What do AMD CPUs have over Intel?

[Faa]

There simply are some wrong points throughout.

I will quickly point them out;

- Piledriver can process two floating point operation at the same time. So it can function as 8 threads for the SIMD cluster (I gave a explanation in my previous post).

- HSA is NOT meant to replace SIMD cluster as he refer to. I have also previous pointed out (not in this thread) what exactly HSA will be useful for.

- "however anything that utilizes all threads available runs faster on the smaller more parallel architecture of the AMD module" - Again he is wrong. I have previously mention in this thread where exactly the module shines, and where it doesn't.

- "So architecturally speaking, Intel isn't really ahead of AMD nor is AMD ahead of Intel so to speak" - Extremely big no. Intel is far ahead in certain technologies. Especially the frontend and SIMD cluster.

This was simply something I quickly spotted.

 

 

The upgrade from a 4Ghz Nehalem quadcore to Haswell quadcore isn't considerable. You're looking at about 15-25% better single threaded performance with a 4670K and no improvement at all in multi-threaded performance.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/158364-deciding-to-upgrade-cpu-mobo/#entry2110863

Isn't the first flaw, he recommended lately a guy to get a 8320 for WoW. Stuff like games dont support HT, Haswell consumes more power than ivy bridge at idle, he pretty much knows piledriver is on par with nehalem in terms of single core performance and a 1GHz OC on PD would match Haswell's single core performance.

Here's where he recommended it (2nd page): http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/149573-amd-or-intel/#entry1998470

 

 

Disable CrossfireX via the Catalyst Control Center, if GPU usage goes significantly up in the same gameplay sequence then you probably have got a CPU bottleneck.

Complety has no ideas how cpu bottlenecking works. Did he copypaste that arcticle from the net orwhat.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/175630-whyhow-is-the-fx-8350-a-bottleneck/page-2#entry2347812

Basically he updates that article with new benchmarks such as BF4 showing AMD outperforming Intel but doesnt bother to add Haswell to his synthetic benchmarks because it apparently outperformed it there. Apparently showing benchmarks 4300's outperforming 2500k's, 6300's outperforming 2600K's, 4300 outperforming 6100's, 8350's outperforming 3930k's in Far cry 3 are all valid. He seems to be sponsored by AMD, who would recommend a 8320 over the i3 for a game like WoW.

[ZeroBreaker]

Wrong, with the ousting of Saddam Hussein the U.S. effectively gave Iraq to the Shias, giving Iran unprecedented regional influence without a neighbor keeping them in check. Again you prove you can't follow basic logic. And of course with the Shia government led by a man who persecutes the Sunnis, this has led the ISIS military group being able to rally the Sunnis of Iraq to their side.

 

This is all a result of direct U.S. interference.

 

Sorry, but no. This sort of conflict between muslim sects is not unique to modern times, all they need is an excuse and the US gave them that excuse. Most combatants in these conflicts are foreign to iran, iraq and afghanistan, and their goal is a restoration of the islamic golden age, where the arabs basically had a monopoly on science and knowledge as they were the only people actually interested in (relatively) modern times. There have been deep rooted issues with relations between and within middle eastern countries due to the sunni shia situation, and peoples anger has simply been given a platform and the technology and weapons necessary to act. No side is truely in the right. You simply cannot simplify the issues in the middle east like this - ask one member of ISIS why he fights, and it's pretty much garaunteed the reason will be different to the next member of ISIS you ask.

 

 

No no no, I said if the minority was truly powerless, such as the Jews having been walled off before they knew what hit them.

 

So if a majority is also powerless to make the necessary changes, as is often the case in the middle east and notably russia, is this also their fault?

Your initial point was that it is the peoples fault for not enacting change. You have had to clarify this twice. Do you not now realise that such an issue cannot be clear cut? You seem to be simplifying all these issues, and there are very few situations that can be simplified into a forum post.

 

Anyway, i think it would be best if we stopped spamming this thread. Not exactly the right place for such a conversation.

[vm'N]

Haswell consumes more power than ivy bridge at idle

Meanwhile haswells power-saving features is on?

It shouldn't.

[Faa]

Meanwhile haswells power-saving features is on?

It shouldn't.

He pulled it from a review so obviously yeah.

[patrickjp93]

 

 

 

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/158364-deciding-to-upgrade-cpu-mobo/#entry2110863

Isn't the first flaw, he recommended lately a guy to get a 8320 for WoW. Stuff like games dont support HT, Haswell consumes more power than ivy bridge at idle, he pretty much knows piledriver is on par with nehalem in terms of single core performance and a 1GHz OC on PD would match Haswell's single core performance.

Here's where he recommended it (2nd page): http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/149573-amd-or-intel/#entry1998470

 

 

 

Complety has no ideas how cpu bottlenecking works. Did he copypaste that arcticle from the net orwhat.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/175630-whyhow-is-the-fx-8350-a-bottleneck/page-2#entry2347812

Basically he updates that article with new benchmarks such as BF4 showing AMD outperforming Intel but doesnt bother to add Haswell to his synthetic benchmarks because it apparently outperformed it there. Apparently showing benchmarks 4300's outperforming 2500k's, 6300's outperforming 2600K's, 4300 outperforming 6100's, 8350's outperforming 3930k's in Far cry 3 are all valid. He seems to be sponsored by AMD, who would recommend a 8320 over the i3 for a game like WoW.

 

Haswell does not consume more power at idle as long as the motherboard the chip is on supports the new lower 3 energy states.

[patrickjp93]

Sorry, but no. This sort of conflict between muslim sects is not unique to modern times, all they need is an excuse and the US gave them that excuse. Most combatants in these conflicts are foreign to iran, iraq and afghanistan, and their goal is a restoration of the islamic golden age, where the arabs basically had a monopoly on science and knowledge as they were the only people actually interested in (relatively) modern times. There have been deep rooted issues with relations between and within middle eastern countries due to the sunni shia situation, and peoples anger has simply been given a platform and the technology and weapons necessary to act. No side is truely in the right. You simply cannot simplify the issues in the middle east like this - ask one member of ISIS why he fights, and it's pretty much garaunteed the reason will be different to the next member of ISIS you ask.

 

 

 

So if a majority is also powerless to make the necessary changes, as is often the case in the middle east and notably russia, is this also their fault?

Your initial point was that it is the peoples fault for not enacting change. You have had to clarify this twice. Do you not now realise that such an issue cannot be clear cut? You seem to be simplifying all these issues, and there are very few situations that can be simplified into a forum post.

 

Anyway, i think it would be best if we stopped spamming this thread. Not exactly the right place for such a conversation.

facedesk* Now you're putting words in my mouth. But yes, this is officially the end of this.

[cacra]

No no no, I said if the minority was truly powerless, such as the Jews having been walled off before they knew what hit them.

Im curious as to how a discussion about CPUs turned into one about Jews, but too lazy to look.

[Faa]

Haswell does not consume more power at idle as long as the motherboard the chip is on supports the new lower 3 energy states.

We all know Haswell doesnt consume more power. There's only one new state C7.

[vm'N]

I think he was referring to a statement from techfan or whatever he was named.

Also the PSU also needs to support it.

[Bansh33]

I grew up with AMD so I stay with them.

[Brogen]

Like everyone else has said, the 8 cores thing, even though Intel has proven better than their 8 core processors.  Their chips can provide a good value for rendering videos.  But Intel has them beat with gaming, servers, multitasking in multiple scenarios.  Also Intel is sooo much better with power consumption.

[TechFan@ic]

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/158364-deciding-to-upgrade-cpu-mobo/#entry2110863

Isn't the first flaw, he recommended lately a guy to get a 8320 for WoW. Stuff like games dont support HT, Haswell consumes more power than ivy bridge at idle, he pretty much knows piledriver is on par with nehalem in terms of single core performance and a 1GHz OC on PD would match Haswell's single core performance.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/175630-whyhow-is-the-fx-8350-a-bottleneck/page-2#entry2347812

Basically he updates that article with new benchmarks such as BF4 showing AMD outperforming Intel but doesnt bother to add Haswell to his synthetic benchmarks because it apparently outperformed it there. Apparently showing benchmarks 4300's outperforming 2500k's, 6300's outperforming 2600K's, 4300 outperforming 6100's, 8350's outperforming 3930k's in Far cry 3 are all valid.

I back everything I say with evidence rather than preconceived notions or spite.

A 4670K is in fact only 15-25% ahead a 4Ghz Nehalem in single threaded & slower in multi-threaded.

Clock for clock 920 is faster in multi-threaded without even comparing 4Ghz Nehalem to a stock 4670k.

http://hwbot.org/submission/2501618_atisoc0936_winrar_core_i7_920_10311_kbs

http://hwbot.org/submission/2400869_mag180_winrar_core_i5_4670k_6052_kbs

 

I never said Haswell consumes more than Ivy at Idle I said Haswell consumes more at load. Now you're basically putting words in my mouth.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/7003/the-haswell-review-intel-core-i74770k-i54560k-tested/2

 

 

Complety has no ideas how cpu bottlenecking works. Did he copypaste that arcticle from the net orwhat.

Again what happens when there is a CPU bottleneck, GPU utilization drops. So how can we make sure that the low GPU utilization is due to a CPU bottleneck rather than some driver anomaly especially when the user was using a multi-GPU setup, we disable crossfire or SLI & then test again, if GPU utilization goes significantly up we know that the CPU was holding the multi-GPU setup back, if GPU utilization only increases marginally then we know that it's an entirely different issue.

 

As for your accusation that I cherry picked benchmarks to showcase AMD winning here is a direct quote from my thread :

As things stand right now, the majority of games are either coded for two or four threads which gives the larger intel cores the advantage here, however recently game engines that support up to 6 threads have started to appear.

And then I went on to give examples to some of those new engines.

 

 

He seems to be sponsored by AMD, who would recommend a 8320 over the i3 for a game like WoW.

Yes I'm obviously sponsored by AMD because in both threads that YOU linked to I actually recommended INTEL processors.

 

Both chips are overpriced. Either get an FX 8350 or a 4670K and get a more powerful graphics card instead of spending more on the CPU.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/149573-amd-or-intel/page-2#entry2003583

Consider grabbing a six core Gluftown instead, an i7 970/980X or 990X used. Gulftown has slightly higher IPC, slightly better overclockablity and more importantly two additional cores will improve performance in a significant number of newer games.

BF4, Watch Dogs & Crysis 3 all scale very well from 4 to 6 cores.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/158364-deciding-to-upgrade-cpu-mobo/#entry2110863

 

So are we supposed to take you seriously ?

Agreed. And you get a 250% single threaded performance improvement from a phenom x6 to a 8350.

http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/158364-deciding-to-upgrade-cpu-mobo/#entry2110863

[bamerx98]

from what I've read they are a lot better at rendering plus on the integrated graphics side AMD completely squashes intel

Sadly the 8350 isnt faster for rendering, streaming it good with, have have personal experience with both a 8350 that I just upgraded from to my new fancy i7 4790k

[Judist]

I grew up with AMD so I stay with them.

Amen, this is what it comes down to.

IMO put your $ where your loyalties are, or where you think it'll be used best. I prefer Nvidia because I enjoy their innovations, they do good stuff, so I pay for future solutions.

In the end everything is good enough. The difference in effective performance isn't enough to get our panties in a twist over.

[TechFan@ic]

I think he was referring to a statement from techfan or whatever he was named.

Also the PSU also needs to support it.

I NEVER said Haswell consumes more power at idle than Ivy Bridge that's utter hogwash, I said Haswell consumes more power at load which is a FACT.

I'm no longer going to participate in this mud throwing competition, Faa is biased and that's fact.

[Bansh33]

Amen, this is what it comes down to.

IMO put your $ where your loyalties are, or where you think it'll be used best. I prefer Nvidia because I enjoy their innovations, they do good stuff, so I pay for future solutions.

In the end everything is good enough. The difference in effective performance isn't enough to get our panties in a twist over.

Agreed loyalty is the utmost importance in consumer purchases. I know that Intel delivers more performance and I'm not mad about it and going to switch to them. AMD has never been a bad deal for me they're products have always been flawless and reliable. I own a full AMD build

I actually catch a lot of shit for using AMD because they're not the "best"

[thebennyboy]

I grew up with AMD so I stay with them.

 

 

Faa is biased and that's fact.

 

Amen to both these statements.

[vm'N]

Loyalty for a company? Not unless you have any stocks in them.

Don't have loyalty for a company. In the end, companies have no moral. They will try to fool you.

EDIT; It might have some viewpoint you share, but a company can (and will) change those viewpoint if they depend on it.

[Judist]

I NEVER said Haswell consumes more power at idle than Ivy Bridge that's utter hogwash, I said Haswell consumes more power at load which is a FACT.

I'm no longer going to participate in this mud throwing competition, Faa is biased and that's fact.

I believe it was a quote of a quote which caused confusion. The word idle was indeed used, it's not true, I think everyone moved on.

[i_build_nanosuits]

Loyalty for a company? Not unless you have any stocks in them.

Don't have loyalty for a company. In the end, companies have no moral. They will try to fool you.

EDIT; It might have some viewpoint you share, but a company can (and will) change those viewpoint if they depend on it.

indeed being loyal to any company is the most stupid thing a human being can do...get what fits the best for you and offers you the most performance and reliability for what you do and fits your budget.

And this is not only for computer parts it applies to litteraly everything one can buy.

[vm'N]

I believe it was a quote of a quote which caused confusion. The word idle was indeed used, it's not true, I think everyone moved on.

I was indeed talking about something faa said about Techfan.

This is a very confusing debate in the matter of I have almost no idea of who said what.

[thebennyboy]

This whole thread has been a mixed bag of topics, some how it went to politics at one point.

[Bansh33]

indeed being loyal to any company is the most stupid thing a human being can do...get what fits the best for you and offers you the most performance and reliability for what you do and fits your budget.

And this is not only for computer parts it applies to litteraly everything one can buy.

And yes some people are like that and others do have loyalty for a company or at least they're products! The extreme side of loyalty is fanboyism. Not everyone can think what is the best out there when they can just look at what was in their past and what worked for them so that person stays with that company. It's not always about the best! You're just letting your testosterone kick in by needing the absolute best have you ever thought of that? It's all about personal preference and there is such a thing as loyalty to a certain company.

[Judist]

Loyalty for a company? Not unless you have any stocks in them.

Don't have loyalty for a company. In the end, companies have no moral. They will try to fool you.

EDIT; It might have some viewpoint you share, but a company can (and will) change those viewpoint if they depend on it.

Shadow play, gsync, physx, cuda, shield, etc. They have a history of providing technologies I desire, therefore they rightfully have my loyalty.

When they let me down that will change.

IMO it's not a mindset to spend your money on a historically innovative and proven company. Loyalty is how a business should be rewarded and thus flourish. I see it more as logical than state of mind.

[TassieTim]

intel in my gaming rig but both my media pcs are running amd apus