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$4K CAD workstations

danalog
By danalog
in New Builds and Planning
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Budget (including currency): $3500-4000 USD

Country: US

Games, programs or workloads that it will be used for: Unreal Engine 4/5, Unity, Godot, Maya, Autodesk 3DS, Choregraphe

Other details: Upgrading from Ryzen 3600/GTX1070/16GB RAM workstations. 

 

I've been tasked with assembling four $4,000 workstations for a school game design course. I'm well aware that this price is absolutely ludicrously overkill. (4K per, not for all four.)

Was thinking of a Ryzen 7800x3D and RTX 4080 TI with 64 GB RAM, and a workstation-class motherboard. No RGB etc. 1TB-2TB of NVMe storage should suffice. 

A rather plain case with a lot of vents is preferable. Corsair 4000D Airflow comes to mind, I know Fractal has some nice function-focused high airflow cases too - the case just can't be too massive. Height is less of an issue, any ATX case should be fine but the workstations this system is replacing are almost twice the width of most ATX cases for ...some reason, which makes them remarkably unwieldy. 

I have very little knowledge of hardware from after 2010 though so I want to triple check to make sure these workstations will be solid. 

 

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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With that budget you might want an i9 14900k and dual 40 series gpus.

System Specs:

CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800x 8-Core Processor

Memory: 32 GB G.Skill Trident Z DDR4

SSD: WD_BLACK SN770 1TB

GPU: Nvidia GeForce RTX 3060 12G oc

Motherboard: Asus Prime B-450 A2

Case: MuseTex k2 Mid Tower

Monitor: Samsung SyncMaster S27D360

Keyboard: Razer Onata

Mouse: Razer Viper

 Other cool tech:

Ender 5 pro 3d printer

Dji mini 3

Flight hotas x52

Fender Squire SSH stratocaster

Positive grid spark 40w amp

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4 minutes ago, ThePCNerd129 said:

With that budget you might want an i9 14900k and dual 40 series gpus.

Dual 40 series GPUs are pointless, no? No NVLink.....

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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id prob go 7950x. Since its a workstation rather then a pure gaming system. Dont need a workstation class Mobo, just one with exactly what you need with a 10Gbe integrated and the amount of USB ports.

 

You could  go 14900k, but expect it to also need a slightly bigger case and some tuning. 360mm AIO minimum.

4080ti doesnt exist o.o did you mean 4080/4080Super?

 

Case wise you can easily just get an ATX board and case, you dont need a super large case for this.

My Gaming and Editing Rig : http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/500716-red-gaming-build/

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4 minutes ago, Shimejii said:

id prob go 7950x. Since its a workstation rather then a pure gaming system. Dont need a workstation class Mobo, just one with exactly what you need with a 10Gbe integrated and the amount of USB ports.

 

You could  go 14900k, but expect it to also need a slightly bigger case and some tuning. 360mm AIO minimum.

4080ti doesnt exist o.o did you mean 4080/4080Super?

 

Case wise you can easily just get an ATX board and case, you dont need a super large case for this.

Apologies, 4080 Super. See, I really don't know what I'm talking about.

 

Thanks for the 7950X suggestion. 10GBe is absolutely not a requirement since the building is still on gigabit and will be for a long time, I'll shoot for 2.5gbe though. And I'll stick with a workstation board for reliability.

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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7 minutes ago, da na said:

Apologies, 4080 Super. See, I really don't know what I'm talking about.

 

Thanks for the 7950X suggestion. 10GBe is absolutely not a requirement since the building is still on gigabit and will be for a long time, I'll shoot for 2.5gbe though. And I'll stick with a workstation board for reliability.

They are no more reliable then normal boards. That isnt really a thing with motherboards for consumers. Its usually just the USB and 10 GBe that makes them "workstation". Not anything to do with reliability.

My Gaming and Editing Rig : http://linustechtips.com/main/topic/500716-red-gaming-build/

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The X3D cpu's are not meant for productivity ... google the benchmarks. 500GB for your o/s, 4TB for storage.

 

PCPartPicker Part List

CPU: *Intel Core i7-14700 2.1 GHz 20-Core Processor  ($399.99 @ Amazon) 
CPU Cooler: *ARCTIC Liquid Freezer III 72.8 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler  ($98.55 @ Amazon) 
Motherboard: *Gigabyte Z790 AERO G ATX LGA1700 Motherboard  ($269.99 @ Amazon) 
Memory: *G.Skill Ripjaws S5 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR5-6000 CL30 Memory  ($199.99 @ Newegg) 
Storage: *Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 3.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  ($47.98 @ GameStop) 
Storage: *Samsung 990 Pro 4 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  ($319.99 @ Amazon) 
Video Card: *MSI EXPERT GeForce RTX 4080 SUPER 16 GB Video Card  ($1169.99 @ Newegg) 
Case: *Lian Li LANCOOL III ATX Mid Tower Case  ($144.99 @ Newegg Sellers) 
Power Supply: *be quiet! Pure Power 12 M 1000 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply  ($129.90 @ Amazon) 
Total: $2781.37
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
*Lowest price parts chosen from parametric criteria
Generated by PCPartPicker 2024-02-24 18:45 EST-0500

 

A better look at those components.

 

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/Z790-AERO-G-rev-10#kf

 

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/236781/intel-core-i7-processor-14700-33m-cache-up-to-5-40-ghz/specifications.html  

 

https://www.arctic.de/us/Liquid-Freezer-III-420/ACFRE00137A

 

https://www.gskill.com/product/165/377/1649234605/F5-6000J3040G32GX2-RS5K-F5-6000J3040G32GA2-RS5K

 

https://www.msi.com/Graphics-Card/GeForce-RTX-4080-SUPER-16G-EXPERT  

 

https://www.bequiet.com/en/powersupply/4161 

 

https://lian-li.com/product/lancool-iii/  

 

 

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55 minutes ago, da na said:

(4K per, not for all four.)

yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

 

55 minutes ago, da na said:

Was thinking of a Ryzen 7800x3D and RTX 4080 TI with 64 GB RAM, and a workstation-class motherboard. No RGB etc. 1TB-2TB of NVMe storage should suffice.

idk how well each program takes advantage of the 3D cache, Intel's better here, or AMDs with many cores

 

15 minutes ago, Why_Me said:

Storage: *Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 PCIe 3.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive  ($47.98 @ GameStop)

is this supposed to be a boot drive, or did you forget to remove it?

Note: Users receive notifications after Mentions & Quotes. 

Feel free: To ask any question, no matter what question it is, I will try to answer. I know a lot about PCs but not everything.

current PC:

Ryzen 5 5600 |16GB DDR4 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1080 ti [further details on my profile]

PC configs I used before:

  1. Pentium G4500 | 4GB/8GB DDR4 2133Mhz | H110 | GTX 1050
  2. Ryzen 3 1200 3,5Ghz / OC:4Ghz | 8GB DDR4 2133Mhz / 16GB 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1050
  3. Ryzen 3 1200 3,5Ghz | 16GB 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1080 ti
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3 minutes ago, Why_Me said:

You quoted the answer to your question. 500GB for the o/s, 4TB for storage. Full reinstall and you don't lose any data.

ah, makes sense, yes, good build btw

Note: Users receive notifications after Mentions & Quotes. 

Feel free: To ask any question, no matter what question it is, I will try to answer. I know a lot about PCs but not everything.

current PC:

Ryzen 5 5600 |16GB DDR4 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1080 ti [further details on my profile]

PC configs I used before:

  1. Pentium G4500 | 4GB/8GB DDR4 2133Mhz | H110 | GTX 1050
  2. Ryzen 3 1200 3,5Ghz / OC:4Ghz | 8GB DDR4 2133Mhz / 16GB 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1050
  3. Ryzen 3 1200 3,5Ghz | 16GB 3200Mhz | B450 | GTX 1080 ti
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15 minutes ago, da na said:

10GBe is absolutely not a requirement since the building is still on gigabit and will be for a long time, I'll shoot for 2.5gbe though

PCIE Network cards are cheap (e.g Iocrest). 1 gbe wouldn't be a deal breaker if it is noticeable lower cost.

If you want to spend on a mainboard checkout Asrock RACK, Gigabyte server or Supermicro. Most of the consumer "pro", "workstation", "creator" are nothing more than marketing and a motherboard for half the price is in similar quality and features.

 

 

 

On topic what $3.9k looks like:

random $250 mainboard as baseline, "random" useable 4TB SSD, random 128G RAM,  incl. W11 pro licence, the 4000D you mentioned for reference.

 

Instead of Corsair 4000D you could "downgrade" some parts (e.g. 2TB SSD) and get a watercooled 4090 with an ITX enclosure like the CoolerMaster NR200P (not the best quality but cheap and fit's a large air cooler like the Scythe Ninja 5; 280mm radiator and ATX-PSUs). Depending on the room/office this could improve the aesthetics. Let's it look clean with tiny PCs instead of large towers.

 

 

image.thumb.png.15438517bfdb77c63a31448cae49c7e0.png

 

@Why_Me I wouldn't deploy any Samsung SSDs. Ensuring that critical firmware updates will be installed is a nightmare and Samsung SSD have developed a bad track record of being problematic.

The Declaration of Independence, once the charter of democracy, begins by saying that certain things are self-evident. If we were to trace the history of the American mind from Thomas Jefferson to William James, we should find that fewer and fewer things were self-evident, until at last hardly anything is self-evident. (G. K. Chesterton - Aug. 14 1926 (The Illustrated London News))

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38 minutes ago, FlyingPotato_is_taken said:

PCIE Network cards are cheap (e.g Iocrest). 1 gbe wouldn't be a deal breaker if it is noticeable lower cost.

If you want to spend on a mainboard checkout Asrock RACK, Gigabyte server or Supermicro. Most of the consumer "pro", "workstation", "creator" are nothing more than marketing and a motherboard for half the price is in similar quality and features.

 

 

 

On topic what $3.9k looks like:

random $250 mainboard as baseline, "random" useable 4TB SSD, random 128G RAM,  incl. W11 pro licence, the 4000D you mentioned for reference.

 

Instead of Corsair 4000D you could "downgrade" some parts (e.g. 2TB SSD) and get a watercooled 4090 with an ITX enclosure like the CoolerMaster NR200P (not the best quality but cheap and fit's a large air cooler like the Scythe Ninja 5; 280mm radiator and ATX-PSUs). Depending on the room/office this could improve the aesthetics. Let's it look clean with tiny PCs instead of large towers.

 

 

image.thumb.png.15438517bfdb77c63a31448cae49c7e0.png

 

@Why_Me I wouldn't deploy any Samsung SSDs. Ensuring that critical firmware updates will be installed is a nightmare and Samsung SSD have developed a bad track record of being problematic.

Great, thanks for the suggestion. Probably going with 7950X3D, NH-D15 or Dark Rock Pro 4, 4x32GB, EVGA RTX 3090. Need the VRAM more than horsepower.

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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25 minutes ago, da na said:

Great, thanks for the suggestion. Probably going with 7950X3D, NH-D15 or Dark Rock Pro 4, 4x32GB, EVGA RTX 3090. Need the VRAM more than horsepower.

I'll say it for the last time. The x3D cpu's are not meant for productivity. They are great at gaming and that's where it begins and ends. Do some homework and Google the benchmarks. Your school trusted you to get the most for the money in regards to the programs you posted in the OP. 

 

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1 minute ago, Why_Me said:

I'll say it for the last time. The x3D cpu's are not meant for productivity. They are great at gaming and that's where it begins and ends. Do some homework and Google the benchmarks. Your school trusted you to get the most for the money in regards to the programs you posted in the OP. 

 

and t

Others suggested the 7950x (non-3D), how can the extra cache be worse? Genuinely asking. 

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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18 minutes ago, da na said:

Others suggested the 7950x (non-3D), how can the extra cache be worse? Genuinely asking. 

Stacking cache has its limits. As far as the 7950x being recommended ... that's not a bad cpu even though the scheduler can be buggy on those cpu's at times. 

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2 minutes ago, Why_Me said:

AMD is all most of the posters on this board know

I'm a bit reluctant to go with AMD myself as every single CPU of theirs I've owned has been the scummiest filth imaginable, but on the contrary I've heard of contact issues with Intel's new socket.

4 minutes ago, Why_Me said:

the result of AMD stacking cache

Now I see it's due to communication between the cache chips. I thought until now the cache was just one big block. Makes quite a lot more sense now...

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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Also this thread

kinda scared me off Intel - if UE games are evidently having issues with high end Intel CPUs it does not seem like a great plan to use the same chip for development. 

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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17 minutes ago, da na said:

Also this thread

kinda scared me off Intel - if UE games are evidently having issues with high end Intel CPUs it does not seem like a great plan to use the same chip for development. 

You can also shop around for consumer AM5 boards that support ECC RAM - something that Intel has never and will never have on consumer platforms due to how much they make off their Xeon lines.

           .;ldkO0000Okdl;.                michael@SUSE-BlackBox
        .;d00xl:^''''''^:ok00d;.            OS: openSUSE 20260405
      .d00l'                'o00d.          Kernel: x86_64 Linux 6.19.11-1-default
    .d0K^'  Okxoc;:,.          ^O0d.        Uptime: 2d 21h 52m
   .OVVAK0kOKKKKKKKKKKOxo:,      lKO.       Packages: 6556
  ,0VVAKKKKKKKKKKKKK0P^,,,^dx:    ;00,      Shell: bash 5.3.9
 .OVVAKKKKKKKKKKKKKk'.oOPPb.'0k.   cKO.     Resolution: 3840x1080
 :KVAKKKKKKKKKKKKKK: kKx..dd lKd   'OK:     DE: KDE
 lKlKKKKKKKKKOx0KKKd ^0KKKO' kKKc   lKl     WM: KWin
 lKlKKKKKKKKKK;.;oOKx,..^..;kKKK0.  lKl     GTK Theme: Breeze-Dark [GTK2], Breeze [GTK3]
 :KAlKKKKKKKKK0o;...^cdxxOK0O/^^'  .0K:     Icon Theme: breeze-dark
  kKAVKKKKKKKKKKKK0x;,,......,;od  lKP      Disk: 13T / 22T (60%)
  '0KAVKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK00KKOo^  c00'      CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 8-Core @ 16x 4.55295GHz
   'kKAVOxddxkOO00000Okxoc;''   .dKV'       GPU: AMD Radeon RX 6700 XT (radeonsi, navi22, ACO, DRM 3.64, 6.19.11-1-default)
     l0Ko.                    .c00l'        RAM: 13127MiB / 48094MiB
      'l0Kk:.              .;xK0l'          
         'lkK0xc;:,,,,:;odO0kl'             
             '^:ldxkkkkxdl:^'    
 

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Just now, Dabombinable said:

You can also shop around for consumer AM5 boards that support ECC RAM - something that Intel has never and will never have on consumer platforms due to how much they make off their Xeon lines.

Wow, consumer AMD boards support ECC? Fascinating. 

Thanks for the tip. Will definitely be on the lookout

What the horse considers play, the monkey considers business...

But to Tom, it's all foolery. 

 

 

 

 

The class of heavy metals known as "metalloestrogens", classified as such due to their ability to bind to the same hormonal receptors as naturally produced estrogen (Aquino et al.), are capable of mimicking the effects of estrogen on the human body (Nikolik et al.). Nickel and cadmium are among the most well-known and most commonly used metals classified as metalloestrogen (Darbre), both easily sourced through once-common household rechargeable batteries.

Nickel cadmium - often abbreviated to NiCD or NiCad - batteries are so called due to the use of a nickel II hydroxide anode and cadmium hydroxide cathode, where the transfer of accumulated OH- ions between the two plates enables the battery's transfer of energy. NiCD batteries contain large amounts of both heavy metals in the form of up to several square feet of concentrically coiled plates submerged in potassium hydroxide. Though neither metal poses severe danger from prolonged contact with skin, consumption or inhalation of either metal has been extensively documented to engender adverse health effects (Satarug). 

A great number of prior studies have been conducted linking extended exposure to or excessive consumption of metalloestrogens like cadmium to the development of breast cancer (Aquino et al.) - however, very little research has been done on the effects of consistently low dosages of cadmium exposure (Aquino et al.). Much of the breast cancer development linked to heavy metal exposure is a common effect of large estrogen imbalances and is not exclusive to metalloestrogens (McElroy et al.). Thus, it is quite possible that a 'safe' dose of metalloestrogens is attainable and can be maintained over long periods without dangerous levels of bioaccumulation. 

Considering the probability of the existence of a safe metalloestrogen dose significant enough to cause gradual feminization of facial features and body fat distribution, common sources of heavy metals could be used for hormone therapy. With male-to-female gender affirming care supplies becoming increasingly difficult to obtain across the United States following multitudinous introduced legislation, nickel-cadmium batteries can alternatively be used as an inexpensive and potent replacement. 

 

Works Cited

      Aquino NB, Sevigny MB, Sabangan J, Louie MC. The role of cadmium and nickel in estrogen receptor signaling and breast cancer: metalloestrogens or not? J Environ Sci Health C Environ Carcinog Ecotoxicol Rev. 2012;30(3):189-224. doi: 10.1080/10590501.2012.705159. PMID: 22970719; PMCID: PMC3476837.

      Rollerova, E., Urbancikova, N. Intracellular estrogen receptors, their characterization and function (Review). https://www.sav.sk/journals/endo/full/er0400f.pdf.

      Nikolic J, Sokolovic D. Lespeflan, a bioflavonoid, and amidinotransferase interaction in mercury chloride intoxication. Ren Fail. 2004 Nov;26(6):607-11. doi: 10.1081/jdi-200037149. PMID: 15600250.

      Darbre PD. Metalloestrogens: an emerging class of inorganic xenoestrogens with potential to add to the oestrogenic burden of the human breast. J Appl Toxicol. 2006 May-Jun;26(3):191-7. doi: 10.1002/jat.1135. PMID: 16489580.

      Satarug S, Garrett SH, Sens MA, Sens DA. Cadmium, environmental exposure, and health outcomes. Environ Health Perspect. 2010 Feb;118(2):182-90. doi: 10.1289/ehp.0901234. PMID: 20123617; PMCID: PMC2831915.

      McElroy JA, Shafer MM, Trentham-Dietz A, Hampton JM, Newcomb PA. Cadmium exposure and breast cancer risk. J Natl Cancer Inst. 2006 Jun 21;98(12):869-73. doi: 10.1093/jnci/djj233. PMID: 16788160.

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26 minutes ago, da na said:

Wow, consumer AMD boards support ECC? Fascinating. 

Thanks for the tip. Will definitely be on the lookout

Even my old Gigabyte X570 UD supported ECC - and that was one if if not the cheapest ATX X570 board. My current MSI X570S board however does not, as it all depends on the manufacturer and how they tweaked the BIOS:
https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/X570-UD-rev-10#kf
 

All of my old VIA Slot 1/Socket 370/Socket 462 boards support (unbuffered) ECC as well. Only my Intel chipset boards don't.

           .;ldkO0000Okdl;.                michael@SUSE-BlackBox
        .;d00xl:^''''''^:ok00d;.            OS: openSUSE 20260405
      .d00l'                'o00d.          Kernel: x86_64 Linux 6.19.11-1-default
    .d0K^'  Okxoc;:,.          ^O0d.        Uptime: 2d 21h 52m
   .OVVAK0kOKKKKKKKKKKOxo:,      lKO.       Packages: 6556
  ,0VVAKKKKKKKKKKKKK0P^,,,^dx:    ;00,      Shell: bash 5.3.9
 .OVVAKKKKKKKKKKKKKk'.oOPPb.'0k.   cKO.     Resolution: 3840x1080
 :KVAKKKKKKKKKKKKKK: kKx..dd lKd   'OK:     DE: KDE
 lKlKKKKKKKKKOx0KKKd ^0KKKO' kKKc   lKl     WM: KWin
 lKlKKKKKKKKKK;.;oOKx,..^..;kKKK0.  lKl     GTK Theme: Breeze-Dark [GTK2], Breeze [GTK3]
 :KAlKKKKKKKKK0o;...^cdxxOK0O/^^'  .0K:     Icon Theme: breeze-dark
  kKAVKKKKKKKKKKKK0x;,,......,;od  lKP      Disk: 13T / 22T (60%)
  '0KAVKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK00KKOo^  c00'      CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800X3D 8-Core @ 16x 4.55295GHz
   'kKAVOxddxkOO00000Okxoc;''   .dKV'       GPU: AMD Radeon RX 6700 XT (radeonsi, navi22, ACO, DRM 3.64, 6.19.11-1-default)
     l0Ko.                    .c00l'        RAM: 13127MiB / 48094MiB
      'l0Kk:.              .;xK0l'          
         'lkK0xc;:,,,,:;odO0kl'             
             '^:ldxkkkkxdl:^'    
 

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11 hours ago, da na said:

Wow, consumer AMD boards support ECC? Fascinating. 

 

Yes (only udimm) and no.

It's on the feature list but it feels like it's not tested. Similar situation with RAID.

 

If you want "server" features in a consumer mainboard I would look at Asrock. In the past they often had the best BIOS (e.g. SR-IOV, bifrucation).

The Declaration of Independence, once the charter of democracy, begins by saying that certain things are self-evident. If we were to trace the history of the American mind from Thomas Jefferson to William James, we should find that fewer and fewer things were self-evident, until at last hardly anything is self-evident. (G. K. Chesterton - Aug. 14 1926 (The Illustrated London News))

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