Sata-600 vs NVMe M.2 SSD confusion

[VincentN]

Hi all,

I've stumbled upon a problem/mistake I made but I was hoping one of you could confirm my answer so that I don't make another mistake trying to correct the first one.

Backstory
So my GF's dad has this Medion akoya p5207 f pc which was running really slow lately, due to lot of bloatware, high CPU temps etc. He asked me to give it refresh (Total wipe and reïnstall), and asked if he could put an ssd card in it. So I popped open the sidepanel and saw a m.2 slot, which I could also confirm looking at the BIOS. So I said that would be possible without given it much more thought, and I would be happy to do it for him. And that I would change the cooling paste on the CPU in the meantime. I've build my own high end PC so this should be no problem... But...

The problem
He bought a 500gb Samsung Evo 970pro NVMe ssd. I put it in the desktop and rebooted to Windows but it was not getting recognised in partition manager, and also the BIOS said that there is no device detected in the slot, while it clearly was inserted... I extracted and remounted it but still no detection.

What I think is wrong
I found the type of motherboard using cmd (wmic baseboard get product,Manufacturer,version,serialnumber) which said it is a: H110H4-CM2 board.
I cannot find a specsheet on it, only a bios upgrade page but that has no usefull information at all.
But I think the mobo just does not support NVMe drives?
 

• First clue: Looking at the specs on https://tweakers.net/pricewatch/479215/medion-akoya-pc-p5207-f/specificaties/ I see "storage bus: sata-600".
  At first I thought that was unrelated to the M.2 slot, but I guess not?
• Second clue: When Googling that mobo number (H110H4-CM2) I find this other prebuild Medion PC that has a preinstalled ssd which is the "Samsung MZNLF128HCHP-00000".
  When I google that ssd I find this "specsheet" page that clearly states that drive is a Sata-600 m.2 card.
• Third clue: This website gives a list if compatible SSD upgrade drives for this exact PC and it suggests the "Samsung 860 EVO M.2 SATA SSD" which is also a SATA M.2.

 

So, does this motherboard just not support nvme cards?
It might sound silly but I never thought about that, especially because the m.2 port on the mobo has only one plastic breaker which makes the NVMe card fit without issue (see image below).
While it it seems Sata m.2 card have 2 cuts in the connection. I would have expected 2 plastic breakers on the M.2 slot on the mobo if it's only compatible with Sata drives, hence my confusion.
So is my conclusion right and should I just return the drive and change it for Samsung Evo 860 Sata m.2 card and would that just work?
Or is my theory wrong and should this actually work and might there be another problem?
(I'm not eager to do a bios update, due to the lack of information about the board, or any information on the bios upgrade page at all.)

Thanks alot.

 

[schwellmo92]

H110 does not support NVMe. It is also important to note that if you do populate an M.2 drive it will use some SATA ports, so you may need to move the existing HDD to other SATA ports on the motherboard if it stops getting detected.

 

I would honestly just get a 2.5" SATA SSD, they're cheaper and wont steal any PCI-E lanes (H110 only has 6 lanes maximum).

[comicsansms]

I tried to put an NVMe SSD in an Elitebook 840 the other day. Didn't work. 

 

Yes, ECS (the motherboard manufacturer in your Medion) probably used the wrong key m.2 slot, but that's common and really doesn't matter to them, because the manufacturer has already determined what components they'd use in that PC.

[TrigrH]

Why on earth would you spend the extra on nvme for a "dad" pc from a cheapstore. It doesn't even help anyway.

[GoldenLag]

M.2 is an interface, doesnt say anything about the protocol used. 

 

There are Sata aswell as NVMe drives for m.2 Interface

[VincentN]

53 minutes ago, schwellmo92 said:

H110 does not support NVMe. It is also important to note that if you do populate an M.2 drive it will use some SATA ports, so you may need to move the existing HDD to other SATA ports on the motherboard if it stops getting detected.

 

I would honestly just get a 2.5" SATA SSD, they're cheaper and wont steal any PCI-E lanes (H110 only has 6 lanes maximum).

1. Ok, thanks for confirming my conclusion.
2. The pc has one HDD, 1 empty hotswap drive and a dvd drive.
   So IF the current HDD does not get recognised anymore I could switch the hdd sata cable with the one of the hotswap or dvd drive right?
   As both are unused.
3. You mean place a 2.5" instead of the current HDD? Or what do you imply saying "wont steal any PCI-E lanes" ?
   I'm sure he want's to keep the current hdd, but if 2. happens I can hook that up instead of the empty hotswap drive.
   But I'll suggest both options to him. Thanks

 

40 minutes ago, Comic_Sans_MS said:

Yes, ECS (the motherboard manufacturer in your Medion) probably used the wrong key m.2 slot, but that's common and really doesn't matter to them, because the manufacturer has already determined what components they'd use in that PC.

Ok, that does not sound unreasonable. I just did not give any thought because I saw that specific m.2 slot.  

 

40 minutes ago, TrigrH said:

Why on earth would you spend the extra on nvme for a "dad" pc from a cheapstore. It doesn't even help anyway.

As said, he just asked me if he could expand it with a fast ssd, and I confirmed that to him after seeing the M.2 slot. He picked and ordered the drive himself.
True, I should have checked if it was nvme compatible, but I hadn't much time when he asked and the slot seemed to confirm it.
And think that even when I have known it he would have gone for the fastest most expensive Sata drive he could find. That's just how GF's dad works
The pc was just very slow on boot to start with, which could be improved by using an ssd. And also other file managing stuff felt really slow.

 

18 minutes ago, GoldenLag said:

M.2 is an interface, doesnt say anything about the protocol used. 

There are Sata aswell as NVMe drives for m.2 Interface

Yes, I'm well aware of that now  
But Sata M.2 drives have 2 slit's in the interface, while NVMe has 1, if I'm correct.
And because of the wrongly installed interface on the mobo I made that wrong assumption.
Will not make that mistake again  

[VincentN]

On 4/14/2019 at 1:30 PM, schwellmo92 said:

I would honestly just get a 2.5" SATA SSD, they're cheaper and wont steal any PCI-E lanes (H110 only has 6 lanes maximum).

I explained both options to him but suggested the 2.5" Samsung Evo 860 drive, because it could be more easily reused in any future PC, compared to the sata M.2. And because the speed would be the same due to the sata protocol anyways. Which he aggreed to and contacted the seller for a trade. Thanks for your help

[schwellmo92]

8 hours ago, VincentN said:

I explained both options to him but suggested the 2.5" Samsung Evo 860 drive, because it could be more easily reused in any future PC, compared to the sata M.2. And because the speed would be the same die to the sata protocol anyways. Which he aggreed to and contacted the seller for a trade. Thanks for your help

Good recommendation  .. it’s cheaper, more compatible and performs the same, cooling is typically better as well in 2.5” drives.

[-rascal-]

NVMe slots will use up PCI-E lanes, while non-NVMe M.2 typically shares SATA III (e.g. SATA-600) from the regular SATA ports.

Whether you get a M.2 SATA III SSD, or a regular 2.5" SATA III SSD, they will perform the same -- just different form factor.

 

Even a SATA III SSD will easily be 3x or 4x faster than a spinning 7200 RPM mechanical HDD.

[ewitte]

On 4/14/2019 at 6:30 AM, schwellmo92 said:

H110 does not support NVMe. It is also important to note that if you do populate an M.2 drive it will use some SATA ports, so you may need to move the existing HDD to other SATA ports on the motherboard if it stops getting detected.

 

I would honestly just get a 2.5" SATA SSD, they're cheaper and wont steal any PCI-E lanes (H110 only has 6 lanes maximum).

A bit cheaper I used this though to save space and make the cables cleaner.

 

StarTech.com 4x M.2 SATA mounting adapter for 3.5in drive bay

 

Uses 1 SATA cable for each drive but 1 power

 

OP:  You *may* be able to cut the video card to 8x and run the NVME drive in a PCIe slot with an adapter.  May be a PITA to get it bootable if the computer doesn't support it (there are ways around it but its not ideal). I had a Z87 I hacked UEFI to get it to work you can also use clover.  BUT if its not your machine its usually best to keep it simple.