AMD's Zen and Intel Kaby lake CPUs are reportedly delayed

[dalekphalm]

3 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

If anything AMD could be delayed, because perhaps Apple is getting first grabs at CPUs for their future line-ups?  Hopefully.

Interesting... A delay caused by them filling a large OEM order.

 

If that was the case, I think they should still go ahead with their current planned Soft Launch, and still push whatever chips out to consumers that they can.

 

Never the less, I still don't believe this rumour for a second, until there's something verifiable.

[Mr.Meerkat]

Meh, oh well if it's late...it's no longer that big of a deal as I've already upgraded to a 5820k (what was a I meant to do, go without my main PC for 8 months for polaris or 3 for Broadwell-e?).

[dalekphalm]

I also like how everyone is talking about AMD and not too many talking about Intel

 

But it's probably fake for both of them anyway, so whatever.

[SurvivorNVL]

1 minute ago, dalekphalm said:

Interesting... A delay caused by them filling a large OEM order.

 

If that was the case, I think they should still go ahead with their current planned Soft Launch, and still push whatever chips out to consumers that they can.

 

Never the less, I still don't believe this rumour for a second, until there's something verifiable.

I hope it is true, and that Apple has consumed AMD's initial pickings.  It'd be perfect for them.  A bunch of cash for AMD, at no loss given the scope Apple can order for custom or already build parts.  AMD is perfect for Apple, x86 APU's, get rid of discrete gpus for onboard graphics running 8GB of HBM2.  Hell, that'd be excellent for all Apple product lines, just need a custom HBM SOC for tablets and phones.  Then they can keep making themselves thinner and thinner for some obscene reason.

[dalekphalm]

4 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

I hope it is true, and that Apple has consumed AMD's initial pickings.  It'd be perfect for them.  A bunch of cash for AMD, at no loss given the scope Apple can order for custom or already build parts.  AMD is perfect for Apple, x86 APU's, get rid of discrete gpus for onboard graphics running 8GB of HBM2.  Hell, that'd be excellent for all Apple product lines, just need a custom HBM SOC for tablets and phones.  Then they can keep making themselves thinner and thinner for some obscene reason.

It would certainly make for a kickass Macbook Air, and even if the Higher End APU's deliver on promised performance, that could be an awesome Macbook Pro too, remove the dGPU and use a higher powered APU w/ Polaris Graphics. Hell AMD could do Semi-Custom Zen APU designs for them too.

 

But alas, I remain skeptical until we hear more

[Rekojylekilun]

Now we'll have enough time to upgrade from Haswell to Skylake three cheers for Intel and their fabulous products that are worth every penny.

[handymanshandle]

2 hours ago, zMeul said:

makes sense if you also consider the reports AMD has problems with Polaris clocks

it could be that GloFo has issues with Samsung's 14nm FinFET

inb4 AMD should've used TSMC or Samsung themselves? GloFo uses Samsung Designs?

[SurvivorNVL]

13 minutes ago, dalekphalm said:

It would certainly make for a kickass Macbook Air, and even if the Higher End APU's deliver on promised performance, that could be an awesome Macbook Pro too, remove the dGPU and use a higher powered APU w/ Polaris Graphics. Hell AMD could do Semi-Custom Zen APU designs for them too.

 

But alas, I remain skeptical until we hear more

Oh, I too shall remain skeptical as well.  Though I really do hope if AMD does land all the future console deals, they also land CPU and GPU for Apple, that'd keep the going nice and strong. It'd also mean I'd own an all AMD machine when I snag up a Macbook Pro in 2017.

[Curufinwe_wins]

1 hour ago, Prysin said:

makes sense in your world.

IN the world the rest of us live in, it doesnt. As all the shit you are talking about is unfounded and debunked rumors.

 

Polaris clocks has already been shown to be 1200MHz or higher at live demos.

The AMD CEO went on stage and said ZEN was on track 9 days ago.

ZEN on track meant they just started sending out advanced engineering samples... That is like 6-9 months from consumer non-paper launch (which isn't that crazy, and could be VERY late Q4 2016, but I think Q1 2017 seems much much more realistic).

 

Also, in fairness to Zmeul, it isn't obvious 1200MHz means they aren't having clock speed issues.

 

I mean consider this: Suppose Nvidia was showing off Pascal with 1500-1700 speed clocks. In hindsight that would be clear evidence of issues with clock speed (since low 2000s are normal), but without knowledge of Pascal, you would NEVER have arbitrarily expected clock speeds that high (at the uppermost levels of Maxwell OCs) to be indicative of a POOR chip.

 

Thus is IS POSSIBLE (although I don't necessarily believe it to be this way), that even though 1200 Mhz seems very high compared to Fiji and Hawaii, that it is actually notably lower than what AMD was looking for.

 

Again, I don't think AMD actually is having this issue, but just saying that seeing 1200 Mhz doesn't really mean anything.

[Trixanity]

13 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

ZEN on track meant they just started sending out advanced engineering samples... That is like 6-9 months from consumer non-paper launch (which isn't that crazy, and could be VERY late Q4 2016, but I think Q1 2017 seems much much more realistic).

 

Also, in fairness to Zmeul, it isn't obvious 1200MHz means they aren't having clock speed issues.

 

I mean consider this: Suppose Nvidia was showing off Pascal with 1500-1700 speed clocks. In hindsight that would be clear evidence of issues with clock speed (since low 2000s are normal), but without knowledge of Pascal, you would NEVER have arbitrarily expected clock speeds that high (at the uppermost levels of Maxwell OCs) to be indicative of a POOR chip.

 

Thus is IS POSSIBLE (although I don't necessarily believe it to be this way), that even though 1200 Mhz seems very high compared to Fiji and Hawaii, that it is actually notably lower than what AMD was looking for.

 

Again, I don't think AMD actually is having this issue, but just saying that seeing 1200 Mhz doesn't really mean anything.

The clock speed issues zMeul is referring to is not that AMD isn't hitting 2000 MHz. He's referring to the news article he has been posting that AMD was struggling to hit 850 MHz with Polaris and now he's still regurgitating it despite AMD showing it off running at what? 1266 MHz?

That proves the news article false but I guess you can't dispel blind faith.

Keep in mind clock speed isn't everything.

43 minutes ago, SurvivorNVL said:

I hope it is true, and that Apple has consumed AMD's initial pickings.  It'd be perfect for them.  A bunch of cash for AMD, at no loss given the scope Apple can order for custom or already build parts.  AMD is perfect for Apple, x86 APU's, get rid of discrete gpus for onboard graphics running 8GB of HBM2.  Hell, that'd be excellent for all Apple product lines, just need a custom HBM SOC for tablets and phones.  Then they can keep making themselves thinner and thinner for some obscene reason.

Problem is Zen APUs won't arrive till probably Q2 2017 so that doesn't make sense in this context. Apple would, as you say, most likely be primarily interested in APUs, particularly mobile APUs. We might have to wait a year from now for that. 

 

Zen will launch with full blown desktop CPUs, so at best Apple would be picking some up for the Mac Pro or something. 

 

I have actually heard some rumors that Zen APUs have been delayed till 2018. Apparently due to lack of resources aka not enough money and not enough manpower. However that wouldn't make sense since Zen APUs would be a more profitable product than a Zen CPU so I wouldn't put too much stock in that. Well, unless they are more focused on enterprise/datacenter customers which would in turn probably be even more profitable and that's assuming they can push Intel to the side.

[Curufinwe_wins]

1 minute ago, Trixanity said:

The clock speed issues zMeul is referring to is not that AMD isn't hitting 2000 MHz. He's referring to the news article he has been posting that AMD was struggling to hit 850 MHz with Polaris and now he's still regurgitating it despite AMD showing it off running at what? 1266 MHz?

That proves the news article false already.

 

Fair enough. I didn't even read the AMD clock speed issue article (Fiji did it for me haha).

[maulemall]

3 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

 

I have actually heard some rumors that Zen APUs have been delayed till 2018. Apparently due to lack of resources aka not enough money and not enough manpower. However that wouldn't make sense since Zen APUs would be a more profitable product than a Zen CPU so I wouldn't put too much stock in that. Well, unless they are more focused on enterprise/datacenter customers which would in turn probably be even more profitable and that's assuming they can push Intel to the side.

AMD is expanding in India so I don't believe any financial rumors.

 

[Trixanity]

3 minutes ago, maulemall said:

AMD is expanding in India so I don't believe any financial rumors.

 

Well, I don't believe most of these rumors either unless they make perfect sense and have even a shred of evidence. That means I don't believe this particular rumor.

[Arc_Jester]

2 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

Well, I don't believe most of these rumors either unless they make perfect sense and have even a shred of evidence. That means I don't believe this particular rumor.

https://community.amd.com/thread/201342

[Trixanity]

4 minutes ago, Arc_Jester said:

https://community.amd.com/thread/201342

You misunderstood me. Let me clarify: I meant that I don't believe the rumor that Zen APUs are delayed till 2018. 

 

AMD expanding is no big secret  They are on their way up again.

[Arc_Jester]

3 minutes ago, Trixanity said:

You misunderstood me. Let me clarify: I meant that I don't believe the rumor that Zen APUs are delayed till 2018. 

 

AMD expanding is no big secret  They are on their way up again.

Oh , the way you worded it made it seem like you didn't believe they were expanding.

[zMeul]

5 hours ago, wcreek said:

inb4 AMD should've used TSMC or Samsung themselves? GloFo uses Samsung Designs?

GloFo licensed the 14nm process from Samsung: http://www.globalfoundries.com/newsroom/press-releases/2014/04/17/samsung-and-globalfoundries-forge-strategic-collaboration-to-deliver-multi-sourced-offering-of-14nm-finfet-semiconductor-technology

 

if you recall, Apple sourced custom chips on LPE process from both Samsung (14nm) and TSMC (16nm) - those from Samsung were hotter

[zMeul]

5 hours ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

Also, in fairness to Zmeul, it isn't obvious 1200MHz means they aren't having clock speed issues.

let me remind you that nVidia shower 2+Ghz on stage and no one was able to achieve that with the FE cards, only with the AIB custom boards

 

if AMD didn't had, and does not have, problems with Polaris, where are the cards? they showed Polaris 10 ever since January

[ApolloFury]

8 hours ago, Notional said:

Intel's Skylake CPU's has been very expensive with little added performance/features to show for it, so it would not be a surprise if Intel has built up a big stock they find hard to sell.

But it makes zero sense for AMD to do the same. ZEN with 8 core/16 threads does not clash with any existing product SKU from AMD, thus it cannot cannibalize any other AMD products, but only compute with Intel products. So the argument that stock plays a role for AMD is nonsensical.

 Here in Australia the i7 6700K is $10 cheaper than the 4790K, DDR4 is only $5 more. Digitalfoundry did a video where they tested all i7s from 2600K to 6700K and shows a 10% performance improvement from Haswell with all i7s overclocked to 4.4GHz. Other benchmarks shows 6700K barely performing better than the 4790K because the stock turbo clock has been nerfed from 4.4 to 4.2. put all i7s to the same clock speed and it's a different story, 40% gap from 2600K to 6700K according to Digitalfoundry's all i7s 4.4 test.

[annoyingmoments]

Well after all those experts and technology analysts in here, which go off like a tornado on rumours, I guess I should buy AMD stock. Especially if the share holder revenue is higher than Apple.

 

The whole thread seems to be gliding into fanboyism, at least for some folks.

 

Can we all calm down now? 

[Prysin]

1 hour ago, zMeul said:

let me remind you that nVidia shower 2+Ghz on stage and no one was able to achieve that with the FE cards, only with the AIB custom boards

 

if AMD didn't had, and does not have, problems with Polaris, where are the cards? they showed Polaris 10 ever since January

they showed it at their Macau event?
Linus got a exclusive first peek. Held it in his hand?

 

Are you THIS detached from reality?

 

[Coaxialgamer]

2 hours ago, zMeul said:

GloFo licensed the 14nm process from Samsung: http://www.globalfoundries.com/newsroom/press-releases/2014/04/17/samsung-and-globalfoundries-forge-strategic-collaboration-to-deliver-multi-sourced-offering-of-14nm-finfet-semiconductor-technology

 

if you recall, Apple sourced custom chips on LPE process from both Samsung (14nm) and TSMC (16nm) - those from Samsung were hotter

Except this is a different process.  The apple chips were on 14nm LPE, while zen will be on LPP

[leadeater]

32 minutes ago, Prysin said:

they showed it at their Macau event?
Linus got a exclusive first peek. Held it in his hand?

 

Are you THIS detached from reality?

 

At least HE didn't drop it .

 

Also why are Pascal and Polaris GPU's being discussed in this thread, they literally have zero bearing on AMD Zen or Intel architectures at all. Different engineering teams, different computational tasks, different architecture types. Any problems a manufacturer may or may not being having with one technology does not inherently flow through to other areas. You can even have issues with silicon die manufacturing at the same node size for a GPU die but not for the CPU die at the exact same plant.

 

There is one thing I can guarantee, Zen will be faster than any of AMD's previous offerings. Not only would they not release a slower product, brand suicide, it would actually be a difficult task to do so considering node size and advances in technology.

 

What we don't know and will never know until official product launch is where Zen sits in regards to Intel, engineering samples can be intentionally clocked lower. Engineering partners rarely want to do performance testing of chips, they are working on compatibility and integration first and foremost with performance being the last thing they test.

[zMeul]

25 minutes ago, Coaxialgamer said:

Except this is a different process.  The apple chips were on 14nm LPE, while zen will be on LPP

no exactly, I specified LPE - but LPP is an evolution of LPE

it's the same 14nm FinFET, but refined 

[Coaxialgamer]

2 hours ago, zMeul said:

Snip