What is your belief in God? (No racism or flaming please)

[Woodypc]

Faith is a generally dishonest position to have. It requires no evidence and will be defended against all evidence. Evidence is based on fact and a fact is a demonstrable and predictable piece of data.

 

HOWEVER

 

You cannot prove that Vishnu, Thor, Yahweh, Baast, Baal, Kali, Jesus, or any other supernatural immortal entity exists.

AND You cannot prove that The Flying Spaghetti Monster, The Invisible Pink Unicorn, Santa Claus, Krampus, or Cthulhu Don't exist.

Do we have reason to believe they do? No, but it simply cannot be dismissed.

Exactly you can not actually dismiss ANYTHIING, but if there is no sufficient evidence for it we have to really dismiss it and move on.

[beebskadoo]

No you don't believe in nothing, it is nothing.

If someone believes something and it has NO effect on you, what business do you have telling them what they can and can't believe in?

[mr moose]

I have to both agree and disagree. Plenty of legislation in the US has been passed by governments (state, local, federal) that were the direct result of religion, not just securing a vote with the religious demographic. 

Russia hasn't banned religion, they are mostly some sort of orthodox catholic.

Korea and China are the way they are because of insane dictators.

Dictators have been both religious and non religious . Hitler for example was Catholic, not Atheist as some would lead others to believe. He rejected evolution and wrote and spoke of his faith publicly. 

Religion was banned in Russia from 1922.  They essentially did to religions what the nazis did to jews.

 

Hitler used religion as his justification for what he did. I don't think he was religious at all.

 

China and korea with insane dictators who hated religion? no I am just saying these countries have the absolute separation of state and church yet they also have the worst human rights violations. which makes a mockery of the argument that religion is the cause of all wars/suffering/government failure...

 

My only real point is that separation of state and church happened decades ago and if people want to hate on religion then by all means hate, but hate on the pricks who deserve it. And remember that not all politicians are who they say they are.

[Woodypc]

If someone believes something and it has NO effect on you, what business do you have telling them what they can and can't believe in?

Yes that is fine but that does not happen in the real world many things people believe in effect me, like indoctrinating children in schools, that very much effects me.

[beebskadoo]

If someone has a belief that directly effects me, I can offer opinion on the matter and enter debate to find out why that person believes what they do, but at the end of the day it is the persons choice to believe what they want though not always without repercussion. 

[Woodypc]

Religion was banned in Russia from 1922.  They essentially did to regions what the nazis did to jews.

 

Hitler used religion as his justification for what he did. I don't think he was religious at all.

 

China and korea with insane dictators who hated religion? no I am just saying these countries have the absolute separation of state and church yet they also have the worst human rights violations. which makes a mockery of the argument that religion is the cause of all wars/suffering/government failure...

 

My only real point is that separation of state and church happened decades ago and if people want to hate on religion then by all means hate, but hate on the pricks who deserve it. And remember that not all politicians are who they say they are.

What about the good old USA. Ohh that's right it is fine to make human rights violations if you are the biggest kid on the block.

[Woodypc]

If someone has a belief that directly effects me, I can offer opinion on the matter and enter debate to find out why that person believes what they do, but at the end of the day it is the persons choice to believe what they want though not always without repercussion. 

You can not have a rational debate with someone who thinks irrationally.

[beebskadoo]

Religion was banned in Russia from 1922.  They essentially did to religions what the nazis did to jews.

 

Hitler used religion as his justification for what he did. I don't think he was religious at all.

 

China and korea with insane dictators who hated religion? no I am just saying these countries have the absolute separation of state and church yet they also have the worst human rights violations. which makes a mockery of the argument that religion is the cause of all wars/suffering/government failure...

 

My only real point is that separation of state and church happened decades ago and if people want to hate on religion then by all means hate, but hate on the pricks who deserve it. And remember that not all politicians are who they say they are.

I was referring to modern Russia, just to show that even though it's now a 'religious' country, it's still a shit place to live

Hitler was religious, and it was reflected in his writings.

Separation of church and state is pretty loose in the US. Though it wasn't always that way.

in the 1950's christian monuments were added to courthouses, christian sayings were printed on money, and 'under god' was added to the pledge of allegiance. 

[mr moose]

What about the good old USA. Ohh that's right it is fine to make human rights violations if you are the biggest kid on the block.

Not saying that at all, I'm just saying that religion is not the cause. People are, and in countries were people are free to express themselves there are slightly less violations.

 

You'll note that in the USA, UK, Australia, NZ you can be gay, live together, even adopt and marry in some of them, but not in China, Russia, Noth Korea etc etc.  Just sayin'

[Woodypc]

I was referring to modern Russia, just to show that even though it's now a 'religious' country, it's still a shit place to live

Hitler was religious, and it was reflected in his writings.

Separation of church and state is pretty loose in the US. Though it wasn't always that way.

in the 1950's christian monuments were added to courthouses, christian sayings were printed on money, and 'under god' was added to the pledge of allegiance. 

The the US was a secular state with a secular government till the mid 1900s when the Creationist really started to effect it.

[Woodypc]

Not saying that at all, I'm just saying that religion is not the cause. People are, and in countries were people are free to express themselves there are slightly less violations.

 

You'll note that in the USA, UK, Australia, NZ you can be gay, live together, even adopt and marry in some of them, but not in China, Russia, Noth Korea etc etc.  Just sayin'

Not fully in the USA, but in all those countries the creationist fought and still are to ban gay marriage.

[mr moose]

I was referring to modern Russia, just to show that even though it's now a 'religious' country, it's still a shit place to live

Hitler was religious, and it was reflected in his writings.

Separation of church and state is pretty loose in the US. Though it wasn't always that way.

in the 1950's christian monuments were added to courthouses, christian sayings were printed on money, and 'under god' was added to the pledge of allegiance. 

I know, but Russia is very slowly getting better, as I believe China might be. However I will not defend the stupidity of early christians, they have fucked it up for themselves and are mostly to blame for all the ignorance.

[beebskadoo]

You can not have a rational debate with someone who thinks irrationally.

Indoctrination of children is a case in which it would effect you.

Well, in order to deem something irrational, it has to conflict with your ideals. 

I understand that there is no evidence for anything supernatural or impossible and debating someone who does can be a losing battle, because as soon as faith is used as an argument, the debate falls apart.

But what if you are arguing with someone who is opposed to gay marriage and LGBT rights? Yes it's irrational but to the other person it's very rational.

[beebskadoo]

Not saying that at all, I'm just saying that religion is not the cause. People are, and in countries were people are free to express themselves there are slightly less violations.

 

You'll note that in the USA, UK, Australia, NZ you can be gay, live together, even adopt and marry in some of them, but not in China, Russia, Noth Korea etc etc.  Just sayin'

Though to be fair, some politicians would like to see LGBT people fenced off somewhere away from the population, and those that want that are religious.

[beebskadoo]

I know, but Russia is very slowly getting better, as I believe China might be. However I will not defend the stupidity of early christians, they have fucked it up for themselves and are mostly to blame for all the ignorance.

Russia is certainly not getting better in any meaningful way. Imprisoning people for being Queer isn't progress...

[beebskadoo]

The the US was a secular state with a secular government till the mid 1900s when the Creationist really started to effect it.

I am fully aware of that, I was giving specific examples. You are preaching to the choir dear.

[Simmytu]

I'm a Protestant Christian (open minded one) and sometimes I feel quite sad how people react to each other when they have a "faith war" (YT, FaceBook =ugh) especially when they are ignorant enough to "hate"each other because one is a christian and other beliefs in other religion. Why aren't people nice to each other, I'm sorry but we ALL are humans!

The human nature these days  :mellow:

[Woodypc]

Though to be fair, some politicians would like to see LGBT people fenced off somewhere away from the population, and those that want that are religious.

Just like with the shut-down in the US many republicans wanted the world to end and though that this shut-down would create a apocalypses and end the world as we know it so they could be saved by Jesus.

[mr moose]

Not fully in the USA, but in all those countries the creationist fought and still are to ban gay marriage.

Not really, In Australia there is more anti Gay rhetoric in secular society than in the church.  Only 10% of Australians are active Christians and more than half support gay marriage. Yet more than 40% of Australia say they don't support Gay marriage.  This means that there are more atheists/secular members of society that oppose gay marriage than there are Christians, not including the fact that more than half of the Christians actually support it.  I understand it isn't fully in the USA though, they have some serious issues to get through first. Like the bible belt and west borough.

[beebskadoo]

Just like with the shut-down in the US many republicans wanted the world to end and though that this shut-down would create a apocalypses and end the world as we know it so they could be saved by Jesus.

One reason why the US is doomed, thankfully the Republicans are going to be dying off soon due to that stunt.

Trust me, I know how to be friendly to religious people, My Boyfriend is Catholic

Do I hold it against him? No, it's his choice and his belief, and it does not effect me.

[CornOnJacob]

Obviously there isn't any evidence but to the person believing it there is and they will continue to believe until something convinces them otherwise.

I wouldn't say I'm entirely anti-theist, I do acknowledge the fact that the majority of human atrocities have been linked to religion, but that doesn't mean that there aren't any good people that happen to be religious. 

Agreed. If people would actually follow the teachings of their religion (my other post about that), then the world would be very different. The Crusades happened, but I think you would be hard-pressed to find something to justify them in what Christianity technically teaches (love your neighbor as yourself).

[mr moose]

Russia is certainly not getting better in any meaningful way. Imprisoning people for being Queer isn't progress...

They'll stop that, I don't know when but they will. And I don't think they have that many religious nuts in their government, so Why are they doing it? I bet it's human nature, change is a scary thing when you are controlling a country. they probably think it's better to keep anything they don't understand illegal.

[beebskadoo]

Agreed. If people would actually follow the teachings of their religion (my other post about that), then the world would be very different. The Crusades happened, but I think you would be hard-pressed to find something to justify them in what Christianity technically teaches (love your neighbor as yourself).

Actually, the world would be a terrible place.

Have you read the Bible?

just sayin...

PM me and I can give you specific examples.

[Woodypc]

I'm a Protestant Christian (open minded one) and sometimes I feel quite sad how people react to each other when they have a "faith war" (YT, FaceBook =ugh) especially when they are ignorant enough to "hate"each other because one is a christian and other beliefs in other religion. Why aren't people nice to each other, I'm sorry but we ALL are humans!

The human nature these days  :mellow:

You may be open minded and a good person but there is a lot of like minded people to you that are always wanting to fight to get thing there way. We have a obligation to make sure this does not happen and correct any wrong they have created.

[beebskadoo]

They'll stop that, I don't know when but they will. And I don't think they have that many religious nuts in their government, so Why are they doing it? I bet it's human nature, change is a scary thing when you are controlling a country. they probably think it's better to keep anything they don't understand illegal.

Well they have the support from the state church, and many rally's had political figures and church members and clergy clashing with protesters of the anti gay legislation. It's a mess and they're getting away with it.