LMG has become bias

[♠FlamieMeister♠]

I have found something after delving the depths of the LTT channel, and that is the fact that LTT has possibly sold out to nVidia. My evidence?

In the 1060 review Luke made, he said the 1060 walked all over the rx 480. The highest difference was 10 frames in a dx11 game. When he went to give amd credit for something, his voice lowered a bit, and seemed hesitant. Also, all the games were dx11. Where's Vulkan (which is supported by Valve) or DX12, where the rx480 beats out the 1060? It seems awfully strange that other reviewers are going to the dx12 and Vulkan benchmarks, but one of the largest tech review channels is stuck on dx11. Next up is how scarcely I see Linus criticize nVidia products anymore.  It seems strange. Nest up is things that I've heard about involving nVidia and reviewers. Here's what I've pieced together: If a reviewer talks bad or puts a review criticizing nVidia, they don't get samples from nVidia anymore, and are discouraged. If a person leaves a good review though for nVidia, and make competitors look worse, they get more free stuff. Seeing as if we go with the talking I've heard that is industry standard for nVidia , and that Linus still receives items from nVidia, it is possible to conclude that he is creating a form of bias content.  I've also seen a bunch of nVidia fanboys lurk around the comments section, copy pasting stuff from a site as a reply. LTT is becoming an nVidia fanboy magnet from this. I'm pretty sure nVidia fans don't like people that talk about amd beating  nVidia in dx12 or Vulkan. This could also draw the conclusion that LTT is biased as well. My last and final piece of evidence is the channel's subscriber count. If LTT had 10k or 100k subs, nVidia wouldn't care as much about the channel. But LTT is one of the biggest channels out their, nearly at 3 million subscribers. If they criticize nVidia, nVidia would take quite the hit. In order to keep this from happening, nVidia most likely pays and gives free stuff to LTT to keep nVidia afloat.

 

I know that this will possibly be deleted because criticism, but I'll do my best to leave my mark with a hashtag:

 

#MakeLTTGreatAgain

[Jack02]

2 minutes ago, ♠FlamieMeister♠ said:

I have found something after delving the depths of the LTT channel, and that is the fact that LTT has possibly sold out to nVidia. My evidence?

In the 1060 review Luke made, he said the 1060 walked all over the rx 480. The highest difference was 10 frames in a dx11 game. When he went to give amd credit for something, his voice lowered a bit, and seemed hesitant. Also, all the games were dx11. Where's Vulkan (which is supported by Valve) or DX12, where the rx480 beats out the 1060? It seems awfully strange that other reviewers are going to the dx12 and Vulkan benchmarks, but one of the largest tech review channels is stuck on dx11. Next up is how scarcely I see Linus criticize nVidia products anymore.  It seems strange. Nest up is things that I've heard about involving nVidia and reviewers. Here's what I've pieced together: If a reviewer talks bad or puts a review criticizing nVidia, they don't get samples from nVidia anymore, and are discouraged. If a person leaves a good review though for nVidia, and make competitors look worse, they get more free stuff. Seeing as if we go with the talking I've heard that is industry standard for nVidia , and that Linus still receives items from nVidia, it is possible to conclude that he is creating a form of bias content.  I've also seen a bunch of nVidia fanboys lurk around the comments section, copy pasting stuff from a site as a reply. LTT is becoming an nVidia fanboy magnet from this. I'm pretty sure nVidia fans don't like people that talk about amd beating  nVidia in dx12 or Vulkan. This could also draw the conclusion that LTT is biased as well. My last and final piece of evidence is the channel's subscriber count. If LTT had 10k or 100k subs, nVidia wouldn't care as much about the channel. But LTT is one of the biggest channels out their, nearly at 3 million subscribers. If they criticize nVidia, nVidia would take quite the hit. In order to keep this from happening, nVidia most likely pays and gives free stuff to LTT to keep nVidia afloat.

 

I know that this will possibly be deleted because criticism, but I'll do my best to leave my mark with a hashtag:

 

#MakeLTTGreatAgain

I'll be honest I did not read this all. I do agree they prefer Nvidia though. I myself do as well. Can you name a channel besides Tek Syndicate that supports AMD though?

[magnumkobra]

I dont think its just lmg , i think its almost the whole gaming community, its because amd has been sitting on ass for the pass couple of years and nvidia, hasnt. Now by no means am i a nvidia fanboy , i hate their guts.but I dont think to me they showed bias to the 1060 over the rx480, they still reccomend buying the highest aib partner card than buying the lowest priced 1060 card. 

[RS2007GOD]

i feel gamers nexus has unbiased reviews but hey all to them if they make money from it imo as long as it does get to blatent. i dont blame luke not jumping up and down over the 480 winning in a few things im not that impresses by a 10 fps in 1 game or what ever it was either. regardless im probly going to be going amd in the future just becouse i can and want to support them, i have no need for a 1080 or titan xp

[magnumkobra]

2 minutes ago, RS2007GOD said:

 

i feel gamers nexus has unbiased reviews but hey all to them if they make money from it imo as long as it does get to blatent. i dont blame luke not jumping up and down over the 480 winning in a few things im not that impresses by a 10 fps in 1 game or what ever it was either. regardless im probly going to be going amd in the future just becouse i can and want to support them, i have no need for a 1080 or titan xp

 

is everyone calling it the xp because of linus?

 

[Tech_Dreamer]

Honestly if there was a side deal between NVIDIA & Linus, nobody would know except those two, no matter how many truthful  looking video is posted, maybe there is , maybe there isn't , We're fed from the "source" where they can say it came from anywhere they desired , just like the regular open media we're exposed to now.

[Fungal]

Okay I agree they have a little bias but they're definitely not being payed off by nvidia or anything. Yes they give them cards but so does every other company. And the only reason Luke was harsh on the rx 480 was because of the whole hype train it caused and they were just disappointed it didn't hold up to the 1060. The 1060 came out on top by about 6-10 frames in each game besides hitman (which works better with amd cards), was about 10c cooler, and had less power draw. 

[blaze756]

I don't think they've "sold out" to Nvidia they're just more in favor of their cards, AMD isn't what they use to be. But they certainly are getting a lot better. I'm waiting for their higher end cards then myself and I think everyone else will make a new judgment on AMD again. 

 

As for DX12 vs DX11 games I think everyone knows that AMD will beat Nvidia in most if not all cases (at least until Nvidia sorts their s**t out).

I must confess I'm a fan of team Green and would require some heavy persuading before witching to team red, but it's not total out of the question.

But the decider for this generations cards will be VR performance so we'll see what happens in the "Furry xyz" vs "Titan XP" or "1080 ti".

[App4that]

So because they didn't give you the results you want, they're biased? You realize that makes you biased, right?

[Curufinwe_wins]

Just now, magnumkobra said:

is everyone calling it the xp because of linus?

 

The joke seems to have originated from numerous sources concurrently.

 

Anyways... On topic... This is something that has come up quite a bit on other channels. The state of DX12 games right now isn't great. In fact since it is dominated by UWP games, it's probably better to call it horrific on the whole. Quantum Break is a disaster. Mirrors Edge is just starting to get it's shit together. The Division is in the same boat. Tomb Raider fairly recently got a DX12 updated patch that finally made its DX12 backend not "universally worse than DX11". Hitman just legitimately runs like dogshit on literally EVERY Nvidia card no matter what (far worse than any other DX12 game or test out there.)

 

Which basically leaves Time Spy and AotS. AotS works well for the people who can get it's benchmarking system to give consistent results, but SHOCKINGLY that isn't something everyone seems to be able to do (on AMD or Nvidia hardware.)

 

Time Spy seems great and all, but it is likewise quite new. 

 

I think the biggest issue is that very few of these games were built with DX12 in mind from the start and IT SHOWS. Once we get more start to finish DX12 games, you'd naturally expect more reviewers to be using them (not that you can't find reviewers with all these games, just disclaimer, they aren't very great.)

 

Doom with Vulkan seems like a great idea for benching, just remember it to came out just over two weeks ago. 

Too bad no other game uses it.

[ttam]

Sorry but 10 frames in a benchmark is worlds apart. 

 

It's also extremely illegal for companies to take money for a positive review.

[westport17]

I also wonder why they so "DX11-centered" when comparing same price level GPU from red and green, even after Vulkan full supported game and DX12 benchmark software has released..

[Curufinwe_wins]

Also this is really hilarious because Luke was bitching and moaning so hard about the 1060 pricing in both the WAN show and his review. Far more than I personally felt was appropriate seeing as this card is indeed pricing better than founders at msrp for aftermarket samples and the 480 is a unicorn (just like the 1070 and 1080 are.)

 

Not that it isn't possible that Nvidia puts pressure on these guys, but just remember, AMD is the ones who have basically emphatically omitted reviewers not deemed preferential enough to them in the past (Fury X review sample scandal).

 

I don't know anyone who has lost the ability to get Nvidia review samples based on their reviews of products.

[TheRandomness]

1 minute ago, ttam said:

Sorry but 10 frames in a benchmark is worlds apart. 

 

It's also extremely illegal for companies to take money for a positive review.

But they do anyway. 

 

I was recently on a gmod server where everyone was an nvidiot. I then explained the pros and cons of both companies and after that they all shut up and tried their hardest to avoid the subject before disconnecting.

[magnumkobra]

2 minutes ago, ttam said:

Sorry but 10 frames in a benchmark is worlds apart. 

are you sure? the distance between 12345678910 is nowhere near to the distance that the earth is to mars.

[App4that]

Just now, westport17 said:

I also wonder why they so "DX11-centered" when comparing same price level GPU from red and green, even after Vulkan full supported game and DX12 benchmark software has released..

Because Doom doesn't have a canned benchmark. And the games tested have been tested before so you can see relative performance. Benchmarking takes hours and hours. Around 4 hours for each game to do it properly. Not to mention the absolute insane disparity between the games that use DX12 and the rest of the thousands of games that don't. 

[Curufinwe_wins]

6 minutes ago, westport17 said:

I also wonder why they so "DX11-centered" when comparing same price level GPU from red and green, even after Vulkan full supported game and DX12 benchmark software has released..

Lol.

 

Why did the 1060 review that went up on July 19th fail to benchmark the new Vulkan API (Doom) that came out July 11th (and was subsequently patched numerous times/new drivers in the next few days) or why did they not include the new 3D Mark DX12 Bench that came out on July 14th?!?!?!?!

 

I wonder... Clearly they made the video July 19th so they should have already properly investigated every detail about those two releases by then right? Say what? They don't record videos the same day they are released...

 

 

You can complain all you want at why AotS isn't included (it's probably the only DX12 that doesn't have a super strong argument about including, well except recently with Tomb Raider as well), but the other two you implicitly reference here are just not relevant.

[Curufinwe_wins]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

Because Doom doesn't have a canned benchmark. And the games tested have been tested before so you can see relative performance. Benchmarking takes hours and hours. Around 4 hours for each game to do it properly. Not to mention the absolute insane disparity between the games that use DX12 and the rest of the thousands of games that don't. 

See above. That isn't even a factor.

[DXMember]

 

[App4that]

5 minutes ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

See above. That isn't even a factor.

What's not a factor? LTT like canned benchmarks as they're harder to spin and offer more valid results, getting the video out before the competition means not spending days on that one video, and you should buy a card based on all the games you play, not just one.

[Curufinwe_wins]

2 minutes ago, App4that said:

What's not a factor? LTT like canned benchmarks as there are harder to spin and offer more valid results, getting the video out before the competition means not spending days on that one video, and you should buy a card based on all the games you play, not just one.

Because the Vulkan API for Doom came out literally a WEEK before the 1060 launch review and you can be damn sure that they had the video recorded significantly before that.

 

Even in the HardOCP review which did include Vulkan Doom they noticed the 1060 wasn't using anywhere near the newest version of the Vulkan API for some reason (similar to the issue AMD cards previously using the old version of OpenGL), and thus the benchmarks completely for those reviews may very well be invalid now or in the future when that issue is solved.

[App4that]

Just now, Curufinwe_wins said:

Because the Vulkan API for Doom came out literally a WEEK before the 1060 launch review and you can be damn sure that they had the video recorded significantly before that.

So? Talos Principal is Vulkan too, why not ask for that game? Oh yeah, it runs better in Nvidia... Doom doesn't have a canned benchmark and because of Vulkan not supporting a lot of overlays you're at the mercy of using the one used in the game. 

[Curufinwe_wins]

6 minutes ago, App4that said:

So? Talos Principal is Vulkan too, why not ask for that game? Oh yeah, it runs better in Nvidia... Doom doesn't have a canned benchmark and because of Vulkan not supporting a lot of overlays you're at the mercy of using the one used in the game. 

This is why.

 

 

Anyways... 

Even in the HardOCP review which did include Vulkan Doom they noticed the 1060 wasn't using anywhere near the newest version of the Vulkan API for some reason (similar to the issue AMD cards previously using an old version of OpenGL), and thus the benchmarks completely for those reviews may very well be invalid now or in the future when that issue is solved.

 

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2016/07/19/nvidia_geforce_gtx_1060_founders_edition_review/4#.V5hMobgrIuU

Quote

However, even though we have the libraries installed, it is up to the video card and game to utilize what it wants. In this case, we found on both NVIDIA GPUs DOOM uses Vulkan API libraries 1.0.8 in the game.

However, the AMD drivers install the newest 1.0.17.0 Vulkan API libraries by default. We found that the AMD Radeon RX 480 uses the newest 1.0.17.0 Vulkan API libraries in-game. When we brought up the console (shown above) on RX 480, it showed "1.0.17.0" next to Vulkan API where NVIDIA GPUs show 1.0.8. Just something worth noting.

 

Crysis 3 doesn't have a canned benchmark, but they still have been running that for ages. And Doom is proving to be a very popular game.

 

Basically what I am saying is that even if they wanted to run Doom (which we don't know if they did/do), they probably weren't prepared to do it (esp in pre-recorded works like Video that you can't just insert a page like a text review) and perhaps could have decided not to based on the above issue.

[App4that]

1 minute ago, Curufinwe_wins said:

This is why.

 

 

Anyways... 

Even in the HardOCP review which did include Vulkan Doom they noticed the 1060 wasn't using anywhere near the newest version of the Vulkan API for some reason (similar to the issue AMD cards previously using the old version of OpenGL), and thus the benchmarks completely for those reviews may very well be invalid now or in the future when that issue is solved.

 

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2016/07/19/nvidia_geforce_gtx_1060_founders_edition_review/4#.V5hMobgrIuU

 

Crysis 3 doesn't have a canned benchmark, but they still have been running that for ages. And Doom is proving to be a very popular game.

 

Basically what I am saying is that even if they wanted to run Doom (which we don't know if they did/do), they probably weren't prepared to do it (esp in pre-recorded works like Video that you can't just insert a page like a text review) and perhaps could have decided not to based on the above issue.

The only people pushing for Doom are AMD fans, and that's just to win an argument. I own and play Doom. Not to win internet arguments but because it's an awesome game. If anyone actually cared about fair you would look to have the most common games played used. Most benchmarks used for comparison are tech demos, others like Crysis 3 are known ball busters. 

[Curufinwe_wins]

3 minutes ago, App4that said:

The only people pushing for Doom are AMD fans, and that's just to win an argument. I own and play Doom. Not to win internet arguments but because it's an awesome game. If anyone actually cared about fair you would look to have the most common games played used. Most benchmarks used for comparison are tech demos, others like Crysis 3 are known ball busters. 

I don't mind it being included either way, but I certainly wouldn't fault a tech reviewer for not including a review of effectively a 6 day old game in the launch of a brand new product. That is just asking for invalid results.