ASUS releases first sub-100 dollar 10GbE card

[leadeater]

2.5Gbps and 5Gbps were actually created mostly to address wireless access points and the increasing speed that are being able to be delivered to wireless clients. With multiple clients on an access point wired bandwidth has been a concern for some time now, it doesn't take much to overload it.

[Juanitology]

20 hours ago, leadeater said:

2.5Gbps and 5Gbps were actually created mostly to address wireless access points and the increasing speed that are being able to be delivered to wireless clients. With multiple clients on an access point wired bandwidth has been a concern for some time now, it doesn't take much to overload it.

huh I had no idea, thanks for the info. I thought they were meant to provide higher bandwidth for cat5e installations that weren't certified for 10Gb.

[AshleyAshes]

On 6/21/2017 at 6:59 PM, Terodius said:

Finally the value proposition for 10GbE is reasonable, and for those of us running home/PLEX servers with 4K films this will be a very welcome upgrade. 

I gotta be honest.  I've looked at the few 4K HDR Remux's that have leaked such as The Smurfs 2.  They're only about 50GB each.  That's 50GB for a 1hr 37min movie.  You really, really, REALLY don't need 10GbE for that unless you are shelling out data to like 10 clients concurrently bare minimum.  Even my TV can play the file off a USB 2.0 key.

 

Even a FULL UHD BD disc, that's 128GB for a 1hr 37min for the typical feature film. That's no problem for 1GbE unless you are feeding a number of clients concurrently.

 

10GbE doesn't solve any 4K problems because those problems don't actually exist.  (Unless you are serving a LOT of clients at once.  You'd basically have to have a McMansion full of most of your relatives with people using EVERY TV to produce the demand necessary)

[Juanitology]

17 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

I gotta be honest.  I've looked at the few 4K HDR Remux's that have leaked such as The Smurfs 2.  They're only about 50GB each.  That's 50GB for a 1hr 37min movie.  You really, really, REALLY don't need 10GbE for that unless you are shelling out data to like 10 clients concurrently bare minimum.  Even my TV can play the file off a USB 2.0 key.

 

Even a FULL UHD BD disc, that's 128GB for a 1hr 37min for the typical feature film. That's no problem for 1GbE unless you are feeding a number of clients concurrently.

 

10GbE doesn't solve any 4K problems because those problems don't actually exist.  (Unless you are serving a LOT of clients at once.  You'd basically have to have a McMansion full of most of your relatives with people using EVERY TV to produce the demand necessary)

Blu-Ray "4K" UHD is for pussies. Real men watch cineform true 4K  300GB for a 40 min film = 7.5GB/min = 125MB/s which is actually slightly more than what 1GbE can provide.

 

Now is this an extremely niche scenario? yes. Is this a one-in-a-million use case of someone streaming near-raw quality 4K video? yes. But does it allow me to say 1Gbps is not enough for true 4K streaming? yes, yes it does lol

[AshleyAshes]

Just now, Terodius said:

Blu-Ray "4K" UHD is for pussies. Real men watch cineform true 4K  300GB for a 40 min film = 7.5GB/min = 125MB/s which is actually slightly more than what 1GbE can provide.

 

Now is this an extremely niche scenario? yes. Is this a one-in-a-million use case of someone streaming near-raw quality 4K video? yes. But does it allow me to say 1Gbps is not enough for true 4K streaming? yes, yes it does lol

...I'm literally sitting in a visual effects office, working on a 4K episodic series where the source footage are 4K 10bit DPX image sequences at 34mb/frame.  Please stop trying to impress me with file sizes, you just look like a scrub.

 

Also, congrats, TimeScapes, outside of the Blender short films, is like the ONE movie every pirate has in high bitrate Cineform...  That's not a format that will ever actually be used for content distribute. I mean geez, Cineform is literally an intermediate format by definition.

[Juanitology]

1 minute ago, AshleyAshes said:

...I'm literally sitting in a visual effects office, working on a 4K episodic series where the source footage are 4K 10bit DPX image sequences at 34mb/frame.  Please stop trying to impress me with file sizes, you just look like a scrub.

 

Also, congrats, TimeScapes, outside of the Blender short films, is like the ONE movie every pirate has in high bitrate Cineform...  That's not a format that will ever actually be used for content distribute. I mean geez, Cineform is literally an intermediate format by definition.

relax I was just making a joke haha. That's seriously impressive though, I tried my hand at video editing and playing around with Ae and maya but I just wasn't good enough. I wish I was creative enough to be good at it but sadly I ended up as a web developer. and yeah I know cineform is an intermediate format, I remember learning that from the video LMG made a while back about their workflow, but I don't really know how to get it into an HEVC .mkv container so it's just sitting there in its cineform house happily for now. 

 

PS any chance you can tell us which series you're working on?

[AshleyAshes]

Just now, Terodius said:

PS any chance you can tell us which series you're working on?

I can't talk about the projects I work on until after they go to air or cinemas.

 

But my point still stands, for 4K content consumption, 10GbE solves nothing because there's no problem.  (Again, unless you have a REALLY demanding home setup, but we're talking about something that'd exceed even the demands of a single family home)

[Juanitology]

18 minutes ago, AshleyAshes said:

I can't talk about the projects I work on until after they go to air or cinemas.

 

But my point still stands, for 4K content consumption, 10GbE solves nothing because there's no problem.  (Again, unless you have a REALLY demanding home setup, but we're talking about something that'd exceed even the demands of a single family home)

For 4K content creation though it's definitely worth it right?

[AshleyAshes]

Just now, Terodius said:

For 4K content creation though it's definitely worth it right?

You're moving the goalpost now.

[Juanitology]

Just now, AshleyAshes said:

You're moving the goalpost now.

I mean say it's a hybrid situation. Someone who consumes media on 4K, but also does network backups and snapshotting and they do content creation for youtube/twitch on 4K. It's not absolutely necessary, but it's nice. Whenever I finish downloading a big movie that's 40-50GB or a 12-hour 1080p recording from my twitch stream and want to move it from my SSD to my NAS, it takes a fair bit of time. 

[AshleyAshes]

1 minute ago, Terodius said:

I mean say it's a hybrid situation. Someone who consumes media on 4K, but also does network backups and snapshotting and they do content creation for youtube/twitch on 4K. It's not absolutely necessary, but it's nice. Whenever I finish downloading a big movie that's 40-50GB or a 12-hour 1080p recording from my twitch stream and want to move it from my SSD to my NAS, it takes a fair bit of time. 

Anything that would actually make good use of 10GbE would also need to have storage that can do those speeds.  The whole thing becomes about building an entire infrastructure for 10GbE.

[Juanitology]

1 minute ago, AshleyAshes said:

Anything that would actually make good use of 10GbE would also need to have storage that can do those speeds.  The whole thing becomes about building an entire infrastructure for 10GbE.

I think last time I ran an internal benchmark on my NAS it was doing 700MB/s, but I can only access about half of that since I'm connected to it with a 4x1GbE teamed NIC. and my PC is on an nvme SSD so it can easily do 1+GB/s

[AshleyAshes]

8 minutes ago, Terodius said:

I think last time I ran an internal benchmark on my NAS it was doing 700MB/s, but I can only access about half of that since I'm connected to it with a 4x1GbE teamed NIC. and my PC is on an nvme SSD so it can easily do 1+GB/s

Yeah, when you're teaming four NICs together, you are well into what I'd call the 'Infrastructure Territory' for sure.

[Juanitology]

1 minute ago, AshleyAshes said:

Yeah, when you're teaming four NICs together, you are well into what I'd call the 'Infrastructure Territory' for sure.

What do you mean by infrastructure territory?

[AshleyAshes]

1 minute ago, Terodius said:

What do you mean by infrastructure territory?

Using hardware that has for NICs.  Using managed switches.  And a NAS that is either high end or running SSDs, both of which are atypical consumer deployments.

 

But again, this is you moving the goal post.  You said this would solve the 'problem' of watchin 4K content at home, which was BS, and now you're redefining terms until you can make it useful.  And yes, if you move the goal post far enough, 10GbE become practical.

[leadeater]

3 hours ago, Terodius said:

huh I had no idea, thanks for the info. I thought they were meant to provide higher bandwidth for cat5e installations that weren't certified for 10Gb.

It was, most access points use existing cabling and replacing it is expensive so just being able to swap out an AP to one that supports 2.5/5 and a switch is much less costly. Not so bad to do re-cabling when you only have a few APs but when you have hundreds that's a huge project.

[2bitmarksman]

Oh cool, a justification for me making sure my entire house has Cat6 throughout the entire house when I eventually buy a house in like 5 years

[Drak3]

2 hours ago, leadeater said:

It was, most access points use existing cabling and replacing it is expensive so just being able to swap out an AP to one that supports 2.5/5 and a switch is much less costly. Not so bad to do re-cabling when you only have a few APs but when you have hundreds that's a huge project.

I could stand to replace the cabling running to my AP, too long. Unfortunately, the only smaller option I found is 1 ft. and that's too short.

[Jito463]

10 minutes ago, 2bitmarksman said:

Oh cool, a justification for me making sure my entire house has Cat6 throughout the entire house when I eventually buy a house in like 5 years

Eh, just go all out and make it fiber.  That's what I'd do.

[TheUzu]

10GBE lan is useful in the same sense that my 3200mhz ram and 2nd 1080ti are.

 

Because I can.

 

Also it saves me from running direct SFP+ 10GBE anymore.

[leadeater]

7 hours ago, Drak3 said:

I could stand to replace the cabling running to my AP, too long. Unfortunately, the only smaller option I found is 1 ft. and that's too short.

Make your own cable?

[Drak3]

48 minutes ago, leadeater said:

Make your own cable?

I'm not going to buy more cabling to do that unless I need to make multiples. Is somewhat expensive.

[leadeater]

Just now, Drak3 said:

I'm not going to buy more cabling to do that unless I need to make multiples. Is somewhat expensive.

Just find an exposed cable trunk and cut some off, I'm sure who ever you take it from won't mind lol. Would give the IT guys a great story too.

[Drak3]

Just now, leadeater said:

Just find an exposed cable trunk and cut some off, I'm sure who ever you take it from won't mind lol. Would give the IT guys a great story too.

I'll think about it the next time I'm demoing a job and they're dumb enough to leave Cat5e.

 

And every spare cable I have currently are staying as they are backups or used infrequently but still used.

[Zodiark1593]

On 6/21/2017 at 7:08 PM, Ryan_Vickers said:

First, let me just say it's great to see 10 Gb hardware getting cheaper, but I have to say a few things, first about the article, and then the product itself.

 

Uh, no.  There is no shortage of NVMe SSDs that can perform faster than this connection by quite a bit, so no it's not "just what you need", it's "about 2/3^rds of what you need".  Furthermore, who the hell has a NAS built out of NVMe SSDs?

 

Uh, yes, and you can already do that easily with 1 Gb ethernet.  A 50 GB bluray file streamed over the course of 1.5 hours needs less than 10 MB/s, under 1/10 of what's already doable.

 

Can they seriously not come up with one valid use for it?  (This is where I transition to my problem with the product itself.)

 

Well luckily @TheRandomness did  

 

It's for those people in Sweden/Denmark/etc. that get 5 gigabit internet access.  

 

For everyone else, it's just not worth it.  If you have a NAS, sure, this will be faster than what you've got, but are you really gonna pay $99 per machine, plus whatever it takes for all new CAT 6A cables, plus 1 or more 10 Gb switches just to less than double your speed (assuming you've got HDDs in your NAS)?  If so, good on you, but I suspect the answer is no, and that's the enthusiast end of the market.  For the other 99% of people, they simply don't transfer files often enough or with enough urgency to make it worth it.

Game Sstreaming uncompressed to another box? (though I think 40g would be required) 

 

The only time I actually really abused the 1g bandwidth (or ever used Ethernet for that matter)  was transferring 24 GB of anime to a laptop without USB 3. It was SSD to SSD, so this was the first time I've ever seen my network bandwidth completely saturated. This house is not setup for wired networking though, so I use wifi 99.99% of the time. 

 

Considering a Blu Ray video requires about 5 MB/sec (40 mbps is the official spec), and 4K blu ray requires about twice that, a 1 Gb network should easily support several simultaneous streams.