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More gamers are playing on Radeon graphics than Intel and Nvidia combined

Liltrekkie
By Liltrekkie
in Tech News
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Posted
11 hours ago, Godlygamer23 said:

The problem that I have with including consoles is that they're forced to use AMD hardware. Both Sony and Microsoft chose a custom AMD SoC for their consoles, and no console gamer has a choice in the matter, so it's not like they went "I'm going with Sony because they used AMD." There's simply no choice, and I'm not sure that it matters since again, console gamers are forced to use the AMD SoCs in order to use the PS4 and Xbox One.

and likewise, if Sony and MS had chosen Nvidia, all console gamers would be forced to use Nvidia.

 

The choice of hardware thus lies with SONY and MS. Thus the vendor that can pitch and price their hardware the most tempting will be used in consoles. Apparently, for the current gen products, AMD had the most compelling product in terms of features and price. Nvidia did not. Intel did not.

 

You have to realize that only the most complete package is tempting for MS and Sony. OBVIOUSLY, if they did not chose the package from NV or Intel or qualcomm or whatever, then those packages was not targeted enough towards what a console is -> A gaming machine on the cheap.

 

Cheap does not mean rubbish, it means that the investment in hardware is low enough to still have a profit margin.

Current setup

Images of setup: http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/183-show-off-your-setup/?p=5872590

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I could have easily assumed that with just common sense. Does intel do dedicated and integrated graphics for desktops and laptops and do consoles? Nope! Does nVidia? Nope! Does AMD? Yes! The only company to do dedicated and integrated graphics solutions and have multiple console solutions. That does not mean they are all used for gaming (it's OK to assume the console are for gaming). Does not mean it's what people want. And does not mean AMD is bringing in huge profits from it. Simply they are the most common. 

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having statistics in your favor means nothing if you don't gain much from it.

May the light have your back and your ISO low.

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I an see a lot of people here didn't get the general jist of the what the article is trying to say or just want to pick and chose what a gaming device is.

CPU: Intel i7 7700K | GPU: ROG Strix GTX 1080Ti | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 (faulty) | Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB 3200Mhz 16GB | OS Drive: Western Digital Black NVMe 250GB | Game Drive(s): Samsung 970 Evo 500GB, Hitachi 7K3000 3TB 3.5" | Motherboard: Gigabyte Z270x Gaming 7 | Case: Fractal Design Define S (No Window and modded front Panel) | Monitor(s): Dell S2716DG G-Sync 144Hz, Acer R240HY 60Hz (Dead) | Keyboard: G.SKILL RIPJAWS KM780R MX | Mouse: Steelseries Sensei 310 (Striked out parts are sold or dead, awaiting zen2 parts)

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14 hours ago, Notional said:

Consoles are used (almost exclusively) for gaming. The only game apple users play is "why is my bank accounts empty?".

I beg to differ on the first remark. Many people use there Xbox to stream movies, watch tv shows, use the Internet (yuck), and yes play games.

▓ƆԀ▓ S▓₱▓Ɇ▓c▓s▓: i7 6ʇɥפᴉƎ00K (4.4ghz), Asus DeLuxe X99A II, GT҉X҉1҉0҉8҉0 Zotac Amp ExTrꍟꎭe),Si6F4Gb D???????r PlatinUm, EVGA G2 Sǝʌǝᘉ5ᙣᙍᖇᓎᙎᗅᖶt, Phanteks Enthoo Primo, 3TB WD Black, 500gb 850 Evo, H100iGeeTeeX, Windows 10, K70 R̸̢̡̭͍͕̱̭̟̩̀̀̃́̃͒̈́̈́͑̑́̆͘͜ͅG̶̦̬͊́B̸͈̝̖͗̈́, G502, HyperX Cloud 2s, Asus MX34. פN∩SW∀S 960 EVO

Just keeping this here as a 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̌̅̒̾̈́̆͌̌̾̎̽̐̅̏́̈̔͛̀̋̃͊̒̓͗͒̑͒̃͂̌̄̇̑̇͛̆̾͛̒̇̍̒̓̀̈́̄̐͂̍͊͗̎̔͌͛̂̏̉̊̎͗͊͒̂̈̽̊́̔̊̃͑̈́̑̌̋̓̅̔́́͒̄̈́̈̂͐̈̅̈̓͌̓͊́̆͌̉͐̊̉͛̓̏̓̅̈́͂̉̒̇̉̆̀̍̄̇͆͛̏̉̑̃̓͂́͋̃̆̒͋̓͊̄́̓̕̕̕̚͘͘͘̚̕̚͘̕̕͜͜͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͠ͅS̷̢̨̧̢̡̨̢̨̢̨̧̧̨̧͚̱̪͇̱̮̪̮̦̝͖̜͙̘̪̘̟̱͇͎̻̪͚̩͍̠̹̮͚̦̝̤͖̙͔͚̙̺̩̥̻͈̺̦͕͈̹̳̖͓̜͚̜̭͉͇͖̟͔͕̹̯̬͍̱̫̮͓̙͇̗̙̼͚̪͇̦̗̜̼̠͈̩̠͉͉̘̱̯̪̟͕̘͖̝͇̼͕̳̻̜͖̜͇̣̠̹̬̗̝͓̖͚̺̫͛̉̅̐̕͘͜͜͜͜ͅͅͅ.̶̨̢̢̨̢̨̢̛̻͙̜̼̮̝̙̣̘̗̪̜̬̳̫̙̮̣̹̥̲̥͇͈̮̟͉̰̮̪̲̗̳̰̫̙͍̦̘̠̗̥̮̹̤̼̼̩͕͉͕͇͙̯̫̩̦̟̦̹͈͔̱̝͈̤͓̻̟̮̱͖̟̹̝͉̰͊̓̏̇͂̅̀̌͑̿͆̿̿͗̽̌̈́̉̂̀̒̊̿͆̃̄͑͆̃̇͒̀͐̍̅̃̍̈́̃̕͘͜͜͝͠͠z̴̢̢̡̧̢̢̧̢̨̡̨̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̛̲͚̠̜̮̠̜̞̤̺͈̘͍̻̫͖̣̥̗̙̳͓͙̫̫͖͍͇̬̲̳̭̘̮̤̬̖̼͎̬̯̼̮͔̭̠͎͓̼̖̟͈͓̦̩̦̳̙̮̗̮̩͙͓̮̰̜͎̺̞̝̪͎̯̜͈͇̪̙͎̩͖̭̟͎̲̩͔͓͈͌́̿͐̍̓͗͑̒̈́̎͂̋͂̀͂̑͂͊͆̍͛̄̃͌͗̌́̈̊́́̅͗̉͛͌͋̂̋̇̅̔̇͊͑͆̐̇͊͋̄̈́͆̍̋̏͑̓̈́̏̀͒̂̔̄̅̇̌̀̈́̿̽̋͐̾̆͆͆̈̌̿̈́̎͌̊̓̒͐̾̇̈́̍͛̅͌̽́̏͆̉́̉̓̅́͂͛̄̆͌̈́̇͐̒̿̾͌͊͗̀͑̃̊̓̈̈́̊͒̒̏̿́͑̄̑͋̀̽̀̔̀̎̄͑̌̔́̉̐͛̓̐̅́̒̎̈͆̀̍̾̀͂̄̈́̈́̈́̑̏̈́̐̽̐́̏̂̐̔̓̉̈́͂̕̚̕͘͘̚͘̚̕̚̚̚͘̕̕̕͜͜͝͠͠͝͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͠͝͝͝͝͝͝ͅͅͅī̸̧̧̧̡̨̨̢̨̛̛̘͓̼̰̰̮̗̰͚̙̥̣͍̦̺͈̣̻͇̱͔̰͈͓͖͈̻̲̫̪̲͈̜̲̬̖̻̰̦̰͙̤̘̝̦̟͈̭̱̮̠͍̖̲͉̫͔͖͔͈̻̖̝͎̖͕͔̣͈̤̗̱̀̅̃̈́͌̿̏͋̊̇̂̀̀̒̉̄̈́͋͌̽́̈́̓̑̈̀̍͗͜͜͠͠ͅp̴̢̢̧̨̡̡̨̢̨̢̢̢̨̡̛̛͕̩͕̟̫̝͈̖̟̣̲̖̭̙͇̟̗͖͎̹͇̘̰̗̝̹̤̺͉͎̙̝̟͙͚̦͚͖̜̫̰͖̼̤̥̤̹̖͉͚̺̥̮̮̫͖͍̼̰̭̤̲͔̩̯̣͖̻͇̞̳̬͉̣̖̥̣͓̤͔̪̙͎̰̬͚̣̭̞̬͎̼͉͓̮͙͕̗̦̞̥̮̘̻͎̭̼͚͎͈͇̥̗͖̫̮̤̦͙̭͎̝͖̣̰̱̩͎̩͎̘͇̟̠̱̬͈̗͍̦̘̱̰̤̱̘̫̫̮̥͕͉̥̜̯͖̖͍̮̼̲͓̤̮͈̤͓̭̝̟̲̲̳̟̠͉̙̻͕͙̞͔̖͈̱̞͓͔̬̮͎̙̭͎̩̟̖͚̆͐̅͆̿͐̄̓̀̇̂̊̃̂̄̊̀͐̍̌̅͌̆͊̆̓́̄́̃̆͗͊́̓̀͑͐̐̇͐̍́̓̈́̓̑̈̈́̽͂́̑͒͐͋̊͊̇̇̆̑̃̈́̎͛̎̓͊͛̐̾́̀͌̐̈́͛̃̂̈̿̽̇̋̍͒̍͗̈͘̚̚͘̚͘͘͜͜͜͜͜͜͠͠͝͝ͅͅͅ☻♥■∞{╚mYÄÜXτ╕○\╚Θº£¥ΘBM@Q05♠{{↨↨▬§¶‼↕◄►☼1♦  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Posted
1 hour ago, SamStrecker said:

I beg to differ on the first remark. Many people use there Xbox to stream movies, watch tv shows, use the Internet (yuck), and yes play games.

Why I wrote almost. Sure you can use it for other things, but how many people buy a console and don't play games on it? I would think that number would be insignificant.

Watching Intel have competition is like watching a headless chicken trying to get out of a mine field

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Posted
6 hours ago, Misanthrope said:

This part might as well read "This is where our fancy numbers guy flatout made up fucking bullshit!"

 

Meanwhile in reality land:

 

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/

 

survey.PNG

Steam is only ONE source of information.

Many of the plebs who play LoL, Overwatch or WoW only dont use steam. They just use the respective game launcher. Claiming that steam is the only true source of info is asinine at best.

 

That being said. I wonder how many consoles HAS AMD graphics... lets see

20m XB1s

nearly 50m PS4s

and what else? Wii? those didnt sell remotely close to that many consoles. PS3 and XB360 was NV/IBM.... So OPs numbers doesn't add up.... unless i am missing some chinese knock-off brand that sold millions of units.

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Posted
4 minutes ago, Prysin said:

Steam is only ONE source of information.

Many of the plebs who play LoL, Overwatch or WoW only dont use steam. They just use the respective game launcher. Claiming that steam is the only true source of info is asinine at best.

 

That being said. I wonder how many consoles HAS AMD graphics... lets see

20m XB1s

nearly 50m PS4s

and what else? Wii? those didnt sell remotely close to that many consoles. PS3 and XB360 was NV/IBM.... So OPs numbers doesn't add up.... unless i am missing some chinese knock-off brand that sold millions of units.

The Wii used ATi's GPU so there's technically 100 million right there. Plus another 18 for the WiiU

 

A lot of Apple's computers had AMD GPUs in them, more often than NVIDIA's.

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13 minutes ago, Prysin said:

Steam is only ONE source of information.

Many of the plebs who play LoL, Overwatch or WoW only dont use steam. They just use the respective game launcher. Claiming that steam is the only true source of info is asinine at best.

 

That being said. I wonder how many consoles HAS AMD graphics... lets see

20m XB1s

nearly 50m PS4s

and what else? Wii? those didnt sell remotely close to that many consoles. PS3 and XB360 was NV/IBM.... So OPs numbers doesn't add up.... unless i am missing some chinese knock-off brand that sold millions of units.

True, yet the article quoted by OP uses steam as well but attempts some statistics chicanery instead of being honest about it: PC gaming belongs 1st to intel but second to Nvidia, and even more important is that the relevant, sales driven ( Mobas I consider microtransaction driven or post-sale not really profit driven) games as shown on the steam survey, belongs to Nvidia.

 

Counting AMD because of the console market is extremely disengenious first because the console market is extremely different overall: AMD doesn't has to sell products in retail directly, game devs don't need to account for as many configurations, development and entry level is usually much more expensive (i.e. most games do want at least some physical retail prescence with it sometimes dominating sales numbers instead of digital distribution) and perhaps the most important is that, if the current financial numbers are anything to go by, these console hardware deals are terrible for AMD as a company as they're basically undercutting Nvidia so much they barely get any fucking returns, specially as time goes by.

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Posted
14 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

The Wii used ATi's GPU so there's technically 100 million right there. Plus another 18 for the WiiU

 

A lot of Apple's computers had AMD GPUs in them, more often than NVIDIA's.

almost all apple products use AMD exclusively for many many years now. If they dont have AMD iGPUs, they have intel IRIS or similar. Havent seen a apple product using NV hardware for many many years

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1 minute ago, Prysin said:

almost all apple products use AMD exclusively for many many years now. If they dont have AMD iGPUs, they have intel IRIS or similar. Havent seen a apple product using NV hardware for many many years

All of the non-retina slim iMacs were NVIDIA. A handful of generations of the regular unibody were as well. The MacBooks had NVIDIA in later generations before becoming a glorified tablet with a keyboard. And MBPs went back and forth.

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4 hours ago, Bsmith said:

having statistics in your favor means nothing if you don't gain much from it.

Pretty much this: trusting statistics without looking at the methodology usually leads to widespread myths

 

Spoiler

Like the wage gap.

 

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Posted
2 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

True, yet the article quoted by OP uses steam as well but attempts some statistics chicanery instead of being honest about it: PC gaming belongs 1st to intel but second to Nvidia, and even more important is that the relevant, sales driven ( Mobas I consider microtransaction driven or post-sale not really profit driven) games as shown on the steam survey, belongs to Nvidia.

 

Counting AMD because of the console market is extremely disengenious first because the console market is extremely different overall: AMD doesn't has to sell products in retail directly, game devs don't need to account for as many configurations, development and entry level is usually much more expensive (i.e. most games do want at least some physical retail prescence with it sometimes dominating sales numbers instead of digital distribution) and perhaps the most important is that, if the current financial numbers are anything to go by, these console hardware deals are terrible for AMD as a company as they're basically undercutting Nvidia so much they barely get any fucking returns, specially as time goes by.

yes, but this article is not, under any circumstances a discussion of "PC gamers".

 

It is about Gamers.

 

and by that accord, some kiddo with a gameboy color IS a gamer. Now, mind you, they narrowed it down to x86 products, which means PC, Mac, Linux, PS4,XB "OG", XB360, XB1, Wii and WiiU. Those are the only true x86 gaming systems.

By that accord, due to console sales, AMD HAS a large advantage. Just think about it. PS4 and XB1 alone is 70m+ AMD GPUs. This is a fact!!! Doesnt matter if Nvidia sells shitloads of dGPUs, or intel sells shitloads of iGPUs. Under no circumstances does either one of them ship in THAT large quantities unless looking at all their products as a whole.

The algorithm used to narrow down the number of gamers, whilst i wont comment on its accuracy, is a necessity to have a discussion at all.

 

How many Macbook Pro's doesnt come with AMD GPUs?
All of them since 2012 AFAIK. Yet how many of those MBPs are used for gaming? 10%? 20%?? Probably no more then that.

 

The thing is. not ALL GPUs on steam is used for gaming. Steam is a very nice place to get ahold of cheap game development software too, or music editing software. Hell iv'e seen Sony Vegas at 25% off during steam sales. If you are looking for legal "pro" software, steam is NOT a bad platform. Thus all steam numbers may not be accuratly representative either. Many steam PCs are belonging to the same person, i got several AMD products and a couple of Nvidia products. Yet i only use ONE of them... Unlike most PC users, which often have a laptop in addition to their desktop, MOST console owners only have ONE console. Some have two or three. But most only have one. Thus console numbers are a bit more credible in terms of actual market share.

Think about it, if we removed all the intel iGPUs solely belonging in systems that is not regularily used for gaming and only kept the "active" gaming setup. i think we would see a dramatical drop in intel iGPUs.

 

AMD and Nvidias numbers in steam is more credible then Intels by a wide margin. Because most people who do go to the hassle to acquire a dGPU will use it for gaming. Unlike iGPU users who stream netflix on the craptop while playing overwatch on their main PC.

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2 minutes ago, goodtofufriday said:

I dont think most console gamers ecen know that AMD powers their console. 

Or even know amd/nvidia. 

Have a friend who doesn't believe that sony or microsoft would be stupid enough to put amd products in their consoles. Guess he wanted his ps4 to cost more money than it already does.

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2 minutes ago, XenosTech said:

Have a friend who doesn't believe that sony or microsoft would be stupid enough to put amd products in their consoles. Guess he wanted his ps4 to cost more money than it already does.

d-d-did you tell him the t-t-truth?

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Posted
Just now, Prysin said:

d-d-did you tell him the t-t-truth?

lol yeah cause he asked... To think he did the same IT degree as me at college (I dropped out because I was bored of school)

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10 minutes ago, Prysin said:

yes, but this article is not, under any circumstances a discussion of "PC gamers".

 

It is about Gamers.

 

and by that accord, some kiddo with a gameboy color IS a gamer. Now, mind you, they narrowed it down to x86 products, which means PC, Mac, Linux, PS4,XB "OG", XB360, XB1, Wii and WiiU. Those are the only true x86 gaming systems.

By that accord, due to console sales, AMD HAS a large advantage. Just think about it. PS4 and XB1 alone is 70m+ AMD GPUs. This is a fact!!! Doesnt matter if Nvidia sells shitloads of dGPUs, or intel sells shitloads of iGPUs. Under no circumstances does either one of them ship in THAT large quantities unless looking at all their products as a whole.

The algorithm used to narrow down the number of gamers, whilst i wont comment on its accuracy, is a necessity to have a discussion at all.

 

How many Macbook Pro's doesnt come with AMD GPUs?
All of them since 2012 AFAIK. Yet how many of those MBPs are used for gaming? 10%? 20%?? Probably no more then that.

 

The thing is. not ALL GPUs on steam is used for gaming. Steam is a very nice place to get ahold of cheap game development software too, or music editing software. Hell iv'e seen Sony Vegas at 25% off during steam sales. If you are looking for legal "pro" software, steam is NOT a bad platform. Thus all steam numbers may not be accuratly representative either. Many steam PCs are belonging to the same person, i got several AMD products and a couple of Nvidia products. Yet i only use ONE of them... Unlike most PC users, which often have a laptop in addition to their desktop, MOST console owners only have ONE console. Some have two or three. But most only have one. Thus console numbers are a bit more credible in terms of actual market share.

Think about it, if we removed all the intel iGPUs solely belonging in systems that is not regularily used for gaming and only kept the "active" gaming setup. i think we would see a dramatical drop in intel iGPUs.

 

AMD and Nvidias numbers in steam is more credible then Intels by a wide margin. Because most people who do go to the hassle to acquire a dGPU will use it for gaming. Unlike iGPU users who stream netflix on the craptop while playing overwatch on their main PC.

As I said, the console hardware deals are terrible for AMD, they've been making these chips for years and haven't seen a motherfucking nickel out of it. They're likely selling those chips to the console manufactuers are so razor thin of a proft margin that they break even at most from the looks of it.

 

Selling a lot of units is pretty meaningless if you don't actually profit for it: I don't care if they sell 3x more units if those sales are putting them out of business.

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12 minutes ago, XenosTech said:

Have a friend who doesn't believe that sony or microsoft would be stupid enough to put amd products in their consoles. Guess he wanted his ps4 to cost more money than it already does.

Your friend probably didn't live through the red ring of death plague.

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1 minute ago, Misanthrope said:

You're friend probably didn't live through the red ring of death plague.

He doesn't like xbox, so I highly doubt he did.

CPU: Intel i7 7700K | GPU: ROG Strix GTX 1080Ti | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 (faulty) | Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB 3200Mhz 16GB | OS Drive: Western Digital Black NVMe 250GB | Game Drive(s): Samsung 970 Evo 500GB, Hitachi 7K3000 3TB 3.5" | Motherboard: Gigabyte Z270x Gaming 7 | Case: Fractal Design Define S (No Window and modded front Panel) | Monitor(s): Dell S2716DG G-Sync 144Hz, Acer R240HY 60Hz (Dead) | Keyboard: G.SKILL RIPJAWS KM780R MX | Mouse: Steelseries Sensei 310 (Striked out parts are sold or dead, awaiting zen2 parts)

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Just now, XenosTech said:

He doesn't like xbox, so I highly doubt he did.

The PS3 also had plenty of yellow light of death. Nowhere near as prevalent as the 360 but it was still fairly high failure rate numbers, particularly for consoles with such a long cycle: barely any original PS3 models survived the 6 years mark.

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2 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

As I said, the console hardware deals are terrible for AMD, they've been making these chips for years and haven't seen a motherfucking nickle out of it. They're likely selling those chips to the console manufactuers are so razor thin of a proft margin that they break even at most from the looks of it.

 

Selling a lot of units is pretty meaningless if you don't actually profit for it: I don't care if they sell 3x more units if those sales are putting them out of business.

Actually it's the other way around. In the last earnings reports the semi-custom market seems to be one of their main revenue streams. Even if the margins are thin, the total revenue at least helps to keep the whole thing afloat.

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Posted
Just now, Misanthrope said:

The PS3 also had plenty of yellow light of death. Nowhere near as prevalent as the 360 but it was still fairly high failure rate numbers, particularly for consoles with such a long cycle: barely any original PS3 models survived the 6 years mark.

Guess I got lucky with my ps3... Still works until my nephew breaks it.

CPU: Intel i7 7700K | GPU: ROG Strix GTX 1080Ti | PSU: Seasonic X-1250 (faulty) | Memory: Corsair Vengeance RGB 3200Mhz 16GB | OS Drive: Western Digital Black NVMe 250GB | Game Drive(s): Samsung 970 Evo 500GB, Hitachi 7K3000 3TB 3.5" | Motherboard: Gigabyte Z270x Gaming 7 | Case: Fractal Design Define S (No Window and modded front Panel) | Monitor(s): Dell S2716DG G-Sync 144Hz, Acer R240HY 60Hz (Dead) | Keyboard: G.SKILL RIPJAWS KM780R MX | Mouse: Steelseries Sensei 310 (Striked out parts are sold or dead, awaiting zen2 parts)

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9 minutes ago, Jovidah said:

Actually it's the other way around. In the last earnings reports the semi-custom market seems to be one of their main revenue streams. Even if the margins are thin, the total revenue at least helps to keep the whole thing afloat.

No this isn't accurate: they have to keep manufacturing the chips or dealing with the fabs so they keep making them. Without that huge investment they'd have more money for R&D and wouldn't lag behind in tech so much.

 

But even more imporantly: they got screwed on the initial deal. Probably they wanted to outbid Nvidia so bad they settled for an extremely low profit margin, if they were making decent money on all those console sales they'd be rolling in cash.

 

Say what you will about Nvidia but they don't need to cheapen their brand and mass produce products almost at costs to compete: they can get away with consistently raising the price of the high end cards and at the end of the day, the fact that they have the upper hand in tech and a consistent lead on the high end market has make them a lot more money than AMD selling millions upon millions of console crap chips they barely break even on.

 

Sure it keeps them afloat but not for much longer: at this rate if they don't start to make a lot more money they simply won't be able to offer a console chip that makes sense and Nvidia will be able to just offer something much better to the point that Sony, MS and Nintendo would go "yeah this might costs us more but it just makes more sense"

 

Like Nintendo just did with the switch: AMD has no answer for that when is the last time you've seen a competitive AMD tablet or phone?

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