i7 8700 vs i7 8700k ?

[subrooz]

So i'm struggling on deciding between getting the i7 8700 or the i7 8700k. 
[ If i were to get the non K chip, i most likely wouldn't be too upset not being able to overclock. On the contrary, if i got the K chip, i would most definitely overclock. So either works for me. ]
 

Now in my country, the i7 8700 + Cooler Master 212 is around $500 together, meanwhile the i7 8700k + NH-D15S is around $640. 

 

My main question - What are the noticeable differences between the non K and K chip in terms of performance other than the extra GHz? Is it worth the extra $140 or not?

 

Thank you!

[Eduard the weeb]

here the thing your already buying a Z307 board until non OC boards come out but if you are upset about not OC you can put that money else were

 

I would get the non K personally to save the money on other components or games 

[RollinLower]

well, the difference between the 8700 and the 8700K is literally just the unlocked multiplier. imo not worth the price premium, tough being able to overclock is always nice for somewhat future proofing your rig.

[Bhav]

Just now, RollinLower said:

well, the difference between the 8700 and the 8700K is literally just the unlocked multiplier. imo not worth the price premium, tough being able to overclock is always nice for somewhat future proofing your rig.

Current prices on Scan - 8700 £335, 8700k £349.

 

Seems worth £15 for an extra few hundred MHZ, but once budget boards come out it probably won't be.

[Princess Luna]

Well I went with the i7 8700 locked because:

 

It is cheaper, it does not need to be delidded, it is much cooler to where the Hyper 212X keeps it super cool while being super silent, you're not overclocking so you can cheap up on motherboard and grab just about the cheapest z370 you can find (still good for memory overclocking) and on top of all that for the very first time Intel has made the locked i7 IDENTICAL in performance to the unlocked i7, both CPUs have an all core turbo boost of 4.3ghz making them essentially identical at stock settings, meaning you only start getting more performance after overclocking you get none out of the box.

 

And to overclock you need to spend lots as mentioned above.

 

To me it was a no brainier cheap up hell lot going with the locked i7 8700 and I have pretty much identical experience of the i7 8700k 5GHZ specially in gaming which is more and more GPU bound.

 

Adding the GPU price spike up I managed to replace my 1080 Ti for the TITAN Xp at no expenses and I can assure you the i7 8700 is not bottlenecking my Xp at all.

[Eduard the weeb]

Yeah and if you ever want to the next gen will most likely run Z307 so you could upgrade to the next gen high end K processor down the line in 2-3 years 

[Mira Yurizaki]

Considering the most people have added to the i7-8700K before going to more beefy cooling solutions is around 0.3GHz (i.e., up to 5GHz), it's not really worth the extra price premium. Assuming both processors can maintain turbo speeds and you have something like MCE, you're look at less than a 10% improvement. That's not even in "futureproofing" territory.

[SeanAngelo]

16 minutes ago, subrooz said:

So i'm struggling on deciding between getting the i7 8700 or the i7 8700k. 
[ If i were to get the non K chip, i most likely wouldn't be too upset not being able to overclock. On the contrary, if i got the K chip, i would most definitely overclock. So either works for me. ]
 

Now in my country, the i7 8700 + Cooler Master 212 is around $500 together, meanwhile the i7 8700k + NH-D15S is around $640. 

 

My main question - What are the noticeable differences between the non K and K chip in terms of performance other than the extra GHz? Is it worth the extra $140 or not?

 

Thank you!

you said you'd overclock, so get the 8700K. will have more performance due to the extra frequency speed. 

[subrooz]

Bless you guys for the quick input! Looks like i'll most likely be going for the i7 8700!

Just quickly guys I have my eyes on two motherboards rn, 

 

the Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard ($190) and the ASRock Z370-EXTREME4 LGA ($250) 1151 Motherboard. Do you guys have any other personal recommendations that is an all rounder good motherboard without breaking the bank? Cheers!

[Bhav]

9 minutes ago, M.Yurizaki said:

Considering the most people have added to the i7-8700K before going to more beefy cooling solutions is around 0.3GHz (i.e., up to 5GHz), it's not really worth the extra price premium. Assuming both processors can maintain turbo speeds and you have something like MCE, you're look at less than a 10% improvement. That's not even in "futureproofing" territory.

Yea its not even necessary to OC the 8700k anyway. It already seems to be running close to its limits.

[Bhav]

2 minutes ago, subrooz said:

Bless you guys for the quick input! Looks like i'll most likely be going for the i7 8700!

Just quickly guys I have my eyes on two motherboards rn, 

 

the Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard ($190) and the ASRock Z370-EXTREME4 LGA ($250) 1151 Motherboard. Do you guys have any other personal recommendations that is an all rounder good motherboard without breaking the bank? Cheers!

Neither. You wait for non Z. Or there's no point getting the non K right now.

 

I mean, why would you want a motherboard with 'EXTREME' in its name for $250 if you're not gonna over clock?

[Misanthrope]

Do you have a cooling solution?

 

It's important since AFAIK decent overclocks of the 8700k require a rather robust cooling solution which ends up being a significant price difference.

[Princess Luna]

3 minutes ago, subrooz said:

Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard

I actually bought myself this one, it is pretty decent does all you'd expect from it, though you may need to update the BIOS to F4 to solve dual/single channel memory possible issues but doing so is very easy through their APP Center and afterwards my system was 10/10 stable.

 

I did get it though mostly because I was going with a micro-ATX case to begin with so it made sense, if you're going with a full ATX full sized case then I'd rather advise the AsRock-4 instead.

 

@Bhav Memory overclocking still gives fair performance results, go from the usual 2133mhz~2400mhz of locked chipsets to 3000~3200mhz actually has been giving more gaming performance than overclocking those few missing mhz on the CPU... so in a way the z370 chipset makes MORE SENSE to overclock the memory than overclock the i7 right now.

[Bhav]

3 minutes ago, Princess Cadence said:

I actually bought myself this one, it is pretty decent does all you'd expect from it, though you may need to update the BIOS to F4 to solve dual/single channel memory possible issues but doing so is very easy through their APP Center and afterwards my system was 10/10 stable.

 

I did get it though mostly because I was going with a micro-ATX case to begin with so it made sense, if you're going with a full ATX full sized case then I'd rather advise the AsRock-4 instead.

 

@Bhav Memory overclocking still gives fair performance results, go from the usual 2133mhz~2400mhz of locked chipsets to 3000~3200mhz actually has been giving more gaming performance than overclocking those few missing mhz on the CPU... so in a way the z370 chipset makes MORE SENSE to overclock the memory than overclock the i7 right now.

Oh, but shouldn't locked coffee lake run at 2666 MHz ram? Memory speed reviews on the 8700k show even less difference above 2666 MHz CL14 than just adding a 100 MHz CPU OC.

[subrooz]

3 minutes ago, Misanthrope said:

Do you have a cooling solution?

 

It's important since AFAIK decent overclocks of the 8700k require a rather robust cooling solution which ends up being a significant price difference.

if i got the i7 8700k, it would go with the NH-D15S like i stated. From what i've read it should be able to handle the i7 8700k OC'd up to 4.8Ghz fine, and possibly 5.0Ghz w/ delid.

[Princess Luna]

3 minutes ago, Bhav said:

.

That is a common confusion... the "CPU stock" should be 2666mhz.... but that's not the CHIPSET "stock" hahaha... I got myself fooled on this one as well in the past... for instance the H310 the cheapest variant will remain stuck at 2133mhz for memory.

[Bhav]

Just now, Princess Cadence said:

That is a common confusion... the "CPU stock" should be 2666mhz.... but that's not the CHIPSET "stock" hahaha... I got myself fooled on this one as well in the past... for instance the H310 the cheapest variant will remain stuck at 2133mhz for memory.

Oh, in that case indeed going under 2666 MHz turns coffee lake into poop. Though its hard to find any gains above it:

 

https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Intel/Core_i7_8700K_Coffee_Lake_Memory_Performance_Benchmark_Analysis/

[DocSwag]

20 minutes ago, subrooz said:

Bless you guys for the quick input! Looks like i'll most likely be going for the i7 8700!

Just quickly guys I have my eyes on two motherboards rn, 

 

the Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard ($190) and the ASRock Z370-EXTREME4 LGA ($250) 1151 Motherboard. Do you guys have any other personal recommendations that is an all rounder good motherboard without breaking the bank? Cheers!

If you're willing to wait it may be worth waiting for the non z series chipset. It might save you a fair bit of money

 

EDIT: After further thought though a z370 board may be worth it for MCT. Unfortunately, there isn't much data on the all core turbo for the 8700 so I can't say for certain how much it's worth doing. Maybe @Princess Cadence could confirm what the all core turbo is?

[Misanthrope]

18 minutes ago, subrooz said:

if i got the i7 8700k, it would go with the NH-D15S like i stated. From what i've read it should be able to handle the i7 8700k OC'd up to 4.8Ghz fine, and possibly 5.0Ghz w/ delid.

I believe that's about a 15% increase in performance in productivity yet we'd be talking 5 FPS extra tops on gaming but the nonk chip can already do better than any chip that is not the 8700k and by a comfortable margin.

 

Personally, I don't believe a 28% increase in your price is worth 15% performance increase in some benchmarks: I'd put that extra cash towards ram since prices are still insane or something else.

[Princess Luna]

7 minutes ago, DocSwag said:

?

MCE will only work with the unlocked variant sadly, regardless it will run at 4.3ghz all day long if you use all cores for sure, and it often boosts to 4.5ghz~4.6ghz when it isn't being fully stress out.

[subrooz]

15 minutes ago, DocSwag said:

If you're willing to wait it may be worth waiting for the non z series chipset. It might save you a fair bit of money

I've been stuck on a AMD Phenom X4 840 and Geforce GT 210 for 6 years man, I want to get out of this hell hole asap ???

 

Honestly, since i'm in Australia, i don't even think there would be a noticeable price difference for the non z chipset. For example, The B350 Tomahawk motherboard goes for like $160 here meanwhile like $80 in the US. I feel like we cop it on the chin regardless lol. But if i did decide to wait, do you know roughly how long it'd take? Are we talking like a month, or a couple of months?  

[Bhav]

6 minutes ago, subrooz said:

I've been stuck on a AMD Phenom X4 840 and Geforce GT 210 for 6 years man, I want to get out of this hell hole asap man ???

 

Honestly, since i'm in Australia, i don't even think there would be a noticeable price difference for the non z chipset. For example, The B350 Tomahawk motherboard goes for like $160 here meanwhile like $80 in the US. I feel like we cop it on the chin regardless lol. But if i did decide to wait, do you know roughly how long it'd take? Are we talking like a month, or a couple of months?  

Well in the case of the ram being gimped to under 2666 MHz on non Z coffee lake boards, its probably advisable to just pick up the cheapest, but non MSI, Z370 board instead.

 

You don't need any higher than that on the ram as long as you can get it to CL14, but anything lower destroys 8700 performance.

[subrooz]

5 minutes ago, Bhav said:

Well in the case of the ram being gimped to under 2666 MHz on non Z coffee lake boards, its probably advisable to just pick up the cheapest, but non MSI, Z370 board instead.

Considering i'm getting 16gb 3200mhz that makes sense, thanks! I'm leaning to the Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard. Also just curious, whats wrong with MSI boards?

[Bhav]

6 minutes ago, subrooz said:

Considering i'm getting 16gb 3200mhz that makes sense, thanks! I'm leaning to the Gigabyte Z370m D3H LGA 1151 Motherboard. Also just curious, whats wrong with MSI boards?

MSI boards - catastrophic failure rates, even on ones they charge over £400:

 

 

Widespread same issues with motherboard failures across their official forums (see screenshots in the thread), and additionally their support staff have no clue what's going on and refuse to accept that there was such a wide problem that really should have led to product recalls.

 

They don't have the same stringent quality control as other motherboard manufacturers, and use components that fail within a few months across their entire range of motherboards, from the top to the bottom, and they are notorious for the highest motherboard failure rate by a landslide.

[subrooz]

1 minute ago, Bhav said:

MSI boards - catastrophic failure rates, even on ones they charge over £400:

 

 

Widespread same issues with motherboard failures across their official forums (see screenshots in the thread), and additionally their support staff have no clue what's going on and refuse to accept that there was such a wide problem that really should have led to product recalls.

 

They don't have the same stringent quality control as other motherboard manufacturers, and use components that fail within a few months across their entire range of motherboards, from the top to the bottom.

Damn that sounds like a pain in the ass lol, thanks for the heads up