Never skimp on an SSD! PSA

[dcgreen2k]

It seems like everybody complains about how slow their 7200rpm hard drives are at nearly everything, meanwhile my 5400rpm drive feels just fine for everything besides starting on a cold boot. I just put it in hibernate mode when I leave the PC so it loads faster and everything's where I left it, but I'll record some system/program startup times tomorrow.

[ZcanKal]

I'm getting new storage soon (SSD + new HDD) but for now my 5400RPM laptop HDD has been doing it's best.

[Mira Yurizaki]

In a modern OS, storage performance is somewhat of a moot point once you've launched your daily applications after a fresh boot. If you close them, the OS will just cache the data they were using in RAM and when you launch them again, it'll be quick. Storage performance also has little to no impact on in-game performance, even in most open world games.

 

If I'm on a tight budget and I have to sacrifice the performance of something, storage is going first. Once the thing is loaded in RAM, that's it, it's a moot point.

[cretsiah]

Just my personal opinion,

 

I think both @fasauceome and @M.Yurizaki are both right here, but i think its right depending on context.

 

if you have enough or heaps of ram you probably wont notice the difference .

but if you have low ram and your system is using the page file (windows), swap drive/file (linux) alot then you will notice the difference in performance. 

[Mira Yurizaki]

1 minute ago, cretsiah said:

-Snip-

I also think of it as how much time are you spending waiting around for storage vs. the entire time spent doing something? Like if it's only say 1% of the time, then is it really worth having a pissing contest over?

[RejZoR]

7 hours ago, fasauceome said:

Now that the new LTT video has shown that even with a $150 budget you should still get a cheap SSD, hopefully we will see a lot less parts lists with just an HDD as a "cost saving" measure. It will hurt you in the long run, and buying Mass storage hard drives later as opposed to just sticking with one as a boot drive is such a massive quality of life improvement. 

As someone who went from hard drive to SSD and will never go back, I can only recommend getting an SSD as bare minimum in any PC whatsoever, and any less is pointless. 

There is an alternative. Hybrid HDD+SSD array. You get capacity and cost efficiency of HDD and near SSD speed. And if you're using PrimoCache, if SSD happens to fail because it's a cheap crappy one, you just fall back to HDD speeds and that's it.

 

I moved to a massive 2TB SSD and I took top of the line one (850 Pro), but I still can't shake off the feeling it might one day just out of the blue die. I've never heard of SSD's gradually having problems like HDD's that usually start to get slow and make funny noises, SSD's just die literally over night for no logical reason.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

6 hours ago, RejZoR said:

There is an alternative. Hybrid HDD+SSD array. You get capacity and cost efficiency of HDD and near SSD speed. And if you're using PrimoCache, if SSD happens to fail because it's a cheap crappy one, you just fall back to HDD speeds and that's it.

 

I moved to a massive 2TB SSD and I took top of the line one (850 Pro), but I still can't shake off the feeling it might one day just out of the blue die. I've never heard of SSD's gradually having problems like HDD's that usually start to get slow and make funny noises, SSD's just die literally over night for no logical reason.

I had a hybrid HDD+SSD (SSHD) once; I was not impressed with it.

 

While it's true SSDs usually irrecoverably fail without warning, that's not a reason to not use one in favor off an HDD. HDDs can also irrecoverably fail without warning. All drives, given enough time, will eventually drive. SSDs are generally more reliable than HDDs.

 

The only way to ensure your data is reasonably safe is for it to exist in three separate places. For most people, this is on the computer, on an onsite backup drive, and on an offsite backup drive. For a drive to be a true backup drive, it must be kept disconnected from the computer, powered dowm, and stored out of sight of the computer. Depending on getting a warning before a drive can fail is playing Data Russian Roulette with all but one of the chambers loaded.

 

[Fasauceome]

All this discussion and I just got an email about a Newegg sale for a 240gb SSD for $35. They're just so much better for the same price! In fact, that's even less expensive than the bog standard WD blue

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 hour ago, fasauceome said:

All this discussion and I just got an email about a Newegg sale for a 240gb SSD for $35. They're just so much better for the same price! In fact, that's even less expensive than the bog standard WD blue

As much as the prices of SSDs have dropped, that seems like an unrealistically low price for a decent SSD. The fact it is only 240GB instead of 250GB or 256GB strongly suggests it's an inferior one with extra overprovisioning in an attempt to compensate for lower quality. Can you provide a link to that SSD?

[Fasauceome]

28 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

As much as the prices of SSDs have dropped, that seems like an unrealistically low price for a decent SSD. The fact it is only 240GB instead of 250GB or 256GB strongly suggests it's an inferior one with extra overprovisioning in an attempt to compensate for lower quality. Can you provide a link to that SSD?

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-301-366

 

Soliciton power makes good products for how cheap they are. My coworker bought one for his PC and loves it, and I used one in an old PC to revitalize it. Even a cheap SSD is an order of magnitude faster than a hard drive

[Lady Fitzgerald]

2 hours ago, fasauceome said:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=20-301-366

 

Soliciton power makes good products for how cheap they are. My coworker bought one for his PC and loves it, and I used one in an old PC to revitalize it. Even a cheap SSD is an order of magnitude faster than a hard drive

Granted, even a cheap SSD is faster than the best HDD but that doesn't mean it's good quality. Frankly, I never even heard of that brand. Good TLC SSDs in the size range of the one you linked will have a capacity of 250GB (MLCs are 256GB). Lower quality TLC SSDs will have a capacity of only 240GB to allow for extra spare cells to replace ones that die during use.

 

There is no way I would ever recommend that SSD, even at that sale price. It has only a three year warranty. Good SSDs are reliable enough there is no reason to not have a warranty of less than five years unless the manufacturer isn't confident it won't take take a bath on warranty claims due to a longer warranty. The 240GB capacity is another red flag.

 

Frankly, the only SSDs I will ever recommend are Samsungs. Until recently, when I bought five 4TB 860 Pros I haven't put into service yet, I've owned 32 Samsung SSDs, an 840 pro and the rest 850 EVOs. I have had only one die on my after almost 5 years use (a 128GB 840 Pro) and only one 850 EVO arrive DOA (which the vendor quickly replaced with a new one). Except for the early 840 EVOs (and their problem was fixed in production a long time ago), Samsung has an excellent reputation and long track record for their SSDs (longer than most others). Prices have come down enough there is no real reason one can't just save up their shekels a little longer to get the much better Samsungs.

[Fasauceome]

48 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Granted, even a cheap SSD is faster than the best HDD but that doesn't mean it's good quality. Frankly, I never even heard of that brand. Good TLC SSDs in the size range of the one you linked will have a capacity of 250GB (MLCs are 256GB). Lower quality TLC SSDs will have a capacity of only 240GB to allow for extra spare cells to replace ones that die during use.

 

There is no way I would ever recommend that SSD, even at that sale price. It has only a three year warranty. Good SSDs are reliable enough there is no reason to not have a warranty of less than five years unless the manufacturer isn't confident it won't take take a bath on warranty claims due to a longer warranty. The 240GB capacity is another red flag.

 

Like I said, I've been using these ones for a while, so I don't think their cheap price means they're bad. Actually, advertisers have found that of you make something more expensive, people just think it's better than something cheaper, and I think that plays into this. Overall, my personal experience with silicon power is very positive.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

1 minute ago, fasauceome said:

Like I said, I've been using these ones for a while, so I don't think their cheap price means they're bad. Actually, advertisers have found that of you make something more expensive, people just think it's better than something cheaper, and I think that plays into this. Overall, my personal experience with silicon power is very positive.

How many have you been using and for how long?

[Fasauceome]

16 minutes ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

How many have you been using and for how long?

2 for 2 years, so yeah it's not a huge sample size but hey, I'll get back to you when the warranty expires lol

[Kuno]

You ever notice how the specs of systems get better each and every year, but the overall speed never shifts that much? I have a crappy old HP laptop from before the turn of the century that boots into Windows 95 in about 11 seconds off a 4GB hard drive (that sounds like a buzz saw). The tech always gets better, but the amount of crap we have running on it increases proportionally.

SSD's have the advantage of hard drives as they can randomly read from all areas at about the same rate. This is great for loading times, but if something goes wrong, your just have a garbled mess of data with no logical layout that needs to be stitched back together.

Buyer beware...

[Benjeh]

On 10/31/2018 at 12:04 AM, r2724r16 said:

I'm not saying SSDs are bad, they're amazing. But people who ONLY use Chrome on a budget don't NEED an SSD.

My mum literally uses her laptop to browse the net, she got so angry with the hard drive slowing the thing down to a halt she threw said laptop and the hard drive went FUBAR. I put an SSD in it as thats what I had to hand, she's fallen in love with her Laptop again, I literally saved her £100s for the sake of a £50 500GB SSD. Sorry but I can't agree with what you're saying.

[Fasauceome]

12 minutes ago, Benjeh said:

My mum literally uses her laptop to browse the net, she got so angry with the hard drive slowing the thing down to a halt she threw said laptop and the hard drive went FUBAR. I put an SSD in it as thats what I had to hand, she's fallen in love with her Laptop again, I literally saved her £100s for the sake of a £50 500GB SSD. Sorry but I can't agree with what you're saying.

Can't really say the average user experience involves throwing a laptop in anger, but the Advent of the SSD did save astronauts a ton of trouble in space, since little spinning motors are awful in zero gravity.

[Benjeh]

Just now, fasauceome said:

Can't really say the average user experience involves throwing a laptop in anger, but the Advent of the SSD did save astronauts a ton of trouble in space, since little spinning motors are awful in zero gravity.

I literally can't use a laptop or pc with an hard drive as the main drive, storage or backup, fine, boot drive, no chance...

[Settlerteo]

On 10/31/2018 at 1:48 AM, Eastman51 said:

An extra 1.5 seconds? What turbocharged HDD are you using?

On my 7200rpm HDD it took 15 seconds for chrome to open, but on my 860 EVO it takes .5 sec. Literally Night and Day

That reminded me of the Velociraptor HDDs. They were like WD Blacks on steroids.

[Tristerin]

Me pre SSD: Hit start up button, leave room, come back later

Me post SSD: Hit start button, fart, start using my PC

 

You can get a $120gb SSD for less than $30 now.  It makes zero sense to do anything on a mechanical drive unless Mass Storage is your preference, and speed is not.

 

The delta between a mechanical drive and an SSD (I don't care about the numbers, just talking about real world experience) is unbelievable.  My media center runs all its games off a 1tb HDD - its slow as balls compared to all the other computers in my house.  Loading screens take FOREVER (just talking real world experience).  Plus...Im now used to the lack of sound of a mechanical drive head moving around in my PC.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

2 hours ago, Kuno said:

if something goes wrong, your just have a garbled mess of data with no logical layout that needs to be stitched back together.

Buyer beware...

I'm really tired of seeing this pathetically absurd argument being used against SSDs.

 

All drives, including SSDs and HDDs, are subject to sudden, irrecoverable data with no warning (all drives, given enough time will eventually fail). Depending on being able to recover data from a failed drive of any kind is idiocy. No matter what kind of drive you use or if you use some kind of redundancy (RAID, etc.), the ONLY way to ensure the safety of your data is for it exist in three, separate places. In other words, BACK UP YOU DATA! Then it won't matter if a drive dies. Btw, there are far more ways to lose data than just to drive failure and only backups can protect one from them.

 

Yes, it is true that SSDs, when they fail, usually fail catastrophically (HHDs can do it, too). Despite that, SSDs are still more reliable overall than HDDs (not to mention faster, etc.).

[JoostinOnline]

1 hour ago, Lady Fitzgerald said:

Despite that, SSDs are still more reliable overall than HDDs. 

Not really.

[Fasauceome]

18 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

Not really.

you don't have to worry about bumping or mechanical wear, so it fails less randomly

[Tristerin]

On ‎10‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 3:42 PM, fasauceome said:

2 for 2 years, so yeah it's not a huge sample size but hey, I'll get back to you when the warranty expires lol

Your testimony is what really matters not peoples opinion.  And reviews are testimonies.  If something has good reviews, its likely a decent product (or great!). 

 

I have 840, and 850 Samsung SSDs.  I also have TeamLite, ADATA, and some other ones that I know are lower tier...Ive had them all for a year (840 for much longer of course) and none of them have issues.  And I wouldn't hesitate buying the one you linked if I could justify having it.  But I cant so not worth the fight with the ol' lady (I get to many boxes showing up on the porch as it is LOL)

 

EDIT - I just checked your link - I wouldn't EVEN BALK at purchasing that one.  The price for performance vs reviews is a GREAT BUY.  Especially for someone entering the SSD world, or building cheap gaming rigs to flip, or HTPCs etc.

[Lady Fitzgerald]

25 minutes ago, JoostinOnline said:

Not really.

https://www.contegix.com/solid-state-disks-fail-often-hard-disks/

 

https://www.networkworld.com/article/2873551/data-center/debunking-ssd-myths.html

 

https://www.ricksdailytips.com/reliability-of-ssds-vs-hard-drives/