EZTV is dead as we know it, it was taken over by scammers

[Trik'Stari]

The only issue with the term theft in my opinion is that technology has changed faster then our legal terms.  Making perfect copies of something hasn't been a possibility for the entirety of human history until the last few decades.  The internet and computing in general have created situations we don't yet have legal terms for, so they fall under whatever term works best.  Your definition is cool and all, but I doubt it would even pretend to work as a legal defense.  Historically, when something new shows up that we don't have exact legal terms and case law for, it falls under whatever it most closely resembles.  It then gets hashed out and clarified via appeals and further legislation.

 

How I see this argument going for the "it's not theft" crowd.

Defendant:  Your honor, I can't be changed with theft because the definition of theft doesn't exactly fit word for word my actions.

Judge:  That's cool, still guilty, life still fucked.

That situation wouldn't happen though, because when one gets caught pirating, one doesn't get charged with theft, they get charged with piracy, copyright violations, and a whole host of other things. (like conspiracy to commit piracy

 

They don't get charged with theft, at least not that I've ever heard of. If you know of a case where someone caught pirating has been charged with theft, please share a link to it as I would be quite interested to read such a case.

 

Again, I'm not defending piracy. Back in high school I used to download music like almost everyone else, but it's been a LONG time since I did that. Now I just use stuff like spotify or soundcloud. Mainly because I just don't trust file sharing sites anymore, got WAY too many viruses back in high school, so now I just sit through adverts and listen to music on my PC.

[ChineseChef]

That situation wouldn't happen though, because when one gets caught pirating, one doesn't get charged with theft, they get charged with piracy, copyright violations, and a whole host of other things.

 

They don't get charged with theft, at least not that I've ever heard of.

 

So, basically, we are all arguing semantics, but the legal world already uses the right terminology?  And we are all simply arguing to be the most right on the internet about telling other people they are wrong for using an extremely generic term?  It is almost like we aren't all experts and we are speaking in generalities using generic terms so that everyone can understand each other.  Heaven forbid we don't all speak in perfect legalize 100% of the time. 

 

It is stealing, theft, copyright infringement, illegal copying, whatever the fuck you want to call it.  What we call it has literally 0 bearing on the proper legal terminology.  We are simply using words to most easily communicate an idea, the whole purpose of language.  The reality is, that as a collective, we could decide that theft now means to make illegal copies, Oxford could put that new line in their dictionaries, and theft would now mean whatever we want it to mean.  (We being the generic collective of the English speaking world)   Words mean what we want them to mean, and we can change that meaning whenever it suits us best.

 

Edit:  On a side note, my hostility is not meant for you, sorry.  I am just tired of the people who try to argue that it is perfectly moral and just and right simply because they want this thing they are taking.

Edited May 19, 2015 by ChineseChef

[Trik'Stari]

So, basically, we are all arguing semantics, but the legal world already uses the right terminology?  And we are all simply arguing to be the most right on the internet about telling other people they are wrong for using an extremely generic term?  It is almost like we aren't all experts and we are speaking in generalities using generic terms so that everyone can understand each other.  Heaven forbid we don't all speak in perfect legalize 100% of the time. 

 

It is stealing, theft, copyright infringement, illegal copying, whatever the fuck you want to call it.  What we call it has literally 0 bearing on the proper legal terminology.  We are simply using words to most easily communicate an idea, the whole purpose of language.  The reality is, that as a collective, we could decide that theft now means to make illegal copies, Oxford could put that new line in their dictionaries, and theft would now mean whatever we want it to mean.  (We being the generic collective of the English speaking world)   Words mean what we want them to mean, and we can change that meaning whenever it suits us best.

I'm just trying to fight the ignorant practice of calling it theft, because it doesn't meet any of requirements to qualify as theft. You can cop out by making the argument seem asinine if you want. But I choose not to.

 

Why would we alter the definition of theft to include piracy, when we already have terms to meet that crime? Terms like internet piracy, and illegal re-manufacturing and distribution. Piracy is theft the same way someone giving me a piece of gum out of their pack of gum, is theft.

[zacRupnow]

Then why is identity theft a thing?

You take something you don't own its theft.

it's digital Identity, to steal credit card and other money stuff, so it is removing something from someone's possession. Breaching copyright is creating a duplicate of something you don't have the licensing to.

 

When you purchase a DVD you own the box and the disc, you don't own the data on the disc, you own a license to use the data.

[ChineseChef]

I'm just trying to fight the ignorant practice of calling it theft, because it doesn't meet any of requirements to qualify as theft. You can cop out by making the argument seem asinine if you want. But I choose not to.

 

Why would we alter the definition of theft to include piracy, when we already have terms to meet that crime? Terms like internet piracy, and illegal re-manufacturing and distribution. Piracy is theft the same way someone giving me a piece of gum out of their pack of gum, is theft.

 

So I just did a whole bunch of reading, for the explicit purpose of proving you wrong.  And instead, found that you are absolutely right.  The proper generic term is stealing, not theft.  There are a couple countries that have piracy legally covered under the umbrella of theft; but even then it is simply for ease of legal punishments.

 

So I will concede that you are correct, and I was wrong.  The proper generic term for piracy would simply be piracy or stealing, and not theft.

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

I don't have sympathy for pirates and thieves. They knew what they were getting into, they don't get to cry now that someone else did to them what they do to others.

That's quite short-sighted, as is to be expected whenever anything relating to torrents etc is discussed.

Some people download shows because where they live the shows only air years later or simply aren't available, or because ripping the DVDs (that we own) is simply a lot more work than downloading. Or because when you do rip them (as I tend to do) the episodes often aren't on the disc in the right order and you need a downloaded copy of the entire season to easily identify which episode is what number in the series.

To those people the uploaders aren't pirates or thieves, they're saviours providing us with the content that a bunch of corporate greedy f***tards is trying to keep us from getting in an attempt to make us watch their rubbish or their never-ending warning labels instead.

[GoldSrc]

If it costs money where you are, and you don't pay for it, that is stealing.

How about stuff you can't get in your country and there's no legal way for you to get it?

I wouldn't call that "stealing", is just illegal distribution. 

[ChineseChef]

How about stuff you can't get in your country and there's no legal way for you to get it?

I wouldn't call that "stealing", is just illegal distribution. 

 

Really it is no different then illegal importing, thus acquiring "stolen" goods.  Just as illegal really.  Which totally sucks, but that's how it is.

 

That being said, I would just pirate it and tell the companies that they get nothing.  But that is just me.

[GoldSrc]

Really it is no different then illegal importing, thus acquiring "stolen" goods.  Just as illegal really.  Which totally sucks, but that's how it is.

 

That being said, I would just pirate it and tell the companies that they get nothing.  But that is just me.

Fair enough, but is not like you can physically steal digital goods so they disappear from the owner.

XKCD puts it better

https://xkcd.com/1228/

[MageTank]

But... I... need... to watch the show! I've read the books and I don't want to miss it!

 

Side note, you pay to have the HBO channel therefore you own Game of Thrones content? Ok. 

 

Your little side-note is irrelevant and makes no sense. You do not pay to own the content. You pay to view it. Much like one pays to rent a movie. You are not allowed to keep the movie after paying a $3 rental fee. In order for you to own the content, you must go out and purchase a DVD of a specific season. Surely you understand this concept, you are just being petty for no reason. 

 

I also believe you have your wants and needs confused. If you NEED to watch it, then pay for it like you pay for your other needs (food, drink, housing). Clearly you do not need entertainment, but i figured if we are going to associate things in that manner, we could also pay for them in the same manner. 

 

As others have stated before, this was a fate bound to happen. If it would not have ended this way, surely they would have been taken down by some company that owns the rights to the shows they streamed. 

 

 

I don't see how pirating TV shows is thievery?

 

Most of them are showed on free-to-air television. Just because I don't watch the channels' advertisements doesn't make me a thief.

 

Some australian channels show day-old re-runs on their websites, ad-free. How is pirating ANY different to that?

 

Except its not free-to-air. They pay a syndication fee to broadcast these shows to you. They make their money by selling commercial slots for you to view as they televise popular shows to you, but they still pay nonetheless. People have this delusion when it comes to piracy, thinking "it's not theft, we didn't take anything from anyone, theft implies taking something and the other person does not have it!" except those very same people are complete idiots. It is theft. You are stealing what would have been profits of a company because you refuse to pay for something. People can try to justify their means for piracy, but not a single person can show me a valid argument for doing so. 

[dfsdfgfkjsefoiqzemnd]

People can try to justify their means for piracy, but not a single person can show me a valid argument for doing so.

Some people download shows because (argument 1) where they live the shows only air years later or simply aren't available, or (argument 2) because ripping the DVDs (that we own) is simply a lot more work than downloading. Or (argument 3) because when you do rip them (as I tend to do) the episodes often aren't on the disc in the right order and you need a downloaded copy of the entire season to easily identify which episode is what number in the series.

[Accursed Entity]

Your little side-note is irrelevant and makes no sense. You do not pay to own the content. 

 

Sorry to break it to you kid but my side-note was directed to that guy because of how he expressed it. Which he used the word "OWN"... I was clarifying him on that(that simple), and to add to your fail of understanding on how sarcasm works yeah, I was using sarcasm. That's why he ignored me, my comment was a childish-tone one yet you took it seriously, I LOL at your life.

[MageTank]

Some people download shows because (argument 1) where they live the shows only air years later or simply aren't available, or (argument 2) because ripping the DVDs (that we own) is simply a lot more work than downloading. Or (argument 3) because when you do rip them (as I tend to do) the episodes often aren't on the disc in the right order and you need a downloaded copy of the entire season to easily identify which episode is what number in the series.

 

Argument 1: there are legal reasons as to why media is not available in countries (certain stations or subsidiaries of companies own certain publishing and syndication rights, and dictate what is shown where). You cannot take something for free just because you had no means to pay for it, or view it yourself. It's why netflix is banning proxies, because legally, they cannot allow someone to view content outside of their licensed distribution agreements.

 

Argument 2: This is a terrible argument to be made. With modern technology, you can rip a DVD faster than most people could download one. Not only that, why even bother ripping it? Buy a cheap blu-ray drive for your PC and put the disk in when you get the urge to watch a DVD. You do not need to store your entire DVD library on a disk drive.

 

Argument 3: See argument #2. While i understand ripping television shows more so than movies (it takes much longer to watch an entire season of Entourage than what it would take to watch The Lion King) you can still view from the DVD itself. I do not know which software you use to rip DVD's, but i have never had a problem with any of my DVD's being out of order when it comes to television episodes.

 

 

Sorry to break it to you kid but my side-note was directed to that guy because of how he expressed it. Which he used the word "OWN"... I was clarifying him on that(that simple), and to add to your fail of understanding on how sarcasm works yeah, I was using sarcasm. That's why he ignored me, my comment was a childish-tone one yet you took it seriously, I LOL at your life.

 

First of all, i am not a kid. I wish i was, but alas, i grew up. Secondly, sarcasm cannot be conveyed easily through text, which is why its common to type "/sarcasm" after being sarcastic. You were not hinting at sarcasm in the slightest. The irony of you calling me a kid when you yourself do not understand context, something taught in the 5th grade of school.

 

His context was rather simple: You don't own the content that you torrent. He never once claimed to own the content either. Your own argument is voided by the fact that he himself never once claimed to own that show. He seems to understand the concept of subscriptions, where you either do not, are or feigning ignorance. I took your comment about as serious as i take other comments, with a grain of salt. Unless you make it blatantly obvious that you are being sarcastic, or are joking, i am going to assume you are being serious, because most people on the internet really do say stupid things, and mean it. 

[atomicmonkey101]

*needs a court order* *shuts up shop*. yeah I wonder why. stop crying.

[fringie]

I don't have sympathy for pirates and thieves. They knew what they were getting into, they don't get to cry now that someone else did to them what they do to others. 

Lol. So if someone does something that is a form of theft and distribution it is OK for them to be the victim of other crimes? Most people do not pay the stated value of the music they acquire and if a friend asked for said music asked for a copy most people would say sure so I guess it's no big deal if said person get some of their bitcoins (as an example) stolen? That logic is so broken. I'm guessing you never took an ethics class before (I had thought you were some form of computing professional).

[LAwLz]

People can try to justify their means for piracy, but not a single person can show me a valid argument for doing so. 

You will probably not accept these reasons but these are the reasons I pirate some things.

 

1) Availability - I live in Sweden which is already a pretty poor situation for media consumption. We often get the short end of the stick when it comes to region locks (like Swedish NetFlix's pretty terrible content library) but that's not my biggest issue. My biggest issue is anime. I literally can't see a huge number of shows legally, no matter how hard I try. I don't have the TV channels that air it since I don't live in Japan, CrunchyRoll has region locks on a bunch of stuff and they lack a lot of shows I want to watch as well, even if I were to import official blurays I still might end up being screwed because Japan uses the region code A while Sweden is in region B.

Not to mention that if all the stars align and the show is on Crunchyroll and region locks don't screw me over, the version on there is often full of censoring to the point where it is unwatchable (literally 2/3 of the screen was just blacked out in some scenes, and some scenes were just removed altogether).

 

Here is what the CR version looked like. You might think that these are all from the same scene because a lot of them look the same, but they used that same gray/blue fog in almost every episode to black out the screen.

 

 

2) Copies - I already have a ton of expensive channels as well as NetFlix, but I still pirate some things that are on there. I even pirated Rick and Morty despite it being completely free to watch on Adultswim's website. Why? Because I want to be able to play the episodes in my video player and not their web player (more features, better upscaling, higher performance and so on). I also want to be able to watch things without needing a stable and fast Internet connection. Even if you ignore my 3GB data cap I have on my phone, I still wouldn't be able to stream for example Rick and Morty while on the bus to school because there are a lot of deadzones where I drop down to Edge speed (if even that). Because of stupid things like DASH (and the likes) I can't even pre-buffer things before I leave the house/school.

When I download I don't get a file filled with stupid ass DRM either. I have ran into issues recording things on my TV and trying to play it back on my computer, because the video is encrypted and needs the key in the card (that's in the TV) to be decrypted. So I can only play the thing I recorded back on the TV, and not my tablet or other computer.

 

3) Archiving - A lot of things are never released on DVD/Bluray, and don't get reruns. Ever wanted to watch the original Top Gear? Good luck finding it legally.

This can also be a big issue for some games which gets really expensive (or flat out impossible to find altogether). My friend tried to buy Battle For Middle Earth here in Sweden and the only store he found wanted over 150 dollars for it, and it was some pretty sketchy looking site. I ended up just lending him my copy then he used a no-CD crack.

This is becoming less and less of an issue since more things are moving to online distribution, but it will become an issue again when games that rely on online service gets their servers shut down (has already happened a few times).

 

 

Pretty much the only things I pirate is video these days. I got literally hundreds of games on Steam and my libraries on GOG and Origin are growing pretty rapidly as well. Most programs I use are free and open source but the ones that aren't I just buy online or get for free (DreamSpark fuck yeah!).

Music can be tricky sometimes depending on the song but it's still far easier than video because I don't run into stupid shit like DRM preventing me from for example listening to a song I have bought on my smartphone.

I pirate quite a lot of manga as well but that's for similar reasons to point 1. A lot of them are in weekly comics which I just can't find in any store that ships to Sweden, and the few times I do the shipping and handling fees raise the price of that single (weekly) comic from 5 dollars to 20 dollars... and even if I did order it I would still have to pirate the fan-translated version as well.

[Trik'Stari]

 

People can try to justify their means for piracy, but not a single person can show me a valid argument for doing so.

Some people download shows because (argument 1) where they live the shows only air years later or simply aren't available, or (argument 2) because ripping the DVDs (that we own) is simply a lot more work than downloading. Or (argument 3) because when you do rip them (as I tend to do) the episodes often aren't on the disc in the right order and you need a downloaded copy of the entire season to easily identify which episode is what number in the series.

 

Currently I'm watching the DBZ Buu series on some sketchy streaming site, why? Because it isn't on netflix, and I don't know where I can get the original english sub (not that new abomination they show on nickelodeon, you know, the one meant for today's ADHD generation).

[Bouzoo]

-snip-

If you download some anime, but it says something along those lines: "This anime is free, don't pay for it", is that still pirating? I mean downloading in that case should be fine right?

Sometimes I want to buy a program and I'm debating on which one, so I download few of them, use them for some days and they decide which one I'm gonna buy, then delete them and buy the real deal (please don't start you have trial versions etc., I remember some of them don't). Therefore I'd say piracy sometimes helps.

 

[Trik'Stari]

If you download some anime, but it says something along those lines: "This anime is free, don't pay for it", is that still pirating? I mean downloading in that case should be fine right?

Sometimes I want to buy a program and I'm debating on which one, so I download few of them, use them for some days and they decide which one I'm gonna buy, then delete them and buy the real deal (please don't start you have trial versions etc., I remember some of them don't). Therefore I'd say piracy sometimes helps.

 

-snip

If it say's "this anime is free, don't pay for it" than it's technically freeware. Kind of like the Area 51 game I downloaded yesterday (the one with David Duchovny and Marlyin Manson in it), which after a few years was legally declared freeware by it's owner.

 

Sadly, It's NOT AT ALL optimized for PC. Which is a shame because it's a fun game, and has one of the most fun shotgun dual wield options I've ever used in a game.

[ShadowCaptain]

SNIP

 

Basically its a service problem 

 

 

 Area 51 game

 

I remember that game, didnt know it was freeware now

[Trik'Stari]

Basically its a service problem 

 

 

 

 

I remember that game, didnt know it was freeware now

Yup. Hard to find though as the official website for downloading it went offline a while ago, but you can still find it.

[minibois]

Lol, all these people trying to say pirating is wrong as so many people trying to say it's right.

I am neutral on pirating. As I dont think it is stealing (not as in the definition of stealing and in terms of my opinion on it).

Is it morally wrong? Maybe. Sometimes.

You have seen and heard some reasons on the page (most notably shows that are not available otherwise or highly censored or cut up on 'legal' sites)

 

And of course convenience plays a roll too. 

If a paid service has a shitty (G)UI, you don't want to use it and rather get it from somewhere else.

(And with somewhere else I mean a. another paid service you use or b. pirate/spooky site)

[minibois]

Yup. Hard to find though as the official website for downloading it went offline a while ago, but you can still find it.

I almost bought that game for PS2 (there was a 5 games for 10 euros discount, so WHY NOT?!)

[Trik'Stari]

I almost bought that game for PS2 (there was a 5 games for 10 euros discount, so WHY NOT?!)

totally worth it.

[LAwLz]

If you download some anime, but it says something along those lines: "This anime is free, don't pay for it", is that still pirating? I mean downloading in that case should be fine right?

If it say's "this anime is free, don't pay for it" than it's technically freeware. Kind of like the Area 51 game I downloaded yesterday (the one with David Duchovny and Marlyin Manson in it), which after a few years was legally declared freeware by it's owner.

 

Sadly, It's NOT AT ALL optimized for PC

 

I am pretty sure you are referring to some of the fan-translated anime from like the 90's and early 00's, right? A lot of fan-subbers put "if you paid for this, you got ripped off" and such in their releases back then.

It's not that the anime was a free-license and the studio allowed anyone to download it. What they meant was that if you paid for the episode then you got ripped off because it was an illegal bootleg they paid for, not an official release.

It was meant to say "Hey! You just paid for a pirated copy of this!".

 

Downloading those episodes is still illegal.