General Intel HEDT Xeon/i7 Discussion

[croszz]

Hey guys, i have a very old build and its time to upgrade some parts. However i need some advice and tips since i don't have much knowledge about all this.

 

Current build:

CPU: i7-920 @2.67 GHz

Motherboard: MSI X58A-GD65

RAM: 8GB Corsair LPX DDR3

GPU: XFX 8800 GTX

Storage: Samsung EVO 750 250GB

PSU: CoolerMaster 620 W

 

Parts that i want to upgrade to:

CPU: xeon W3680 @3.33GHz (± 70$)

RAM: (6x4) 24GB ECC Registered DDR3 (± 75-100$)

GPU: MSI 1080 GTX (± 370$)

 

Are these parts compatible with my motherboard or are there better options to go for? I have seen a lot of different ECC memory like PC3-10600E and PC3-10600R, 2RX8, 2RX4, 4RX4 etc.. which one i should use for my build?

 

thanks!

[Pasi123]

1 hour ago, croszz said:

Hey guys, i have a very old build and its time to upgrade some parts. However i need some advice and tips since i don't have much knowledge about all this.

 

Current build:

CPU: i7-920 @2.67 GHz

Motherboard: MSI X58A-GD65

RAM: 8GB Corsair LPX DDR3

GPU: XFX 8800 GTX

Storage: Samsung EVO 750 250GB

PSU: CoolerMaster 620 W

 

Parts that i want to upgrade to:

CPU: xeon W3680 @3.33GHz (± 70$)

RAM: (6x4) 24GB ECC Registered DDR3 (± 75-100$)

GPU: MSI 1080 GTX (± 370$)

 

Are these parts compatible with my motherboard or are there better options to go for? I have seen a lot of different ECC memory like PC3-10600E and PC3-10600R, 2RX8, 2RX4, 4RX4 etc.. which one i should use for my build?

 

thanks!

Registered memory doesn't work on X58 mobos. Normal non-registered ECC memory works even when mixed with normal DDR stics

[croszz]

15 minutes ago, Pasi123 said:

Registered memory doesn't work on X58 mobos. Normal non-registered ECC memory works even when mixed with normal DDR stics

in the link below in the list of compatible memory there are HP ecc registered memory listed as compatible, so these wont work?

http://www.pc-specs.com/mobo/MSI/MSI_X58A-GD65/167/Compatible_RAM

 

and what about the xeon w3680, is this one compatible and a good choice?

[Glasare]

Check MSI's page for CPU support on that motherboard.

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X58AGD65#support-cpu

 

It doesn't seem to support more than just the Xeon W3520. Maybe that's not the whole story.

 

Regarding the RAM. If it were up to me, I'd just buy some more of what you already have.

[Pasi123]

10 minutes ago, croszz said:

in the link below in the list of compatible memory there are HP ecc registered memory listed as compatible, so these wont work?

http://www.pc-specs.com/mobo/MSI/MSI_X58A-GD65/167/Compatible_RAM

 

and what about the xeon w3680, is this one compatible and a good choice?

I wouldn't trust that site at all, it lists that HP registered memory for all DDR3 boards.

 

That mobo does support 6-core CPUs so that W3680 should work. X5650 and similar Xeons should work too but I can't find any info about that.

[asand1]

3 hours ago, Glasare said:

Check MSI's page for CPU support on that motherboard.

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/support/X58AGD65#support-cpu

 

It doesn't seem to support more than just the Xeon W3520. Maybe that's not the whole story.

 

Regarding the RAM. If it were up to me, I'd just buy some more of what you already have.

Most of the Xeons that work in X58 were never listed. Unfortunately the supported CPU lists don't offer much help for us.

[asand1]

I can tell you first hand that Asus X58 will not run registered RAM. Tried it and no go.

[agent_x007]

On 2.04.2018 at 7:04 AM, MaratM said:

You need a samsung 950 pro, this is the only drive that will work as a plug and play device, cause it is the only one with legasy bios support. The bios will see it as another ide drive.

You also need a pci-e to nvme card. You can get any of them from ebay or aliexpress or from known brand as asus or watercool. A heatsink is highly recommended. I went with aliexpress one with a heatsink.

due to the fact x58 got only pci-e gen 2 you will not get full speed of this drive, but it is significantly faster of sata2 or even sata3

however if your mobo does support sata3 the difference in speed between nvme and sata3 is not that great +-3 sec on boot time, but if it supports only sata2 the speed difference is up to 5 times

have a look in my buildlog

1) 950 Pro isn't needed if you can spare a USB pendrive or one partition of SATA harddrive space (capacity ~200MB) for Clover or DUET booting : LINK + LINK
2) NVMe/PCI-e AHCI are miles ahead of anything SATAIII can do on X58 board (because Marvell/ASMedia controllers that were used for it are far cry from Intels native ones).
3) Lastly, there is this experimental method at this point as well (baking "borrowed" NVMe code for Legacy BIOS into your BIOS ) : LINK
^All three (if last one works), enable use of NVMe type drive on any PCI-e capable MB with 64-bit CPU (in theory).
You only need a simple passive PCI-e to M.2 M-Key adapter (example : LINK).

[MaratM]

42 minutes ago, agent_x007 said:

1) 950 Pro isn't needed if you can spare a USB pendrive or one partition of SATA harddrive space (capacity ~200MB) for Clover or DUET booting : LINK + LINK
2) NVMe/PCI-e AHCI are miles ahead of anything SATAIII can do on X58 board (because Marvell/ASMedia controllers that were used for it are far cry from Intels native ones).
3) Lastly, there is this experimental method at this point as well (baking "borrowed" NVMe code for Legacy BIOS into your BIOS ) : LINK
^All three (if last one works), enable use of NVMe type drive on any PCI-e capable MB with 64-bit CPU (in theory).
You only need a simple passive PCI-e to M.2 M-Key adapter (example : LINK).

Point i was trying to make was:

1) samsung 950 pro is a plug-and-play device. I’m aware of other possibilities of getting other nvme drives working on x58, but samsung is the easiest one!!!

2) If the mobo supports sata3 there is no point of investing $250+ Into nvme drive, unless the x58 is used as a professional workstation, but as a professional workstation it is a bit out of date

3) any adapter will work with no problems

 

 

[Intelfreak]

1 hour ago, MaratM said:

Point i was trying to make was:

1) samsung 950 pro is a plug-and-play device. I’m aware of other possibilities of getting other nvme drives working on x58, but samsung is the easiest one!!!

2) If the mobo supports sata3 there is no point of investing $250+ Into nvme drive, unless the x58 is used as a professional workstation, but as a professional workstation it is a bit out of date

3) any adapter will work with no problems

 

 

Agreed Samsung 950 PRO is the easy way to get M.2 NVMe SSD to work on X58. Im using two right now in my X58 system. One for OS and one for games. There are other ways to get others to work like a modded bios or third party software booted from USB. But 950 PRO is the safest (because you dont have to risk third party software or bios going bad and fuck up your motherboard in the proces), easiest way and in my opinion bedst way to M.2 on X58 that also can be booted from. Sure you dont get full speed be cause of PCIe gen 2 speed limits per. lane but its sure as hell way better than sata raid or the crappy marvel sata 3 controller + you dont have to fiddle with power and sata cable with M.2 SSD.

 

my system with 950 PRO.

 

[Glasare]

Is there any reason the X5650 seem to get the bang/buck recommendation over the W3670? Looking at ebay, they're basically the same price.

 

Is it the TDP? the QPI speed?

[NoxiousOdor]

6 minutes ago, Glasare said:

Is there any reason the X5650 seem to get the bang/buck recommendation over the W3670? Looking at ebay, they're basically the same price.

 

Is it the TDP? the QPI speed?

The 5650 has a tdp of 95W while the 3670 has a tdp of 130W. That is probably why but both would be solid choices

[Ground]

Hm, given the lower clock speed of the x5650 I think there shouldn't be much of a difference between power consumption in practice. I think it just got a lot cheaper though, because I remember the last time I checked it was barely cheaper then the w3680 which is, given the unlocked multiplier, a lot more interesting. Might pick one up at some point just to test it, after all resale value for these xeons isn't gonna drop any further anyways...

 

First 10 E5606s tested, 2x258-260 BCLK, 6x249-255, 2x<240. Lets hope something more interesting is in the next batch!

[bimmerman]

My 2c is to skip the 5650 and get the 5675. Same 95W TDP but highest stock multiplier of the 95W parts, and also the highest Tjmax.

 

They're $50-75, so more than the 5650, but it's still dirt cheap. Mine overclocks really really well (4.5 24/7, 4.7 stable, room to go higher but past the point of diminishing returns)

 

The X5680 and 5690s are 130w TDP without the unlocked multiplier of the W3680/90 series, so personally I don't see why these make sense IF you'll be overclocking. If you're going for fastest chip without overclocking or for multi chip systems, these are your go-to.

 

The W3680 and W3690 are interesting mostly because they're identical to the i7-980x/990x chips (i.e., unlocked multiplier), but at half the cost on the used market. The W3670 I'm not sure makes as much sense due to combination of still locked multiplier and high TDP.

 

All that said...we're splitting hairs. Buy the best one you can afford given the cooling system you have. Or buy two, because they cost almost nothing.

[NoxiousOdor]

20 minutes ago, bimmerman said:

My 2c is to skip the 5650 and get the 5675. Same 95W TDP but highest stock multiplier of the 95W parts, and also the highest Tjmax.

 

They're $50-75, so more than the 5650, but it's still dirt cheap. Mine overclocks really really well (4.5 24/7, 4.7 stable, room to go higher but past the point of diminishing returns)

 

The X5680 and 5690s are 130w TDP without the unlocked multiplier of the W3680/90 series, so personally I don't see why these make sense IF you'll be overclocking. If you're going for fastest chip without overclocking or for multi chip systems, these are your go-to.

 

The W3680 and W3690 are interesting mostly because they're identical to the i7-980x/990x chips (i.e., unlocked multiplier), but at half the cost on the used market. The W3670 I'm not sure makes as much sense due to combination of still locked multiplier and high TDP.

 

All that said...we're splitting hairs. Buy the best one you can afford given the cooling system you have. Or buy two, because they cost almost nothing.

The 5690 does have an unlocked multiplier. Really interesting info on the other chips though I didn't realize the 5675 had a 95w tdp

[FlatBrokeRacing]

the 5680's multiplier is semi-unlocked, its adjustable up to 26. either way i had seen 4.9 stable but no way you could run daily there.

 

my 5660 overclocked very similar to the 5680 and scored around the same as well.

 

My recommendation would be stick with the lower tdp parts as it may be easier on the boards VRM's. I still havent been able to surpass the 225BLCK yet (x5660 went that high, x5680 caps at 211blck) atleast on my boards. Tried everything from loose ram timing, turning down the memory speed, turning down the ulck, etc just couldnt make that jump I'm happy with the results and i think anyone wanting an X58 based system cannot go wrong with any of the X56XX chips as from what i see they all overclock virtually the same.

[Ground]

@FlatBrokeRacing To get beyond ~220 you need to start raising the PCIe frequency. My E5649 needs 110 MHz for 240 and 115 for 250 (126 for 269.65); 250 should be doable on most CPUs (about 80% in my experience)

There are some boards that really don’t like anything beyond 220 (P6T supposedly, Foxconn boards need hardmods), but my 3 boards have all managed at least 250 MHz BCLK. Practical daily limit is probably about ~230 with 105 PCIe, though that may or not be stable. Some Nvidia GPUs aren’t great at PCIe (my GTX 670 does 117; my 8600 GT does 135). Adjusting it in-OS might be needed in some rarer cases. 

 

edit: warning! Do not raise the pcie freq with a drive you care about - it can lead to data corruption and drive failure. 

[Glasare]

My experience from my two X58 and the P35 board is that it's the NB that gets the hottest. 

I'm not a very experienced overclocker, and will generally back down an OC a bit if the NB starts getting too hot.

 

Also, the temp readings from my X58 boards are a bit weird aswell.

On the Asrock, HW Info will report NB Temps around 100C at idle. After running Assassin's Creed: Origins for an hour, it will report something around 40C....  At this point, I can have my finger on the NB heatsink for about 5 seconds before it starts getting uncomfortably hot.

The Gigabyte board is awaiting a W3680 and a Corsair 275R, so I'll have a closer look at that when they arrive.

 

Typing this, I just got 2x 40mm Fractal R3 fans delivered. I'll do some testing with those and see if they're any help

 

[Glasare]

So.. Got my first 1000+ Cinebench-score @4.4GHz with the W3670 today. CB seem to think that my multiplier is 24, but this is done with 22x200.

To increase from 4.2 to 4.4, I have to bump Vcore from 1.325 to 1.368. Not yet confirmed that this is a stable overclock. For now it has only been through 5-6 consecutive CB runs.

 

Must say that the Asrock OC Tuner was very handy when tuning as you get access to a bunch of voltages etc.

 

Exhaust from the case is not bad at all.. I realized that it's problably the 1060 which is of the ITX variety that really heats up the case as it's pretty much stuck around 80C during gaming.

 

[FlatBrokeRacing]

On 2018-04-10 at 3:27 AM, Ground said:

@FlatBrokeRacing To get beyond ~220 you need to start raising the PCIe frequency. My E5649 needs 110 MHz for 240 and 115 for 250 (126 for 269.65); 250 should be doable on most CPUs (about 80% in my experience)

There are some boards that really don’t like anything beyond 220 (P6T supposedly, Foxconn boards need hardmods), but my 3 boards have all managed at least 250 MHz BCLK. Practical daily limit is probably about ~230 with 105 PCIe, though that may or not be stable. Some Nvidia GPUs aren’t great at PCIe (my GTX 670 does 117; my 8600 GT does 135). Adjusting it in-OS might be needed in some rarer cases. 

 

edit: warning! Do not raise the pcie freq with a drive you care about - it can lead to data corruption and drive failure. 

I tried ripping the shit out of the PCIE freq, went up to 120 and back down with my P6T boards, and no go, i've dicked and cranked every setting and voltage option i could and even gone places i'm suprised the smoke never got let out. my stable limits are pretty much hard set in the 4.4-4.5 neighborhood with low 200's blck otherwise its not 100% stable (passes aida64, but game for an hour or 3 and it will constantly crash or even just freeze and knock you out of the game randomly)

[Ground]

1 hour ago, FlatBrokeRacing said:

I tried ripping the shit out of the PCIE freq, went up to 120 and back down with my P6T boards, and no go, i've dicked and cranked every setting and voltage option i could and even gone places i'm suprised the smoke never got let out. my stable limits are pretty much hard set in the 4.4-4.5 neighborhood with low 200's blck otherwise its not 100% stable (passes aida64, but game for an hour or 3 and it will constantly crash or even just freeze and knock you out of the game randomly)

Oh, you have a P6T, damn, those really suck for BCLK beyond 220. Damn...

[FlatBrokeRacing]

9 hours ago, Ground said:

Oh, you have a P6T, damn, those really suck for BCLK beyond 220. Damn...

yup the P6T delux is stable up to 200blck, can push 211 if reaaaaaaaallllyyyyy want but thats it.

 

the other board is a P6T-SE and will hit 225ish.

 

In all honesty i dont see much if a difference pushing the BLCK that high, you pick up some Cinnebench score, but i run them at the stable limit on both BLCK and Multiplier, all of which have been around 4.4-4.5 which in all honesty is pretty damn good for these old chips. I'm surprised my X5680 and the P6TDeluxe survived the punishment streak i gave them to hit 1100CB score. that old 130w xeon took nearly 1.61V Vcore like a champ to boot 5Ghz in windows LOL

[Ground]

3 hours ago, FlatBrokeRacing said:

yup the P6T delux is stable up to 200blck, can push 211 if reaaaaaaaallllyyyyy want but thats it.

 

the other board is a P6T-SE and will hit 225ish.

 

In all honesty i dont see much if a difference pushing the BLCK that high, you pick up some Cinnebench score, but i run them at the stable limit on both BLCK and Multiplier, all of which have been around 4.4-4.5 which in all honesty is pretty damn good for these old chips. I'm surprised my X5680 and the P6TDeluxe survived the punishment streak i gave them to hit 1100CB score. that old 130w xeon took nearly 1.61V Vcore like a champ to boot 5Ghz in windows LOL

Wow, 1.6V Vcore? I've managed booting 5 with 1.5 with my E5649 and best E5640 (that one did 5.577 with 1.7V). And yeah, for daily anything beyond 220 isn't really worth it, but for benching its fun... 

[bimmerman]

Thinking about jumping to an SR-2 build. Anyone have suggestions on cases and/or chipset waterblocks?

 

Looks like the EK and Koolance stuff is NLA.

[MaratM]

On 14.04.2018 at 12:04 AM, bimmerman said:

Thinking about jumping to an SR-2 build. Anyone have suggestions on cases and/or chipset waterblocks?

 

Looks like the EK and Koolance stuff is NLA.

Your only option for waterblocks is to look for it on the second hand market, or some retails might have some leftovers