not at all like an external PC-grade monitor. Also if AMD brags that they had this tech long before, then why they've never even mentioned it before nvidia released the 1st monitor with gsync? I worked for corp for too long to believe in any PR material before I see a proof.

 

Viewing angles? It's important for multi monitor and for showing stuff to people around you. We have very bad viewing angles on monitors where i work and it's a constant hassle to show stuff to cooworkers. Also it's nice to be able to open a guide on a monitor and glance at it from time to time while ripping a laptop to pieces.

[f22luke]

Also, have you thought about the fact that G-sync is a hardware solution? It isn't even compatible with previous gen Nvidia's GPUs, whether or not it can work with AMD architecture is uncertain. 

I suspect the reason G-sync does not work with older cards has something to do with Nvidia wanting people to upgrade rather than it just not being feasible.  I'm not saying that it's a bad thing or that they should have given a new feature to the owners of older cards.  The only reason why a company supports older models is if they are concerned about customer loyalty.  Given the number of Nvidia fanboys out there they have nothing to worry about.

[afa7336]

He said it's bad for the regular joe who won't be able to buy version 2. Do you even fucking watch Linus?

 

Bottom line. I'm not paying for something right when it comes out because it will be more expensive and have more bugs. I am especially not paying for something that I can get for free.

 

Just because I don't fap over every word he says, memorize every word he says and drool over him doesn't mean I don't watch him. See, I am a grown man that takes all the information in and makes up my own mind. Honestly, I don't understand why everyone puts so much stalk in Linus' words. He's just another man, he puts his pants on the same as you and I, he's no different.

 

And where did you get that I was a regular joe, that should listen to what you had to say? I can afford about 100 revisions without breaking a sweat.

 

That's your choice, but it doesn't make it ours. And if you really truly think its free, you're going to be in for a shock. Most monitors, to my knowledge and talking with a few people, can't really be flashed with a new revision of anything. They're normally one firmware and thats it. AMD has an amazing PR and Marketing department, don't get me wrong, but its going to piss a lot of people off now. Freesync was an internal name, as I read/heard somewhere (pcper I think). It was a direct dig at Nvidia. They actually said they had this tech for a while now... which annoys me and should annoy you. I wonder why people aren't getting pissed about that.

[mr moose]

Profit is what drives innovation. It sucks but they deserve it. 

Also, have you thought about the fact that G-sync is a hardware solution? It isn't even compatible with previous gen Nvidia's GPUs, whether or not it can work with AMD architecture is uncertain. 

 

I agree, profit does drive innovation, and being profitable grants one the ability.

 

I daresay Nvidia didn't even consider enabling G-sync on older cards because it was a drawing board concept when those cards where being prototyped.   Besides that by the time G-sync monitors hit the shelves and are affordable it will be time for most of us with pre-gsync cards to upgrade anyway.

[gatecrasherlok]

I suspect the reason G-sync does not work with older cards has something to do with Nvidia wanting people to upgrade rather than it just not being feasible.  I'm not saying that it's a bad thing or that they should have given a new feature to the owners of older cards.  The only reason why a company supports older models is if they are concerned about customer loyalty.  Given the number of Nvidia fanboys out there they have nothing to worry about.

 

Or is the market getting a little flacid and needing a big boot up the backside, no-one knows the true nature why this product has reared it's head now and not earlier. It makes sense to me that we seem to get better and better graphics cards but dimishing returns to where it matters (display) maybe they had that in mind. Of course the biggest agenda is stealing a bigger market share and may be the only agenda, i mean why not, businesses are there to make money and being in a business is ruthless. For whatever the reason freesync, gsync I will praise just as long as it brings something useful to the end user Me/you.  

[TheRuke]

Just because I don't fap over every word he says, memorize every word he says and drool over him doesn't mean I don't watch him. See, I am a grown man that takes all the information in and makes up my own mind. Honestly, I don't understand why everyone puts so much stalk in Linus' words. He's just another man, he puts his pants on the same as you and I, he's no different.

 

And where did you get that I was a regular joe, that should listen to what you had to say? I can afford about 100 revisions without breaking a sweat.

 

That's your choice, but it doesn't make it ours. And if you really truly think its free, you're going to be in for a shock. Most monitors, to my knowledge and talking with a few people, can't really be flashed with a new revision of anything. They're normally one firmware and thats it. AMD has an amazing PR and Marketing department, don't get me wrong, but its going to piss a lot of people off now. Freesync was an internal name, as I read/heard somewhere (pcper I think). It was a direct dig at Nvidia. They actually said they had this tech for a while now... which annoys me and should annoy you. I wonder why people aren't getting pissed about that.

 He puts on his socks on differently. Why the fu*k can't you talk like a civilized being such as @Jasmin?

 

Who the fu*k said you had to listen to me? I don't care if you can afford 100 revisions. The point is: Is it worth it? If you're 15 years old like me you would want to be very careful where and how you spend your money. 

 

Who knows? If it does require a new monitor, fu*k them. If it doesn't, all hail AMD. No sh*t it's a dig at Nvidia!

[gatecrasherlok]

 He puts on his socks on differently. Why the fu*k can't you talk like a civilized being such as @Jasmin?

 

Who the fu*k said you had to listen to me? I don't care if you can afford 100 revisions. The point is: Is it worth it? If you're 15 years old like me you would want to be very careful where and how you spend your money. 

 

Who knows? If it does require a new monitor, fu*k them. If it doesn't, all hail AMD. No sh*t it's a dig at Nvidia!

 

I don't think he meant it as a dig as such, the contect of replies always come across diffrently in text.

[afa7336]

 He puts on his socks on differently. Why the fu*k can't you talk like a civilized being such as @Jasmin?

 

Who the fu*k said you had to listen to me? I don't care if you can afford 100 revisions. The point is: Is it worth it? If you're 15 years old like me you would want to be very careful where and how you spend your money. 

 

Who knows? If it does require a new monitor, fu*k them. If it doesn't, all hail AMD. No sh*t it's a dig at Nvidia!

 

The phrase puts his pants on the same as you and I is a phrase used to say to someone the person is just like us. They are no different then you and I. In otherwords, Linus is just another guy and isn't special in any way shape or form. I've briefed Admirals, Generals, VPOTUS and many others and never once did I treat them special. He'll I've actually called one a stupid ignorant fuck. And I share a drink with him to this day at least once every couple months. The trick is, they aren't special they are normal.

 

As for what you said, and who should listen to whom, we'll just have to quote posts won't we?

 

A. Never be an early adopter

A. Ehhh, personal choice. I've had good experiences being early adopter to tech before. That isn't a given, and acting like its some rule is stupid.

Linus also said it's bad to be an early adopter, it's not just me.

[LOST TALE]

Make myself look like an idiot by doing so.

doing so...doing what?

[LOST TALE]

I suspect the reason G-sync does not work with older cards has something to do with Nvidia wanting people to upgrade rather than it just not being feasible.

Captain Marketing Obvious. Much Nvidia so fanboism very money

[mr moose]

Captain Marketing Obvious. Much Nvidia so fanboism very money

I doubt it was marketing, the oldest card to support Gsync is the 650Ti, So essentially only kepler except the 640 and under.  Any cards that were developed before then were developed when G-sync was only in the very early planning stage (early 2012 and before).  You cannot make a card compatible with a feature that is still only in planning.  

[CyberneticTitan]

R-Sync can still be a thing boys.

[LOST TALE]

I doubt it was marketing, the oldest card to support Gsync is the 650Ti, So essentially only kepler except the 640 and under.  Any cards that were developed before then were developed when G-sync was only in the very early planning stage (early 2012 and before).  You cannot make a card compatible with a feature that is still only in planning.  

I'm pretty sure they are good chances older cards can, also I'm sure they could communicate with AMD/and intel to make that gsync module more usefull.

so back to what I said prior to this.

[gatecrasherlok]

I'm pretty sure they are good chances older cards can, also I'm sure they could communicate with AMD/and intel to make that gsync module more usefull.

so back to what I said prior to this.

 

They probably can but sometimes to a business, is it really worth all that r and d to go back that many generations to get their new tech out.

[LOST TALE]

They probably can but sometimes to a business, is it really worth all that r and d to go back that many generations to get their new tech out.

For everyone it would be worth it, for them alone, nope. it would probably cost 10% more. but once again...

I blindly estimate the chances that older cards having a big difference in communication ability is very low.

[gatecrasherlok]

For everyone it would be worth it, for them alone, nope. it would probably cost 10% more. but once again...

I blindly estimate the chances that older cards have a big difference in communication ability very low.

 

Of course to you and me it would be worth it but blindly estimating r and d costs does not justifying it to a business. Maybe there are more underlying issues that limits it to only kepler based gpu's. Who knows really.

[mr moose]

I'm pretty sure they are good chances older cards can, also I'm sure they could communicate with AMD/and intel to make that gsync module more usefull.

so back to what I said prior to this.

Businesses don't remain successful ( and by that I mean don't go belly up) by giving stuff away, esp. to their main competitor.  If we want to see GPU's get faster and cheaper, then AMD and Nvidia need to both be profitable and play the game.  That means they won't do anything that doesn't net them a return or invest in a technology that they can't control. 

[maximilian4o]

Maybe it's my Fanboyism but every time I hear that NVIDEAHHHHHHHH shit before a game I wana just take my monitor and throw it.

Yeah man. That NVIDEAHHHH shit is so fkn old and anoying. It's just the voice and the "HHHHHHHHHHH" that annoys me. It's about time they change it.