The AMD Problem.

[App4that]

interesting discussion...guys, do you know what would make AMD cards perform better in games?! MONEY!!

AMD is OUT OF MONEY they are broke they haven't made a token in YEARS now...what do you expect?!

How do you convince developers to put some thought or optimization for cards that less than 30% of us PC gamers are using?

AMD used to give games with their cards, now they don't because there are almost no ''AMD sponsored'' games that are coming out...it's all nvidia meant to be played all over the place and gameworks and shit and it ain't gonna change until AMD stop trying to compete nvidia in price/performance cause clearly they are loosing what they have to do IMHO is settle down and cut price the 390 should be a good 50 to 80$ cheaper than a 970 for people to really start buying into it.

The real problem is that the 390 has potential. Epic potential. But without driver support it will never realize it.

[Praesi]

Not very difficult to see why. Which other games lets you turn it to a full blown waifu sim?

Sex sells very easily.

Yep. Took me Hours to get my Skyrim Sexbomb like i wanted her

[AMDisTheBEST]

Why is Asking why Radeon doesn't get out there and make relationships with developers as frequently as Nvidia trolling? What's in it for the developers? People will ether tire of their high powered GPU spinning its wheels because the manufacturer refuses to support it and change brand of GPU, or deal with their high powered GPU spinning its wheels because the manufacturer refuses to support it. Ether way the developer is doing what anyone would do and support those who support them.

I found your comments to be thoughtless and just plain wrong. Business adopt to meet the demands of the consumers, not the other way around. Developers loses 30% of the PC market alongside both the xbox 1 and PS4, platforms that vastly outsells PC and runs on AMD APUs FOR DOING SO. 

[Clyne]

 

 

Hmm got that confused with performance smoothness, ran 1080P 60FPS however. 

[i_build_nanosuits]

The real problem is that the 390 has potential. Epic potential. But without driver support it will never realize it.

Drivers from the radeon technology group (lol) and support and optimization from game developers are two key elements that would need to happen...both of which require money (big money) to be spend and AMD is not in a position to invest big bucks in those things.

[Praesi]

The real problem is that the 390 has potential. Epic potential. But without driver support it will never realize it.

Are you sure its a Driver Problem and not some weird stuff going on with the architecture itself?

AMD should know how to develop Drivers. They are around for some time now.  :blink:

[Praesi]

Drivers from the radeon technology group (lol) and support and optimization from game developers are two key elements that would need to happen...both of which require money (big money) to be spend and AMD is not in a position to invest big bucks in those things.

Last time i checked, AMD went minus with every Dollar they made. (Im sure its horrible gramma, but fuck it )

[App4that]

Are you sure its a Driver Problem and not some weird stuff going on with the architecture itself?

AMD should know how to develop Drivers. They are around for some time now.  :blink:

For the 390 I'd say driver. My 290 is noticeably smoother than the 390 I had. So ether Radeon is completely incompetent or the drivers haven't caught up yet.

[i_build_nanosuits]

Are you sure its a Driver Problem and not some weird stuff going on with the architecture itself?

AMD should know how to develop Drivers. They are around for some time now.  :blink:

The architecture is getting old and it has a lot of weaknesses indeed...somehow people seem to think those are brute-force powerhouses because they consume a lot of power, they run hot and they ship with a lot of memory...this to me is inefficiency, and lots of useless video memory...not brute-force.

 

here, this user submitted benchmark database rank the 390 above the 970, the 390 according to the benchmarks is 4% faster than the 970 overall when no driver issues are stopping it from being faster...but if you look at it closely the 970 is faster at rendering, NB calculations, lighting and reflection...all very nice to have, meanwhile the 390 is better at texture due to the better memory configuration but that can only go so far when it comes to gaming:

 

http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-970-vs-AMD-R9-390/2577vs3481

[xAcid9]

The architecture is getting old and it has a lot of weaknesses indeed...somehow people seem to think those are brute-force powerhouses because they consume a lot of power, they run hot and they ship with a lot of memory...this to me is inefficiency, and lots of useless video memory...not brute-force.

 

here, this user submitted benchmark database rank the 390 above the 970, the 390 according to the benchmarks is 4% faster than the 970 overall when no driver issues are stopping it from being faster...but if you look at it closely the 970 is faster at rendering, NB calculations, lighting and reflection...all very nice to have, meanwhile the 390 is better at texture due to the better memory configuration but that can only go so far when it comes to gaming:

 

http://gpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Nvidia-GTX-970-vs-AMD-R9-390/2577vs3481

-snip-

 

 

GPU tests include: DX9 and DX10 3D performance.

Congratz, website is totally reliable like Passmark. /s

[sandboarder08]

Everyone in this thread needs to watch this and hopefully Amd is about to change the game. Start at 00:58:30 into it.

https://youtu.be/-gM5tIa5nfw

Quoting myself cause again you guys should watch this.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Quoting myself cause again you guys should watch this.

 

Neh just forget it, threads like these appear very often. The same things are said every time. The same people appear every time. Everything here has already been said/posted before. It be best to leave those peeps alone. 

[App4that]

Neh just forget it, threads like these appear very often. The same things are said every time. The same people appear every time. Everything here has already been said/posted before. It be best to leave those peeps alone.

Did you watch it? They say the same things I've been saying. AMD has faster more powerful Hardware but lack the software to utilize it. Where Nvidia has the software and does a better job. They also say that though AMD is making bold announcements they lack any faith in AMDs ability to pull it off, that if it happens it will be the community that does it.

So rather than making snarky comments, watch it.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

Did you watch it? They say the same things I've been saying. AMD has faster more powerful Hardware but lack the software to utilize it. Where Nvidia has the software and does a better job. They also say that though AMD is making bold announcements they lack any faith in AMDs ability to pull it off, that if it happens it will be the community that does it.

So rather than making snarky comments, watch it.

 

Snaky comments? What for? Your exact words, what was said in the video was what I've already said 2 months ago. Let's not be sour over this yea. 

[App4that]

Snaky comments? What for? Your exact words, what was said in the video was what I've already said 2 months ago. Let's not be sour over this yea.

I used snarky because I feel this needs to be discussed. We are the community and as was said in the video are responsible for any change that happens. You have a point that this usually becomes a flame war but can't we find a way to stop that? If the same people are in these discussions that means they care, or they wouldn't be here.

[Kinda Bottlenecked]

I used snarky because I feel this needs to be discussed. We are the community and as was said in the video are responsible for any change that happens. You have a point that this usually becomes a flame war but can't we find a way to stop that? If the same people are in these discussions that means they care, or they wouldn't be here.

 

mmhmm.

[Longshot]

Bethesda and Rocksteady had all the time in the world. Bethesda is yet to release a game that isnt buggy.

Arkham City was broken at launch

 

Bethesda.... ya.... well their terminator games worked fine

[Praesi]

Quoting myself cause again you guys should watch this.

I watched it. What now?

[harrynowl]

600 series was unmatched by AMD. 7000 series were loud, power hungry and slower. That's why 7970 ghz edition had to come out and shit like that.

Pre catalyst 12.11, yea.

 

So release benchmarks wont really show that

 

A lot of people hail 12.11 as the miracle driver for GCN

 

But that does definitely back up to AMD being a bit slow when it comes to driver improvements for gamers 

[ZetZet]

Pre catalyst 12.11, yea.

 

So release benchmarks wont really show that

 

A lot of people hail 12.11 as the miracle driver for GCN

 

But that does definitely back up to AMD being a bit slow when it comes to driver improvements for gamers 

after drivers they were still loud and power hungry, just not slower. 

[harrynowl]

after drivers they were still loud and power hungry, just not slower. 

Off topic: Well the reference ones look pretty close to me, all at defaults:

 

 

On topic: Anyway the intention wasn't to derail the thread, I was more pointing out that it demonstrated AMDs driver history even in more recent times has been a bit hit and miss.

[App4that]

Off topic: Well the reference ones look pretty close to me, all at defaults:

 

 

On topic: Anyway the intention wasn't to derail the thread, I was more pointing out that it demonstrated AMDs driver history even in more recent times has been a bit hit and miss.

I'd say AMDs a stormtrooper, personally. And my GPU is Luke fucking Skywalker...

[sandboarder08]

I'd say AMDs a stormtrooper, personally. And my GPU is Luke fucking Skywalker...

So your gpu is depressed and hiding on far planet?

[App4that]

So your gpu is depressed and hiding on far planet?

No, my GPU prefers the expanded universe and gives it to Mara Jade on the daily. No spoilers btw.

[Prysin]

interesting discussion...guys, do you know what would make AMD cards perform better in games?! MONEY!!

AMD is OUT OF MONEY they are broke they haven't made a token in YEARS now...what do you expect?!

How do you convince developers to put some thought or optimization for cards that less than 30% of us PC gamers are using?

AMD used to give games with their cards, now they don't because there are almost no ''AMD sponsored'' games that are coming out...it's all nvidia meant to be played all over the place and gameworks and shit and it ain't gonna change until AMD stop trying to compete nvidia in price/performance cause clearly they are loosing what they have to do IMHO is settle down and cut price the 390 should be a good 50 to 80$ cheaper than a 970 for people to really start buying into it.

 

The AMD problem is REAL brother.

 

cutting the price of a product, even a Hawaii core, which is a very mature process by now, will eat into your margins...

 

now... how much margin do you think AMD has on the 390?

100 bucks? 200 bucks?

 

add in shipping, handling, import/export taxes, marketing, production costs etc... ill say AMD most likely have 150$ margin on their 390... probably less.

 

if you cut the cost by 50-80 bucks, you gotta do so out of AMDs margin. because no retailer on earth will cut THEIR margin to sell an AMD product. Just aint happening.

So that means AMD makes A LOT less money per card. Given their low market share, they do not have the "brand name" to do the marketing for them. So they would simply make less money, have less money to spend on marketing. Thus selling even less cards.

 

what AMD needs is to release FEWER PRODUCTS....

do a Nvidia, just cut down cores..

 

why have Bonaire, Pitcairn, Tonga, Hawaii and FIji???? WHY?

 

then you have a "Pro and XT" version of these.... WHY?

 

just do "Tonga" for lower end

Hawaii for mid to high range

Fiji for max

 

you could easily disable some ROPs/SPs in Tonga in order to "cut it down" enough to perform at 260X levels...

by doing so, a single fucking GPU core could span 3 cards... which means LESS COST....

Pit Hawaii XT (290X/390X) vs the 970.... you would absolutely demolish the 970

 if a 390X cost the same as a 970....

 

then just leave Fiji to deal with the rest.

 

THIS would have been a good idea... this way you need THREE PRODUCTS.... you can just disable SPs/ROPs/TMUs in BIOS, or do it on a hardware level....

they could just say "Custom bios = no warranty.... so good luck bios modding your 260X Tonga chip to a 380X tonga chip.... cuz we wont care what happens"