Arduino Sattelite

[Julian5]

I have been working on projects with arduino during the past 4 years annd have recently created a machine that will be presented in an apple summit early next year although I cannot disclose precise infomration on that. Working alongside apple was very fun and provided huge fnancial aid but I would like to work on a more personal project without so much restrictions. I would like to create a picosattelite, Basically a smale cube with a variety of sensors, telemetry and maybe even Solar Sails or some sort of propulsion system, I will be Constructing the sattelite from scratch and probably making experiemnts using weather ballons, This Thread will probably be a build thread on how the project goes!  

I know these sattelites exist but I thought It might be fun to construct one.

As of now I have made a ruff design of the cube structure that I will print on my 3D Printer, here is the list of things I want to sattelite to do and have

 

- Solar Cells on 4 of the sides (rest for sensors) (bought already) (might have them extend automatically)

- For now I will have 1-2 18650 Batteries and a charge circuit  (already owned)

- UHF Radio transmitter to send Sensor data to groud station (Bought a Kit today for testing purposes with low MW power)

- Solar radiation - Cosmic ray detector - geiger counter

- Humidity Sensor

-Temperature sensor

- Live feed camera if possible (Might have to be 1 image per hour for example to reduce power)

- Possibly extending solar sails.

-GPS/tracking

 

 

I do not expect this thing to leave leave the stratosphere but though it might be a fun project.

 

Any input and thing that might be added will help!

 

 

[The_Denks]

You could get more than 1 FPH.

You could, depending on altitude, resolution, battery, get up to 10FPM

[corrado33]

How long do you plan on having it up there? If it's just in the strasosphere it won't be up for long right? Why have solar panels then? Just pack it full of batteries.

 

In any case, lithium batteries do NOT like the cold. Period. They are not a good choice for this, unless you heat them, which would require more batteries, and more heaters....

 

Your best choice for batteries is Ni-Cd. They have some of the best low temperature resistance. Even then, I'm not even sure they'll work at the temps you'll see. 

 

Normal electronics do not work in space or well in limited atmosphere environments. Things will outgas, components will overheat (very little air to pull away heat).

 

Also cosmic rays tend to reek havoc on electronics. You need to have redundant EVERYTHING if you want to have it work for any sort of time. This is less of a design choice and more of a programming choice. 

[Bananasplit_00]

normal electronics hate space more then you might think, even tho this isnt going into orbit and i think this would be really cool some things die from temperatures and pressure. anyway im following this because i want to know what happens with it and i kinda would love to have a way to tune into that live feed if there will be one so make sure to stream that to Twitch or something

[Julian5]

33 minutes ago, corrado33 said:

How long do you plan on having it up there? If it's just in the strasosphere it won't be up for long right? Why have solar panels then? Just pack it full of batteries.

 

In any case, lithium batteries do NOT like the cold. Period. They are not a good choice for this, unless you heat them, which would require more batteries, and more heaters....

 

Your best choice for batteries is Ni-Cd. They have some of the best low temperature resistance. Even then, I'm not even sure they'll work at the temps you'll see. 

 

Normal electronics do not work in space or well in limited atmosphere environments. Things will outgas, components will overheat (very little air to pull away heat).

 

Also cosmic rays tend to reek havoc on electronics. You need to have redundant EVERYTHING if you want to have it work for any sort of time. This is less of a design choice and more of a programming choice. 

I want to make it as realistic as possible like If I was to send it to space however the max this sattelite will ever reach is just the stratosphere using a weather ballon, yeah I was thinking lithium would have issues, so I will use ni-cd or anything else that is suitable, I want to use solar panels to make it as realistic as possible, Thanks for the input I will make sure to add heatsinks and I was thinking of adding 2 of each units.

[Bananasplit_00]

can we have a picture of the planed 3D print? would love to see what you have planed for that

[Julian5]

28 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

normal electronics hate space more then you might think, even tho this isnt going into orbit and i think this would be really cool some things die from temperatures and pressure. anyway im following this because i want to know what happens with it and i kinda would love to have a way to tune into that live feed if there will be one so make sure to stream that to Twitch or something

Im not sure about twitch but I know you can tune in to some picosattlites using a ham radio. I still ahev to do some research on what can resist temperatures and pressure, Might have to ditch the arduino and make my own microcontroller if needed.

[Bananasplit_00]

Just now, Julian5 said:

Im not sure about twitch but I know you can tune in to some picosattlites using a ham radio. I still ahev to do some research on what can resist temperatures and pressure, Might have to ditch the arduino and make my own microcontroller if needed.

well if nothing else i guess i might be DIYing a ham radio  they arent too expensive to make IIRC

[Julian5]

Just now, Bananasplit_00 said:

well if nothing else i guess i might be DIYing a ham radio  they arent too expensive to make IIRC

Whenever I send it with the weather ballon Ill make sure to record the footage or  live stream it from the ground station, might use an FPV camera for the weather ballon test

[Julian5]

2 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

can we have a picture of the planed 3D print? would love to see what you have planed for that

Ok will send

[Bananasplit_00]

2 minutes ago, Julian5 said:

Whenever I send it with the weather ballon Ill make sure to record the footage or  live stream it from the ground station, might use an FPV camera for the weather ballon test

that could be really cool, hope this project works out nicely  

[Julian5]

29 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

that could be really cool, hope this project works out nicely  

https://gyazo.com/dfd48d35ff489ed623ffac50882856a3

https://gyazo.com/b35ce7207949b81933b89f48b6bb1018

 

gonna make the 3d printable one tommrow and print it this week, ill start with the electrics asap, the antesnas on the sides are meant to deploy, 2 will be for Radio telemetry and 2 for video signal

[Bananasplit_00]

12 minutes ago, Julian5 said:

https://gyazo.com/dfd48d35ff489ed623ffac50882856a3

https://gyazo.com/b35ce7207949b81933b89f48b6bb1018

 

gonna make the 3d printable one tommrow and print it this week, ill start with the electrics asap, the antesnas on the sides are meant to deploy, 2 will be for Radio telemetry and 2 for video signal

looks good, good luck!  

[mariushm]

Have a look at the technical details in this thread, the guy launched a weather balloon : http://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/you-might-find-this-interesting/

You can see where the thing went (carried by wind) on this page: http://qrp-labs.com/ultimate3/ve3kcl-balloons/ve3kcl-s9.html

and if i remember correctly in that thread, or in another thread he created, he describes all the hardware he uses on that balloon.

 

It would be expensive to actually put a picosatellite in orbit and you'd have to fulfill lots of requirements... would cost about $7500-8000 just to launch in space, and then if the rocket actually goes up and throws out the satellites successfully, your picosatellite would survive for 3 to 16 weeks until it burns up.

Lithium batteries are kind of a bad thing due to big changes in temperatures and considering your sat will only stay up there for a few months, primary batteries may be enough to keep your picosat working

See http://makezine.com/2014/04/11/your-own-satellite-7-things-to-know-before-you-go/

[dany_boy]

Seems like an interesting and challenging project to undertake. I suggest you take a look at this bloke: David Windestal.

In that video he talks of all the necessary preparations that electronics require to get to high altitudes.

Cheers

[Julian5]

2 hours ago, dany_boy said:

Seems like an interesting and challenging project to undertake. I suggest you take a look at this bloke: David Windestal.

In that video he talks of all the necessary preparations that electronics require to get to high altitudes.

Cheers

This is actually one of the videos that wanted to make me do this, been to subsrived to david for years!

 

18 hours ago, mariushm said:

Have a look at the technical details in this thread, the guy launched a weather balloon : http://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/you-might-find-this-interesting/

You can see where the thing went (carried by wind) on this page: http://qrp-labs.com/ultimate3/ve3kcl-balloons/ve3kcl-s9.html

and if i remember correctly in that thread, or in another thread he created, he describes all the hardware he uses on that balloon.

 

It would be expensive to actually put a picosatellite in orbit and you'd have to fulfill lots of requirements... would cost about $7500-8000 just to launch in space, and then if the rocket actually goes up and throws out the satellites successfully, your picosatellite would survive for 3 to 16 weeks until it burns up.

Lithium batteries are kind of a bad thing due to big changes in temperatures and considering your sat will only stay up there for a few months, primary batteries may be enough to keep your picosat working

See http://makezine.com/2014/04/11/your-own-satellite-7-things-to-know-before-you-go/

Thanks! ordering an FPV kit rn

[Julian5]

Ok So I Have ordered a 600mw 5.8GHZ FPV kit on ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/162257364551 with a corresponding PAL camera, I will have to see the power draw and modify the reciever acordingly, The kit promises 5km reach but I believe I can extend that  using various circular helical antennas.

[Bananasplit_00]

13 minutes ago, Julian5 said:

Ok So I Have ordered a 600mw 5.8GHZ FPV kit on ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/162257364551 with a corresponding PAL camera, I will have to see the power draw and modify the reciever acordingly, The kit promises 5km reach but I believe I can extend that  using various circular helical antennas.

yah throw some better antennas on that and the range will go way up, you can probably up the transmittor power too a bit if you need more range  

[Julian5]

5 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

yah throw some better antennas on that and the range will go way up, you can probably up the transmittor power too a bit if you need more range  

yeah the included antennass are shit, Ill be using  different antennas ill make myself. I will also remove some stuff from the transmitter like the lcd since its unecessary, I might have to have a circuit that turns it on every hour for a bit if it takes too much power.

[dany_boy]

7 hours ago, Julian5 said:

yeah the included antennass are shit, Ill be using  different antennas ill make myself. I will also remove some stuff from the transmitter like the lcd since its unecessary, I might have to have a circuit that turns it on every hour for a bit if it takes too much power.

I hope you have the proper licences for operating high power radio equipment in the EU. I am by no means an expert but some friends of mine and some interneting say that the EU is really picky with the bands and power of your radios. Probably a good idea to do some research. Also why not lower frequency?

Cheers!

[Julian5]

11 hours ago, dany_boy said:

I hope you have the proper licences for operating high power radio equipment in the EU. I am by no means an expert but some friends of mine and some interneting say that the EU is really picky with the bands and power of your radios. Probably a good idea to do some research. Also why not lower frequency?

Cheers!

Yeah I did some research about the frequency and Indeed the EU is very very picky about this and you need for lots of frequencies, the 433mhz band and 900mhz which is what Im using for telemtry is prohibted as it reserved for police I believe but The transmitter I currrently have have has a range of about 100m or 1mw, I will be using it for experimenting however on the final flights I will need to buy something on another frequency. regarding the 600mw transmitter on 5.8ghz its very very complicated, I must own a lisence and ask  1 month before the use of the frequency for the use and I must give an explanation, the max power is 500mw. I Will just use it and hope nothing goes wrong xD, after looking on some Spanish Forums I have seen most people dont own the license and have had no issues. 5.8ghz seems to be a common band and I dont think I will cause any issues. FPV is also useless in Spain for drones as and I cannot fly higher than 150m or out of my line of sight / 200m and drone must be 2.5kg max.... I have used my 100mw 2.4ghz turnigy 9x for years now and haev ahd no issues though so Im not worried.

[straight_stewie]

If you have contact with Apple, you could consider trying to pitch the idea to them. They could be very helpful in getting you up to a suborbital trajectory (which is much less expensive than you think). I'm on an unnamed collegiate rocket design team and I know that our next project is going to be very fun, after we finish breaking the collegiate speed record that is.

There are some laws that you need to be aware of with weather balloon satellites @Julian5. The first, and most important rule is that, due to the altitudes that you will be flying at, you must have permission from the FAA, which is relatively easy to get. The second thing is that the FAA will want to review your design before giving you permission, and they will be looking for two things: That your craft will not poison people should it land in water (basically, no nuclear or chemical power, LiPo batteries are fine) and that the craft can be cut from it's weather balloon should it need to get out of the way of an airplane. The FAA will not let you fly without the latter.

[Bananasplit_00]

1 hour ago, straight_stewie said:

If you have contact with Apple, you could consider trying to pitch the idea to them. They could be very helpful in getting you up to a suborbital trajectory (which is much less expensive than you think). I'm on an unnamed collegiate rocket design team and I know that our next project is going to be very fun, after we finish breaking the collegiate speed record that is.

There are some laws that you need to be aware of with weather balloon satellites @Julian5. The first, and most important rule is that, due to the altitudes that you will be flying at, you must have permission from the FAA, which is relatively easy to get. The second thing is that the FAA will want to review your design before giving you permission, and they will be looking for two things: That your craft will not poison people should it land in water (basically, no nuclear or chemical power, LiPo batteries are fine) and that the craft can be cut from it's weather balloon should it need to get out of the way of an airplane. The FAA will not let you fly without the latter.

EU has different rules im pretty sure, launch will be from spain AFAIK

[straight_stewie]

25 minutes ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

EU has different rules im pretty sure, launch will be from spain AFAIK

I did not notice that. 

[Julian5]

2 hours ago, straight_stewie said:

If you have contact with Apple, you could consider trying to pitch the idea to them. They could be very helpful in getting you up to a suborbital trajectory (which is much less expensive than you think). I'm on an unnamed collegiate rocket design team and I know that our next project is going to be very fun, after we finish breaking the collegiate speed record that is.

There are some laws that you need to be aware of with weather balloon satellites @Julian5. The first, and most important rule is that, due to the altitudes that you will be flying at, you must have permission from the FAA, which is relatively easy to get. The second thing is that the FAA will want to review your design before giving you permission, and they will be looking for two things: That your craft will not poison people should it land in water (basically, no nuclear or chemical power, LiPo batteries are fine) and that the craft can be cut from it's weather balloon should it need to get out of the way of an airplane. The FAA will not let you fly without the latter.

 

1 hour ago, Bananasplit_00 said:

EU has different rules im pretty sure, launch will be from spain AFAIK

 Yeah I have to contact AESA which is the Spanish equivalent of FAA. As far as I know it will be quite complicated as I am in the senter of both GibraltarianAirport airspace and Malaga airport, Might have to travel for the launch. the only reason apple finance my projects is so I can present how we use apple in education, I strongly Doubt apple is willing to pay 8000€ for a sub-orbital launch that will breifly show the use of apple. I would also  have to ditch most of the equipment and arduino since apple Dont let me use any non-apple affiliated products such as arduino, I will discuss the project on my next meeting in london but Im not expecting much. However I believe my school can finance part/all of the costs if needed for a watehr ballon launch.