Digital Foundry Makes A Case For 30FPS

[ComradeHX]

I don't see people trying to build their consoles so why always assume you have to build your own pc ffs.

Somebody tried to build console into laptop and it ended up costing more than highend gaming laptops. LOL

[Analog]

After reading all coments I can only say one thing - I really hope consoles just die and are never picked up again. People should stop being ignorant and move to what is obviously better. 

 

1. Some guys said that building a PC is difficult. Yes it is, there is no arguing in that, but you can buy one pre-built from basically everywhere. Or you can save some cash and learn how to do it yourself. These kinds of mental activities are a good brain exercise and will serve the average console peasant very well. 

 

2. The other argument is that PC are more expensive. Yes they are, but they are also more versatile. Instead of having an Xbox to play games and a PC to watch porn, you can have one devices that manages to do both of those things. Hell, if you have two monitors you can even play games and watch porn at the same time, how cool is that?! 

 

3. The last thing is that on PCs there is no plug-and-play. Yes, you actually have to double click on the icon to launch a game, which makes it more time consuming and very hard indeed. However, with the launch of SteamOS all of these issues will be remedied. All of you (console peasants) will have the old noob-friendly graphical design with big flat icons and limited customization options. 

[sannukas0016]

Post one post on reddit /r/buildapc and you have all the "right part" you need.

You already lost the argument with that line.

The whole point of this discussion is that with consoles you just go to the store and buy your console without having to do any research. Just plug and play.

[Derangel]

Not at all.

PC is a shit platform for gaming due to a wide variety of issues as outlined above in my previous posts.

It is indeed cheaper and easier to develop a game with a specific locked framerate.

And last but not least, 30 FPS wasn't a problem before for anyone. There weren't massive online discussions when people found out that the battles in Final Fantasy 8 were going to be 15 FPS on PC too, and very few complained about the sub-20 FPS some N64 games had.

 

People didn't complain about frame rate on older consoles? Where the hell were you in that era? There may not have been "massive internet discussions" but there sure as hell were complaints in gaming magazines at the time. Frame rate issues on consoles at the time were a little bit more excepted due to the limited nature of the hardware and what a lot of the best developers were trying to make it due. That said, I have no issue with 30FPS on consoles. It is not cheaper or easier to design a game at 30FPS. I'd argue that 60 would be cheaper on consoles since a massive portion of development cost goes towards graphics and you'd need to tone down the graphics on modern consoles to achieve a stable 60.

 

If building a PC is too hard for some people they don't have to build a PC you can buy one or have anyone of the thousands of places that build custom gaming pc's do it for you.. lots of stores will build it and test it for you for as little as $50 ontop of hardware costs.. I don't see people trying to build their consoles so why always assume you have to build your own pc ffs.

 

Did you read the post I was replying to? He was specifically talking about how building PCs are easy and how consoles have as many issues as PCs. Still buying a prebuilt does handle some of the issues that come up with hardware failures and other isses (assuming the support from the OEM isn't completely useless which is not uncommon). It still won't help the myriad of software and driver compatibility issues that pop up, the other several thousand ways computers can mess up, and so on. I've been building and troubleshooting computers for over 15 years. I understand how to fix a lot of issues and how to look up and understand various obscure tweaks or fixes, but I can accept that not everyone is going to have the time or skillset to get into it that deeply or to understand everything.

 

Post one post on reddit /r/buildapc.

 

Or various other tech forums, still doesn't mean the problems aren't there and at times are quite a bit more complex than what you'd find on consoles. It also still kills your entire point that consoles have as many hiccups as PCs.

[ComradeHX]

You already lost the argument with that line.

The whole point of this discussion is that with consoles you just go to the store and buy your console without having to do any research. Just plug and play.

There was no argument. There was someone whining about PC building being difficult.

Or various other tech forums, still doesn't mean the problems aren't there and at times are quite a bit more complex than what you'd find on consoles. It also still kills your entire point that consoles have as many hiccups as PCs.

My point was that Consoles have hiccups too and that you have to wait for $ony or M$ to fix it.

At the end of the day, with consoles, you can't fix underpowered hardware.

[Lord Baal]

 

Did you read the post I was replying to? He was specifically talking about how building PCs are easy and how consoles have as many issues as PCs. Still buying a prebuilt does handle some of the issues that come up with hardware failures and other isses (assuming the support from the OEM isn't completely useless which is not uncommon). It still won't help the myriad of software and driver compatibility issues that pop up, the other several thousand ways computers can mess up, and so on. I've been building and troubleshooting computers for over 15 years. I understand how to fix a lot of issues and how to look up and understand various obscure tweaks or fixes, but I can accept that not everyone is going to have the time or skillset to get into it that deeply or to understand everything.

 

The same could be said for consoles Xbox360's RROD for example one of my 2 original playstations CD rom died I also had a power supply on my original xbox die. Just because it's a console doesn't mean it'll never have hardware issues doesn't even make it less likely and then you're reliant on warranty Sony recently breaking the ps4 sleep mode and other things shows they're not even immune to software issues. Most all good places that sell custom gaming machines should have little problem offering a warranty that matches a console or if the persons knowledgeable enough to know what failed there's warranties on each piece of hardware(though not everyone is and you're right many larger companies such as Acer and HP for examples suck). I've been building pc's for 20 years so I like you know what I'm doing I've also not had too many software or driver compatibility issues in recent years and near none at all with my current build.

[Mooshi]

That comment section made Youtube look good..the pure ignorance on that page.

 

I do love watching Digital Foundry videos with showing real time performance of cards, but I'm a bit meh at this article. Yes, a game at a constant frame rate is always better than jittering around, but not at the expense of optimization. It's no secret I get onto those who take PC Master Race seriously as being obnoxious, but console gamers who brag about performance with non factual rubbish are even more obnoxious than even the most hardcore PC gamer with GabeN tattooed on their face. If a game is poorly optimized, you don't have the right to tell someone to upgrade their rig when their rig is already high end, admit it's the devs fault, not use petty "stop being poor" type of a shitty attitude. 

 

Imagine if this attitude applied in the auto world. Would you really want a Veyron to have the same performance of a VW Bug? No. Ignorant console gamers have this attitude that everything should match their performance when in reality, consoles are underpowered and PC ports tend to be crap. This has nothing to do with PC vs Console and everything to do with a poorly designed game and companies underpowering consoles by not taking the time to study how much power a mid-range gaming desktop has. (Or maybe consoles should have modules you can swap out for more graphical performance kind of like the N64 had mem expansion instead of struggling to deliver graphics these companies know damn well is impossible on current hardware)

 

-shrug-

 

Then again I'd rather play the upcoming yarn based Yoshi title on the WiiU before the overrated Crysis series...which would run a lot smoother.

[Stomplar]

Say the words 30fps and 90% of the forums turn into crying rabid animals.

[ComradeHX]

Imagine if this attitude applied in the auto world. Would you really want a Veyron to have the same performance of a VW Bug?

But 30mph is so much more scenic.

[Deli]

I make a case for fixed 10fps. (sarcasm  :lol: )

 

1. any hardware, even ancient GPU will do the job nicely. 

2. use less power, good for the electric bill. Good for the pocket and environment.

3. easier to port the game to PC from console. Developers are happy. Game companies are happy. CEOs and the shareholders are happy.

4. everyone is equal. No more PC master race or console peasant, because games run exactly the same on PC and consoles. 

 

See, fixed 10 fps can have so many benefits. It might even bring world peace. Oh, I think I must be second coming of Jesus Christ.

[Silent_Xaxal]

There is no justification when your hardware can support 60. Just want to make it clear.

And I'll be the last person to trust an article of this language/message.

[ObscureMammal]

More options are always a good thing, give me more options but do not hard-cap a game at 30 FPS

[martinrox1568]

OK you know what? 30fps STABLE is not that bad. Your brain gets used to the gaps in between frames. Is it noticeable? Yeah it is. Is it unplayable? No it's not. Honestly why are people here that have a PC complaining about CONSOLES

[Sharkyx1]

Holy shit people

People are calling euro gamer corrupt, or no ethix, or saying this is a gamaaaaaergate issue, when you have no idea.

Digital foundry is one of the best places for getting performance stuff on new games, they don't bend the truth, they just talk about the tech in games, the circle jerk here is just too fucking strong to even accept a second opinion on this. It doesn't matter that they prefer 60 fps, it doesn't matter what they are actually saying you are just too inept

[Stomplar]

OK you know what? 30fps STABLE is not that bad. Your brain gets used to the gaps in between frames. Is it noticeable? Yeah it is. Is it unplayable? No it's not. Honestly why are people here that have a PC complaining about CONSOLES

thank you for being human. I agree with you. I understand the 60fps argument I really do. But some people on here are extremists. And will stop at nothing to please appetite for 60fps. Then once they get it start complaining that a game isn't 120fps..

[Sharkyx1]

Is anyone really going to argue with this
 

why cut your potential frame-rate in half on a platform that offers so much flexibility? Why not settle on something like 40 or 45fps? The problem here is that 60 screen refreshes per second cannot be equally divided by 40 or 45 frames. Some frames stay on-screen for longer than others, resulting in off-putting judder. Locking to 30fps ensures that each rendered frame persists for two screen refreshes and presents with no screen-tear whatsoever.

 The idea of this article is, if you can't hit 60 with the image quality you'd like, it might make sense to lock to 30 for a smooth presentation.

 

EDIT:

 

 

You heard it first here folks

 

Slick and linus think that there is a case for lower framerates

[IdortMasterRace]

A game actually being good is more important than 30v60.

[Misanthrope]

My point is that PC is a shit platform regardless of whether the games are 30 FPS or not. Besides, not like low FPS bothered anyone before.

And yes, there is a case for 30 FPS only. It makes development easier and cheaper.

Right....

*Updates ignore list*

[mr moose]

 

PCs have been playing games at 60FPS for 20+ years now, th

 

What hardware and games were you playing in 94 that were 60FPS?

[HippY]

has anyone cared to read the article rather than read the title only?

 

They are saying that if you have a low end PC or a huge, 2.5K or 4K monitor @60Hz, it might be wiser to lock your framerate at a fix 30, rather than fluctuating around.

 

They mentioned that 

 

 

To conclude, let's be clear here - this piece isn't about giving a free pass to poorly optimised titles (though it may help to get better results from them if all other options fail) and we have serious issues with the 'cinematic' gaming argument occasionally rolled out by developer and publishers. It may make sense to run at 30fps on a fixed console platform, but the whole point of PC gaming is that the ability to define the experience rests with the player, based on how he or she wants to play, based on the kit available.

 

 

In motion, we can confirm that a locked 40 or 45fps does indeed produce a better experience than 30fps, once judder and tearing are removed from the equation. G-Sync monitors are the only solution on the market right now and they're expensive, but Samsung FreeSync display are due in Q1 2015, so hopefully competition will drive the prices down on this essential technology sooner rather than later.

 

 

For example, we have to say that 30fps gaming using keyboard and mouse controls isn't very pleasant at all as a gameplay experience, but it works just fine for joypads.

 

I am not going to quote the full article. please read it before you judge the fucking title

[mr moose]

has anyone cared to read the article rather than read the title only?

 

They are saying that if you have a low end PC or a huge, 2.5K or 4K monitor @60Hz, it might be wiser to lock your framerate at a fix 30, rather than fluctuating around.

 

They mentioned that 

 

I am not going to quote the full article. please read it before you judge the fucking title

 

[sarcasm] What?  you expect people to educate themselves before running their mouth off like self important little kids?  [/sarcasm]

 

 

Glad to see there is still some critical thinking around here.

[Deli]

Yes, I'm running a PC with Pentium IV 2.66GHz and a GTX440 with a 4K monitor. Since my PC is less than stellar, I should better run it at fixed 10fps. Next year, I plan to replace my monitor with a 8K. Just set it fixed 5fps, everything would be fine. (sarcasm)  :lol:

[HippY]

Yes, I'm running a PC with Pentium IV 2.66GHz and a GTX440 with a 4K monitor. Since my PC is less than stellar, I should better run it at fixed 10fps. Next year, I plan to replace my monitor with a 8K. Just set it fixed 5fps, everything would be fine. (sarcasm)  :lol:

dude

what and why?

can it even run windows or a youtube 4k?

[Deli]

dude

what and why?

can it even run windows or a youtube 4k?

10fps  is even better than "cinematic experience".(sarcasm)  :lol:

[ComradeHX]

OK you know what? 30fps STABLE is not that bad. Your brain gets used to the gaps in between frames. Is it noticeable? Yeah it is. Is it unplayable? No it's not. Honestly why are people here that have a PC complaining about CONSOLES

Becaise we don't like it when consoles retard gaming as a whole.

Yes, I'm running a PC with Pentium IV 2.66GHz and a GTX440 with a 4K monitor. Since my PC is less than stellar, I should better run it at fixed 10fps. Next year, I plan to replace my monitor with a 8K. Just set it fixed 5fps, everything would be fine. (sarcasm) :lol:

Assassin's greed： Slideshow - most cinematic goty 2016 by Ubisoft.

Smooth 10fps is too oldskool, next gen gameplay allows you to control when to see the next frame. It introduces new dimension to gameplay, where even fps and frame time variance are decided by skill.