Case Design Study - What are you looking for in a PC case?

[MEC-777]

Hey all,  PLEASE read everything before commenting. I will try to keep this short. Thank you. 

 

Doing some market research and I'm Looking for constructive and helpful info from as many of you as possible. I'm in the process of designing a new series of PC chassis/cases that I might seriously create a kickstarter campaign for, if I can get a few solid prototypes designed and built. 

 

But first, I'm interested in what you, as enthusiasts, gamers and general PC users, want and look for in a PC case. What features do you look for? What features have you not yet seen, but would like to have? What common features do you dislike and wish would go away? Tell me your deepest desires for the perfect chassis. Well, maybe not 'deepest', but you know what I mean.  

 

To get a few things out of the way; I'll share with you a glimpse of my design philosophy so we can be sort of on the right page with this. 

-Minimalistic, clean, natural design with a focus on optimized cooling, silence and functionality. 

-Absolutely NO RGB lights or fans and NO "gamer" branding, flashiness or gimmickry. (If you want RGB, you can add it or buy something else).

 

For quite some time now, I've not been impressed at all with the direction case manufacturers have been going. Some brands I still like (such as Fractal Design), but most have been going down-hill. IMHO, they look and feel cheaper. They all more or less have the same layout options with "ok" to "poor" airflow dynamics. I'm looking to create something very different from the norm and (hopefully) disruptive. Yeah, I know, wishful thinking, but that's not going to stop me from trying.  

 

Currently I have 6 different base designs laid out, 3 mini-ITX, 1 micro-ATX and 2 full-ATX, ranging from a very small HTPC-oriented micro-tower, to a big enthusiast enclosure aimed specifically at custom loop watercooling. Something for everyone. The designs are far from their final form, but the basic layout and aesthetic I'm going for is there. 

 

Now, I'm looking to you guys to see if I've missed anything that could still yet be integrated into the designs. 

 

Thanks in advanced. And no, I'm not going to show the designs until I have a prototype built.  Ain't giving away my secrets.  

 

[LienusLateTips]

A Define C TG clone with good cooling. Excellent cooling, actually. 

 

Dark TG would make it both look good and be minimalistic

[jiyeon]

For a case, my main concern is the aesthetics and how that affects cooling. I'll take the NZXT S340 as an example;

 

The NZXT S340 has front and rear fan support for nice positive air pressure from the front towards the back, which is ideal for a PC build. I'm not a big user of top fans so in the case of the S340 (pun intended) I'm not worried there.

From a looks perspective, I want a PC case to show what's important, and the S340's PSU shroud does this perfectly, it hides the PSU and its cables from sight, displaying only the motherboard, graphics card(s), and whatever fans you might have installed, it's beautiful.

[Rainbow Dash]

For me something like the Phanteks Enthoo Pro with lots of modularity.

Or my bad case idea:

[Jurrunio]

1. Hard drive cooling. I know hard drives are fine with ambient cooling, but my case (Antec P110 Silent, it's just the P110 Luce with different side panel and worse air filter on the top) Techpowerup's review showed how some of the HDD mounts work

 

Spoiler

The 3.5" drive is located right under this metal piece, while another 2.5" or 3.5" drive could be mounted on the top. Basically means the bottom drive is suffocated down there. I dont like this. Or rather, I hate this.

 

2. Rivets. [profanity] these.

 

3. Fixed power supply shroud. Bad news if your PSU is modular and you want to plug another cable in because you added some new stuff.

 

4. air filters not hold in place tightly. The bottom air filter sometimes start buzzing because of vibration of the whole case. I prefer them to be secured with magnets.

[Atom Ridge]

Here's my 2 cents:

 

* Front panel should be either solid with 1 inch side intakes on BOTH sides, or it should be fully mesh for the best possible airflow. Try to avoid TG front panels, as they are usually terrible for front airflow unless proper front intakes are there.

 

* A PSU shroud I would consider necessary these days, and by this point most are the same, but certain features such as these are the cherry on top: perforation on the top for airflow to the PSU, SSD brackets on the top or side of the shroud, possibly a removable cutout in the shroud to expose logos. It isn't necessary to include all of these features, but the SSD bracket one I would definitely recommend you implement.

 

* For ATX, I think the case should support a 360mm radiator on front or  top, and for mATX, a 280/240mm at the front or top would be fine. For fans, I would rather the case come with no fans than have some crappy cheap ones. And if you're throwing in a fan controller, I would make sure  it supports at least 6 fans and is SATA  powered, and not molex.

 

* For IO, I'd like to see a circular power button with a small white LED or none at all, 4 USB 3.0 ports and a single USB-C port, and maybe a built in fan speed controller in the IO like Be Quiet! has.

 

*For the frame itself, try not to use bare steel as it gets covered in fingerprints really quickly, you should have a sand blasted finish or a brushed metal finish like Fractal has. I wouldn't mind seeing some plastic, just make sure it's high quality stuff and that it won't fall apart or creak.

 

* Like the majority of people, I do like a TG side panel to show of the interior of my build. For mounting, use either thumbscrews or the completely screwless mounting system on the Define R6. To reduce cost, you could not cover the PSU shroud in glass, and just make it part of the frame. I like both a clear and dark tinted glass panel, but many don't, so is probably better to just use clear or give the option of both.

 

* In the back, you should probably have a solid panel and not TG. For the actual cable management area, try and implement cable routing channels as seen in the NZXT H700i. I don't think a cable management bar at the front is necessary, however. Make sure to use rubber gromits, and put in cutouts on the PSU shroud for the PCIe power cables to the GPU. Also make sure that an ATX motherboard will not cover said rubber grommits.

 

Gotta give a massive shout-out to Dmitry from HardwareCanucks and Steve from Gamers Nexus, without them I'd probably know nothing about cases

[Giganthrax]

Cable management support, lots of airflow, and aesthetics (I like them industrial-looking). 

[MEC-777]

Thanks for the responses so far. Much appreciated.  

 

Looks like I've already addressed many of the issues and suggestion made, thus far. Seems I'm on the right track then and I'll continue to refine the design. if anyone else has anything else to add, please, by all means. I'm all ears. 

 

I've put a lot of thought into airflow and cooling (of all the components, not just CPU and GPU) while at the same time trying not to make it look like (or sound like) a wind tunnel. Tempered glass will be an option, but only on the one side for most models. 

 

New question; Would you be interested in buying a case that you assemble yourself? Or would you prefer to buy it already built? The reason I ask this is because one of the features will be nearly limitless exterior/interior finish options - meaning you can take it apart easily (no rivets! ) and paint it any colour or give it any type of finish you want. It could also result in lower manufacturing costs and shipping costs as the packaging could also be made smaller. What do you all think?

[TVwazhere]

How about something TRULY unique;  a case that can stretch base on the motherboard used?

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12866/riotoros-project-morpheus-case-changes-shape-to-fit-your-build

 

 

[TVwazhere]

Also, a different layout. Rotate the motherboard and Put the rear I/O on the bottom or top. Mount the Hard drives or SSD's on the "front panel" in a show off window instead of fans. Make the case completely (or mostly) disassemble to easier cleaning, modding or painting like the Corsair 380T

Spoiler

No Glossy Plastic, especially near the I/O

Maybe Tooless EVERYTHING? Tooless PCI-E bracket screws (Pegs on springs maybe?)

The full size tower Monster to Include a mITX added board for dual systems 

 

I've been seeing a lot of people still calling for more than 2 hard drives recently as well (more for the larger scale computers than the SFF ones.)

 

Edit: And while we are at it CAN WE FINALLY GET A GODDAMN PINK CASE THAT ISNT COMPLETE GARBAGE??? I cant count how many times people come to me for building a PC advice and they say "I like pink" but all the native pink cases are old and bleh. All cases are black or white now with the exception of some color options on the Focus G lineup for example.

[MEC-777]

6 minutes ago, TVwazhere said:

How about something TRULY unique;  a case that can stretch base on the motherboard used?

 

https://www.anandtech.com/show/12866/riotoros-project-morpheus-case-changes-shape-to-fit-your-build

 

Very interesting. Thanks for sharing.  

 

Few problems I see with their design - and, mind you, some of this is subjective; 

-The perforated panels (all the holes everywhere). Would let in too much dust and particles, yet at the same time, the holes are too small and would restrict airflow too much for my liking. It also doesn't give a very nice aesthetic either. 

-It's too compromised. In order to make it work with various form factors, they had to make some design choices that would effect the overall look and function of the final product. It seems a bit too big and clunky to be a good ITX case and makes too many sacrifices to be a good ATX case. Although I do think it makes a better ATX than ITX chassis. It's kind of like all-season tires. Winter tires and summer tires and rain tires all have specific requirements and design aspects, some of which are practically opposite to one another. The end result is a product that is compromised in most areas, such that it's not particularly "good" in any area of performance, but only mediocre in most conditions.

 

It is an interesting concept though, but I think they could have executed it much better. 

 

The design philosophy I like to follow is; to design something with a specific goal or goal(s) in mind and not compromise that by trying to include or accommodate too many other features that require very different design elements. That's why 5 of the 6 cases I've been developing thus far are all focused primarily on air cooling with no thought given to mounting any radiators for an AIO. Whether you could actually fit one or not would just be coincidence.   

[TVwazhere]

3 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

That's why 5 of the 6 cases I've been developing thus far are all focused primarily on air cooling with no thought given to mounting any radiators for an AIO. Whether you could actually fit one or not would just be coincidence.   

I would at least consider keeping 240mm RAD support for most of the lineup (probably not some of the mITX cases) but I feel it would hurt consumer interest to not consider at least that radiator option. I cant think of a single Mid tower released in the last year that cant at least support that as a minimum. 

[MEC-777]

1 hour ago, TVwazhere said:

Also, a different layout. Rotate the motherboard and Put the rear I/O on the bottom or top. Mount the Hard drives or SSD's on the "front panel" in a show off window instead of fans. Make the case completely (or mostly) disassemble to easier cleaning, modding or painting like the Corsair 380T

  Reveal hidden contents

No Glossy Plastic, especially near the I/O

Maybe Tooless EVERYTHING? Tooless PCI-E bracket screws (Pegs on springs maybe?)

The full size tower Monster to Include a mITX added board for dual systems 

 

I've been seeing a lot of people still calling for more than 2 hard drives recently as well (more for the larger scale computers than the SFF ones.)

 

Edit: And while we are at it CAN WE FINALLY GET A GODDAMN PINK CASE THAT ISNT COMPLETE GARBAGE??? I cant count how many times people come to me for building a PC advice and they say "I like pink" but all the native pink cases are old and bleh. All cases are black or white now with the exception of some color options on the Focus G lineup for example.

I'll give away one design element; all of them are top motherboard/GPU I/O oriented.  I haven't yet nailed down where exactly the storage drives would be located and how many. These won't be designed for home NAS builds, but should be able to accommodate at least 2x 3.5" spinners in the ATX and mATX variants, with at least 1x 3.5" drive mount on the larger of the ITX cases. 

 

The case(s) are being designed with the intent for the user to be able to completely disassemble it for cleaning and/or painting to their heart's desire. 

 

Don't worry, there will be no plastic. That's another big no-no I forgot to mention. That being said, I don't expect these to be "cheap" either. They will be more of a high-quality premium product.   

 

I like the idea of making things tooless, but that also introduces additional R&D time and possibly higher manufacturing costs and slower manufacturing time. Tooless drive bays I am definitely going to try and incorporate, but as for the main structure, that will most likely be assembled with removable fasteners. 

 

Dual systems are really cool, but they're also a very niche thing. For now, I'm focusing on single system chassis, but will keep that in mind for a future one-off, maybe. 

 

In regards to colour choice, what if I told you; you can have any colour you want?  

 

 

[TVwazhere]

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

The case(s) are being designed with the intent for the user to be able to completely disassemble it for cleaning and/or painting to their heart's desire. 

<3

3 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

Don't worry, there will be no plastic. That's another big no-no I forgot to mention. That being said, I don't expect these to be "cheap" either. They will be more of a high-quality premium product.   . 

<3 x2

1 minute ago, MEC-777 said:

In regards to colour choice, what if I told you; you can have any colour you want?  

If you dont go Henry Ford on me, I'll take your word for it!  

[MEC-777]

8 minutes ago, TVwazhere said:

I would at least consider keeping 240mm RAD support for most of the lineup (probably not some of the mITX cases) but I feel it would hurt consumer interest to not consider at least that radiator option. I cant think of a single Mid tower released in the last year that cant at least support that as a minimum. 

It's not something I'd be completely against and I will consider it. However, due to the nature of the design I'm focusing on, when including the option to install a 120 or 240 rad, this would introduce extra complexity and compromise the original design function and also possibly break the aesthetic/theme that is consistent throughout the lineup. 

 

Again, not throwing out the idea, just putting on the back burner for now.  

 

One of the goals I have with this is to create some of  the best air cooled cases on the market. And I am willing to sacrifice some sales to achieve that claim. Not trying to sound harsh or anything. Just saying I think that's part of the reason for the decline in case quality/design we've seen in recent years - is due to lack of focus and trying to include everything for everyone. Hope that makes sense, lol.

[TVwazhere]

14 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

It's not something I'd be completely against and I will consider it. However, due to the nature of the design I'm focusing on, when including the option to install a 120 or 240 rad, this would introduce extra complexity and compromise the original design function and also possibly break the aesthetic/theme that is consistent throughout the lineup. 

 

Again, not throwing out the idea, just putting on the back burner for now.  

 

One of the goals I have with this is to create some of  the best air cooled cases on the market. And I am willing to sacrifice some sales to achieve that claim. Not trying to sound harsh or anything. Just saying I think that's part of the reason for the decline in case quality/design we've seen in recent years - is due to lack of focus and trying to include everything for everyone. Hope that makes sense, lol.

It definitely makes sense and it's definitely not a bad thing, focusing on actual airflow rather than catering entirely to aesthetics. And I would bet that many people use air coolers over AIOs anyways, however I would imagine that most users interested in this case are going to either use NH-D15's, DRPro 4's, R1 Ultimates (the big ass air coolers of 165mm+) or some sort of AIO, which 8 years ago probably wasn't as prevalent.

Maybe consider 200mm fan options? That's a big maybe depending on how well Cooler Master's H500 lineup sells, but personally when I was shopping for my system back in 2014, 200mm fans were #1 on my list of must haves. They might be too large for some of your cases though

[MEC-777]

1 hour ago, TVwazhere said:

It definitely makes sense and it's definitely not a bad thing, focusing on actual airflow rather than catering entirely to aesthetics. And I would bet that many people use air coolers over AIOs anyways, however I would imagine that most users interested in this case are going to either use NH-D15's, DRPro 4's, R1 Ultimates (the big ass air coolers of 165mm+) or some sort of AIO, which 8 years ago probably wasn't as prevalent.

Maybe consider 200mm fan options? That's a big maybe depending on how well Cooler Master's H500 lineup sells, but personally when I was shopping for my system back in 2014, 200mm fans were #1 on my list of must haves. They might be too large for some of your cases though

If you run a big enough CPU cooler, like the ones you mentioned, you would not even need a fan on the cooler (or at least it wouldn't need to even spin) until you put the system under moderate loads.  

 

Not really proud to admit this, lol, but I've spent a lot of time (way too much time) studying the way fans work and what different aspects effect how they operate. Long story short; 200mm fans can certainly move a lot of air, not denying that. But relatively speaking, you can move nearly as much with 140's or even 120's, due to the smaller fans having a better "depth to diameter" ratio and tighter gap between the tips of the blades and the rim. The smaller fans will also have a more directed, uniform and focused flow, where as the bigger 200mm fans will produce more of a chaotic 'spray' of air.  

 

The biggest fan that would be used in my designs is a 180mm and they would be the air perpetrators from Silverstone, exclusively. Silverstone and Noctua are the only fan manufacturers I've fount yet, who use and incorporate an actual air flow stator in their fan designs and they only use it on a few of them (like the NF-F12's). A stator basically straightens out the air coming off the fan blades and redirects it backward, away from the fan, rather than the air continuing to swirl and spray off outwards and less focused. 

 

So yeah, I would either use Silverstone air perpetrators and/or Noctuas only, or I would include stators as an add-on accessory that the user would then attach to the exhaust side of the fans of their choosing, to improve performance. 

 

Like I said, I've spent waaaay too much time thinking about all this.  To most folks, a fan is a fan and they blow air. But to me, the difference in is the details.  

[TVwazhere]

4 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

Like I said, I've spent waaaay too much time thinking about all this.  To most folks, a fan is a fan and they blow air. But to me, the difference in is the details.  

People like you are the reasons companies like Noctua exists  

[MEC-777]

1 minute ago, TVwazhere said:

People like you are the reasons companies like Noctua exists  

Lol, I love Noctua, but I've never used any of their products (too expensive). But I like their design philosophy.  Pure function over fashion. Don't like it? Buy something else. haha

 

I'm not trying to be quite that strict, but yeah, I know exactly what you mean. And thanks.

[Stefan Payne]

On 28.6.2018 at 10:23 PM, MEC-777 said:

But first, I'm interested in what you, as enthusiasts, gamers and general PC users, want and look for in a PC case. What features do you look for? 

Lets start with the obvious:

NO Sharp edges

NO Slot Screws outside the case

Good manufacturing Quality,

Good Choice of Materials

Good connection of the I/O Panel area to the Case (used enough rivets or point welds)

NO Heavy one Part Door. If you have to have a door, make it a half door or two  parts -> one for the 5,25" bays, one for the Fans. Not one Heavy thing. (Like be quiet Dark Base Pro 900). Better: be quiet Silent Base 600/800 and Nanoxia Deep Silence 5B.

 

And another very important point: Space for Cards according to spec (or more)!

Specification for old ISA Cards was 315mm long. That is a _MUST_ and can not be avoided.

 

 

If you come across a Nanoxia Deep Silence 5B you know most of the points I made.

It looks good but it is rather fragile in many areas, not build that well. Though not the worst one I have (that would be the Anidees AI6B V2)

 

On 28.6.2018 at 10:23 PM, MEC-777 said:

To get a few things out of the way; I'll share with you a glimpse of my design philosophy so we can be sort of on the right page with this. 

-Minimalistic, clean, natural design with a focus on optimized cooling, silence and functionality. 

-Absolutely NO RGB lights or fans and NO "gamer" branding, flashiness or gimmickry. (If you want RGB, you can add it or buy something else).

So in other words a Boxy design like the ones I mentioned above

 

On 28.6.2018 at 10:23 PM, MEC-777 said:

Currently I have 6 different base designs laid out, 3 mini-ITX, 1 micro-ATX and 2 full-ATX, ranging from a very small HTPC-oriented micro-tower, to a big enthusiast enclosure aimed specifically at custom loop watercooling. Something for everyone. The designs are far from their final form, but the basic layout and aesthetic I'm going for is there. 

I'd like for you to make a 3rd Full ATX or rather µATX Concept.

A Full/µ ATX Desktop case with 90° angled Slots and Riser Cards. 

 

5,25" Drives aren't needed no more these days, so you can remove those.

And I think its possible to live without 3,5" Drive bays as well, so you could stick with 2,5" Drives.

As a PSU, it has to be SFX because of the Slot.

 

Ghe Goal is to have something that is the size of a Low Profile µATX Desktop/Tower Thing (like Antec NSK1480) but able to put in full size cards.

 

On 28.6.2018 at 10:23 PM, MEC-777 said:

Now, I'm looking to you guys to see if I've missed anything that could still yet be integrated into the designs. 

What I like to have is the option to make a file server thing with many 3,5" Drive Bays.

12 would be nice, the more the better.

Maybe something like the good old Chenbro SR-103 Cube Thingy that was popular in the mid 2000s...

[Stefan Payne]

14 hours ago, MEC-777 said:

New question; Would you be interested in buying a case that you assemble yourself? Or would you prefer to buy it already built?

As someone who owns a be quiet Dark Base PRO 900, I'd prefer the Ikea version of that by a mile or rather 10.

With things like that, you run into issues like the Chinese overtighten the screws and shit like that...

Edited June 30, 2018 by Stefan Payne
Fixed typos...

[MEC-777]

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

Lets start with the obvious:

NO Sharp edges

No worries there. 

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

NO Slot Screws outside the case

Good manufacturing Quality,

Good Choice of Materials

Good connection of the I/O Panel area to the Case (used enough rivets or point welds)

NO Heavy one Part Door. If you have to have a door, make it a half door or two  parts -> one for the 5,25" bays, one for the Fans. Not one Heavy thing. (Like be quiet Dark Base Pro 900). Better: be quiet Silent Base 600/800 and Nanoxia Deep Silence 5B.

All good points. 

By "slot screws" do you mean screws that require a flathead screwdriver? If so, no worries there either. I absolutely LOATH flathead screws. 

There will be no large or heavy doors. To keep with the clean aesthetic, any doors or access hatches (anything that opens), I'd like to use magnets to keep them closed, not fasteners that stick out or click-latches that can break or become loose. 

5.25" bays? Pffffft  What are those?  

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

And another very important point: Space for Cards according to spec (or more)!

Specification for old ISA Cards was 315mm long. That is a _MUST_ and can not be avoided.

Shouldn't be an issue in the full ATX and microATX cases. 

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

If you come across a Nanoxia Deep Silence 5B you know most of the points I made.

It looks good but it is rather fragile in many areas, not build that well.

Looks like a fridge. lol. Don't really like it. The designs I'm working on look nothing like that.  

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

So in other words a Boxy design like the ones I mentioned above

 

Everyone's doing boxy designs. I'm looking to do something different. Going back to your first comment; no sharp edges. 

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

I'd like for you to make a 3rd Full ATX or rather µATX Concept.

A Full/µ ATX Desktop case with 90° angled Slots and Riser Cards. 

 

5,25" Drives aren't needed no more these days, so you can remove those.

And I think its possible to live without 3,5" Drive bays as well, so you could stick with 2,5" Drives.

As a PSU, it has to be SFX because of the Slot.

That's a good idea and I will definitely consider this - doing "slim" versions of the more "normal" variants. Thanks.  

To share with you a few more details of some of the models I'm working on; of the 3 mini-ITX designs, the largest will fit a massive 3-slot GPU like the MSI GTX 1080Ti Lightning and has the option to use either an ATX or SFX PSU, all while not being too large (for an ITX system) and not compromising on cooling. The other 2 smaller ITX designs will use only SFX PSUs to keep the footprint and interior volume down (and there's no need for an ATX PSU in systems that small). 

 

As for using SFX PSUs in a slim ATX/mATX case, definitely a possibility. They're becoming more popular and may eventually even become the new standard. Keeping that in mind. 

 

5.25" bays never even crossed mind, lol. 

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

What I like to have is the option to make a file server thing with many 3,5" Drive Bays.

12 would be nice, the more the better.

Maybe something like the good old Chenbro SR-103 Cube Thingy that was popular in the mid 2000s...

Might do something like that later on. Maybe a special "home NAS" version. Noted. 

 

6 hours ago, Stefan Payne said:

As someone who owns a be quiet Dark Base PRO 900, I'd prever the Ikea version of that by a mile or rather 10.

Wit things like that, you run into issues like the Chinese overtighten the screws and shit like that...

It's another part of the PC you can assemble, which for me would add to the fun of building a PC. I figured enthusiasts might enjoy it more than simply unboxing and putting the parts in. It would be an addition experience and gives you the opportunity to paint or customise the pieces and sections before putting it together. And yeah, this way you'd know it was put together properly.  Glad you like that idea. I would keep it relatively simple to build, but at the same time, I might not recommend it for a beginner PC builder. 

[airdeano]

building a caselabs from a flat-pack really isn't an issue. easier to ship, less overall damages, and less labor to pay for construction.

so the assembly process isn't a real 'issue' but the end-user might not have that gene to go the extra steps on building their own case. so they wouldn't have to purchase it.

i mean putting a CPU in the socket and putting an aftermarket HSF on it can classify the same skill set for build a case, just a larger scale of an erector set.

 

the only downfall to desktop sized cases today is the case depth. due to the GPU having to be to long (300mm) the overall depths are allowing front air intakes to be non-efficient for proper CPU/GPU cooling. a fans 'influence' is air propagation is realistically 30-60mm, afterwards just stirring the internal air for another fan to just pick it up and use its thermal ability.

when the nzxt switch came out with help fans to direct air once into the chassis was awesome, but faded due to cost and marketing to tell the audience why it is there. not just to populate more fan spots, but actual functionality. the FD arc series was a serious airflow case, but dust rings complaints were overwhelming to show that maintenance was lacking over appearances.

 

but now a new trend is emerging.. side ventilation. don't clutter the front up with rads and filters, TG and RGB fans and then let the side ventilation do the exhausting. already with anemic air flow scenarios sure the CPU and GPU don't really need any air, just vent it out before the dust can settle on those high-ended parts, screw the VRM and 105° caps..

 

and since when did a pile of imported steel command a cost of over $45? new cases without TG still are over $85 and with TG $120. the $60 s340 replaced by a $80-90 and really not that much better to justify 25% increase because.. 'innovation costs money'.. my butt. (rant off)

 

15" max depth ATX enclosure, three 120mm fan intake, foam filter element, no top fan exhaust, 140mm rear i/o fan, rotate PSU 90° to slim the width (if needed) for an air flow case.

dual purpose air/water chassis is neat and masses use them, but also confuses them on what they can actually use in the chassis as far as components. too many options then.

[Stefan Payne]

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

By "slot screws" do you mean screws that require a flathead screwdriver? If so, no worries there either. I absolutely LOATH flathead screws. 

No, I mean this shit that you see mostly on the cheapes of the cheap Cases where you screw the Cards to the case outside the case. (don't know the engl. WOrds for that).

Something you see on this case.

https://www.overclockers.co.uk/kolink-observatory-midi-tower-rgb-gaming-case-white-tempered-glass-window-ca-03c-kk.html

 

The ATX I/O Shield is also flat to the back of the case wich means reduced cost but its really annoying...

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

I'd like to use magnets to keep them closed, not fasteners that stick out or click-latches that can break or become loose. 

Wich means you need a light door, if possible, or a couple of more magnets...

That's the one thing 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

5.25" bays? Pffffft  What are those?  

The things where you put in your hot swap bays, if you want to

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

That's a good idea and I will definitely consider this - doing "slim" versions of the more "normal" variants. Thanks.  

yeah, that's something I'm looking for.
Especially for µATX/Slim Desktops. I had a couple of those cases. The one I have right now is an ANtec NSK1480 wich is bullshit for more modern µATX Boards because of the position of the 3,5" HDD Bays...

Well, was a good idea at the time, whenever that was (like 15 Years ago or so).

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

To share with you a few more details of some of the models I'm working on; of the 3 mini-ITX designs, the largest will fit a massive 3-slot GPU like the MSI GTX 1080Ti Lightning and has the option to use either an ATX or SFX PSU, all while not being too large (for an ITX system) and not compromising on cooling. The other 2 smaller ITX designs will use only SFX PSUs to keep the footprint and interior volume down (and there's no need for an ATX PSU in systems that small). 

Yeah thought about that.

And I have something like that. Silverstone RVZ-01. And its rather big and seem to waste a bit of space here and there is also a version with ATX-PSU (where you can't fit a 3,5" HDD, you can n this one, above the PSU).

Well, the (2,5") Drive position is a problem as the space for the GPU.

And if you wanted to, I'm pretty sure you could put in a 3 slot card as well.

 

Its a niche but most of the cases are just the standard mini Desktop ones...

 

As for the 3 Slot Version: Have you thought about a version with a PCIe Switch? Or would that be too expensive?

 

Another interesting thing would be to make something like an Antec ISK 110 times two. Top part for the Board, Buttom Part for PSU and Graphics card. That should be enough for an ITX type graphics card. 
Not sure about the PSU though. That is a real problem. Though I don't have a "real SFX" here. Only an SFX-L unit...

So I don't really have an idea about the size.

A Flex ATX PSU would be possible but those seem to go EOL left and right and only go up to around 200, maybe 300W...

And because its a non standard part, the case have to come with a PSU...

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

As for using SFX PSUs in a slim ATX/mATX case, definitely a possibility. They're becoming more popular and may eventually even become the new standard. Keeping that in mind. 

SFX-L if at all possible. They aren't that bad and go up to 800W. 
I have a 700W Version. Though I think Sirfa jumped the Shark a bit with that...

I really don't like seing a 390µF Cap in a 700W PSU. And there aren't bigger caps that fit inside...

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

5.25" bays never even crossed mind, lol. 

You don't use them for what they were intended these days anyway...

The Things you put in there are either Fan Controllers or Hot Swap Bays. Optical Drives? for what...

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

Might do something like that later on. Maybe a special "home NAS" version. Noted. 

That seems interesting. A case with more than 8 bays would be nice too. Something like the mentioned Nanoxia. But with a second stack of Dirive bays behind the first one. I'm not a fan of putting the drives vertical at all.

 

2 minutes ago, MEC-777 said:

It's another part of the PC you can assemble, which for me would add to the fun of building a PC. I figured enthusiasts might enjoy it more than simply unboxing and putting the parts in.

Well, if you can invert the case like on the Dark Base Pro 900, it really makes sense to build it yourself as nobody knows how you want to assemble it. There are also a couple of other cases where you have some choices. 

 

And that should go hand in hand. An Ikea version should come only with cases where you have many freedoms/choices - like position of the PSU, if you want it on top or bottom (Some Anime Fans might giggle a little), inverted ATX or normal ATX...

 

 

I know people might hate me right now, when I say it but I really liked BTX. And the way the Boards were designed. 
Its a shame that nobody did ever do "BTX Style ATX Boards"...

The closest thing there is are some older Boards...

Like the Iwill DX400-SN but that was even before the S-ATA Area...

[MEC-777]

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

building a caselabs from a flat-pack really isn't an issue. easier to ship, less overall damages, and less labor to pay for construction.

so the assembly process isn't a real 'issue' but the end-user might not have that gene to go the extra steps on building their own case. so they wouldn't have to purchase it.

i mean putting a CPU in the socket and putting an aftermarket HSF on it can classify the same skill set for build a case, just a larger scale of an erector set.

 

Thanks for the feedback. Perhaps it could be done such that when you order one, you can specify if you want it pre-assembled or not. Pre-assembled would come at a higher cost, of course. It's an option to explore and think about anyways. 

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

the only downfall to desktop sized cases today is the case depth. due to the GPU having to be to long (300mm) the overall depths are allowing front air intakes to be non-efficient for proper CPU/GPU cooling. a fans 'influence' is air propagation is realistically 30-60mm, afterwards just stirring the internal air for another fan to just pick it up and use its thermal ability.

I agree and I've addressed this issue in my designs.  

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

when the nzxt switch came out with help fans to direct air once into the chassis was awesome, but faded due to cost and marketing to tell the audience why it is there. not just to populate more fan spots, but actual functionality. the FD arc series was a serious airflow case, but dust rings complaints were overwhelming to show that maintenance was lacking over appearances.

Funny what people complain about. Even when it's a result of their own inability to perform routine cleaning. lol

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

but now a new trend is emerging.. side ventilation. don't clutter the front up with rads and filters, TG and RGB fans and then let the side ventilation do the exhausting. already with anemic air flow scenarios sure the CPU and GPU don't really need any air, just vent it out before the dust can settle on those high-ended parts, screw the VRM and 105° caps..

Rest assured, there will be no side ventilation, at least not like you see on many cases today. And there will also be absolutely NO RGB fans. TG will be an option but only for side panel(s). 

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

and since when did a pile of imported steel command a cost of over $45? new cases without TG still are over $85 and with TG $120. the $60 s340 replaced by a $80-90 and really not that much better to justify 25% increase because.. 'innovation costs money'.. my butt. (rant off)

Apparently many cases use the same "core" internal tray/structure and it's only the PSU shroud and outer shell that differs. That's got to cut costs a lot too. 

 

I will say this though; I'm not too interested in creating "cheap" cases, though I may explore that avenue later on. I'm looking to create a more premium brand and use some other materials besides plastic and stamped steel. The only plastic you'd find on these would be maybe tooless HDD trays and/or cable tie/holders. Nothing else. As for cost for my designs; I don't really have an idea just yet. I need to figure out manufacturing process costs and BOM costs, then go from there. But again, they won't be on the lower-end of the scale, I'm pretty sure of that. At least not the first round of products. 

 

Knowing how much work I've already put in, and will have to put in moving forward, innovation can and does cost money. Is the H500 that much more complex and does it cost that much more to make? Probably not. Will people pay more for it over the old S340? Probably - because marketing. lol  

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

15" max depth ATX enclosure, three 120mm fan intake, foam filter element, no top fan exhaust, 140mm rear i/o fan, rotate PSU 90° to slim the width (if needed) for an air flow case.

How about 14.5" deep x 13.2" wide for a full ATX, capable of easily supporting SLI and GPUs over 320mm long.

 

Fan size and layout is not fully established just yet, but it will utilize fan sizes and positioning that will provide the most optimal air cooling possible. As for I/O and motherboard orientation, I hinted at that in an earlier post. 

 

On 2018-06-30 at 12:56 AM, airdeano said:

dual purpose air/water chassis is neat and masses use them, but also confuses them on what they can actually use in the chassis as far as components. too many options then.

Yep, I agree to an extent. The majority of the lineup I'm working on will be designed for air cooling, but with one of the models specifically for custom loop water cooling. It will be well-stated in the product documentation that installing AIOs on the intake of these cases is not recommended and will hinder cooling performance. Of course, what people actually do with them is another story, lol.