WINDOWS 'backwards compatibility' is a joke [RB338 woes continue]

[Mark Kaine]

I don't really know if this is a DOS program or win 95/98, point is, I can't get 99% of old programs to run on win 10.

 

 

Any ideas how to fix this? 'VM' is not really going to work, this program needs like zero latency otherwise it's literally unusable... also VM ≠ compatibility. 

 

 

I tried the compatibility troubleshooter, it did nothing (it's not even working / functional I think) 

 

Alternatively, can I install Vista or XP or even win 98 on i5 7200U machine? 

 

 

[Electronics Wizardy]

Make a virtual machine of a older os?

 

This could be a 16bit program, and those will only run on 32bit windows.

[Mark Kaine]

1 minute ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

This could be a 16bit program, and those will only run on 32bit windows

oh, was that a common thing around 1998?  then that could be the reason, yeah... 

 

2 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

Make a virtual machine of a older os?

I've seen videos of this there is always huge input lag from the looks of it? which this program cannot work with, because it's a 'live' music creation program and any input lag will make it go out of sync obviously. 

 

 

[ProjectBox153]

9 minutes ago, Mark Kaine said:

Alternatively, can I install Vista or XP or even win 98 on i5 7200U machine? 

Not natively. You *might* could get Windows 7 to run, but anything older and you're wasting your time. Your best bet is to find a VM solution that has the least amount of lag. 

[Mark Kaine]

2 minutes ago, ProjectBox153 said:

Not natively. You *might* could get Windows 7 to run, but anything older and you're wasting your time. Your best bet is to find a VM solution that has the least amount of lag. 

I see, damn. well any suggestions? 

Also I could try DOSbox right? I mean it's possible this is a DOS program, but I don't know if they had exe / install files... newer versions maybe did? 

[Kilrah]

Just install 32bit w10 on a separate drive and enable 16bit support in it.

 

Or get an old PC with XP on it.

[Mark Kaine]

40 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Just install 32bit w10 on a separate drive and enable 16bit support in it.

hmm, while it's unclear this would work, it might... I don't really have a free drive for this currently - but *if* this works would probably be the easiest solution. 

 

40 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Or get an old PC with XP on it.

yeah, every OS ever gets its own PC, so much for 'legacy support' and backwards compatibility. -.-

 

34 minutes ago, Grand Admiral Thrawn said:

Can you define how many in your case is 99% of the software?

I would say out of 100, 99!

 

So far I only got Colin McRae Dirt Rally 04 working... every single other CD I tried that's not intended for use with windows 10 refuses to work, either because of the DRM fiasco or other reasons that I don't know about (and windows 'compatibility troubleshooter' literally worked *zero* times so far) 

 

Runs at like 400 fps even, which just shows how great it would be if Windows 10 would have a working compatibility mode. 

[Electronics Wizardy]

1 hour ago, Mark Kaine said:

oh, was that a common thing around 1998?  then that could be the reason, yeah... 

 

I've seen videos of this there is always huge input lag from the looks of it? which this program cannot work with, because it's a 'live' music creation program and any input lag will make it go out of sync obviously. 

 

 

A virtual machine setup shouldn't have much of a delay. Just give it a shot.

[Mark Kaine]

1 hour ago, Grand Admiral Thrawn said:

Asking because I do own a collection of old games (2007 and prior developed for Win 95, 98, ME through XP) and most if not all of them seem to work just fine.

Thats certainly weird... 

 

maybe before 2001/2 or so but after that is kinda hard to believe. 

 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.howtogeek.com/230773/how-to-play-pc-games-that-require-safedisc-or-securom-drm-on-windows-10-8.1-8-7-and-vista/amp/

 

seems almost all my games have this or similar... not sure what you need a list for, those are hundreds - thousands... 

 

and it's bs on 7/8 Microsoft let's you enable the driver needed, but not on 10, they'd obviously prefer you to download a 'CD crack' from shady sources. 

 

 

1 hour ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

A virtual machine setup shouldn't have much of a delay. Just give it a shot.

I mean I can try but man does this seem complicated and the input lag seems to be a real issue too. 

[Electronics Wizardy]

2 minutes ago, Mark Kaine said:

I mean I can try but man does this seem complicated and the input lag seems to be a real issue too. 

I mean its just install hyper-v, install windows, and test it, like a 30 min thing. And nice to know how to for the future too.

[Mark Kaine]

3 minutes ago, Electronics Wizardy said:

I mean its just install hyper-v, install windows, and test it, like a 30 min thing. And nice to know how to for the future too.

I agree and maybe it would even be 'usable' but the tutorials I found make this appear far more complicated with 'driver isos' and whatnot. 

 

and hyper v is a program or? 

 

I thought I need virtual box, which honestly seems to be a big mess (for my purpose) 

[Electronics Wizardy]

Just now, Mark Kaine said:

I agree but the tutorials I found make this appear far more complicated with 'driver isos' and whatnot. 

 

and hyper v is a program or? 

 

I thought I need virtual box, which honestly seems to be a big mess (for my purpose) 

Hyper-v is a hypervisor(program that runs vms) thats built into windows, run it if you can, otherwise virtual box will work.

[camieabz]

Install 32-bit Windows of any variety on a cheap 128GB SSD, and it'll work. Win 7 or Win 2000 Pro tend to be pretty solid, but I wouldn't use the latter for Internet-related stuff.

[Kilrah]

1 hour ago, Mark Kaine said:

yeah, every OS ever gets its own PC, so much for 'legacy support' and backwards compatibility. -.-

Backwards compatibility on Windows is great compared to everything else, but at some point it's to be expected that some 23 year old pieces of software from 2 architectures ago might not work anymore...

Try the other systems and see how it fairs. Apple has had 3 complete compatibility breaks in that span.

[Mark Kaine]

12 minutes ago, Kilrah said:

Backwards compatibility on Windows is great 

cannot confirm this at all... 

 

But at this point I agree it would actually make sense to have a... Vista or XP computer for my old games and stuff - I have a lot of things that weren't improved upon at all but can't use because 'no worky'... 

 

I'm even kinda planning that already, I'll get my old Vista PC back from a friend, but it might take a while and I also already know I need a new mobo, not sure how difficult that will be to find - it's a HP from 2007 or 8 with AMD Athlon™ and a Saphire X1950 GT, but that doesn't change that my experience with windows10 legacy support has been nothing but abysmal so far (eh, CMR 04 works, I guess edit: oh and just remembered, 'Jonny Herbert GP 98' or something works too, but controls are buggy and the game is kinda awful anyway lol, but yes, that's another one that *magically* works) 

[Mark Kaine]

2 minutes ago, Grand Admiral Thrawn said:

And no, they just want you to rebuy those games on theirs or associated stores. As long as it is on Windows, they win.

I believe that was the original plan yeah, which is not only scummy and evil, but they also never went through with this, there are a lot of older 'AAA' high caliber games that you simply cannot rebuy for win 10 and even then , why should you... 

 

Also the security risk thing... why did they then allow the driver to be re enabled in older versions? sounds fabricated / bs to me, sorry. 

 

 

Safe disc:

Quote

"Safedisc DRM hasn’t been supported for a few years now, and the driver has consequently not been updated for some time. Microsoft should have migrated the existing software since Windows 8. We don’t know if that’s still possible with Windows 10 or if they simply didn’t care about it.”

 

Microsoft answer :

 

Spoiler

“This DRM stuff is also deeply embedded in your system, and that’s where Windows 10 says “sorry, we cannot allow that, because that would be a possible loophole for computer viruses.” That’s why there are a couple of games from 2003-2008 with Securom, etc. that simply don’t run without a no-CD patch or some such. We can just not support that if it’s a possible danger for our users. There are a couple of patches from developers already, and there is stuff like GOG where you’ll find versions of those games that work.”

. 

 

The question is really why the f did they allow it in the first place and consequently why didn't they care about migrating the issue - I'm sure there would have been solutions, they simply didn't care (ie wanted you to buy the games again)