LMG Sponsor Complaints

[Fabien Pinckaers]

On 10/30/2023 at 4:01 AM, UnclePear said:

Hello all,

First time poster here, just to warn whomever may be interested about the sponsor for the recent pool cooling system (203-10-30 or 2023-10-29):

 

Odoo as a piece of software, technically sucks.
It is the definition of spaghetti code.
It should be a case study in bad software architecture.
It's bad to the point of being dangerous for adopters who don't know what they're doing. It should not be advertised or sold to people without a decent amount of technical ability and know-how or outside striking distance of a well-trained IT department.

I know this because i work with it everyday as a developer for one of the biggest enterprise clients Odoo has in my country ( 250+ user licenses, growing by the month). All in all, i got 4+ years of experience with it, enough to give some objectivity to my opinion.

As advertised, the software is modular. It has a base module that include core code and functionalities that get extended by other modules.
This allows for people to only get the functionality they need.
It also means that, down in the code, even with 4-5 modules installed, everything might extend everything else, and any piece of code might be  functionally interwoven to anything else but not directly linked to it, since the system is modular. This makes debugging and developing a hellish nightmare. It also means that, when two modules interact badly and generate a bug (which is a certainty, as even the official modules are often buggy), it is virtually impossible for non technical users to figure out what's happening and try to solve the underlying problem.
This is just the most egregious of defects, and believe me, there is plenty other stuff that is horrible, but this is the clearest and the easiest to verify.
Just look at the code: the core modules are all open-source. In fact, the whole thing started as a open-source project.

See for yourself.

Now, you might be thinking "stfu and git gud,scrub", and I'd have a hard time convincing you that my skills are not the issue, and that the software is bad, and would be equally bad regardless of me, my job or my existence.
I could point you to the 1.7 / 5 on trustpilot, but luckily, their own documentation might do the trick: https://www.odoo.com/documentation/16.0/developer/reference/backend/orm.html#inheritance-and-extension
in the inheritance section, it basically tells you that there are three ways of inheriting and extending things, to different effects.
Observe carefully this tasty morsel:

This is their official documentation.
Saying that one of the form of inheritance the software provides is "more or less there".

In layman's terms, it would be like the operating manual of a calculator saying something to the tune of "Be careful: the "minus" functionality is more or less there, don't use it if you can, and if you do subsequent subtractions like 5 minus 3 minus 1, we can't guarantee that the result will be 1".

Now imagine yourself giving advertising space and visibility for such a calculator.

 

I hope you will reconsider working with them in the future.
I have no real chip on my shoulder, but I have witnessed and keep on witnessing first-hand the amount of misery that choosing that software created in the company i work for, from us in the IT department upwards all the way to management people and other bigwigs.
I would feel bad to allow that to proliferate elsewhere without trying to warn others.

Stay clear of this. Choose sanity. Be well.


 

Hello, I am the founder of Odoo.

It's clear that Odoo is a large software, solving complex business problems: from logistic to accounting, going through procurements, eCommerce, knowledge management, etc. As a result, it's more complex to work with Odoo than with simple framework, or small standalone software. But to solve complex business problem, I do believe Odoo is unmatched on how simple it is build very advanced solution.

Let me try to explain that:

Spagetthi Code:

It's the total opposite of spagetthi code. It's modularity actually prevents that: if module A depends on module B, module B can not depends on module A. (or use methods of) Because of this modularity, developers can not easily write spagetthi code: it requires a clear path of dependencies and real abstraction layers. There are currently 1003 official modules on Odoo (and 50k in the community apps library): you can install any set of these modules, and it works smoothly. (our continuous integration platforms actually tests that: https://runbot.odoo.com).

In a way, it's similar to a Linux packaging system: you can have a lot of packages in your distribution, but each package does not have to be complex as it does not have to worry about the ones depending on him. (abstraction)

I developed hundreds of module, and the modularity, and abstraction of the framework simplifies so much things. The alternatives would be "hooks", microservices, or a big monolyth. These alternatives are an order of magnitude more complex than the Odoo approach. (for the first two, because it requires an interface for every communication which quickly bloat code), for the last one because you end-up with spagetthi code.

Chained _inherits

When you design a framework, you need a good balance between keeping the framework clean VS supporting a lot of use cases. In this case, we think it's not a good idea to complexify the framework to support multi-layers of _inherits, as we never saw a use case where it was needed. (amongst the 1003 official modules of Odoo)
There is 2000+ traditional inheritances in Odoo but only 27 cases of delegation inheritances. (and 0 multi-layers)

Measuring the code quality

If you are used to work in very simple software, you'll find Odoo complex. But i you are used to work with mid-size/large software, you'll find Odoo is unmatched, very very clean for what it does. I strongly believe great software have less lines of code for a smilar scope. And spagetthi code tends to have much more lines of code.

If I include all official modules of Odoo, we get a large scope: eCommerce, POS, logistic, CRM, sales, procurements, mrp, project management, ... There is no such large projects in open source business apps, so let's compare with the leaders in each category:

So, let's compare with similar Open Source software:
- Odoo: 250k lines of Python code for ALL modlues
- WooCommerce (Ecommerce + WP): 657k lines of code 
- Prestashop (eCommerce only): 1.9M lines of code
- SuiteCRM (CRM only): 900k lines of code

Yet, these software do barely 20% of the scope of Odoo. (just eCommerce, or just CRM)

So, Odoo has between 10x and 20x less lines of code for comparable software. That's only possible because the code is very clean for a large software. (and not as clean as a very small lib)
It is, for me, the best example of how clean the Odoo code is.

TrustPilot Score

TrustPilot is know for negative reviews. All software in Odoo's category have between 1/5 and 2/5. (they business model is to be negative then charge vendors to "fix that"). Have a look at G2, Capterra, GetApp, Odoo's average is 4.3/5 - which is very good for a software that solve very complex business cases.

[EsquireDevMark]

I was curious about Odoo as I've been looking for other website tools to move my website to, signed up for an account and in 4 days I've received 6 emails, 2 phone calls and a whatsapp DM trying to get me to speak to a consultant. I'm not a fan of giving my details to businesses at the best of time, but I draw the line at that many contact attempts and through so many different methods and it's really put me off trying the thing out. 

 

I will be honest and I say I'm not sure if I ticked or did anything that could have opted me into/out of this, I've sent and email asking if they would cool it and I will amend this post if/when I get a response.

 

Edit: I got a response

Quote

Firstly, thanks for your feedback and please accept my most sincere apologies. My goal was not to make you feel overwhelmed with our communications. 

 

We receive hundreds of leads from our website and this is how we qualify the opportunities. However, if a potential customer tells us to stop or to reduce the communications, is our responsibility to do it straight away. Therefore, from now on I will not make any attempt to contact you unless you request it. 

 

I hope you understand and also reconsider moving your website to Odoo's platform. 

This is what I was hoping for and guess it moves from complaint to knowledge for potential users.

Edited November 3, 2023 by EsquireDevMark
Received response from Odoo and wanted my feedback to reflect this response

[Disturbedm]

Genuinely surprised when searching for "Dbrand" or "Ghost case" returns 0 results.

 

I do hope this is nothing to with how close LTT and Dbrand are.

 

Seems quite apparent that whats currently going on is sufficient enough to warrant questioning, be it the delay (yes I've seen the reddit response), the lack of personal customer updates, order page still saying October or more impotantly the influx of cases arriving damaged out of box or being damaged by literally putting the case on the phone....which is kinda the whole point...

 

Anyway, there really is no need to type more, simply visit the Dbrand subreddit here and have a nice read.  

 

Dbrand Subreddit...

[Erioch]

On 11/2/2023 at 8:12 PM, EsquireDevMark said:

I was curious about Odoo as I've been looking for other website tools to move my website to, signed up for an account and in 4 days I've received 6 emails, 2 phone calls and a whatsapp DM trying to get me to speak to a consultant. I'm not a fan of giving my details to businesses at the best of time, but I draw the line at that many contact attempts and through so many different methods and it's really put me off trying the thing out. 

 

I will be honest and I say I'm not sure if I ticked or did anything that could have opted me into/out of this, I've sent and email asking if they would cool it and I will amend this post if/when I get a response.

 

Edit: I got a response

This is what I was hoping for and guess it moves from complaint to knowledge for potential users.

Talk about an overly-attached girlfriend...

[Makeout Bandit]

13 hours ago, Disturbedm said:

Genuinely surprised when searching for "Dbrand" or "Ghost case" returns 0 results.

 

I do hope this is nothing to with how close LTT and Dbrand are.

 

Seems quite apparent that whats currently going on is sufficient enough to warrant questioning, be it the delay (yes I've seen the reddit response), the lack of personal customer updates, order page still saying October or more impotantly the influx of cases arriving damaged out of box or being damaged by literally putting the case on the phone....which is kinda the whole point...

 

Anyway, there really is no need to type more, simply visit the Dbrand subreddit here and have a nice read.  

 

Dbrand Subreddit...

I literally came here to post about it so yes please check on with dbrand. They've given 0 updates on anything, it's really frustrating

[cardiffcal]

Ridge

How many times will I have to see their adverts knowing it costs near nothing for them to produce in mass produce but yet ask £90 ($110 at time of posting) to purchase? 

No wonder they charge so much cause they are paying nearly every YouTube channel to push this "wallet" that can't even carry coins -_-

[QwertyChouskie]

11 minutes ago, cardiffcal said:

Ridge

How many times will I have to see their adverts knowing it costs near nothing for them to produce in mass produce but yet ask £90 ($110 at time of posting) to purchase? 

No wonder they charge so much cause they are paying nearly every YouTube channel to push this "wallet" that can't even carry coins -_-

Every company has a markup.  Some mark up more than others.  If you don't like the markup (or the product itself), nothing is making you buy the product.

[cardiffcal]

10 minutes ago, QwertyChouskie said:

Every company has a markup.  Some mark up more than others.  If you don't like the markup (or the product itself), nothing is making you buy the product.

I have no intention on. My issue is that so many creators are sponsored by ridge and seeing their adverts repeatedly is getting annoying. Is this not the complaint page? 

[Sunoo]

2 hours ago, cardiffcal said:

Ridge

How many times will I have to see their adverts knowing it costs near nothing for them to produce in mass produce but yet ask £90 ($110 at time of posting) to purchase? 

No wonder they charge so much cause they are paying nearly every YouTube channel to push this "wallet" that can't even carry coins -_-

Why do you think they have money to throw around to sponsor so many creators?

[Makeout Bandit]

3 hours ago, cardiffcal said:

I have no intention on. My issue is that so many creators are sponsored by ridge and seeing their adverts repeatedly is getting annoying. Is this not the complaint page? 

No the complaints have to be constructive/real issues. Not hat it annoys you. That's literally every ad ever for someone

[LogicalDrm]

3 hours ago, cardiffcal said:

I have no intention on. My issue is that so many creators are sponsored by ridge and seeing their adverts repeatedly is getting annoying. Is this not the complaint page? 

This is complaint about consumer care and protection. Not about chosen business strategy. Considering what Ridge is (luxury niche), their profits are more than likely linked to how many units they are moving. Which isn't that many.

 

If we would take route of dropping sponsors based on how many creators they work with or what their assumed margins are, SquareSpace would also be among the first to be dropped.

[geomac]

On 11/5/2023 at 5:21 AM, Disturbedm said:

Genuinely surprised when searching for "Dbrand" or "Ghost case" returns 0 results.

 

I do hope this is nothing to with how close LTT and Dbrand are.

 

Seems quite apparent that whats currently going on is sufficient enough to warrant questioning, be it the delay (yes I've seen the reddit response), the lack of personal customer updates, order page still saying October or more impotantly the influx of cases arriving damaged out of box or being damaged by literally putting the case on the phone....which is kinda the whole point...

 

Anyway, there really is no need to type more, simply visit the Dbrand subreddit here and have a nice read.  

 

Dbrand Subreddit...

I ordered a ghost case. Mine did ship on time and is getting (slow) updates from the third party carrier they're using. I'm a bit disappointed  as it has been in the US (where I am) since 10/28 and in my state since 11/2, but I have no new updates since then.

 

Considering the varied reports coming out about the QA in the dbrand subreddit I plan to record my unboxing and inspection of the ghost case upon receiving it, and will be following up here, regardless of the outcome.

 

My guess as to why there's no reports here yet is that everyone who has received their case, which is probably still a minority, and raised a support ticket has not had any conclusive resolution or has had a positive result with dbrand and stopped updating the community.

 

UPDATE: In hands of my local USPS now with an ETA of this evening.

 

UPDATE 2: I did what I said above and responded in their thread on reddit.

Edited November 8, 2023 by geomac

[dalekphalm]

15 hours ago, cardiffcal said:

I have no intention on. My issue is that so many creators are sponsored by ridge and seeing their adverts repeatedly is getting annoying. Is this not the complaint page? 

As others have mentioned, that's not really the point of this Thread.

 

Ridge is a luxury wallet. The fact that it doesn't carry coins is irrelevant. If you want a wallet that does that, buy a different wallet that has that feature. But it won't be the same small formfactor of the Ridge wallet.

 

This is a wallet for people who don't deal with cash or coins much. Which is plenty of people, who really only need to carry around their ID Cards and Credit/Debit cards, and maybe a bit of emergency cash.

 

Do I think it's a good value? No. So I didn't buy one. But if they're selling the product, and it works as advertised, and they're otherwise not doing anything sketchy, then this isn't the place to say you think it's overpriced.

[Disturbedm]

16 hours ago, geomac said:

I ordered a ghost case. Mine did ship on time and is getting (slow) updates from the third party carrier they're using. I'm a bit disappointed  as it has been in the US (where I am) since 10/28 and in my state since 11/2, but I have no new updates since then.

 

Considering the varied reports coming out about the QA in the dbrand subreddit I plan to record my unboxing and inspection of the ghost case upon receiving it, and will be following up here, regardless of the outcome.

 

My guess as to why there's no reports here yet is that everyone who has received their case, which is probably still a minority, and raised a support ticket has not had any conclusive resolution or has had a positive result with dbrand and stopped updating the community.

Yeah I think recording the unboxing is a good shout. I wouldn't have thought people that have received their case by now is a minority (based off all the crap they have said about how many was pre-ordered and the fact it's clearly iPhone ones going out first) but maybe the crossover of people that have received AND come here are the minority. Still find it hard to believe there wasn't a post here already honestly.

[ImNiightt]

Not wanting to stir the pot but just hoping for a bit of clarity re Cuktech. On the initial thread gathering opinions, I posted a concern w/r/t their ToS and their seemingly problematic Kickstarter, neither of which seem to have been addressed, and the thread has been locked without response. Is it possible to say whether this has been considered and/or brought up with the company?

[Disturbedm]

On 8/7/2023 at 7:29 AM, Draevalis said:

I was looking for this. Made an account specifically to complain about Secret Lab's poor quality control over something that has clearly had problems for many years from what I can tell with that first reddit post about armrest tear.

 

I have a 2022 model, using it for about a year (wasn't using it for a few months when I first got it), and my left armrest already has a rip in it.

 

Support tried to brush it off as "normal wear and tear", asking me to pay a shipping fee for just one cover (which, considering the defect, they should at least try replacing both).
I wouldn't have cared all that much, but when I asked about also replacing the right while we were at it, they threw in that I could do so for a subsidized $90 CAD. For a right cover. When I could get a set of covers on their site for around $100 CAD (depending on style), or $25 on their "spare parts" page (which lists each side cover as $25 each). It sounded like some joke, as I can't see how that makes sense in context.

That's when I started googling it, and finding that it was a common problem...

 

The chair itself is fine, no problems there otherwise. But they really need to get called out on their quality control and customer support...

 

Just thought I'd add to this, I too have had the armrests rip along the side, in the same place on TWO chairs (both with two different people using them, 49kg and 83kg). Thats four armrests go the exact same way. Saw posts on here and got in touch and have got the "wear & tear" treatment. They are also charging for delivery.

 

The truth of the matter is after spending £800+ on two chairs, I couldn't really care less about £5.80, but the principle of it, especially when there are a rediculous amount of posts on this matter with countless images and followups from other users (for which I linked them TEN different websites/threads) for them to be as insulting as to claim its wear & tear (I know it isn't, I know how I've treated my chair) is just laughable and I think says a lot more about Secret Labs and their customer service. 

 

There's no doubt the chairs are decent, but their customer service is not. LTT should really hold them to a higher standard.

[Erioch]

4 hours ago, ImNiightt said:

Not wanting to stir the pot but just hoping for a bit of clarity re Cuktech. On the initial thread gathering opinions, I posted a concern w/r/t their ToS and their seemingly problematic Kickstarter, neither of which seem to have been addressed, and the thread has been locked without response. Is it possible to say whether this has been considered and/or brought up with the company?

Their response was "don't care, we're taking the money".

[mynameGeoff]

12 hours ago, ImNiightt said:

Not wanting to stir the pot but just hoping for a bit of clarity re Cuktech. On the initial thread gathering opinions, I posted a concern w/r/t their ToS and their seemingly problematic Kickstarter, neither of which seem to have been addressed, and the thread has been locked without response. Is it possible to say whether this has been considered and/or brought up with the company?

Hey! Appreciate you bringing this back up.

On Nov. 5th, CUKTECH responded to their initial backers on the next steps in the event they haven't received their orders. Considering the response, I felt that the update was sufficient enough to move forward.

 

Regarding their ToS, it's completely normal for companies to enroll you in emails when you create an account as per the FTC. As long as they disclosed it in the ToS, they're all good.

 

With both in mind, I made the decision to move forward.

[Neroon]

Just gonna put a complaint about Dbrand here.

 

Ordered several skins for my iPad Pro 12'9 inch incl Magic Keyboard.

 

The back skins are great, feel great, easy to attach etc.

Border skin is quite nice, good fit and easy to attach. However when put on the magic keyboard, the bumpers in the keyboard catches skin when closing. I contacted them about this, added a ton of info and pictures, but they got back with user error, incorrect application and that I had to close it a certain way, because the normal way would damage it... ehm what the hell Dbrand, if I can't close it the normal way, then why would I want them? Loads of people on reddit have this problem, yet Dbrand claims it's not a big issue because otherwise they would no longer sell them. 

I also had a pencil skin that was incorrectly cut, and thus too small, they admitted their fault in that... however they still wanted me to pay shipping to replace their faulty product, and they still won't admit that their edge skin is flawed, even though they also state it has to be closed a certain way as to not damage it.

 

I opened a thread on reddit, and after getting no response from support anymore, all the sudden I got a response and that new skins are being shipped to me.

 

I will try them out, but I doubt it will fix it. Regardless their attitude towards their customers is troublesome, the fact so many have the exact same issues, tells me they don't do their research. I don't care if it's solved by closing it in a special way. I should not need to close it in a different way to not damage it. Either it doesn't damage, or don't sell it (to be clear, the edge skin can be added to the Magic Keyboard skin, so it is a package deal)

[stellar_cxex]

Friendly reminder -- For any Build Redux customers on this forum, please note that I am still reviewing this board every day. Let me know if you have any questions, comments, or concerns. 

 

Always here to help! 

[Heeroo]

AG1 is scam. There are primarily German reports on it, but it’s supplements are in no way healthy. 

 

i couldn’t really find critical things about it in English. 
 

here I found something in English: 

 

[geomac]

On 11/6/2023 at 10:35 AM, geomac said:

I ordered a ghost case. Mine did ship on time and is getting (slow) updates from the third party carrier they're using. I'm a bit disappointed  as it has been in the US (where I am) since 10/28 and in my state since 11/2, but I have no new updates since then.

 

Considering the varied reports coming out about the QA in the dbrand subreddit I plan to record my unboxing and inspection of the ghost case upon receiving it, and will be following up here, regardless of the outcome.

 

My guess as to why there's no reports here yet is that everyone who has received their case, which is probably still a minority, and raised a support ticket has not had any conclusive resolution or has had a positive result with dbrand and stopped updating the community.

 

UPDATE: In hands of my local USPS now with an ETA of this evening.

 

UPDATE 2: I did what I said above and responded in their thread on reddit.

BIG UPDATE 11/17:

dbrand has decided to send every purchaser of the Ghost case the upcoming revision when it is released, regardless of the condition that the purchaser's ghost case arrived in. This is so beyond my expectations and such a chad move (for lack of a better term). Huge W. Good on you dbrand.

 

Original post for archive:

 

Alright, I am following up here after responding on their thread on reddit and executing what I said in the post above. I will be reaching out to their support today, but this post is just a distillation of the situation for LMG and LTT forum people.

 

dbrand's response in their subreddit to concerns about scratching really boils down to a detailed response with respect to the engineering and technicalities of the materials and product, which was extremely appreciated and thorough, and a commitment to do the following (paraphrasing):

 

If your ghost case arrived scratched we will fix it.

 

Which is the right course of action; however it neglects a few key realities which are reflecting poorly on the product and IMO are not acceptable for a premium product. It is clear from their communication in the reddit post that they are drawing the line at the moment you start to use the case, including inserting your phone into it. If it is damaged after removing the packaging and inspecting it, then it is on you.

 

Also, I will not be touching on the shipping times, as annoying as that might be for you, it is part of the risk of pre-ordering a product and dbrand has already communicated their philosophy about it.

 

What dbrand is failing to address in the above is:

1. The QC and packaging problem, here is how my unit arrived. The plastic protective layer was applied extremely sloppily and had visible scratch markings on it. This is not acceptable and is my main reason for reaching out to their support staff.
2. There was no guidance on installation. Now from an outsider perspective, I would get confusion -- its just a phone case. But the issue is that there are a lot of people, myself included, who have (potentially) scraped the case just by inserting their phone into it. I did so as carefully as I physically could but I still found scuffs on my case after putting my phone in.

Now #1 is between dbrand and their vendors which they will fix and rectify, but #2 is between dbrand and their customers. I do not believe that they are sufficiently rectifying the situation when they neglect customers who were not communicated to that there was a right and wrong way to install their product to avoid damaging it, and also there was no communication on their product page that their product is more susceptible to scratches.

 

I think the situation would be wholly different if the box had a couple of warnings about ease of scratching/scuffing due to the material properties of the case and there was a condescending dbrand installation video / pamphlet showing you how to do it without immediately scratching it. My box was devoid of any pamphlets at all which I found odd.

 

This raises some questions: How was this product tested? How did none of the sponsored individuals (that I know of) report this? Did dbrand see these installation issues at all? As far as I'm aware, installation guides are standard for dbrand products, if there was a known installation risk here, why wasn't this product given the same treatment? Was this product rushed?

 

Let this be a lesson to not pre-order and be a paying beta tester for a "final" product.

 

^{Anyway excited for my Luxe Backpack!}

Editing to add archive link of the dbrand instructions page for my phone. The closest thing they have is the grip case instructional video and if you did the installation in that manner you would get scatches across the entire back side of the ghost case. It is clear that they did not ship this thing with their usual instruction set.

[Haredeenee]

On 11/7/2023 at 8:15 AM, Disturbedm said:

 

Just thought I'd add to this, I too have had the armrests rip along the side, in the same place on TWO chairs (both with two different people using them, 49kg and 83kg). Thats four armrests go the exact same way. Saw posts on here and got in touch and have got the "wear & tear" treatment. They are also charging for delivery.

 

The truth of the matter is after spending £800+ on two chairs, I couldn't really care less about £5.80, but the principle of it, especially when there are a rediculous amount of posts on this matter with countless images and followups from other users (for which I linked them TEN different websites/threads) for them to be as insulting as to claim its wear & tear (I know it isn't, I know how I've treated my chair) is just laughable and I think says a lot more about Secret Labs and their customer service. 

 

There's no doubt the chairs are decent, but their customer service is not. LTT should really hold them to a higher standard.

Well, it seems like their coverage is more about the chair's frame than anything you actually come into contact with. And if you happen to raise any issues, they might just accuse you of mishandling the chair. After navigating through all their hurdles, they somehow manage to stretch out the process for months, leaving your emails hanging in limbo. It's almost like they deduct the cost of refunds or replacement parts from the customer service reps' paychecks, considering how reluctant they are to provide those.

[Asus_NAsupport]

On 9/22/2023 at 11:51 PM, Rumble said:

Yet another support conversation with ASUS has resulted in being told I bought the Laptop from Best Buy and they will handle its support.

Best Buy wants me to pay,  and now its out of warranty, but it was in warranty when the first conversation took place.   

Best Buy wants me to pay for a repair.  ASUS refuses to support it.

Why is LMG taking money from a company who pushes support and warranty on the retail company, where they don't want to repair it under warranty?  What the heck is going on at LMG?

Hello there! Thank you for contacting us, and we truly apologize for any trouble this has caused as well as any impression this may have left, which we hope will not be a long-term lasting impact. It is disappointing that your experience with this product and service did not match the standards we set for all of our products and customer service. As a result, we'd be delighted to assist you further. To better serve you, we'll send you a private message. We look forward to hearing from you and determining how we can best assist you in resolving your issue.
 

[Neroon]

On 11/8/2023 at 2:26 PM, geomac said:

There was no guidance on installation. Now from an outsider perspective, I would get confusion -- its just a phone case. But the issue is that there are a lot of people, myself included, who have (potentially) scraped the case just by inserting their phone into it. I did so as carefully as I physically could but I still found scuffs on my case after putting my phone in.

And this comes down to the same issue I have, well actually worse in a way. Because it's not just I have to use it in a certain way for installation, but every single time. They sell you a product, don't tell you how to use it, only to get it damaged and to hear that the way you use it, how in this case Apple advertises how to use it, is wrong, and you should do it a different way, without actually showing how.

 

With the case they need to add a disclaimer in the box, to make sure you understand beforehand how to use it. In my case they need to add the disclaimer before you buy it, because it very much changes the way the product is used.