AdoredTV responds to PC Perspective's response to Journalistic Ethics Accusations and The Right To Reply

[PopReference]

1 minute ago, Bullion said:

The amount of coverage they gave is very reasonable. there was the overall reveiw of the 480, it linked to an article with a more in depth look at the power problem. then there was article comparing an asus strix gtx960 to the 480, then there was an article testing the fix. 4 articles.

What are you talking about? Can you actually articulate the issue AdoredTV had stated in his video?

[Derangel]

2 hours ago, Paragon_X said:

So let me get this straight. PCP is both getting paid by companies to do "white papers" aka paid positive reviews. And then they review the products again on the "review business" PCP. They got exposed and people say that the person exposing them is on the wrong? What the actual F. They should choose one of the 2, either doing white papers or real reviews, this is text book conflict of interest.

 

It doesn't matter if it is Intel Nvidia or AMD or any other tech company, they still get paid for the white papers. You expect me to believe that Company A pays you amount X to do a white paper, and if it sucks you are gonna tear them a new one in your review? No chance of happening, because you will lose the customer on the paid review business. Behind the two companies are the same people.

Wait, wait. Stop. A whitepaper is NOT a review. Nothing in a whitepaper qualifies as reviewing a product. A whitepaper is a technical report on a product, going into detail on what makes up the product, tolerances, various information on development, ideal performance metrics, and so on.

 

A review is an opinionated report on a product based on the reviewer's experience with it alongside any relevant information and tests on the product. A review requires an opinion as well as a statement of the quality of the product and whether or not the consumer should pay for said product.

[mr moose]

1 hour ago, PopReference said:

You must be mistaken somewhere. First by "upset-ed" I was simplifying "the reason of friction between 2 parties" for ease of use and not necessarily anyone's emotional response.

So: I ask @Bullion on more specifics when he said:

 

Then he expanded

 

Then I asked him if AdoredTV was specifically referring to PCPer being the first (if not only 1) to write about the power problem, of the AMD cards, being the main issue when it was referred to in the video when it was brought up. Maybe I can ask you if you understood the issue AdoredTV had in this case.

Yes I am mistaken, I thought you were asking something different.  My apologies for the confusion.

[mr moose]

3 hours ago, Paragon_X said:

So let me get this straight. PCP is both getting paid by companies to do "white papers" aka paid positive reviews. And then they review the products again on the "review business" PCP. They got exposed and people say that the person exposing them is on the wrong? What the actual F. They should choose one of the 2, either doing white papers or real reviews, this is text book conflict of interest.

 

It doesn't matter if it is Intel Nvidia or AMD or any other tech company, they still get paid for the white papers. You expect me to believe that Company A pays you amount X to do a white paper, and if it sucks you are gonna tear them a new one in your review? No chance of happening, because you will lose the customer on the paid review business. Behind the two companies are the same people.

what this bloke said:

53 minutes ago, Derangel said:

Wait, wait. Stop. A whitepaper is NOT a review. Nothing in a whitepaper qualifies as reviewing a product. A whitepaper is a technical report on a product, going into detail on what makes up the product, tolerances, various information on development, ideal performance metrics, and so on.

 

A review is an opinionated report on a product based on the reviewer's experience with it alongside any relevant information and tests on the product. A review requires an opinion as well as a statement of the quality of the product and whether or not the consumer should pay for said product.

 

But just to reiterate, a white paper in this instance is an independent validation of a manufacturers product.  This is essential for manufacturers to both improve product and to underpin any marketing claims.   What people seem to fail to understand is that Ryan does white papers for all the companies.  Just recently he did one for AMD, but they chose to use the white paper internally and not release it to the public.  We can only make assumptions as to why, but that doesn't change the fact that all it is is product testing.  It is not promotional work, it isn't fudged figures or market manipulation it doesn't misrepresent any product. 

 

The only real issue is should Ryan have made it clearer he does white paper work in each review article pcper writes?  I think most of us would say yes. But this doesn't change the fact that many of us also think Adoredtv is pushing for views in a witch hunt.  As this could have been handle in a much better way.  There are many more mature and less hypocritical ways to raise his concerns, However they don't get the views he needs do they?

 

 

[ivan134]

TIL I should trust manufacturers numbers instead of waiting for independent reviewers. I also learned that I shouldn't call it anyone for wrongdoing because online trolls might doxx them.

 

Btw, PCPer still has that erroneous FreeSync ghosting video up.

[Nena Trinity]

PCPER = fake news! :3

[mr moose]

19 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

TIL I should trust manufacturers numbers instead of waiting for independent reviewers. I also learned that I shouldn't call it anyone for wrongdoing because online trolls might doxx them.

 

Btw, PCPer still has that erroneous FreeSync ghosting video up.

No, you should trust independent and reproducible numbers,  No one here has said anything about taking a manufacturers word for anything.  ANd most of the issues are that adoredtv went way to far that led to doxxing, not that calling him out was wrong, but that the excessive and sensationalist manner was.

 

Also If you have read the email conversations between adoredtv and Ryan it is quiet clear adoredtv is just a cunt and has no real concern for journalistic ethics unless it gets him views.

[Tarzan]

Now my only tech worthy source left is the remarkable Tech Deals. He's just the tech God everyone should listen to :).

[ivan134]

22 minutes ago, mr moose said:

No, you should trust independent and reproducible numbers,  No one here has said anything about taking a manufacturers word for anything.  ANd most of the issues are that adoredtv went way to far that led to doxxing, not that calling him out was wrong, but that the excessive and sensationalist manner was.

 

Also If you have read the email conversations between adoredtv and Ryan it is quiet clear adoredtv is just a cunt and has no real concern for journalistic ethics unless it gets him views.

Went to far as in? 

 

Don't care about the what happened after the callout. I wasn't going to read that wall he Ryan payed on Reddit because there was nothing he could say that would excuse anything they did. Since you've read it, in what way does Adored not care about journalistic integrity?

 

Do you even care about the other things Adored called him out on? Reading your comments on this thread, the only thing you've touched is the doing validation work for the same product they reviewed and even then you only conceded begrudgingly. What do you have to say for leaving that erroneous video up for 3 years? The day they released that review, people pointed out that it want the fault of FreeSync to them, but Allyn kept saying it was. 3 years they've left that video up and I've even gotten into arguments with people on this forum that FreeSync isn't inferior to GSync because of ghosting who point to their video as evidence. Now instead of taking it down, they've "changed" the title ( the title still gives the impression that FreeSync is the cause of the ghosting and not the panel, or more specifically in the monitor's case, a missing patch).

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

Went to far as in? 

 

Don't care about the what happened after the callout. I wasn't going to read that wall he Ryan payed on Reddit because there was nothing he could say that would excuse anything they did. Since you've read it, in what way does Adored not care about journalistic integrity?

 

Do you even care about the other things Adored called him out on? Reading your comments on this thread, the only thing you've touched is the doing validation work for the same product they reviewed and even then you only conceded begrudgingly. What do you have to say for leaving that erroneous video up for 3 years? The day they released that review, people pointed out that it want the fault of FreeSync to them, but Allyn kept saying it was. 3 years they've left that video up and I've even gotten into arguments with people on this forum that FreeSync isn't inferior to GSync because of ghosting who point to their video as evidence. Now instead of taking it down, they've "changed" the title ( the title still gives the impression that FreeSync is the cause of the ghosting and not the panel, or more specifically in the monitor's case, a missing patch).

 

I haven't really conceded anything on this topic.  My opinions on the matter haven't really changed.  You know that a difference of opinion on where the problem lies in freesync at the time of publishing an article is just that, a difference in opinion.  As far as I am aware pcper released a new video some time later with more information that explains why the ghosting happens (could only have been later because they received new information).  It is no longer a question of misrepresenting facts but of a clash of opinions (funnily enough it's what I have been saying since the very start of this whole debacle). 

 

If you don't want to trust pcper because of this then that's absolutely o.k, You are more than welcome to tell everyone you don't appreciate pcper for said reasons.  However misrepresenting others on this forum is not O.K,  no one said trust the manufacturer over independent reviews.    The only thing I am warning people is to not make the mistake of thinking that adoredtv is some sinless saint who isn't making things intentionally harder and sensationalizing opinions for his own gains.

 

 

 

 

 

[ivan134]

10 minutes ago, mr moose said:

 

I haven't really conceded anything on this topic.  My opinions on the matter haven't really changed.  You know that a difference of opinion on where the problem lies in freesync at the time of publishing an article is just that, a difference in opinion.  As far as I am aware pcper released a new video some time later with more information that explains why the ghosting happens (could only have been later because they received new information).  It is no longer a question of misrepresenting facts but of a clash of opinions (funnily enough it's what I have been saying since the very start of this whole debacle). 

 

If you don't want to trust pcper because of this then that's absolutely o.k, You are more than welcome to tell everyone you don't appreciate pcper for said reasons.  However misrepresenting others on this forum is not O.K,  no one said trust the manufacturer over independent reviews.    The only thing I am warning people is to not make the mistake of thinking that adoredtv is some sinless saint who isn't making things intentionally harder and sensationalizing opinions for his own gains.

 

 

 

 

 

The FreeSync issue is not a matter of opinion. It was outright false. Seems like you're being purposely obtuse here, because all the facts regarding this matter have been completely laid out.

 

I never said I don't trust Ryan's response. I said I didn't read it because there actions Adored called out were inexcusable. Declaring something inexcusable is completely different than saying Ryan is a liar. All I told you was my reading for not reading his reddit post. I'm just asking in what way Jim doesn't care about journalistic integrity since you've read it. Maybe it came off as a defensive question, but that's not what it was. I genuinely want to know.

[mr moose]

2 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

The FreeSync issue is not a matter of opinion. It was outright false. Seems like you're being purposely obtuse here, because all the facts regarding this matter have been completely laid out.

 

I never said I don't trust Ryan's response. I said I didn't read it because there actions Adored called out were inexcusable. Declaring something inexcusable is completely different than saying Ryan is a liar. All I told you was my reading for not reading his reddit post. I'm just asking in what way Jim doesn't care about journalistic integrity since you've read it. Maybe it came off as a defensive question, but that's not what it was. I genuinely want to know.

Perhaps you should read it before dismissing it.  I am not going to copy and paste the email exchange when you can simply read it yourself.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/7tdm7k/pcpers_response_to_the_recent_ethical_concerns/

 

[ivan134]

34 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Perhaps you should read it before dismissing it.  I am not going to copy and paste the email exchange when you can simply read it yourself.

 

https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/7tdm7k/pcpers_response_to_the_recent_ethical_concerns/

 

I've just read it so I guess I missed it. Which part shows Jim doesn't care about journalistic integrity? I laughed at the part where Ryan asked if the video would be taken down of he made edits. He didn't seem to have those same qualms when he left a video up for 3 years that made people believe FreeSync monitors had ghosting.

[mr moose]

2 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

I've just read it so I guess I missed it. Which part shows Jim doesn't care about journalistic integrity? I laughed at the part where Ryan asked if the video would be taken down of he made edits. He didn't seem to have those same qualms when he left a video up for 3 years that made people believe FreeSync monitors had ghosting.

Are you kidding me?  Did you not read where after not asking/offering ryan  a response/comment prior to release, he then tried to brush him off for the whole weekend not even wanting to give him 15 minutes on the phone.  That is really bad journalistic ethics right there, that is the pot calling the kettle black.  Putting the video up and being so petulant claiming the moral high ground and doing that is disgraceful. 

 

Consistency is all I am asking for.   Adoredtv has shown none,  At best he is a hypocrite.  Ryan on the other hand has admitted there should have been a disclosure and added it,  Ryan defended his video's and articles on freesync and explained why they are the way they are.  What we have there is a difference of opinion, not a dismissal of facts. Ergo, if you don't think pcper is being fair then stop watching, explain why you think it is unfair, but don't expect others to adopt your opinions.

 

 

[ivan134]

16 minutes ago, mr moose said:

Are you kidding me?  Did you not read where after not asking/offering ryan  a response/comment prior to release, he then tried to brush him off for the whole weekend not even wanting to give him 15 minutes on the phone.  That is really bad journalistic ethics right there, that is the pot calling the kettle black.  Putting the video up and being so petulant claiming the moral high ground and doing that is disgraceful. 

 

Consistency is all I am asking for.   Adoredtv has shown none,  At best he is a hypocrite.  Ryan on the other hand has admitted there should have been a disclosure and added it,  Ryan defended his video's and articles on freesync and explained why they are the way they are.  What we have there is a difference of opinion, not a dismissal of facts. Ergo, if you don't think pcper is being fair then stop watching, explain why you think it is unfair, but don't expect others to adopt your opinions.

 

 

Hahahaha. I agree with him not contacting him before putting up the video. Make sure you watch this video to the end. Also, if I'm on vacation, I'm not taking any work related calls. He even ended missing his sister's birthday party. The only thing Jim should have done differently was upload the video on the Monday after his vacation so he would have time to deal with anything that came up after it.

 

 

 

[mr moose]

33 minutes ago, ivan134 said:

Hahahaha. I agree with him not contacting him before putting up the video.

So you  don't see the hypocrisy then?

 

Quote

 

Make sure you watch this video to the end.

Before I watch it what does it have to do with this topic?

Quote

 

Also, if I'm on vacation, I'm not taking any work related calls. He even ended missing his sister's birthday party. The only thing Jim should have done differently was upload the video on the Monday after his vacation so he would have time to deal with anything that came up after it.

 

 

 

He made the choice to upload before going away, he wears the consequences, not doing so makes him a prick.  

[ivan134]

16 minutes ago, mr moose said:

So you  don't see the hypocrisy then?

 

Before I watch it what does it have to do with this topic?

 

He made the choice to upload before going away, he wears the consequences, not doing so makes him a prick.  

It shows why I agree with him not talking to him before releasing the video.

 

I don't care to argue about whether he was a prick or not. You accused me of being dismissive of Ryan when this exactly what you're doing. You don't care about the content of the video because you think he was a prick. " All I care about is consistency".

[mr moose]

1 minute ago, ivan134 said:

It shows why I agree with him not talking to him before releasing the video.

 

I don't care to argue about whether he was a prick or not. You accused me of being dismissive of Ryan when this exactly what you're doing. You don't care about the content of the video because you think he was a prick. " All I care about is consistency".

No,  I accused you of misrepresenting what people on here are saying and I accused you of dismissing Ryans response when you hadn't even read it.

Both I think are quite fair accusations given you actually admitted you hadn't read them and I haven't seen anyone claim manufacturers figures should be taken over independent reviews.

 

If the content of the video is inconsistent and lacking integrity and he is doing this only to get views, then that makes him a prick, not the other way around. 

[Razor01]

5 hours ago, mr moose said:

No,  I accused you of misrepresenting what people on here are saying and I accused you of dismissing Ryans response when you hadn't even read it.

Both I think are quite fair accusations given you actually admitted you hadn't read them and I haven't seen anyone claim manufacturers figures should be taken over independent reviews.

 

If the content of the video is inconsistent and lacking integrity and he is doing this only to get views, then that makes him a prick, not the other way around. 

 

 

Ya hit the nail on the head right there.  Wrote this in other thread

 

 

........

 

But going to Adored, its not even worth it, outside of sh*t fling, his channel gives nothing that other reviewers already give.  His content is crap, its based on what others say. I don't know how old you are, but do you remember Heraldo Rivera?  If ya haven't seen his show from the early nineties, watch it, you would be surprised how you can parallelize what Adored is doing now, to that show, its amazing.  It was a tabloid talk show of the lowest degenerates, guess what adored is?

But here is the thing Heroldo ( akin to adored) doing it for one thing, views and hits and adored is being vindicated by his paying followers and their reactions to what is going on.  They only care about that, that is not journalism, that is sensationalism, or yellow journalism, which is extremely frowned up in the journalistic circles.  This is why Adored is made fun of by these guys in the past when he pointed them out in the past.  This time he took it a step too far, he directly pointed, with false accusations at people.  Which by all accounts is slander if damages are done.  And if physical harm comes to Ryan or his family members because of what he stated, oh hell ya that too can be pursued.  Now that is very hard to prove in the US because the accused must prove the damages, but if someone gets physically hurt because of it, that is easy to prove, at least that portion.  In the EU its even easier to prove, and the accuser must prove what he states is real, and if the other party is already uncooperative, its going to be damn hard to prove, if someone gets hurt because of the accuser stated, lol that is a walk in the park.  These aren't criminal charges but civil, so anyone thinking that can't happen and believe its not Adored's responsibility, should take note, it can happen and its not very hard to do if there are any damages.  Again a mistake he has made, he assumed its not his responsibility, in reality it is very much so, because he is the one that opened this can of worms.  His followers are the ones doing the actions based on his information which was false.

 

Now back to Adored, he can't make a tech video with mistakes in it.  Why?

 

1)  He can't do his own true reviews (lack of money or sponsors or what not)

2)  He doesn't have the technical knowledge to do such videos to begin with

3)  He is one arrogant SOB

 

How do I see these three for him to fix

 

1) he can't yet, he needs to make content that is on his own merits to help him get to the point he can, it takes time.  And if he continues down the path he is now, which he has been doing for years, since he started his channel, so I don't see him changing until he really gets hurt by what he does, he will end up being a pariah, just like Charlie of Semiaccurate became.

 

2) Keep asking questions to the guys have been doing it for years, he did that before when he wasn't doing videos, why did he stop now?

 

3) Personality issues, he needs to step back and make himself a better person by saying out load, "I don't know more than my peers". and believing it

 

Being arrogant is ok, if he knows his shit, which he clearly doesn't. And until his arrogance is subsided, he will not be in a position to learn.

 

When was the last time you heard someone start of a conversation, " I know more than you, so I'm going to correct you?" or have that type of mentality?  Ya already hate the guy already.  That is the situation Adored is in now.  so he is already 50% of the way to being a pariah.

 

I can add a lot more to this, but I'll wait on how the discussion evolves.

[Bananasplit_00]

All I see is free attention to both sides because before this I can't say I knew any of them, not that this will make me go look up their content though

[NumLock21]

8 hours ago, Razor01 said:

 

 

Snip

Judging by his past yt videos where it only shows some game play and all of a sudden into tech and immediately started bashing other channel. To bash a tech channel that's been working since the dawn of computing with more knowledge than this so call "expert" ever has, tells me he's up to no good. And for those believe in this idiot, he cares more about his views, than protecting the consumer. The only way for him to achieve this is by creating drama. And wtf does adored even mean?

[Razor01]

Good point even his channel name, he wants attention!