LTT is valued at 100 million dollars but xQc gets paid 100M just to stream on Kick????

[CuriousBread]

So this thing doesn't quite jive with me. 

LTT with a whole product line, various channels, covering many different topics and a whole army of 102 talented employees of various fields is valued at 100M. 

xQc which is basically just a dude who played comp Overwatch and now just doing reactionary content on Twitch...gets paid the exact same amount LMG is valued at. 

 

So maybe I'm a boomer not understanding how valuation work for streamers but what the h? Does Kick just have poor financial sense or am I just out of touch and ignorant? 

[Shimejii]

Kick will be dead within 2 years. XQC is probably worth 2-3m a year at most in revenue for a site, But because they have a Gambling site+ potentially Saudi oil $$$ they have a lot of spending power for 1-2 years before that gets pulled.

 

This is why i laugh at any streamer who thinks they are worth something when the people running Kick try to pay someone this amount of $$. There is absolutely 0 benefit or potential for profit for them by paying this much.

 

Site will be dead and bankrupt within 2 years, unless they just enjoy burning money like this.

[Oshino Shinobu]

It's really not something you can compare without the specific details of what was/is actually being offered in both cases. Even just the top level, there's a huge difference between buying a company and all the associated costs with it, and offering a contract to a streamer where you likely aren't taking on any real cost.

[TOGSolid]

The difference is LTT is a legitimate business and Kick is a sham gambling dumpster with strong ties to crypto bros and the xqx thing is just them trying to sucker people in with wild headlines.

[saintlouisbagels]

4 hours ago, TOGSolid said:

The difference is LTT is a legitimate business and Kick is a sham gambling dumpster with strong ties to crypto bros and the xqx thing is just them trying to sucker people in with wild headlines.

I wouldn’t mind being “suckered in” with 100 million $$$

 

I mean, everyone wins.

Kick gets to use their money pit of "f*ck you" money and xqc (and whoever else) gets paid enough to to do nothing for the rest of their lives.

 

[nhand42]

3 hours ago, saintlouisbagels said:

I mean, everyone wins.

Everybody except all those people who lost money gambling to fund that $100 million. Gambling is an addiction and the gamblers are often miserable and suffering. Personal responsibility or no, they can't control themselves, handing over their savings and paychecks to predatory scum who profit off of the misery. I hate to use the term Blood Money but in this case it seems appropriate.

[LogicalDrm]

This is like comparing local sports goods chain to any professional athlete. They are not same thing. Value is based on multiple factors. Including reach and growth potential. A single persons contract with team, sponsor or similar is about how much money their namebrand can bring and potential for their audience to cross over to new site. It's not like this is first big money contract been made. It's bad for the company as exclusivity in the Internet doesn't work like that. For the person... Most will just take the money, and leave once contract ends. That has happened to all these "competing" sites apart from YouTube which does have more solid base and profit sharing model.

[WereCat]

LTT is not valued at 100M... They were offered 100M.

[wanderingfool2]

On 6/17/2023 at 3:33 PM, Shimejii said:

This is why i laugh at any streamer who thinks they are worth something when the people running Kick try to pay someone this amount of $$. There is absolutely 0 benefit or potential for profit for them by paying this much.

 

Site will be dead and bankrupt within 2 years, unless they just enjoy burning money like this.

It made the news, and likely has drawn in hundreds of thousands of new viewers into Kick.

 

You are looking at it from the perspective that the payment to XQC only can be recovered via advertisements.  Instead what it brings is lots more viewers to the site, and potentially more streamers who now see it as a more legitimate platform with viewers now.

 

Now lets say with all the added attention and hype they manage to get 1 million new users.  Those viewers will be exposed in a large part to gambling streams...and those gambling streams can lead to additions of people seeing their streamer winning and almost needing a fix of adrenaline so they end up gambling.

 

Now maybe only 1% of those million users develop a gambling issue (that's roughly the amount of gambling addicts).  That's 10,000 users.  Those 1% are likely to lose well in excess of $10,000...with some who have the funds losing in excess of $100,000.  This isn't an over exageration either, I know an addict who ends up dumping in his entire disposable income (plus more), and he was working at a rate of $125+/hour.

 

Once they manage to convert a few people to addicts as well, they pretty much have them for life as well (or at least years)...so the amount of gamblers they gain from this kind of deal might be worth it for them.  Plus that's only thinking about those who get to the point of calling it an addiction...there will be plenty of other casual gamblers who end up wasting their money.

 

Kick is essentially the vessel for that.

 

 

 

To the original posters comment, the reason why XQC is paid more is because he is what's bringing in the crowd.  Similar reason why star quarterbacks or other players make so much money (when you look at the cheerleaders who then operate almost on a volunteer basis).

[saintlouisbagels]

30 minutes ago, WereCat said:

LTT is not valued at 100M... They were offered 100M.

Semantics.

Valuation is just some arbitrary number. Theranos had a $10B valuation, but in reality it was a worthless company.

LTT could be valued at several hundreds of millions of $$, but if no one's interested in that theoretically number, then are they actually that value?

100M is a tangible number that someone was actually legit willing to buy them at. You could use a made-up number, or you could use an actual data point.

[Stahlmann]

On 6/18/2023 at 12:33 AM, Shimejii said:

This is why i laugh at any streamer who thinks they are worth something when the people running Kick try to pay someone this amount of $$. There is absolutely 0 benefit or potential for profit for them by paying this much.

 

Site will be dead and bankrupt within 2 years, unless they just enjoy burning money like this.

First of, xqc just made more money than you will probably ever make in your life. So who's laughing?

 

Second, this is not about a streamer coming over. They need a community to come over on Kick and stay there. Obviously they will pull out the biggest streamers for that so the potential audience they bring with them is as big as possible.

[Stahlmann]

4 hours ago, nhand42 said:

Everybody except all those people who lost money gambling to fund that $100 million. Gambling is an addiction and the gamblers are often miserable and suffering. Personal responsibility or no, they can't control themselves, handing over their savings and paychecks to predatory scum who profit off of the misery. I hate to use the term Blood Money but in this case it seems appropriate.

These people would've lost their money either way. How does it make a difference that this money is now going to xqc? Your point doesn't really bring anything up for discussion other than your personal morals.

[WereCat]

19 minutes ago, saintlouisbagels said:

Semantics.

Valuation is just some arbitrary number. Theranos had a $10B valuation, but in reality it was a worthless company.

LTT could be valued at several hundreds of millions of $$, but if no one's interested in that theoretically number, then are they actually that value?

100M is a tangible number that someone was actually legit willing to buy them at. You could use a made-up number, or you could use an actual data point.

Value is based on mutual agreement.

With your logic you could go grab a 4090 and offer cashier a tangible number of $10 instead of their made up asking price. 

[Shimejii]

19 minutes ago, Stahlmann said:

First of, xqc just made more money than you will probably ever make in your life. So who's laughing?

 

Second, this is not about a streamer coming over. They need a community to come over on Kick and stay there. Obviously they will pull out the biggest streamers for that so the potential audience they bring with them is as big as possible.

Woopie fucking doo he made more money. Genuinely dont give a shit, a lot of people will make more money. Money solves some problems yes, aint gonna fix his personality issues and its not gonna fix him being dead before 50 more then likely. Congrats! 

 

You do not pay a streamer to bring a community over, you build a new community around them. It failed HARD every single time a streamer would go to a new platform for quite some time before a new group was there. Most big streamers lose a TON of their audience and its quite hard to gain that back. Yes they have money so boohoo about that, what they enjoy was their community.  Kick is going to fail so hard and its going to be within 2 years, you dont spend stupid amounts of money on streamers like this and expect to live long as a platform, time will tell whos right  

[Stahlmann]

Just now, Shimejii said:

Woopie fucking doo he made more money. Genuinely dont give a shit, a lot of people will make more money. Money solves some problems yes, aint gonna fix his personality issues and its not gonna fix him being dead before 50 more then likely. Congrats! 

If you don't like his personality then that's your problem. Thing is, a lot of people do like him, which is why he's been the top viewed streamer for the last few years. I have no idea why you care about his health but at least he won't ever have to worry about money ever again. Who in their right might would have not taken this deal?

 

Just now, Shimejii said:

You do not pay a streamer to bring a community over, you build a new community around them. It failed HARD every single time a streamer would go to a new platform for quite some time before a new group was there. Most big streamers lose a TON of their audience and its quite hard to gain that back. Yes they have money so boohoo about that, what they enjoy was their community.  Kick is going to fail so hard and its going to be within 2 years, you dont spend stupid amounts of money on streamers like this and expect to live long as a platform, time will tell whos right  

So far everything you're saying is pure conjecture. Sure, Ninja failed hard when he switched to Mixer, but Mixer was also not nearly as big as Kick already is. Microsoft shut down Mixer because it wasn't profitable in the short term. So far it seems like Kick is going for long-term success over short term profits. Seeing how well Stake is doing, they won't run into money issues anytime soon. Gambling isn't going anywhere and so isn't Stake. And if Stake's profits can be used to build up another streaming service to rival Twitch then they will likely proceed in it.

 

And for all the moral apostles out there. He was exclusively streaming on Twitch until now, which is owned by Amazon. 

[Avocado Diaboli]

10 hours ago, Stahlmann said:

These people would've lost their money either way. How does it make a difference that this money is now going to xqc? Your point doesn't really bring anything up for discussion other than your personal morals.

This is an example of begging the question. Also, what's your aversion to discussions based on morals? Someone profiting off of gambling addicts, regardless of the sum, even by proxy, is reprehensible. If you don't agree, explain your reasoning.

[saintlouisbagels]

27 minutes ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

This is an example of begging the question. Also, what's your aversion to discussions based on morals? Someone profiting off of gambling addicts, regardless of the sum, even by proxy, is reprehensible. If you don't agree, explain your reasoning.

It just seems like a discussion that will go nowhere.

 

Why are we discussing the morals of a company that makes money off gambling addicts while we are using our laptops and smart phones that have been created by cheap Chinese labor, while running off electricity that's causing carbon emissions leading to worsening climate change?

 

I'm sure a lot of food you eat has components that trace back to 3rd world countries cultivating salt or palm oil and they get paid several cents a day.

 

[Avocado Diaboli]

2 minutes ago, saintlouisbagels said:

It just seems like a discussion that will go nowhere.

Why are we discussing the morals of a company that makes money off gambling addicts while we are using our laptops and smart phones that have been created by cheap Chinese labor, while running off electricity that's causing carbon emissions leading to worsening climate change?

Why are we discussing anything ever then? And while I'm already pointing out argumentative fallacies, yours is an example of whataboutism.

 

I do have to wonder why people insist on shutting down discussions they aren't required to participate in.

[saintlouisbagels]

1 minute ago, Avocado Diaboli said:

Why are we discussing anything ever then? And while I'm already pointing out argumentative fallacies, yours is an example of whataboutism.

 

I do have to wonder why people insist on shutting down discussions they aren't required to participate in.

Because having a moral high ground regarding a company making their money off gambling addicts seems really silly since we have no control on their money source. Oh, we're against xQc accepting gambling money? That has no effect on him accepting or declining the money, and that has no effect on Kick still making money.

 

Things like cheap labor and harmful environmental stuff? We're all active participants in that.

[Avocado Diaboli]

13 minutes ago, saintlouisbagels said:

Because having a moral high ground regarding a company making their money off gambling addicts seems really silly since we have no control on their money source. Oh, we're against xQc accepting gambling money? That has no effect on him accepting or declining the money, and that has no effect on Kick still making money.

 

Things like cheap labor and harmful environmental stuff? We're all active participants in that.

Discussing it has the potential to cause people to stop watching xQc and by proxy Kick, thereby decreasing the amount of money they can generate through ads for gambling. If the headline is just "Twich streamer gets $100 million to switch platforms", that's a completely different message to "Twich streamer accepts $100 million from company built on exploiting gambling addicts", which in turn leads some in the audience to question whether they should follow the streamer. 

 

Again, responding with whataboutism doesn't solve the initial problem at all. And it's especially preposterous when you try to paint people raising this issue as seeking the moral high ground when you sit on the sidelines doing the same.

[nhand42]

15 hours ago, Stahlmann said:

These people would've lost their money either way. How does it make a difference that this money is now going to xqc? Your point doesn't really bring anything up for discussion other than your personal morals.

I was responding to the comment Everybody Wins. In fact no, many people have lost something. How does it make a difference? Because money is not instantly "cleaned" after passing through Kick. It is still dirty money. That was the point I made when I said Blood Money. That's not my personal morals. It's an observation of reality.

[cmndr]

16 hours ago, WereCat said:

LTT is not valued at 100M... They were offered 100M.

A third party valued them at at least $100M and made an offer of $100M.

 

valued in this sense is used to mean "a valuation and offer was issued" - which is a bit nuanced. 

Company valuations are a huge can of worms. 

[CuriousBread]

There's just a whole multi-paragraph shitshow right above me that I don't have the patience to crawl through. Anyone got a synopsis of what they are arguing about? 

[wasab]

18 hours ago, WereCat said:

LTT is not valued at 100M... They were offered 100M.

For what?

[MASONNETofficial]

Such BS